Empoleon (Update)

[Seven Deadly Sins]

After a little tweaking, the best spread for Empoleon is:

12 HP / 252 SAtk / 244 Spe

244 Spe Modest hits 217, which after +2 outspeeds neutral +1/Scarf Electivire and Yanmega. Stupid, I know, but better safe than sorry. 12 HP with a 31 IV lets you sub 3 times to Petaya from full HP. Maxed SAtk is obviously important.

 

[cim]

I can't touch this til I get home from vacation but I thought I'd start a discussion on some post mence changes quick:

-ice beam is a bit more viable with dragonite and shaymin so it'll get stronger emphasis, gk remains the first slash imo though
-any reason not to use GK on the lead?
-should defensive be tailored more to kingdra or should it be kept as is?

 

[Deaga]

After a little tweaking, the best spread for Empoleon is:

12 HP / 252 SAtk / 244 Spe

244 Spe Modest hits 217, which after +2 outspeeds neutral +1/Scarf Electivire and Yanmega. Stupid, I know, but better safe than sorry. 12 HP with a 31 IV lets you sub 3 times to Petaya from full HP. Maxed SAtk is obviously important.

If you're going to use that much speed, isn't it better to simply use 252 Speed and adjust the HP IV so that you can activate Petaya on the third Sub? The tie against opposing Empoleon may be very situational, but so are 12 HP EVs...

 

[Luf]

If you're going to use that much speed, isn't it better to simply use 252 Speed and adjust the HP IV so that you can activate Petaya on the third Sub? The tie against opposing Empoleon may be very situational, but so are 12 HP EVs...

So it only takes 3 Subs to activate the Pinch Berry instead of 4. That also means it's harder for CB Scizor to revenge kill you because Bullet Punch does 14.5% - 17%.

 

[cim]

If you're going to use that much speed, isn't it better to simply use 252 Speed and adjust the HP IV so that you can activate Petaya on the third Sub? The tie against opposing Empoleon may be very situational, but so are 12 HP EVs...

I can't really see when you'd ever have the same number of Agilities and neither of you would have the Sub advantage...

I forget why the EVs for Speed are the way they are in the writeup right now (probably +1 Gyarados or something, could drop to adamant +1 base90), but the EVs in Defense make living through Bullet Punch a lot easier... That's less of an issue now so moving them to HP to help with the Subs probably isn't so bad. I'll (re)look into it.

 

[Setsuna]

I can't touch this til I get home from vacation but I thought I'd start a discussion on some post mence changes quick:

-ice beam is a bit more viable with dragonite and shaymin so it'll get stronger emphasis, gk remains the first slash imo though
-any reason not to use GK on the lead?
-should defensive be tailored more to kingdra or should it be kept as is?

1. Agree.
2. No. Keep Grass Knot on the lead set.
3. No, Pokemon such as Heatran and Shaymin are more common right now, and the situation will continue being like that for the time being. So investing Evs in the Special Defense is useful, since it permits Empoleon to take hits from the aforementioned Pokemon in a better way.

 

[cim]

update: i'll do this this weekend, fuck college

by 2 i meant "is there any reason one SHOULDNT use gk"

3 yeah i agree but empoleon is "the kingdra counter" so i dunno? maybe 2 sets or spreads, i'll figure it out?

EDIT: I have had extraordinarily bad luck this week, this WILL BE DONE

 

[Setsuna]

I don't mean to rush this, but Empoleon is one of the few Pokemon that hasn't had an OU update yet, and I really want to get this done as soon as possible. Thanks!

 

[Rising_Dusk]

Okay, well, this has been sitting around for long enough that we are reassigning it. I'll be taking the writing for this over so that it can get on-site pronto using this thread as a guide for how it passed QC. (I will change nothing about the sets)