I've been giving Arbok a try and he's pretty awesome! Intimidate is like a free coil pretty much against physical attackers (like a Sawk trapped in CC) and Gunk Shot has an awesome amount of power, Earthquake provides nice coverage and Sucker Punch rounds it out with Priority and a Dark Type attack to boot against psychics. 80 base speed is solid enough for this tier and he's able to absorb Toxic Spikes. I've been impressed so far and he can take down a good amount of pokemon.
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Gen V Initial NU Metagame Thread
- Thread starter Oglemi
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And how many grass types do you see in the tier on a regular basis? Tangela? Maybe?
And that's a horrible argument to put against something. Are you going to say that Ferrothorn is awful because it's walled by steel types? Ferrothorn is Skarmory spikesbaut. Therefore, Ferrothorn sucks.
This. it can sometimes be hard to tell what it's trying to do, which makes it absolutely fantastic! Nobody really expects Rock Polish. They just expect it to set up SR but Torterra can do much more than that. I pair him up with Scarf Magmortar personally. As Magmortar can shrug of Ice Attacks and scare of opposing Grass Types while hitting on the special spectrum. Magmortar is just strong in general too which helps.
Torterra has a lot of great moves with the stats and the typing to abuse them making him a cool pokemon.
I like gen 5 NU, a place where i can pass +3's to electrode and then you have a sweep. Only problem is the absurd amounts of pokemon like Sawk.
If you're getting a Tail Glow pass off THAT easily, you're just against bad players...
Honestly now whenever I see Torterra I only expect Rock Polish. What better set is there? A SR or bulky set is infinitely easier to handle.
@above: agreed, lol
I have to respectfully disagree with that. My tank Torterra is probably my MVP. People don't really realize that it's physically defensive capabilities are more or less equal to Gliscor's (Torterra has 20 more base in HP, while Gliscor has 20 more base in Def). It also has incredible typing that lets it absolutely wall Rhydon, among others, for weeks. And then it's one of the most reliable Stealth Rocks in the tier. Probably THE most reliable. Then there's base 109 attack which is great even with no investment to go with insanely strong STABs and Leech Seed...I'm not just some noob that's babbling here, either. I know it's good from some high-on-the-ladder and now tournament experience.
ferrothorn sets up spikes, srs, and leech seeds vs. skarm.
torterra sets up SR vs. grass types then sits there and farts while I get up spikes or switches while I get up spikes.
the only Pokemon who's a grass type that will be setting up spikes is Roselia. Who's just rock polish bait and is neutral to his STAB Earthquake. Maractus what? Cacturne where? Yeah they can set up Spikes too, but Cacturne could be doing better things while Maractus is whooped by Stone Edge.
Don't underestimate Torterra. Physical walls like Tangela and Weezing will stop him, but he's completely deadly in the right hands. (Once again, I recommend using Magmortar / Simisear as an offensive partner, but that's just me.)
Edit: Ran some calcs and bold Roselia with Max HP and Max Def ev's will only be 2HKOd by an adamant Torterra holding a life orb (using Earthquake). Sometimes a 3HKO. Obviously, Roselia isn't as frail as I thought it was but because it can't really do anything to Torterra, you can get in a free Rock Polish.
On a side note: Is Jolly or Adamant the preferred nature for Torterra before I go off and get mine edited in Black version? Adamant is a no-brainer for the raw power, but Jolly would allow you to outspeed (after 1 rock polish) Jolly scarfed Pinsir and scarfed Magmortar (and I believe Scarfed Sawk too) hmmm....
Don't underestimate Torterra. Physical walls like Tangela and Weezing will stop him, but he's completely deadly in the right hands. (Once again, I recommend using Magmortar / Simisear as an offensive partner, but that's just me.)
Edit: Ran some calcs and bold Roselia with Max HP and Max Def ev's will only be 2HKOd by an adamant Torterra holding a life orb (using Earthquake). Sometimes a 3HKO. Obviously, Roselia isn't as frail as I thought it was but because it can't really do anything to Torterra, you can get in a free Rock Polish.
On a side note: Is Jolly or Adamant the preferred nature for Torterra before I go off and get mine edited in Black version? Adamant is a no-brainer for the raw power, but Jolly would allow you to outspeed (after 1 rock polish) Jolly scarfed Pinsir and scarfed Magmortar (and I believe Scarfed Sawk too) hmmm....
I meant that it's easier to handle in the vein that even when its a tank, it's more or less reliably checked by the same things as the offensive version (though Leech Seed definitely does help, yes) as well as having the disadvantage of losing to faster stuff in general. I'm not discrediting Torterra as a physical tank because I'm sure it does brilliantly, but I can deal with it in almost the exact same ways as I do an offensive version. Also watch out for random Ice Punches from Rhydon because I got nailed by one once and it cost me a victory.
But yeah, I'm sure your forum presence speaks for itself. I don't really think you need to alert me that you're not just "some noob"...
I am thinking of trying this metagame. How useful is Throh?
It's extremely fantastic with Bulk Up Circle Throw. Underrated, but one of the most unstoppable sweepers if your opponent doesn't have powerful super effective attacks.
I prefer to use bulky sweepers, so that make me happy that I can use him. Any other suggestions? My teams are like this:
1. Lead/anti-lead (usually suicide)
2-4: Bulky Sweepers
5. Scout
6. Fast and frail sweeper that I can fall back on.
Is a team like this viable down here?
1. Lead/anti-lead (usually suicide)
2-4: Bulky Sweepers
5. Scout
6. Fast and frail sweeper that I can fall back on.
Is a team like this viable down here?
Bulky sweepers are pretty much THE NU tier along with setup sweepers. Also, I dunno WHY anyone would use cacturne as a spiker when there's much better spikers like Scolipede, but, if one does happen to use Cacturne with max def and HP, the most bulky Torterra will be doing with EQ is about 68 damage to Cacturne
However, Jolly with max attack using Stone Edge will do about 113, not a lot either.
but of course, Torterra shouldn't stay in against ANY grass types period unless it's a really frail one with no investment, Which is why I like to run Magmortar / Simisear with my Torterra to cover his faults (Being able to hit Weezing on the weaker side and all grass types with Fire Blast)
Also, on a random note (I like to randomly highlight some pokemon for no reason.....) CB Emboar is really strong, and he's got the bulk to take a few hits.
However, Jolly with max attack using Stone Edge will do about 113, not a lot either.
but of course, Torterra shouldn't stay in against ANY grass types period unless it's a really frail one with no investment, Which is why I like to run Magmortar / Simisear with my Torterra to cover his faults (Being able to hit Weezing on the weaker side and all grass types with Fire Blast)
Also, on a random note (I like to randomly highlight some pokemon for no reason.....) CB Emboar is really strong, and he's got the bulk to take a few hits.
maybe with a full field of hazards haha
252 Atk Life Orb Torterra Wood Hammer vs 255 HP/255 Def Cacturne: 35.47% - 41.86%
3 hits to KO
Speaking of underappreciated mons, I don't really know why Rotom-S hasn't been mentioned at all yet. It's got solid typing and STAB and tons of options - you can go choice w/ Trick (Scarf Rotom-S notably outspeeds Scarf Sawk) or you can go with a bulky set with WoW + Pain Split or an offensive LO set with PS. You could even go with a hax set; Thunder Wave, Confuse Ray, and Air Slash together can get pretty frustrating. Rotom-S also deals with some of these recent threats fairly well too.
Also in my last few matches Torkoal seems to have stepped up to the plate as a notable Rapid Spinner. Its defenses are solid enough that it can check some stuff and get a spin off. ...or maybe its just my team i dunno lol
Also in my last few matches Torkoal seems to have stepped up to the plate as a notable Rapid Spinner. Its defenses are solid enough that it can check some stuff and get a spin off. ...or maybe its just my team i dunno lol
Oops, my calc was 252 / 4. Still, Cacturne dies on its second switch into Rocks. But yeah Torterra's Wood Hammer hits a lot of bulky Grasses a lot harder than it has a right to.
Rotom-S is powerful and bulky, but I'm really digging (Sub) Magneton at the moment. Its bulk is just ridiculous and it hits bloody hard on top of that. The metagame is really pretty Electric-weak.
SubCM Mesprit is also tearing shit up at the moment.
Hmmm Jynx is certainly an awesome pokemon! She's pretty much an NU Lilligant.... infact, she IS an NU Lilligant. With Lovely kiss, an amazing speed stat (for NU) Nasty Plot and psyshock. She's an insanely scary pokemon who should be used more.
I use one to open the match and mine holds a focus sash, I JUST replaced my lead Shiftry and I don't miss him at all. Jynx can be absolutely devastating considering she's guarenteed to survive 2 turns with a Focus Sash.
With an amazing speed stat she usually gets the first strike, so it's a free lovely kiss. and if it just so happens that the opponent's faster, focus sash will insure she at least gets that lovely kiss in (or attempts it...)
Really, an underrated pokemon imo who probably isn't used as much as she should due to having an unflattering design.... and the fact that there's THOUSANDS of other psychics to choose from
I use one to open the match and mine holds a focus sash, I JUST replaced my lead Shiftry and I don't miss him at all. Jynx can be absolutely devastating considering she's guarenteed to survive 2 turns with a Focus Sash.
With an amazing speed stat she usually gets the first strike, so it's a free lovely kiss. and if it just so happens that the opponent's faster, focus sash will insure she at least gets that lovely kiss in (or attempts it...)
Really, an underrated pokemon imo who probably isn't used as much as she should due to having an unflattering design.... and the fact that there's THOUSANDS of other psychics to choose from
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