Gastrodon (Placeholder)


<3 <3 <3 <3

Gastrodon
Status: Will be written up in about a week's time.

QC: (, , , ) GP: (, , , )

[Overview]

  • Whilst Gastrodon isn't as popular as other bulky waters such as Slowbro, Empoleon and Milotic, it does hold some advantages over them in key situations.
  • For example, Gastrodon has an immunity to Electric attacks instead of a weakness, and since popular Fire types such as Victini and Arcanine run Electric coverage moves instead of Grass ones, Gastrodon can often completely wall them.
  • Gastrodon also has useful dual STAB in Earthquake or Earth Power, which can be used to smack around the Poison and Steel types that can't be hit by Toxic.
  • Not to mention Gastrodon has the support movepool of a god. It has Counter + Mirror Coat, Stockpile, Amnesia and Curse, Recover, Clear Smog, even Memento! What Gastrodon lacks in sheer walling capacity it makes up for in versatility.
  • Storm Drain's buff, now granting immunity to Water attacks and giving Gastrodon a Special Attack boost, is also very nice. Unfortunately, almost all Water types in the tier run Toxic and outspeed Gastrodon, which means that Gastrodon will rarely be in a good position to use it.

[Set]
Name: Tank
Move 1: Earth Power
Move 2: Surf / Ice Beam
Move 3: Toxic
Move 4: Recover
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
Nature: Modest
EVs: 252 HP / 124 Def / 76 SpA / 56 SpD

[Set Comments]

  • This set provides a balance of defense and offense, tanking hits from common attackers as well as dealing decent damage especially if it gets a Storm Drain boost.
  • Surf is good primary STAB as usual, getting some crucial KOs with its base power and Gastrodon's good special attack. Earth Power is dual STAB that can hit the Steel and Poison types which are immune to Toxic hard. Toxic deals with anything that Gastrodon can't really deal much damage to, and is useful in general for such a bulky wall. Recover gives it the fabled instant recovery that everyone wants.

[Additional Comments]

  • Gastrodon is simply an excellent check to Victini, Arcanine, Zapdos and Nidoking with this EV spread. For example, Gastrodon is never 2HKO'd by LO Victini's V-Create or Zen Headbutt, and always survives Final Gambit if it hasn't taken prior damage. LO Arcanine can't 3HKO with Flare Blitz or 2HKO with Close Combat, and with lowered defenses both Fire types are taken out by Surf with certainty, unless Victini has HP investment for some reason. If it does, it's Trick Room Victini, and that could mean it's in a whole other world of trouble.
  • Zapdos can't do shit to Gastrodon without HP Grass or Toxic, and even then HP Grass doesn't OHKO Gastrodon without a Life Orb. Nidoking also can't take out Gastrodon with a combination of Ice Beam + Earth Power, so basically Gastrodon can switch in on any attack other than Earthpower and KO 100% of the time with Surf and SR
  • Special Kingdra is also dealt with fairly easily, with LO Draco Meteor never managing a KO and being healed off fairly easily. However, physical sets with Outrage can prove a nuisance, so be aware of this.
  • Scald is another STAB option, but it lacks the ability to either burn or OHKO -1 Victini or -1 Arcanine. If you're not particularly fussed about OHKOing these two, since you wall them anyways, by all means go for Scald. Ice Beam can be used over Surf if you're not concerned about the OHKO too, giving you better coverage and letting you hit Grass types on the switch.
  • If you're using either of these attacking options, then using a 252 HP / 124 Def / 132 SpD Calm EV spread is recommended, giving you better special bulk and thus slightly more general utility.

[Set]
Name: All-Out-Attacker
Move 1: Surf
Move 2: Earth Power
Move 3: Ice Beam
Move 4: Recover
Item: Life Orb
Ability: Storm Drain
Nature: Modest
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe

[Set Comments]

  • Here, Gastrodon sacrifices some of its bulk to go on the offensive, in a similar vein to Life Orb Milotic. Whilst Gastrodon is slower and not as bulk, it boasts dual STAB and perfect neutral coverage, as well as a possible SpA boost from Storm Drain.
  • Surf is picked over Scald for the power, Earth Power and Ice Beam follow it up as the perfect coverage options and Recover tops it all off, letting Gastrodon heal off residual damage and weaker attacks.
[Additional Comments]

  • Since Gastrodon isn't outspeeding anything any time soon (other than Slowbro), he still gets to maintain most of his bulk whilst also having maximum offensive power.
  • Choice Specs can be used over Life Orb, but this limits Gastrodon's potential as an offensive tank in this tier; since there isn't going to be a likely Rain boost like OU, Specs Gastrodon just doesn't have the same wallbreaking power.
  • If you don't want to hit Grass types on the switch, then Hidden Power Grass can be used to hit other Gastrodon and Quagsire harder.

[Set]
Name: Rest Talk
Move 1: Rest
Move 2: Sleep Talk
Move 3: Earth Power
Move 4: Ice Beam / Scald
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain / Sticky Hold
Nature: Calm
EVs: 252 HP / 124 Def / 132 SpD

[Set Comments]

  • Whilst normally Gastrodon is extremely vulnerable to status, Rest + Sleep Talk effectively makes it a non issue, and can help to increase Gastrodon's stalling power.
  • Alongside RestTalk, Gastrodon can either run great neutral coverage or dual STAB, with both benefitting from a possible Storm Drain boost. However, since this Gastrodon set is wrecked more than any other by Trick users, Sticky Hold is perfectly viable as an ability. Whilst it can't augment Gastrodon's offensive power, it's arguably much more suited to hardcore stall teams.

[Set]
Name: Curse
Move 1: Curse
Move 2: Earthquake
Move 3: Waterfall / Stone Edge
Move 4: Recover
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
Nature: Careful
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Spe

[Set Comments]

  • Like Quagsire, Gastrodon makes a pretty good Curse user thanks to its good defensive typing, good STAB options, decent offense, etc.
  • After a Defense boost, Gastrodon will be almost impossible to OHKO without a Grass move. Meanwhile, Gastrodon can proceed to tear into the UU metagame with its highly valuable STABs.
  • Earthquake is your primary STAB choice due to its high base power and ability to hit bulky waters hard. Waterfall is good secondary STAB but has largely overlapping coverage, so Stone Edge may be used instead.
  • Gastrodon gets Recover! Thank god for that.
[Additional Comments]

  • With this EV spread, Gastrodon can survive even some Grass moves. For example, defensive Celebi's Giga Drain only deals 62.9% - 74.2%, letting it take a Grass type attack if necessary and at near full health. Special attackers that lack Grass type moves will have a tough time getting past this, with LO Nidoking's Earth Power dealing only 39.4% - 46.5%. Physical attackers are obviously screwed, especially since the most common choices tend to be Fire types. Adamant CB Reckless Staraptor fails to OHKO a +1 Gastrodon, dealing 78.4% - 92.5%.
  • If you're willing to build a team around it, Sand Power can also be used as Gastrodon's ability, and gives Gastrodon the equivalent of Base 114 Attack when using Earthquake / Stone Edge. The loss of Storm Drain isn't too bad for Gastrodon, since it really doesn't want to switch into most of the Water types in the tier anyways, and the Special Attack boost would go to waste. In this case, Stone Edge actualy outpowers Waterfall, and since it has a better secondary effect, it should always be used unless you have qualms over accuracy and PP.
[Other Options]

  • Gastrodon makes a great teammate to pokémon that are weak to Water and Electric types thanks to its immunities, such as Victini, Arcanine, etc.
  • Yawn can be used to phase opponents and give teammates setup opportunities, but it's hard to fit in over Recover or a STAB attack, and synergises poorly with Toxic.
  • Clear Smog works exactly like Haze except it's blocked by Substitute instead of Taunt. It can be useful when combined with Stockpile to deal with opposing stat boosters, but Gastrodon already has 4 moveslot syndrome as it is. If you don't want to use dual STAB, then it's a perfectly good option.
  • Memento can be used for setup opportunities, but it's generally a waste on such a bulky pokémon.
  • Substitute can be used on most sets for Gastrodon to use as an insurance against status, using it as bulky waters switch in, but again Gastrodon has issues fitting it onto its crowded movesets, and it's too slow to use Substitute to block status from anything other than Slowbro.
  • A Countercoat set can be run, thanks to Gastrodon's large HP, modest defenses and single weakness. However, realistically Wobbuffet outclasses this thanks to Shadow Tag and better support moves.
  • Stockpile can also be used to boost Gastrodon's bulk to near-unconquerable heights, but vulnerability to status and a 4x weakness to exploit make this somewhat unreliable. Against certain teams it's golden, against others it's worthless. Amnesia can be used in a similar way.
[Checks and Counters]

  • Chansey walls Gastrodon forever, doesn't care about status and can outspeed Gastrodon to Toxic it.
  • Boosting physical sweepers such as Heracross and Cobalion can make Gastrodon very uncomfortable, with Heracross being able to switch into Toxic and having decent enough special defensive to take a few STAB attacks, and Cobalion being a bulky mo-fo with Taunt and immunity to Poison.
  • Roserade can either destroy Gastrodon, set up on him or Sleep Powder a switching teammate. It's pretty much a hard counter unless you predict it switching in and hit it with Ice Beam.
[Dream World]

  • Dream World Gastrodon has been released with the ability Sand Force. Since Sandstorm is uncommon in UU it won't really get much use unless you dedicate your team around it, but it can let Gastrodon become a surprisingly powerful physical tank in the right hands. Then again, Storm Drain is also a boon to Sand teams thanks to the water immunity it provides the team.

PLACEHOLDER.
 

prem

failed abortion
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
choice specs is one of its best sets. well it is in ou, and i believe it would be effective in uu
 
This is incomplete, so an offensive set will be included eventually.

Also, Specs isn't as effective in UU since most of the Water types in the tier can take his Earth Power and hit him with Toxic. There's nothing like Rotom-W or Starmie that runs mostly offensive moves for Gastrodon to force out or take on. I get the feeling a Life Orb set would be most effective.
 

prem

failed abortion
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
ehh im not exactly sure. ill test it out cause i havent used gastro, i just know whenever i see this thing i cringe inside
 

breh

強いだね
note somewhere it 100% counters crocune.

I love Gastrodon. Pity it's so akward in this meta.

Ice Beam and Earth Power provide perfect coverage (bar Rotom-H, which does nothing to you) btw.
 
note somewhere it 100% counters crocune.
Unfortunately not, Gastrodon can't do anything to Crocune, which can just PP stall it to death since it's asleep half the time and thus not using PP. Like in the Ubers analysis, where Rest Talk CM Kyogre can beat Gastrodon via the same method.

Although that reminds me, I'm going to add a Curse set as well. THAT certainly beats Crocune.

REMINDER: The analysis isn't finished, I'll probably do some more work on it now.
 
I feel like the All-Out Attacker set kind of takes away the point of using Gastrodon, and abusing its bulkiness. I don't think that set is really viable and I would rather use the Tank set over it any day.
 
I suppose the primary point of Specs Gastrodon in OU was to absorb a Water attack and proceed to wallbreak, but with the lack of suitable Water types to switch in on Gastrodon is going to have a much harder abusing it. I might just slash Ice Beam onto the Tank set.
 

breh

強いだね
ok so I've been playing around with gastrodon and it's pretty cool. due to having a team full of rock-types, everything draws in water moves like it's nobody's business.

I've been running Recover/Ice Beam/Earth Power/Yawn (filler really) with aromatherapy support and it does well. not hitting rotom-h is a non-issue when I have rhyperior (who just laughs at it).
 
Oh! That's something I should mention in the OC, Gastrodon loves Aromatherapy support. Then it can switch in on bulky waters, hit them somewhat hard with Earthquake or Toxic them, then just switch out and be healed later.
 

Oglemi

Borf
is a Forum Moderatoris a Top Contributoris a Tournament Director Alumnusis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnusis a Top Dedicated Tournament Host Alumnus
Going to tell you right now to scrap the last two sets as they are situational and gimmicky at best. I don't like the third set either, but I haven't tried it. The other two sets look fine, though I don't know why you'd slash Substitute on the first set.
 

breh

強いだね
The tank set works well with Ice Beam over Surf.

The EVs are really wtf though, you may just want to make it a simple 252/252 spread.

Make sure to mention partnering with Water-weak pokemon for Storm Drain.
 
What's wrong with the EVs? They're precise and manage multiple threats simultaneously. Agree with the other two points though, adding them.
 

Honko

he of many honks
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
There's nothing wrong with a complicated EV spread as long as there's a good reason for it and you explain it clearly in the comments. It looks well thought out to me.
 

breh

強いだね
As far as I get, you're using these odd EVs to get rid of Arcanine and Victini. Most Victini I've seen run Grass Knot (which hits for 62.9% minimum from 252 SpA Rash (Flareblitz's EVs)) as well as V-create, while Arcanine has been increasingly rare (and is somthing you wall anyway). Hell, opposing Arcanine shouldn't be staying in on you in the first place unless they have HP Grass (in which case you can't KO them anymore while they 2HKO you) or Toxic.

The Smogon calculator and Cherubi tell me that you fail to always OHKO Nidoking without SR:

262 Atk vs 186 Def & 303 HP (95 Base Power): 288 - 342 (95.05% - 112.87%)

Kingdra is not walled (the Dragon Dance variant is by far the most popular, and laughs at Gastrdon's attempts to damage it) and neither is Zapdos (it usually runs either Toxic or HP Grass; both are very bad for Gastrodon).
 
I'll have a look over it when the new statistcs are released, but I have never seen Grass Knot Victini in my entire time playing UU, always Fusion Bolt.

Points about the Nidoking calc and Kingdra have been rectified. I've already mentioned that both HP Grass and Toxic are bad for Gastrodon when Zapdos uses them, but HP Grass is also never an OHKO, and apart from these two issues, Gastrodon does an excellent job, as stated.
 

Oglemi

Borf
is a Forum Moderatoris a Top Contributoris a Tournament Director Alumnusis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnusis a Top Dedicated Tournament Host Alumnus
I was playing with the EV spread you gave for the first set, and I didn't like it. The main spread needs to be a lot more focused, and imo it should just be a 252 HP / 252 Def spread.

I'll get back to you on the other sets, but please just get rid of the Curse set. I can tell you right now that it isn't very good, and imo it's strictly outclassed by Quagsire.
 

November Blue

A universe where hot chips don't exist :(
is a Contributor Alumnus
The all out attacker set is running an inefficient EV spread. 252 Def / 252 SpA Modest increases Gastrodon's physical bulk significantly.

Modest LO Yanmega's Air Slash on Gastrodon:

252 HP / 252 SpA: 45% - 52%

252 SpA / 252 SpDef: 40% - 47%

Adamand Band Mamoswine's Earthquake on Gastrodon:

252 HP / 252 SpA: 86% - 102%

252 Def / 252 SpA: 74% - 87%
 

breh

強いだね
JT swift is right about the inefficiency but wrong about the spread you should use. A better balanced spread would be 160/48/48.

And JT swift, only for any pokemon that has a base defence 53 base points higher than its base HP, it will always be more advantageous to invest in HP (assuming only one stat can be invested in); otherwise, you can always make a pokemon bulkier on a certain side by investing EVs in a defence instead of HP. gastrodon is no exception.
 
Sorry for bumping, but this is another set I made, for Modest users.

Name: Life Orb
255 SpA / 255 SpD
Nature: Modest
Item: Life Orb Mixed and/or Physical Attacker


-Surf/Waterfall/Scald
-Mud Bomb/Earthquake/Earth Power
-Ice Beam/Blizzard/Sludge Wave/Sludge Bomb
-Mirror Coat

[Set Comments]
Lots of options to choose here, eh? That's one of the big points of this set. Waterfall and Earthquake can be used here to create a Physical set and the two other options can be
used to make a Special set. You can even make a Mixed set out of this. In move terms, Waterfall is a good move for beating Physically Defensive threats like Golem. Surf and Scald are the two most commonly used Water moves, and they both make good artillery for Gastrodon to fight with. In the second slot, Mud Bomb makes for good Accuracy lowering fare, but it is kinda weak. You're probably going to use either Earthquake or Earth Power for this set. Ground typed Psychic? YES. In the third slot are moves for Gastrodon to take care of Grass types that switch into it. Ice Beam and Blizzard are very primitive moves, but they have less PP than say, Flamethrower and Thunder. Sludge Bomb and Sludge Wave are very similar to each other, with Sludge Wave having only 5
more base power and Sludge Bomb having a 10% higher chance of poison. Mirror Coat is a good move for Wobbuffet, so it might be a good move for Gastro too.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top