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DP Research Thread #1 ("Old")

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X-Act said:
Hmm, maybe it does increase the critical hit rate after all.
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Here's what I've gathered so far:

1. The Japanese in-game description of Zoom Lens says it increases accuracy under certain conditions.

2. The North American in-game description says it increases crit rate instead.

3. TRE hit 30 out of 30 times with Megahorn using a Zoom Lens and moving after the target. The target was being healed by an item, meaning that it was going first but not attacking the Megahorn user. Whether the other Pokemon in the battle (it was a Double Battle, I believe) were attacking the Zoom Lens holder is unknown.

All this leads me to my current hypothesis that Zoom Lens increases accuracy by at least 20% as long as the holder moves after the target. Again, I haven't done testing of my own yet (although it will probably be my next project). This is just what I've gleaned from various sources.
 
Just tested the only untested Mold Breaker question I had- Mold Breaker will not let Rampardos use Earthquake on Sky Plate Arceus.
 
Footnote said:
All this leads me to my current hypothesis that Zoom Lens increases accuracy by at least 20% as long as the holder moves after the target. Again, I haven't done testing of my own yet (although it will probably be my next project). This is just what I've gleaned from various sources.
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Maybe Stall isn't as worthless a trait as people originally took it for, since there are numerous items/attacks that seem to work that way...
 
Boa1891 said:
Maybe Stall isn't as worthless a trait as people originally took it for, since there are numerous items/attacks that seem to work that way...
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this is a very good point, actually. zoom lens seems like a nifty item, and payback seems all in all quite amazing. sableye is kinda cool.
 
Sableye doesn't learn any low accuracy attacks. It's least accurate attack seems to be Rock Tomb which is useless for a Stall Sableye. It learns Dynamic Punch and Mega Kick via RSEFL Tutors, but you can't get them and Stall at the same time.
 
Team Rocket Elite said:
Sableye doesn't learn any low accuracy attacks. It's least accurate attack seems to be Rock Tomb which is useless for a Stall Sableye. It learns Dynamic Punch and Mega Kick via RSEFL Tutors, but you can't get them and Stall at the same time.
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This is true. As far as I can tell, Sableye's Stall only has two major benefits.

1. Payback will always be 100 power as long as the target doesn't use a low-priority move.

2. It will always go last in Trick Room. For one thing, this means that Payback will still have 100 power after Trick Room is used. More importanly in my mind, this means that any one-turn Double Battle combo that has Sableye as its second half won't get messed up by Trick Room. For instance, if Sableye's partner uses Swagger and Sableye hits the same target with Punishment, the damage is still increased. (This is working from memory. If I can remember correctly, Stall makes Sableye move last even in Trick Room. I haven't tested it personally.)
 
Footnote said:
This is true. As far as I can tell, Sableye's Stall only has two major benefits.

1. Payback will always be 100 power as long as the target doesn't use a low-priority move.

2. It will always go last in Trick Room. For one thing, this means that Payback will still have 100 power after Trick Room is used. More importanly in my mind, this means that any one-turn Double Battle combo that has Sableye as its second half won't get messed up by Trick Room. For instance, if Sableye's partner uses Swagger and Sableye hits the same target with Punishment, the damage is still increased. (This is working from memory. If I can remember correctly, Stall makes Sableye move last even in Trick Room. I haven't tested it personally.)
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Since you mentioned Double Battles, I have to remind you of Role Play/Skill Swap and all the others like that.
It's not the greatest trait in the world, but at least it's not as worthless as Illuminate.
 
Well, there is the thing about avoiding Metal Burst, especially since Sableye and Bastiodon are likely to be played in similar environments.
 
OK, I know I started it, but this strategy discussion doesn't really belong here in the research thread. If we want to talk about the benefits/drawbacks of Stall, we should probably just resurrect the most recent Sableye discussion thread.

So, my apologies for the tangent.
 
tl;dr

This concerns Castform's trait, Gastro Acid, and Weather Ball.

  • Whenever the weather changes, Castform immediately changes. When Kyogre switches in, Castform changes immediately to Water after the Drizzle's text goes away.
  • Castform's Weather Ball turns into a Rock type in Sandstorm. It is Special-typed. Castform does not transform.
  • Gastro Acid does work on Castform's trait. Castform is stuck on the form it was Gastro Acided on (until it switches out?), even if the weather changes from Normal to Rain, or Fire to Rain, or Rain to Normal.
  • A Rayquaza switch-in's Air Lock forces Castform to revert to normal form immediately.
  • Weather Ball is independent from Castform. Weather Ball always works according to the weather - in Rain, it will always be Water typed, even if Castform is stuck in Fire form. When Rayquaza is on the field, Weather Ball is always Normal.

Some interesting things, too... Maybe we're wrong here, though, and mistook some numbers for something else.

My cousin says that Weather Ball did 84 damage to Blissey under the Sun, but the minimum is 85 or 86 damage (with NB damage calculator and Misty's damage calculator, respectively). Castform's special attack is 143, and Blissey's special defense is 278.

Rock Weather Ball did 44 damage, which is correct - between 38-45.
 
OK...my first batch of Zoom Lens testing is done.

I fought battles against two L.9 Pachirisu with a L.17 Ponyta with Zoom Lens and a L.26 Linoone. Every round, the Ponyta used Fire Blast (85% accurate) and the Linoone used Protect.

4 of the 104 Fire Blasts launched by the Ponyta targeted a Pachirisu before it moved (they use Quick Attack most of the time). Of these 4, 2 missed. Hence, I'm fairly confident that Zoom Lens does not increase accuracy when used against a target who has not taken an action yet in the round.

Of the 100 Fire Blasts that were launched against a Pachirisu that had already taken an action (Quick Attack) in the turn, all 100 hit.

For reference:

50 of the 100 Fire Blasts were launched against a Pachirisu that had attacked the Ponyta previously in the round.

43 of the 100 Fire Blasts were launched when the Ponyta had not been attacked in the round.

The remaining 7 Fire Blasts were launched against a Pachirisu that had attacked the Linoone, but the Ponyta had been hit by the other Pachirisu.

Conclusions: Zoom Lens raises accuracy by at least 18% as long as the target has already taken an action in the turn. I'm willing to wager that in reality the value is at least 20%. It does not appear that the holder needs to take damage in order for the Zoom Lens to take effect, nor does it appear that the user needs to be targeted by an attack.

On a side note, I got at least 7 crits, but I may have missed some, so if any of you want to make sure Zoom Lens doesn't increase crit rate, more testing will need to be done.

Next episode: Stone Edge! (80% accuracy)

EDIT: OK, out of 50 Zoom Lens Stone Edges against an opponent that had already taken its action, 48 hit. This works out to about 96% accuracy. Since 0.8 times 1.2 is exactly 0.96, I'm going to guess that Zoom Lens does indeed raise accuracy by 20% when moving after the target. I was a bit more careful with logging my crits this time. 6 out of the 48 hits were crits ( 1 out of 8 ). I conclude that Zoom Lens does not raise the crit rate.

If any of you feel inclined to test this further, please do! The larger our sample size, the more certain we can be of our estimate.
 
I don't think there needs to be any more tests, honestly. That's more than enough. We can safely conclude that Zoom Lens increases accuracy by 20% if the Pokemon holding it goes last. Good job.
 
Ability Sand Veil will prevent buffet damage from Sandstorm even if the Pokemon is not Steel, Rock or Ground. This only applies to Cacnea and Cacturne though.
 
Necrochild313 said:
How do the SE reducing berries work alongside Solid Rock/Filter? I would imagine the damage is reduced twice, does anybody know for sure?
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Yes. The damage is reduced to its regular 1.33x with the effect (2.66x if it's a 4x weakness), then it is cut in half by the berry (making it an abysmal ~.67).
Not tested, but I can only assume this is how it works. May test tomorrow.

Ability Sand Veil will prevent buffet damage from Sandstorm even if the Pokemon is not Steel, Rock or Ground. This only applies to Cacnea and Cacturne though.
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Does this apply to Role Player, Skill Swappers, Tracers, etc?
And similarly, what about tracing/Role Playing/etc Sandstream? I can assume it might do the same.

And what about the one that raises evasion in a hailstorm?
 
Boa1891 said:
Does this apply to Role Player, Skill Swappers, Tracers, etc?
And similarly, what about tracing/Role Playing/etc Sandstream? I can assume it might do the same.

And what about the one that raises evasion in a hailstorm?
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Yeah, I just tested it. I took a Mr. Mime with Role Play to Route 228 and Role Played a wild Dugtrio with Sand Veil. Mr. Mime took no buffet damage from Sandstorm.

I only noticed this because I was hunting for Cacnea there and realized they weren't taking buffet damage despite their typing.

There aren't any non-Ice Pokemon that knows Snow Cloak naturally, but I think it'd be the same as Sand Veil if copied or something.
 
Mario with Lasers said:
About Zoom Lens, tha accuracy boost will only last for that turn, right?
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Honestly, I haven't extensively tested that. It's technically possible that once you get one more-accurate attack, the rest of your attacks are more accurate no matter when you act in the turn. That being said, it's incredibly unlikely that this is the case. I believe it gives the accuracy boost on a case-by-case basis. It doesn't show a graphic of any sort when the accuracy boost occurs, so I'm assuming it's not a permanent stat boost.

It's not even that it 'lasts for a turn', though. If you use an attack against two targets at once and only one of the two has taken an action, you'll probably get the accuracy boost against the target that has acted and you won't get the boost against the target that hasn't acted.
 
Since Zoom Lens's accuracy boost works only if the user goes last, I'd assume that it works only until the end of that turn. What I mean is that I'm assuming that if the user of Zoom Lens goes last also in the following turn, the accuracy is boosted by 20% (of the original accuracy, not that of the previous turn), and if it goes first, the accuracy goes back to normal. Meaning:

Turn 1:
Opponent does something
User holding Zoom Lens attacks with 120% of the normal accuracy.

Turn 2:
Opponent does something
User holding Zoom Lens attacks with 120% of the normal accuracy (not 120% of 120%).

Turn 3:
User holding Zoom Lens uses Quick Attack with normal accuracy.
Opponent does something
 
OmegaDonut said:
Assist: In Colosseum, Assist did not call on the moves of fainted teammates, while in RSE in-game, it did. How does it behave in DP\PBR?
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A Glameow used Assist on me, using one of it's teammate's moves. It was the trainer's last Pokemon, so it does call on fainted teammates.
 
Wichu said:
A Glameow used Assist on me, using one of it's teammate's moves. It was the trainer's last Pokemon, so it does call on fainted teammates.
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Hmm, I thought I took that off the list. Actually, I'm just wondering if it works in PBR now, since PBR and Colosseum seem to share the same idiosyncrasies, such as Fighting moves not hitting Sableye super-effective (just normal damage) even after using Foresight.
 
Jibaku said:
Does the priority of Pursuit change when one opponent switches in doubles?
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Only if the opponent being targeted by Pursuit switches. Not if your ally or the other opponent switch.

EDIT: Confirmed that Light Clay does not extend the duration of Safeguard (or Tailwind, for what it's worth).
 
I just a little testing with a few Hacked Arcues. Plates change Arcues appearance regardless of it's ability. However it will still be normal type. Also when he is sent out he will be normal, but then text appears that says "Arcues Transformed!" and Arcues changes his colour, but not his type. This could answer someone's statement about how they fought a ghost arcues that got hit SE by fighting moves.

Also this leads me to assume that it's not Arcues' ability that gives it a sticky hold effect, but Arcues itself.
 
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