kd24's Scarf Metagross
METABOSS
METABOSS
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Counter that Pokemon - Mk III [Team 2 won!]
- Thread starter ganj4lF
- Start date
kd24 Metagross
It's a question of taste. The other choices are boring because we all know it, it's not changing anything from building a normal team from now.
The movesets are known, the pokemons are overplayed etc.
And overall, I totally disagree with the "these are the best choices possible". But we'll see.
However, noone is forced to suggest original pokemons; and the voters are chosing.......
On another topic, I feel like this Scarf Keldeo choice was really not great, it's almost like team 2 have to pick another Scarf now, or get something even more boring like SpD Jirachi.
It's a question of taste. The other choices are boring because we all know it, it's not changing anything from building a normal team from now.
The movesets are known, the pokemons are overplayed etc.
And overall, I totally disagree with the "these are the best choices possible". But we'll see.
However, noone is forced to suggest original pokemons; and the voters are chosing.......
On another topic, I feel like this Scarf Keldeo choice was really not great, it's almost like team 2 have to pick another Scarf now, or get something even more boring like SpD Jirachi.
The Great Mighty Doom
The Great Mighty Doom
The Great Mighty Doom's Landorus
The Great Mighty Doom
Even though Psychic is not standard, I prefer that over Focus Blast for Scarf Keldeo. Didn't really look at anything else, tbh--it's just a great choice.
Even though Psychic is not standard, I prefer that over Focus Blast for Scarf Keldeo. Didn't really look at anything else, tbh--it's just a great choice.
kd24
This actually looks like a cool use for Metagross.
This actually looks like a cool use for Metagross.
Melee Mewtwo
I really like Melee's Latios suggestion because we can really abuse Keldeo trying to revenge one of our Pokemon. Team 2's Heatran (or Any future Steel types) will be under a lot of pressure with both Kyurem and Latios. the opponent will be in a jam: "should I revenge kyurem-b in order to prevent it setting up more or should I not in order to prevent the next dragon from Ko'ing one guy immediately?" in my opinion a dedicated sweeper would best be saved for last, since we will know what the ideal coverage will be for the opposing team and what targets we can set up upon. Right now if we choose Lando-I, Team 2 can structure their team to make it incredibly difficult to set up.
I really like Melee's Latios suggestion because we can really abuse Keldeo trying to revenge one of our Pokemon. Team 2's Heatran (or Any future Steel types) will be under a lot of pressure with both Kyurem and Latios. the opponent will be in a jam: "should I revenge kyurem-b in order to prevent it setting up more or should I not in order to prevent the next dragon from Ko'ing one guy immediately?" in my opinion a dedicated sweeper would best be saved for last, since we will know what the ideal coverage will be for the opposing team and what targets we can set up upon. Right now if we choose Lando-I, Team 2 can structure their team to make it incredibly difficult to set up.
The Great Mighty Doom
As cool as kd24's Metagross is, I just can't help but feel that this project isn't suitable for it. Since Team 2 knows that Team 1's Metagross is holding a Choice Scarf, the surprise value that makes ScarfGross effective in the first place is missing. It does have some useful resistances but it's extremely easy to check. I like the offensive synergy RP Landorus has with Kyurem-B and Rotom-W, therefore it gets my vote.
As cool as kd24's Metagross is, I just can't help but feel that this project isn't suitable for it. Since Team 2 knows that Team 1's Metagross is holding a Choice Scarf, the surprise value that makes ScarfGross effective in the first place is missing. It does have some useful resistances but it's extremely easy to check. I like the offensive synergy RP Landorus has with Kyurem-B and Rotom-W, therefore it gets my vote.
Kd24's Metagrawsssss
Metagross: 5 votes
RP Lando: 14 votes
Latios: 4 votes
RP Lando: 14 votes
Latios: 4 votes
Boy was I wrong about this being close. XD This landslide vote (lol bad pun lol) really makes me wonder if there was something really wrong with Latios that I overlooked. (or something really right about Lando) I honestly expected the poor guy to put up a better fight.
Ok, no need to extend the voting period; we already have a big amount of participants and the end result is quite clear, so voting is closed!
This is the tally right now, as usual omitting entries with zero votes:
So, welcome to one of the most frightening sweepers of OU, Rock Polish Landorus, which is the third member of Team 1:
The Great Mighty Doom's Landorus @ Life Orb
Trait: Sheer Force
EVs: 64 HP / 252 SAtk / 192 Spd
IVs: 30 Spd
Modest Nature
- Earth Power
- Psychic
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Rock Polish
Now we're going to discuss the third member of Team 2. Remember to only post sets with all the elements required in the OP and to keep a polite and calm tone while discussing. As already said for the previous round, the duration of this phase will be 72 hours at least, but an extension is possible if we don't get a good amount of discussion / someone drops me a PM or whatever reason that may imply an unability to participate.
This is the tally right now, as usual omitting entries with zero votes:
- Melee Mewtwo's Latios: 4
[*]The Great Mighty Doom's RP Landorus: 16 - G-Von's Forretress: 1
- kd24's Scarf Metagross: 6
So, welcome to one of the most frightening sweepers of OU, Rock Polish Landorus, which is the third member of Team 1:
The Great Mighty Doom's Landorus @ Life Orb
Trait: Sheer Force
EVs: 64 HP / 252 SAtk / 192 Spd
IVs: 30 Spd
Modest Nature
- Earth Power
- Psychic
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Rock Polish
Now we're going to discuss the third member of Team 2. Remember to only post sets with all the elements required in the OP and to keep a polite and calm tone while discussing. As already said for the previous round, the duration of this phase will be 72 hours at least, but an extension is possible if we don't get a good amount of discussion / someone drops me a PM or whatever reason that may imply an unability to participate.
Okay, double posting since there's a pokemon I really love that fits Team 2 like a glove:
Celebi @ Leftovers | Natural Cure
Calm | 252 HP / 232 SpD / 24 Spe
- Giga Drain
- Recover
- Baton Pass
- Thunder Wave
This awesome pixie does lots of things for Team 2 right now. It stops cold every member of Team 1, at the moment, since Rotom-W can't scratch its enormous special bulk and resistances with its attacks (and Thunder Wave is pointless) and will be worn down easily by Giga Drain, Kyurem can shuffle away, sure, but even at +2 it's dealing around 50%, and Celebi will just Perish Song to force out Kyurem, and RP Lando deals 43% max with HP Ice, so it's very easy to stall its LO or just slowly Giga Drain it to death. U-Turn makes sure Celebi is not a momentum killer, and may discourage incoming trappers to be picked. Overall, it's just a solid special wall that happens to have almost perfect synergy with Heatran and is a solid counter to half of Team 2 right now.
I considered Psychic over Giga Drain, but they're both not-that-good STAB attacks, Giga Drain gives some recovery at least and ensures the SE hit on Rotom, and thus is preferred. None of them breaks Kyu-B's Subs, but Perish Song solves that anyway. Still I'd like to hear feedback on the moveset, if anyone has some.
Celebi @ Leftovers | Natural Cure
Calm | 252 HP / 232 SpD / 24 Spe
- Giga Drain
- Recover
- Baton Pass
- Thunder Wave
This awesome pixie does lots of things for Team 2 right now. It stops cold every member of Team 1, at the moment, since Rotom-W can't scratch its enormous special bulk and resistances with its attacks (and Thunder Wave is pointless) and will be worn down easily by Giga Drain, Kyurem can shuffle away, sure, but even at +2 it's dealing around 50%, and Celebi will just Perish Song to force out Kyurem, and RP Lando deals 43% max with HP Ice, so it's very easy to stall its LO or just slowly Giga Drain it to death. U-Turn makes sure Celebi is not a momentum killer, and may discourage incoming trappers to be picked. Overall, it's just a solid special wall that happens to have almost perfect synergy with Heatran and is a solid counter to half of Team 2 right now.
I considered Psychic over Giga Drain, but they're both not-that-good STAB attacks, Giga Drain gives some recovery at least and ensures the SE hit on Rotom, and thus is preferred. None of them breaks Kyu-B's Subs, but Perish Song solves that anyway. Still I'd like to hear feedback on the moveset, if anyone has some.
Skarmory @ Leftovers
252 HP / 232 Def / 24 Spe
Impish Nature
~ Roost
~ Stealth Rock
~ Whirlwind
~ Brave Bird
Shuttin' down RP Landorus with a physical wall? You heard that right. The best Landorus can do to Skarmory is HP Ice, which is a 3HKO after rocks. This means we can stall out its hidden power so that LO slowly kills it, or just whirl it away.
It also provides SR, which is super duper cool because Kyu-B hates them. Brave Bird gives it some offensive power so it's not complete taunt bait.
Celebi is in general a good pick but this would give them a great excuse to use a tornados which is annoying. I don't really know what to suggest but I'll choose latias.
Latias leftovers
Subsitute
Calm mind
Recover
Dragon Pulse
252hp / 252speed / 4defence / timid
While not great for this project I think sub calm mind latias would be great for us. It can set up calm minds against rotom-W and Landorus with ease kill Kyurem if not behind a sub and if they choose scizor to deal with us we can normally make it out alive as they u-turn our sub we get free recovery they pursuit our sub on the switch we lose our sub but not to bad. Also scizor sucks against heatran and keldeo and I don't think Kyurem will like having its leftovers nullified if they choose tyranitar. Also using this set means we can counter trap easy as they pursuit our sub when we switch is dugtrio/magnezones time to come in and trap it. This means we then have a free setup with latias on their other pokes and gives team 1 major trouble.
Latias leftovers
Subsitute
Calm mind
Recover
Dragon Pulse
252hp / 252speed / 4defence / timid
While not great for this project I think sub calm mind latias would be great for us. It can set up calm minds against rotom-W and Landorus with ease kill Kyurem if not behind a sub and if they choose scizor to deal with us we can normally make it out alive as they u-turn our sub we get free recovery they pursuit our sub on the switch we lose our sub but not to bad. Also scizor sucks against heatran and keldeo and I don't think Kyurem will like having its leftovers nullified if they choose tyranitar. Also using this set means we can counter trap easy as they pursuit our sub when we switch is dugtrio/magnezones time to come in and trap it. This means we then have a free setup with latias on their other pokes and gives team 1 major trouble.
Merry Christmas everybody!
Abomasnow (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Snow Warning
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SDef / 252 Atk
Adamant Nature
- Wood Hammer
- Ice Shard
- Substitute
- Focus Punch
What does this set do? Abomasnow is a niche pokemon. The idea behind this set is to abuse its niche typing to set up a Substitue so that it can safely fire off one of its powerful attacks. Wood Hammer is the main STAB option and its mighty 120 base power makes up for the lackluster 92 base attack. STAB Ice Shard is always a nice utility to have as it hits a lot of offensive threats for X2 and X4 damage allowing it stop pull an emergency stop to sweeps. Focus Punch is a very powerful coverage move that makes use of Substitute to put massive dents in the OP. It's strong enough to 2HKO Bulky Scizor while dealing a whopping 70% to max HP Heatran.
How can this set help the team? Normally Abomasnow's niche is its ability. Strangely enough, its typing is what makes it attractive. It resists everything Rotom-W can throw at it while already being so slow that T-Wave isn't a problem. It also resists Lando's STAB Earth Power and takes neutral damage from HP Ice. Even Psychic often fails to 2HKO if SR is up. In response, Abomasnow has a strong chance OHKO Lando with Ice Shard which can also be used to cut off a +2 sweep. Rotom-W crumbles under the mighty power of SE Wood Hameer. Even Kyurem-B isn't happy about switching into Abomasnow as Focus Punch 2HKOs and, thanks to the higher priority, Kyurem-B can't do anything to prevent Focus Punch from connecting.
What can the other team do in response to this set? Abomasnow's high powered attacks actually make it surprisingly hard to counter without resorting to defensive counters. Scizor and Heatran both go out the window thanks to Focus Punch. Roost Scizor would have a chance but with Keldeo and Heatran already on Team 2 this would be a very ineffective set. Offensive TR Bronzong can take whatever the Christmas tree wants to throw at it while putting some pressure back. Metagross is in the same boat while boasting a much higher attack stat and some cool coverage options. Just having SR on the field is going to bother Abomasnow so a reliable SR setter is going to help (althought that won't stop him from countering what he is supposed to).
What potential additions can be made to deal with these responses? Bronzong is already checked by Keldeo who can take 3 Gyro Balls while 2HKOing back with Hydro Pump (It probably won't even need that as Bronzong will have eaten a Focus Punch before hand). Metagross is the best answer to Abomasnow as it takes very little from from any of its attacks while threatening back with its Meteor Mash and Bullet Punch. At the same it can KO both Heatran and Keldeo with coverage moves such as EQ/Hammer Arm and Thunder Punch/Zen Headbutt. Heatran can already revenge kill it though. Gliscor can take anything except Ice Punch while hitting back hard with STAB SE EQ. It can also beat Rotom-W by spamming Substitute with Poison Heal to fish for a miss and PP stall Hydro Pump. With enough defensive investment it can even wall +0 Dtails with a Substitute.
Keep in mind that the advantage of this set is that it counters Team 1 while putting offensive pressure. It counters while being, surprisingly, hard to counter.
Abomasnow (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Snow Warning
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SDef / 252 Atk
Adamant Nature
- Wood Hammer
- Ice Shard
- Substitute
- Focus Punch
What does this set do? Abomasnow is a niche pokemon. The idea behind this set is to abuse its niche typing to set up a Substitue so that it can safely fire off one of its powerful attacks. Wood Hammer is the main STAB option and its mighty 120 base power makes up for the lackluster 92 base attack. STAB Ice Shard is always a nice utility to have as it hits a lot of offensive threats for X2 and X4 damage allowing it stop pull an emergency stop to sweeps. Focus Punch is a very powerful coverage move that makes use of Substitute to put massive dents in the OP. It's strong enough to 2HKO Bulky Scizor while dealing a whopping 70% to max HP Heatran.
How can this set help the team? Normally Abomasnow's niche is its ability. Strangely enough, its typing is what makes it attractive. It resists everything Rotom-W can throw at it while already being so slow that T-Wave isn't a problem. It also resists Lando's STAB Earth Power and takes neutral damage from HP Ice. Even Psychic often fails to 2HKO if SR is up. In response, Abomasnow has a strong chance OHKO Lando with Ice Shard which can also be used to cut off a +2 sweep. Rotom-W crumbles under the mighty power of SE Wood Hameer. Even Kyurem-B isn't happy about switching into Abomasnow as Focus Punch 2HKOs and, thanks to the higher priority, Kyurem-B can't do anything to prevent Focus Punch from connecting.
What can the other team do in response to this set? Abomasnow's high powered attacks actually make it surprisingly hard to counter without resorting to defensive counters. Scizor and Heatran both go out the window thanks to Focus Punch. Roost Scizor would have a chance but with Keldeo and Heatran already on Team 2 this would be a very ineffective set. Offensive TR Bronzong can take whatever the Christmas tree wants to throw at it while putting some pressure back. Metagross is in the same boat while boasting a much higher attack stat and some cool coverage options. Just having SR on the field is going to bother Abomasnow so a reliable SR setter is going to help (althought that won't stop him from countering what he is supposed to).
What potential additions can be made to deal with these responses? Bronzong is already checked by Keldeo who can take 3 Gyro Balls while 2HKOing back with Hydro Pump (It probably won't even need that as Bronzong will have eaten a Focus Punch before hand). Metagross is the best answer to Abomasnow as it takes very little from from any of its attacks while threatening back with its Meteor Mash and Bullet Punch. At the same it can KO both Heatran and Keldeo with coverage moves such as EQ/Hammer Arm and Thunder Punch/Zen Headbutt. Heatran can already revenge kill it though. Gliscor can take anything except Ice Punch while hitting back hard with STAB SE EQ. It can also beat Rotom-W by spamming Substitute with Poison Heal to fish for a miss and PP stall Hydro Pump. With enough defensive investment it can even wall +0 Dtails with a Substitute.
Keep in mind that the advantage of this set is that it counters Team 1 while putting offensive pressure. It counters while being, surprisingly, hard to counter.
Ganj4IF, you beat me to it. I was going to nominate Celebi myself. But anyways, I was thinking of placing ThunderWave in the fourth slot so as to slow some faster pokes down, as well as somewhat crippling Cube, but Perish Song works fine.
P.S. Now that Celebi is an option, Latios seemed like a better pick for T1
P.S. Now that Celebi is an option, Latios seemed like a better pick for T1
Bryce
Lun
Celebi is an awesome pick at the moment.You might want to put Baton Pass instead of U-Turn so Celebi isn't pursuit trapped.U-Turn damage doesn't really matter on celebi as much as the ability to switch out from pursuiters.Okay, double posting since there's a pokemon I really love that fits Team 2 like a glove:
Celebi @ Leftovers | Natural Cure
Calm | 252 HP / 232 SpD / 24 Spe
- Giga Drain
- Recover
- U-Turn
- Perish Song