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From Untiereds to Ubers

Wow, for my first customized pet mod in this thread, NO, in pet mods as a whole, I did pretty good! On votes anyways
... Not to say that's the only one I made in pet mods, but still!
 
SteelixPrismGX said:
Hey, Jamis361 or OM!, when do you guys plan to start up submissions again and update the spreadsheet?
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Jamis361 is in charge of the spreadsheet, I will count the votes at the end of today.

And from there all active players will discuss both in here and on Discord any suggestions to what has won already before we move on to the next slate.

Here is a link to our DISCORD CHANNEL so if you prefer more rapid responses you can discuss here. Reminder: Be fair, honest, helpful, and direct. State why, state alternatives to what you feel needs to be changed, and be willing to consider feedback when it’s your submission people are talking about. Ultimately the coder, Jamis361, and I will make the final edit, but we will consider what anyone brings up, if backed by solid reasoning, and presented in a respectable manner.

I will also try and discuss with our coder if there are any mechanics that cannot be implemented, if so I will make a rule saying “XYZ is not possible” to ensure we only do submissions that are realistic- and edit any winners to match the mechanics. At this point it seems all changes would be feasible but it’s important to just acknowledge the process.

Once discussion is done we will begin the coding process. During the coding process we will open up the 4th Slate submissions.

Let’s aim for a the rest of the month (12 days from July 20-31) of discussion on what winners need to be looked at once again for any changes. We will consider both the original Ubers Tier as well as all winning slates thus far (hence we have to be fair that if something seems overpowered but there are many checks to it in the same winning slate or other slates, then it is not OP bc of now it is surrounded by other new check/counter changes).

Jamis361 I await your approval for this schedule plan.

Come August 1 is Slate 4, and the actual coding begins.

P.S. Slate 4 will take into consideration what takes place in the discussion leading up to it. If we find that the FUtU metagame is too offensive we will consider defensive and supportive slates, if we find it too defensive we will consider offensive and offensive supportive slates, if we find that the slate is too supportive we will consider offensive and defensive, or if we find that we have too few Pokémon of a specific type or too many of a specific type we can focus on limiting our focus to combat overcentralization.
 
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OM! said:
Jamis361 is in charge of the spreadsheet, I will count the votes at the end of today.

And from there all active players will discuss both in here and on Discord any suggestions to what has won already before we move on to the next slate.

Here is a link to our DISCORD CHANNEL so if you prefer more rapid responses you can discuss here. Reminder: Be fair, honest, helpful, and direct. State why, state alternatives to what you feel needs to be changed, and be willing to consider feedback when it’s your submission people are talking about. Ultimately the coder, Jamis361, and I will make the final edit, but we will consider what anyone brings up, if backed by solid reasoning, and presented in a respectable manner.

I will also try and discuss with our coder if there are any mechanics that cannot be implemented, if so I will make a rule saying “XYZ is not possible” to ensure we only do submissions that are realistic- and edit any winners to match the mechanics. At this point it seems all changes would be feasible but it’s important to just acknowledge the process.

Once discussion is done we will begin the coding process. During the coding process we will open up the 4th Slate submissions.

Let’s aim for a the rest of the month (12 days from July 20-31) of discussion on what winners need to be looked at once again for any changes. We will consider both the original Ubers Tier as well as all winning slates thus far (hence we have to be fair that if something seems overpowered but there are many checks to it in the same winning slate or other slates, then it is not OP bc of now it is surrounded by other new check/counter changes).

Jamis361 I await your approval for this schedule plan.

Come August 1 is Slate 4, and the actual coding begins.

P.S. Slate 4 will take into consideration what takes place in the discussion leading up to it. If we find that the FUtU metagame is too offensive we will consider defensive and supportive slates, if we find it too defensive we will consider offensive and offensive supportive slates, if we find that the slate is too supportive we will consider offensive and defensive, or if we find that we have too few Pokémon of a specific type or too many of a specific type we can focus on limiting our focus to combat overcentralization.
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Consider it approved!

I will give any other potential voters until the end of the day to submit their votes. Then, OM! will tally the votes and I will update the spreadsheet (which as far as I know, is up to date) to include the new winners. Right now, it’s looking like we are once again going to include all subs with 3+ votes, so if anyone wants to change that and hasn’t voted already, put your thoughts out there in a vote!
 
Jamis361's Rapidash
sumwum's Delibird
G-Luke's Swanna
Jerry hillenburg's Relicanth
 
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OM! said:
Edited with all of G-Luke’s votes:

Votes so far:

5 votes
Swanna G-Luke

4 votes
Mr. Mime OM!
Relicanth Jerry hillenburg
Delibird sumwun

3 votes
Luvdisc Jamis361
Pacharisu SteelixPrismGX
Gogoat Anaconja

2 votes
Whishcash Stealthbomber16
Arbok Bmw6446
Muk money12wolf
Rapidash Jamis361

1 vote
Bellossom Jamis361
Stantler Anaconja
Watchog G-Luke
Kricketune Anaconja
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With exactly 1 1st Place Finalist, 3 2nd Place Finalists, and 2 3rd Place Finalist, we have exactly 6 Winners!

G-Luke for 1st Place! Golden Glory!

OM! , Jerry hillenburg , and sumwun for 2nd Place! Silver Spectacular!

Jamis361 , SteelixPrismGX and Anaconja for 3rd Place! Bronze Brillance!

Congrats to all of our winning submissions — and to celebrate... we will discuss how all of the slates are going to develop the metagame! Let your submissions’ impact be known.
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From July 20-31, let’s discuss the metagame (both here and on Discord) in 5 key factors. Please try to address as many of these as you can in your posts so we can cover all of our bases. Of course, discussing one point is fine, but it helps to touch on multiple, if possible:

1. Impact - How do these winners affect each other and the original Ubers Tier viable Pokémon metagame, at large? Has a new viable counter emerged against key Uber threats, walls, supporters?

2. Precedence - What changes do these Slate winners have on the metagame, including Items, Abilities, and Moves introduced. Items are sometimes interchangeable, and may be able to serve use on even regular Ubers, while new abilities and moves might see some repeats in future submissions.

3. Standards - Are we creating things that override what our goal is “benefitting the Ubers metagame”? Are we letting creativity, or maximizing our favorites overshadow keeping Ubers from what it is meant to be, are we even keeping Ubers from becoming what it ought to be?

4. Role - Stat distribution, typing combinations, and use / role in the metagame are necessary to not only justify our submissions, but to justify the point of the thread “providing us what we need to balance Ubers”.

5. Balance - Is there a good balance of support, offense, defense? Are there too many ______ types, of too few ______ types, such as too many Dragons, and Psychics, but too few Fairies and Darks? Too many hazards setters, and too many set up sweepers but not enough clerics to Defog or Haze away the offense?

Jamis361 feel free to add or change any subjects and ideas I brought up here.
 
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Well, since you really want us to talk about how our submissions affected the metagame...

Firstly, my Relicanth honestly is one of the best support you could ask for if it existed, due to spore and glare, as well as defensive barrier. I could see someone sending this out first because of that bulk and stealth rock. It deals with both primals pretty... Uhh... Alright as best, but stuff about them that really annoys it is Primal Groudon that is the solar beam variant, and Primal Kyogre gets lucky with thunder.
As for whether you should go for spore or glare, it depends. You could use spore for Lugia so that it can't phase away your Relicanth before it sets up defensive barrier (do watch out for Toxic though regardless as it is slower than all the viable ubers), or generally any mon, but only one because sleep clause but it does best at trolling Lugia, or you could use glare to try as an attempt to ignore sleep clause, but paralysis isn't quite as busted as sleep as you can still do stuff with paralyzation, but it's just the paralyzed Mon being slower and it's only a 30% chance it will stop it from moving.

Defensive barrier can be great for giving Relicanth more bulk to use it's support better for 2 turns (4 with terrain extender), or if you was to run terrain extender, support sweepers that you may have. Also with terrain extender it let's Relicanth use it's supporting moves more, but granted if you want a true support move then this is the most supporty you'll get of all moves.

Now, this thing has rock head head smash for a good reason: So it's not taunt fodder. Most support mons are complete taunt bait, and while this will lose it's other options and is slow enough to get taunted by pretty much everything that can taunt, it still has head smash so it can still do stuff, even when taunted. Although if it gets taunted it becomes primal groudon bait, and that is the most dangerous Mon in ubers.

It's bulk can be pretty good too, because it can live a hit from xerneas and glare it, or use spore on it, but that's only with special investment. It can take a hit from Rayquaza and use status or head smash to do major stuff to it. And Ho-Oh? Don't even think about Ho-oh vs this thing, one head smash and it is dead. However, it does get balanced out because Lugia can toxic it and it's HP will go down more and more, and if it was to play mind games via using whirlwind, you can forget about defensive Barrier if it predicted that. Furthermore, it gets smacked by solar beam primal groudon, takes major damage but not OHKOd from a groudon's precipice blades or earthquake, and gets beat by it no matter what if it was taunted, hates Primal Kyogre loving to run thunder, it is stupidly slow, slower than dusk mane Necrozma even, so uhh swords dance and then an earthquake or it's Z move is going to nuke Relicanth, and since Relicanth is slower than it, it will get to use one of those 3. And if Relicanth already used spore on something else, then it can set up and kill very safely, and do NOT use defensive barrier against this thing if you can't put it to sleep and glare hasn't been used on it, as it can just set up to +6 and steamroll your team, and who knows it may be a ultra Necrozma so that'll stop primal groudon and yveltal if it is, but you do not know which one it is! Lastly, never let this thing eat a grass move, as it is 4X weak to it, although this one isn't a big problem as the only real uber that is a grass type is Shaymin sky, but it's not super dominant or anything like that, so you don't need to worry too much, although you still shouldn't let this thing eat a seed flare.

Overall, it gets balanced out by being big primal groudon bait, being primal Kyogre bait, having to guess what Lugia is even going to do a majority of the time, being bait for Dusk Mane Necrozma to sweep, and unlike Lugia who is also really bulky, it has no reliable way to recover, and any grass move will just splat it dead, while at the same time it has enough bulk to use it's tools effectively, can take on Rayquaza with ease, defensive barrier with terrain extender can really help you're team out, head smash makes it not complete taunt bait, it can utilize 100% accuracy status, and set up hazards. Overall, yeah it gets balanced out from it's upsides and flaws.
 
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Here is a recap of all prior Slate Winners, so we can discuss the slates in their entirety.
Slate Winners Resources List

Slate 1:
1st Place Tie Winners

Persian - 5 votes OM!
Wailord - 5 votes Scoopapa

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2nd Place Tie Winners

Farfetch’d - 4 votes Failure999
Wigglytuff - 4 votes Jamis361
Kecleon - 4 votes Anaconja
Solrock - 4 votes Tmi489
Slate 2:
1st Place Winner

Swalot - 5 votes G-Luke

——————

2nd Place Tie Winners

Lunatone - 4 votes OM!
Huntail - 4 votes Steel With It
Cherrim - 4 votes Scoopapa
Rampardos- 4 votes Demon Dragon
Heatmor - 4 votes Anaconja
Maractus - 4 votes Stealthbomber16
Slate 3:
1st Place Winner

Swanna - 5 votes G-Luke

——————

2nd Place Tie Winners

Mr. Mime - 4 votes OM!
Delibird - 4 votes sumwun
Relicanth - 4 votes Jerry hillenburg

3rd Place Tie Winners

Luvdisc - 3 votes Jamis361
Pacharisu - 3 votes SteelixPrismGX
Gogoat - 3 votes Anaconja
Full List - Updated Per Slate
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Jamis361 please add the hide section to the OP. It will definitely help people from accidentally submitting the same Pokémon twice, and will be easier than scrolling thru the spreadsheet, as I have linked the actual Submission Post in the Pokemon’s Name, and then beside it listed the Votes and tagged the User who submitted it.

By adding to the OP - This will be updated after each slate finishes so we do not have to rebuild from scratch, and I can quickly search for it to copy / paste prior to each discussion break we have between slates.

Easiest way to add it is to just Click REPLY to this post, and edit out everything after the end hide tag. And just copy and paste. (And remove the Quote tags of course!)
 
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Hey, Jamis361, you should probably split up the "Oricorio" part for the spreadsheet for this Pet Mod. There's two types of Untiered Oricorio, Base Form Oricorio, and Oricorio-Pa'u, and to be honest, if you split up the "Oricorio" part, that'll give people a clearer idea on which type of Untiered Oricorio have already won (obviously none have yet, but just in case). And do that for the "Wormadam" section as well.
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SteelixPrismGX said:
Not yet. I think Jamis361 said that submissions would open on August 1st.
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sumwun said:
Are submissions open now? Also now that my Delibird won, will you implement the Santa Clause?
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I made an announcement that discussion is between now and August 1st so we have time to review if any of the slates that won need to be revised so they don’t dominate the original Ubers and eachother.

Let’s focus on fixing anything that needs to be done with “too much, too weak, needs this or that... etc.”

My goal is that on August 1st we can have the Coders begin putting together the final draft of what we agree on and then take the eventual next slate to start, while we can soon have the ability to play it on Pokémon Showdown!

Scroll up to see my post or click here.
 
With only a week to spare, let's formally begin discussion! Any and all members with interest in the metagame are welcome to put in their two cents.

I think that OM!'s Persian needs a nerf, considering its typing and access to insanely powerful no-drawback STAB moves. OM! has already proposed a few changes to his Persian that will make it quite a bit more manageable, the most obvious of these being the removal of Boomburst from its movepool. It's fair to say that not much other than Ghost-types can switch in on a +3 Boomburst off of 119 base SpA and expect to get out alive, so this is most certainly a necessary nerf. Tail Glow has also been proposed to be removed, although with access to Nasty Plot already plus the fact that its most overwhelmingly powerful STAB move is no longer an issue, this might not be as necessary.
 
Jamis361 said:
With only a week to spare, let's formally begin discussion! Any and all members with interest in the metagame are welcome to put in their two cents.

I think that OM!'s Persian needs a nerf, considering its typing and access to insanely powerful no-drawback STAB moves. OM! has already proposed a few changes to his Persian that will make it quite a bit more manageable, the most obvious of these being the removal of Boomburst from its movepool. It's fair to say that not much other than Ghost-types can switch in on a +3 Boomburst off of 119 base SpA and expect to get out alive, so this is most certainly a necessary nerf. Tail Glow has also been proposed to be removed, although with access to Nasty Plot already plus the fact that its most overwhelmingly powerful STAB move is no longer an issue, this might not be as necessary.
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Don’t worry I already took all of the changes into consideration when it was first discussed last month in the Discord and made sure we only had Hyper Voice and Nasty Plot, in addition to the Z-move, and edited my post since then.
 
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With that, the changes that Persian will receive are as follows:
Removal of Boomburst
Removal of Tail Glow

Are there any other elements that we should discuss? Don't hesitate to propose anything, we need to keep this discussion active so we don't regret it later!
 
WigglytuffNormalFairyThick FatCompetitiveMagic Bounce18080851059060600Moonblast, Slack Off, Boomburst, Puff Up

180 / 85 / 90 bulk is pretty ridiculous, it's not quite Cresselia but it's close. Puff Up is Cosmic Power + a special attack boost. Magic Bounce shuts down most of the ways you are supposed to deal with a bulky boosting threat for free. Even just the bulk + Magic Bounce is suspect, as a Magic Bounce pokemon this bulky unfairly craps on any team that leans heavily on status moves. Boomburst destroys any notion of it being passive. This is going to be too easy to set up, too bulky and powerful once set up, and it's going to screw over most hazard setters and walls without even clicking an attack.

Farfetch'dFightingFlyingSuper LuckSniperAerilate721351056390105570Stomping Tantrum, Drill Run, Karate Chop, Cross Chop, Sacred Sword, Leaf Blade, Blaze Kick, Flare Blitz, Extreme Speed, Aerial Stab

The whole ate-Speed with 135 Atk thing raises my eyebrows a bit. Less sure about this one, but I think CB Aerilate Extremespeed is going to be a hassle for offense. It distracts from all the crit / stick stuff that is Farfetch'ds shtick anyway, as I'd rather use Aerilate Extremespeed every time.
 
RelicanthWaterRockRock Head1309011010010070600Spore, Glare, Defensive Barrier
how tf does this guy get spore remove it lmao

SwannaWaterFlyingDelta Stream1151377313773118653Swords Dance, Hydro Pump, U-turn, Grass Knot
Really high BST for some reason, and gets only 2x Electric weakness with Swords Dance + Liquidation and Brave Bird. Sounds like a Rayquaza-Mega-Lite, but then again its main STAB damages it heavily and it doesn't get Dragon Dance. I'm suspicious of this mon though.

SwalotPoisonNormalRegeneratorGluttonyGuts13012311510311574710Recycle, Belly Drum, Quick Attack, Earth Power, Hyper Voice, Curse, Flamethrower
This mon is nuts with comparable bulk to Giratina + reliable recovery in Regenerator, inability to be eliminated by Gengar, and high difficulty in being worn down. Needs a major nerf.

PersianNormalGhostCompound EyesDazzlingNine Lives79597911979139554Lovely Kiss, Lingering Blast (Lingering Surround)
I still don't like this mon. Nine Lives is just another cheese option for HO, idk how Persian gets Lovely Kiss really (don't give me crap like how it uses its tongue by that logic any mon can use Lovely Kiss), and Lingering Blast is again another cheese option for offense to break down defensive mons. IMO boost its SpA a little bit and then remove Lovely Kiss (it has Hypnosis) and remove Spite crap from Lingering Blast.

also remove compound eyes. persian has two eyes goddammit.
 
Anaconja said:
RelicanthWaterRockRock Head1309011010010070600Spore, Glare, Defensive Barrier
how tf does this guy get spore remove it lmao

SwannaWaterFlyingDelta Stream1151377313773118653Swords Dance, Hydro Pump, U-turn, Grass Knot
Really high BST for some reason, and gets only 2x Electric weakness with Swords Dance + Liquidation and Brave Bird. Sounds like a Rayquaza-Mega-Lite, but then again its main STAB damages it heavily and it doesn't get Dragon Dance. I'm suspicious of this mon though.

SwalotPoisonNormalRegeneratorGluttonyGuts13012311510311574710Recycle, Belly Drum, Quick Attack, Earth Power, Hyper Voice, Curse, Flamethrower
This mon is nuts with comparable bulk to Giratina + reliable recovery in Regenerator, inability to be eliminated by Gengar, and high difficulty in being worn down. Needs a major nerf.

PersianNormalGhostCompound EyesDazzlingNine Lives79597911979139554Lovely Kiss, Lingering Blast (Lingering Surround)
I still don't like this mon. Nine Lives is just another cheese option for HO, idk how Persian gets Lovely Kiss really (don't give me crap like how it uses its tongue by that logic any mon can use Lovely Kiss), and Lingering Blast is again another cheese option for offense to break down defensive mons. IMO boost its SpA a little bit and then remove Lovely Kiss (it has Hypnosis) and remove Spite crap from Lingering Blast.

also remove compound eyes. persian has two eyes goddammit.
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Compound eyes can be replaced and I can also remove Lovely Kiss, but at that point it becomes really hard for it to set up since it’s pretty frail and relying on Hypnosis to be able to use Nasty Plot is very much a risk without Focus Sash.

This is Ubers, and the power behind Moves will surely KO it if it cannot land a Sleep move.

I am going to make Lingering Blast a Sound Move that just reduce the foe’s Evasion by 1. This simultaneously punishes the foe for staying in, while improving the accuracy of its own moves.

In order to replace Compound Eyes; what about do you all suggest?

I was thinking Intimidate since it works with its flavor, while also making up for a lack of Hypnosis Accuracy. Intimidate as an ability makes for a great lead as well, and can support your team, and works with U-Turn to serve your team even if it needs to escape the foe.

So at this point, its main moveset will likely be Hypnosis, Hyper Voice, Lingering Blast, and Nasty Plot with 9 Lives serving as the main niche to justify using something so frail.
 
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Scoopapa said:
WigglytuffNormalFairyThick FatCompetitiveMagic Bounce18080851059060600Moonblast, Slack Off, Boomburst, Puff Up

180 / 85 / 90 bulk is pretty ridiculous, it's not quite Cresselia but it's close. Puff Up is Cosmic Power + a special attack boost. Magic Bounce shuts down most of the ways you are supposed to deal with a bulky boosting threat for free. Even just the bulk + Magic Bounce is suspect, as a Magic Bounce pokemon this bulky unfairly craps on any team that leans heavily on status moves. Boomburst destroys any notion of it being passive. This is going to be too easy to set up, too bulky and powerful once set up, and it's going to screw over most hazard setters and walls without even clicking an attack.
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I for sure agree with you. 180 HP is definitely way too high with such decent defenses, so I will back the removal of Boomburst and a 30 point HP reduction (180->150). Magic Bounce could also be removed, but I feel that would neuter its niche in Ubers, since it would be so easy to shut down with Toxic (I don't think Wiggs really has room to be running RestTalk). Perhaps Magic Guard could act as a decent replacement, still providing the Toxic immunity but turning it into Taunt bait and allowing opponents to safely set up hazards without giving Wiggs a free switch in.

Anaconja said:
RelicanthWaterRockRock Head1309011010010070600Spore, Glare, Defensive Barrier
how tf does this guy get spore remove it lmao

SwannaWaterFlyingDelta Stream1151377313773118653Swords Dance, Hydro Pump, U-turn, Grass Knot
Really high BST for some reason, and gets only 2x Electric weakness with Swords Dance + Liquidation and Brave Bird. Sounds like a Rayquaza-Mega-Lite, but then again its main STAB damages it heavily and it doesn't get Dragon Dance. I'm suspicious of this mon though.

SwalotPoisonNormalRegeneratorGluttonyGuts13012311510311574710Recycle, Belly Drum, Quick Attack, Earth Power, Hyper Voice, Curse, Flamethrower
This mon is nuts with comparable bulk to Giratina + reliable recovery in Regenerator, inability to be eliminated by Gengar, and high difficulty in being worn down. Needs a major nerf.

PersianNormalGhostCompound EyesDazzlingNine Lives79597911979139554Lovely Kiss, Lingering Blast (Lingering Surround)
I still don't like this mon. Nine Lives is just another cheese option for HO, idk how Persian gets Lovely Kiss really (don't give me crap like how it uses its tongue by that logic any mon can use Lovely Kiss), and Lingering Blast is again another cheese option for offense to break down defensive mons. IMO boost its SpA a little bit and then remove Lovely Kiss (it has Hypnosis) and remove Spite crap from Lingering Blast.

also remove compound eyes. persian has two eyes goddammit.
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These are all great points. I really was not a fan of Swanna's and Swalot's ridiculous stats, seeing as the point of this Pet Mod was to give regular Pokémon tools to compete with the big boys, and huge stats just make them the big boys themselves. While toying around in the spreadsheet I came up with a 82/127/73/127/73/118 spread for Swanna and a 110/103/105/103/105/74 spread for Swalot, bringing them both down to the standard 600 BST. As for the other problems you mentioned with these two, I'm not sure exactly how I would deal, so I'd like to hear input from you as to what you think needs to happen.
I'm sorry Jerry, but given the complete lack of mushrooms on Relicanth's body, I'm gonna have to side with Anaconja on this one. Relicanth's huge bulk and unique barrier move more than justify its use without the need for a frankly nonsensical sleep move. And speaking of sleep moves, Lovely Kiss could potentially be a problem, but like you said Anaconja, it already gets Hypnosis, and given its shaky 75% accuracy (barely a step above Hypnosis's 60%) with Sleep Clause in effect it shouldn't be much of a problem imo. However, I also think that since Lingering Blast is already so powerful, it really doesn't need such a strong guaranteed effect. The removal of Lingering Blast's Spite effect will solve any frustration issues, and also put it in line with EQ (i.e. easier to code).

EDIT: Totally missed the part about Compound Eyes. That would invalidate my point about Lovely Kiss, but since OM! is happy to switch it out my point still stands
 
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So I have a solution:

Removal of Compound Eyes- replaces with Intimidate.

Removal of Lovely Kiss completely.

Lingering Blast, like Defog, now lowers the foe’s Evasion 1 stage, and qualifies as a Sound move.

This fits the flavor quite nicely as a blast of Sound makes sense for a Pokémon like Persian that knows Screech, Roar, Hyper Voice, etc. and a blast of sound works for its Z-move Lingering Surround.

Soundproof now can block both of its STAB moves and with a standard set including Nasty Plot and Hypnosis, I feel that it’s much easier to Wall now.

Lastly, having an effect is important bc anything with the word Lingering in its name needs to make an impact and have some sort of lasting effect. It won’t be as abusive as +1 accuracy, as the foe can switch out to remove the effects, but it still partners well with Intimidate to reduce the foe’s stats.

Finally, Persian will also have +40 Attack so it still stays under 600 suggested cap BST, and have a mild, (for Ubers), 99 Base Attack, so it’s U-Turn packs a small bite with Life Orb.

Remember, with it maxing it’s Speed, it will invest in SpA so U-Turn is likely to rely on Life Orb as it’s sole boost.

With Intimidate, U-Turn. Lingering Blast, and it’s wide array of moves, Persian will be a unique Sweeper that can be walled by Soundproof; Unaware, and is frail enough to feel less domineering without the accuracy of Compound Eyes or Lovely Kiss.

Move description:

Lingering Blast-

“The user's piercing voice interrupts the opponents concentration, making it easier to strike”

Lingering Surround-

“The user's piercing voice covers the battlefield with a Magical Forcefield to disarm items for all active Pokémon” (Activates Magic Room after successful execution).
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The other benefit of Jamis361 suggestion in Wigglytuff for Magic Guard is that it can use Life Orb and boost Hyper Voice to reasonable damage without being as powerful as Boomburst (117 for LO Hypervoice vs LO Boomburst 182).

That’s a good range and I think Wiggly is more balanced due to it.
 
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