[Gen6] ORAS CAP Metagame Discussion Thread

Pyroak is one of my favourite mons to use in ORAS because of its ability to check some of the best Megas in the meta at the moment such as Mega-Gardevoir, Mega-Metagross, Mega-Altaria whilst also checking pretty much every Fairy type not named Diancie. With 120/105/90 bulk Pyroak can eat hits for days and recover up with Synthesis/ Leech Seed while spreading burns with Will-O-Wisp/ Lava Plume. Pyroak can also set up rocks, cure team-mates with Aromatherapy, phaze set-up sweepers with Roar and hit common switch-ins such as Mollux, Plasmanta and Heatran with Earth Power. Of course Pyroak has his shortcomings. Pyroak's Fire typing, while it does allow Pyroak to serve as a fairy check, makes Pyroak weak to Stealth Rocks which is very undesirable for a defensive mon as it will be needed to switch in many times during the match and therefore will get worn down very easily. If trapped by Gothitelle and tricked a choice item Pyroak becomes almost useless and could very easily be turned into set up fodder depending on what move Pyroak is locked into. On top of this Pyroak is beaten by common threats in the CAP metagame such as Sludge Wave Landorus, Mollux, Stratagem, Talonflame, Tomohawk, Plasmanta etc.

Despite those shortcomings I still love to use Pyroak as a fairy check and a wall in general and believe that Pyroak is a top tier Pokemon.

PS: SD roak is bad, don't use it rof


Let's Keep Fighting
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requested by cbae and made into a pretty long post by HeaL since he couldn't be concise on the subject

Hello CAPpers. Today, I'd like to give you an introduction to BOWS.

Recently, BOWS has gained a bit more support, and what formerly was used by only one or two players is now becoming somewhat more of a trend (or maybe I'm just being hopeful). However, due to the the long time needed to sometimes win a match with BOWS, it is not used on the High Ladder very much. Instead, it is seen either in room tours or on the low to mid ladder where a skilled player can achieve somewhat faster victories. When on the low to mid ladder, a typical match might last between 15 and 80 turns. When used against a skilled player, however, BOWS operates similarly to Stall and matches may reach over 300 turns.

This post lists some potential BOWS team members. Please note not every potential member listed has been thoroughly tested and that some educated guesses have been made. Once BOWS is tested more, some of the recognized "good" members will likely be more apparent.

What is BOWS?
BOWS stands for Bulky Offense with With Support. It is a type of niche team "style" that focuses on two different types of team members; tanky attackers and wish passers that keep the attackers healthy throughout the match. BOWS plays similarly to Stall and in some ways could be considered a subset of Stall. However, the main defining difference is that BOWS spends a tremendous amount of focus making sure that the healers can keep the tanks in top form, whereas the tanks aim to whittle away and damage the opponent in between being healed.

How do I build a BOWS team?
A typical BOWS team will have about 3 Wish Passers. However, in order to expand teambuilding possibilities, I will for now define at least 2 Wish Passers as being required for a BOWS team, whereas more are optional and sometimes helpful. Heal Bell and Aromatherapy are also great in case a team member gets statused. The other members of the team will consist of strong and bulky attackers who are meant to take a few hits and dish a few blows before needing to be healed. Because there is a ton of switching when using BOWS, entry hazard removal is absolutely necessary. Having hazards of your own is very helpful at times as well. Note, though, if opting for Defog over Rapid Spin that a BOWS teams will likely blow away its own hazards many times in a heated match.

Additionally, BOWS teams heavily rely on type synergy, as in order to keep all members alive and healthy a BOWS team will have to switch members to tank different attacks. Some of the current BOWS teams take it as far as to have absolutely no shared weaknesses between team members.

So, a short bullet list of what a BOWS team consists would be something like:

- 2 or 3 Wish Passers
- Typically at least 1 Heal Bell or Aromatherapy user
- At least 2 bulky attackers/tanks to provide offensive pressure
- Hazard Removal
- Typically a Hazard Setter
- Very few, if any, shared weaknesses between teammates
- A way to deal with Set Up Sweepers that aim to power through bulky teams

What are some potential BOWS Wish Passers?

If you see 3 of these guys on a single team, it's a good hint that you might be facing a BOWS team!
Chansey stands out as the bulkiest of the bunch, and it can pass the largest Wishes in the game bar Blissey. Chansey also has access to Heal Bell and Stealth Rock, making it able to fulfill uses for a BOWS team. With only one weakness, Chansey is very easy to fit onto BOWS teams while keeping type synergy at an optimal level.

Alomomola is one of the most physically bulky Wish Passers in the game based on stats alone. However, the true standout trait lies with Regenerator and the ability to switch out and Wish Pass while simultaneously healing itself. Alomomola also has Knock and Scald in its repertoire, allowing it to cripple physical attackers and knock off items to weaken the opposing team.

Sylveon is the most offensive of the viable Wish Passers, allowing it to be both a supporting team member and an offensive tank if necessary. The set up move Calm Mind assists in this role, but Sylveon has other very helpful options such as Heal Bell, Substitute, and Baton Pass.

Vaporeon might seem at times to be outclassed by Alomomola, but truth be told they simply have different niches. Both can Scald and Wish, but Vaporeon has better special bulk and access to Heal Bell and Baton Pass. Water Absorb as an ability is also helpful for a BOWS team when trying to control the switching game.

Clefable is a less offensive option over Sylveon, but it has a different set of support options that are still extremely useful. Like Chansey, Clefable has access to Stealth Rock and Heal Bell. Magic Guard is great for absorbing status and avoiding entry hazards, whereas Unaware can provide a very welcome answer to Set Up Sweepers.

Latias is the fastest of the Wish Passers, and its ability in Levitate is also able to create some significant switch in opportunities. Latias's main struggle is in its mediocre HP, and a result it will be strained the most to fully heal its teammates. However, Latias has some very helpful self-supporting options such as Calm Mind and Refresh, and it can support the team with Defog as well. In clutch moments, Healing Wish is also an option and Latias is the only Wish Passer able to use this move.

Aromatisse's main niche is its ability to shrug off taunt, something that positively cripples the other Wish users. Under normal circumstances, Aromatisse is rather slow which can be a big let down. However, it's access to Trick Room is especially helpful with BOWS, since some of the high power tanks that are viable for use are rather slow. Besides these traits, however, Aromatisse is decidedly mediocre.

Audino's main merit is its access to Regenerator, like Alomomola. It has access to Heal Bell, which is always nice, but it's bulk won't be winning any awards and in general Audino isn't the best member to square off against Hyper Offense teams. However, it and Latias are the only two useful Wish users that can Mega Evolve, and Mega Audino has a few niches despite losing Regenerator. Skill Swap can provide some shenanigans, but in general it is a strategy too gimmicky to use for most BOWS teams, where reliability is crucial.

Fidgit has a lot of type weaknesses that might make team synergy difficult, but it has an assortment of other traits that make it potentially very useful for BOWS. Both Trick Room and Tailwind can help out with the slow bulky attackers used to wear down foes. U-turn makes passing wishes to the proper teammate easier. However, Fidgit truly shines thanks to it's high speed and access to Rapid Spin, Encore, and Taunt. Being the only Wish Passer to also learn Rapid Spin is huge, but being able to limit the opponent's options is a very valuable ability.

What are some potential BOWS Bulky Attackers?

In general, there is a wide range of bulky attackers in CAP. Here are simply a few of the ones that do well with BOWS; there are many other options out there, too!

There are a plethora of bulky attackers than can be used in BOWS, but the most common sets involve either Choice Items, Assualt Vest, or Set Up moves. Life Orb should generally not be used on BOWS since it diminishes longevity, which is the name of the game when using this type of team. However, in cases such as Magic Guard and Sheer Force where the Life Orb damage is removed, then Life Orb becomes acceptable. In general, switching out these Bulky Attackers at the slightest sign of danger is usually the safe and rewarded play. Healing the attackers with Wish after they've been damaged is the primary strategy behind BOWS, and keeping them alive and healthy is crucial.

Landorus-T is significantly bulkier than Landorus-I, but neither are particularly frail. They both can be adequate rock setters, and their immunities to Ground- and Electric-type attacks is great for the switching games of BOWS. Intimidate is especially handy though the raw power of Landorus-I is notable. In general, both should maximize their respective offensive stats. Most of the time, Landorus-T wants to have high bulk investment as well, as 91 is an unreliable speed number, though Choice Scarf is an option since switches are expected anyway.

Keldeo is powerful, speedy, and not as flimsy as a paper bag, making it a legitimate option. Its shining niche is the ability to hit on both sides of the attacking spectrum, which is especially helpful when trying to create dents in the opposing team. One of the trickier parts about using Keldeo, however, is that it has a large amount of weaknesses and it can to be especially careful when switching in.

Azumaril's main deterrent is its low speed, but it possesses enough bulk and power to be considered. Access to Aqua Jet let's it be useful to pick off weakened foes. Most of the time, if Azumarill can make it on the field safely then it will be able to hit a foe hard and put pressure on the opponent.

Mega Metagross's stats certainly fit the bill of being a bulky attacker. It's useful typing allows it to threaten both fairies and the Lord Tomohawk that rules over CAP. While Mega Metagross has notable weaknesses, it has some very nice resistances as well, allowing it to make adequate use of switch-ins. Mega Metagross is also one of the most offensive physical tanks available, making it a nice candidate.

Both Scizor and Mega Scizor are viable on a BOWS team. Scizor can opt to be offensive with a Choice Band or defensive with Defog if the teams Mega slot is already in use. Mega Scizor won't ever be quite as strong as Band Scizor, but it can definitely be a lot bulkier and is a valuable Defogger for BOWS. Roost is fantastic for self-healing, and access to U-turn also helps with the switch game. Swords Dance may be tempting, but Scizor lacks the coverage needed to stay in on many CAP threats, and thus having a reliable way to switch out is usually the better option.

Charizard might seem like an odd choice for BOWS at first due to its crippling weakness to Stealth Rock and the necessity to switch while playing BOWS. However, bulky Charizard-X is viable. With access to Roost and Will-O-Wisp, Charizard-X can support itself to some degree. Charizard-X usually can force a few switches himself, which allows him time to either try to support with Defog or set up with Dragon Dance. Though the defensive set has less coverage than the offensive version, Charizard-X will still barely have enough coverage to be viable as a Set Up Sweeper mid or late game.

Mega Gardevoir lacks defensive bulk, but it can definitely switch into a few special hits. This thing is crazy strong, and its battle screams are a potent option to get rid of threats quickly. Mega Gardevoir in general plays as a more potent sweeper than its competitors, but it does so at the risk of getting KOed early itself. Any team using Mega Gardevoir needs solid partners to take over offensive roles in the event that it faints. It may also be tempting to use Wish on Mega Gardevoir since this is BOWS after all. However, Mega Gardevoir should stay away from using recovery itself and should support its team with offensive capabilities instead.

Tyranitar has both positive and negative traits that make it an iffy, but still somewhat viable, member for BOWS. It has gargantuan defenses and respectable Attack. However, its typing is a flat out pain to work around since it has many weaknesses that can make defensive synergy difficult to pull off. Furthermore, Sand Stream is not the most friendly of abilities as chances are it will hurt teammates as well as foes. It should be stressed that a full out sand team is not viable with BOWS because of the importance of typing synergy. Tyranitar is primarily a late-game Set Up Sweeper within BOWS, and using it too early in the match can be very costly.

Mollux has a wide range of support and offensive options that can benefit a BOWS team. As a scarfer, it can take out some very crucial Set Up Sweepers such as Cawmodore that would otherwise threaten BOWS. Mollux also can use Rapid Spin and can hinder the opposing Pokemon with status via Toxic Spikes or Lava Plume. Dry Skin is very handy, and immunity abilities in general are quite helpful for BOWS switch ins.

Colossoil is the premier Rapid Spinner in CAP, and with Assualt Vest it is the very essence of Bulky Offense. With Rebound it can help keep hazards off of its team's side of the field, and with Guts it doesn't have to positively fear status. However, note that Guts Colossoil will still likely have to be healed of status throughout the match in order to keep it healthy until late-game. Knock Off and U-turn are both great moves to keep up momentum during moments where the switching game hinges upon guesses.

Revenankh isn't known as the best offensive Pokemon by any means, but access to Shed Skin allows him to be a somewhat reliable status absorber for BOWS teams, while his typing allows him to both spin block and be immune to fighting type moves that might threaten teammates such as Chansey. Most Revenankh should run Bulk Up even on a BOWS team, but reliably setting up should wait until late-game. Thanks to respectable defenses, however, Revenankh won't be dead weight in the early and mid stages of a match, and it is a member that can reliably switch in and out and heal later. In general, thanks to psuedo-status immunity and self recovery, Revenankh has potential to carry a team even after the Wish Passers have been crippled. However, since Moonlight has such low PP, Wish Support is still very helpful for it to succeed in longer matches.

Cyclohm generally isn't played offensively, but a Choiced Cyclohm can pull some surprises on a BOWS team. Of course, it could be played as a defensive pivot as well, and Static in particularly can be very useful for the long and drawn out matches that can often happen with BOWS. Access to Heal Bell is another very useful trait in order to keep the team healthy, while Roar can stop opposing Set-Up Sweepers that threaten BOWS.

Arghonaut really has been lackluster lately, but there's hope for it in the future when Naviathan is released. Until then, Arghonaut's Unaware and great bulk can be used to stop Set Up Sweepers. In general, Arghonaut is self-supporting and can be played on Balanced teams rather than BOWS. However, BOWS positively needs some check to Set Up Sweepers, and if the typing synergy gods make the stars align and let Arghonaut fit onto a BOWS team, then he has potential to be a pretty good asset.

Krilowatt's Magic Guard lets it be both bulky and strong, and its ability to paralyze the opposing team in turn significantly helps BOWS teams do their job. Weak to only Ground and Grass, Krilowatt has good switch in potential. In general, Krilowatt on BOWS should be used as a semi-offensive paralysis whore, spreading the status to put less of a strain on its teammates.

Some Previous Misconceptions about BOWS
-BOWS is not synonymous with Toxic stall. A BOWS team may use a Toxic user or two (or alternatively none), but it is not the same as a dedicated Toxic stall team. The goal of BOWS is to heal teammates more than what the opponent can damage them.
-I am not claiming BOWS to be a full-blown teamstyle such as Hyper Offense, Balanced, or Stall. Nevertheless, BOWS has some unique characteristics that make it a "thing." Many teams focus on out damaging the opponent, but BOWS and Stall both add the value of healing into the equation to a higher level. BOWS focuses on Wish Passing as healing moreso than a normal Stall team. Compared to normal stall, BOWS might have some stronger attackers because they can be healed via Wish; the attackers on BOWS do not need recovery moves of their own all of the time.

In Summary
BOWS stands for Bulky Offense with Wish Support. It is a type of team that focuses on bulky healers healing bulky attackers that otherwise would not have as reliable of healing methods. Just like other team types, there are a lot of variations on how to make a BOWS team, but the core concept is to heal more than the opponent can deal in order to allow offensive teammates to slowly rack up damage against the opponent. Who knows, maybe I'll get to see some more BOWS teams in battle, and at the very least I hope you guys can identify a BOWS team if you ever come across one.

I use a Mini-BOWS team right now, as it only uses Fidgit as a wish passer. Still very effective, if your team has lots of self-recovery. It's proven to be pretty effective, I've gotten #1 with it on ladder.


spin, spin, spin
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I know it isn't BOWS per say, but on almost every balance team I make I'll try to fit at least one Wish passer or cleric. I'll actually try to fit Wish and Heal Bell on different Pokemon so that I don't put all the pressure to heal and remove status on one mon, like Clefable/Sylveon + Cyclohm/Pyroak. I usually don't run more than one Wish passer unless I'm leaning towards a stall build, since most of the better Wish Passers are either a Fairy type, and I don't want to stack two similar mons, or something really passive like Chansey or Alomomola.

I haven't really thought of Fidgit outside of anything other than a hazard supporter or TR/Tailwind setter, so I'll definitely have to try it out. I was actually looking for a Wish Passer not named Chansey that didn't stack weaknessed w/ AV Azumarill.

EDIT: Oh yeah, stop posting one-liners and all in this thread, if you're gonna say something at least take the time to write a couple sentences, maybe explain why you like x mon, why x mon worked for you, etc.
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Yea, Fidgit is a pretty neat wish passer. I don't recommend it for most teams, but it pairs well with stuff that don't stack weaknesses. Colossoil loves it, and Weavile has some good synergy too. It's really surprising the amount of stuff Fidgit can pull off, I might try experimenting with some other cool sets I have in mind.

Speaking of Weavile, how effective is it right now? It hurts all of the S-ranks pretty hard, and though while it can't set up on them, it absolutely wrecks with just one Swords Dance. Probably one of the best Ice types right now, and one of the better Knock Off abusers. I know QueenOfLuvdiscs loves it, though nobody seems to use it.


Tier 3 Audino sub
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I personally prefer it (weavile) to syclant bcuz it's faster than it as well as it getting access to stab knock off. I just find it also handy that it isn't quad weak to rocks, so it can come in multiple times, and still be effective. I'm aware that syclant gets mountaineer, but a sash is usually run on that to emphasis its ability. Weavile however, can use LO and apply major pessure to your opponent by weakening stuff for your other threats, such as Altaria and Gardevoir. It's a really good mon rn in the current metagame that needs some love.


Let's Keep Fighting
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Anyone want to discuss how Hoopa-U is affecting the metagame? My observations so far have been brief, but Chansey usage appears to be down, and I heard from a certain spark nerd that tailwind support from Fidgit bolsters Hoopa U's sweeping ability. More observations and comments from you guys are welcome, though try to avoid commenting on Hoopa-U's overall viability itself and focus more on its impact and strategy.
I've been using a few variants of a Tailwind team quite a bit recently, and it's been doing rather well. Basically, slap on Persistent Fidgit and a couple of powerful mixed attackers such as LO Kyu-B, AOA Auru, etc and you can quickly overwhelm a lot of the bog standard ladder-hero teams (you know which ones I mean). As far as good mates go, spikes/sr setters help out tremendously, bonus points if they're good at punishing priority moves such as bullet punch, talon's brave bird, sucker punch, etc aimed at your attackers (use tankchomp more). A backup Tailwind setter is also helpful; Talonflame is a good example, as it gets priority on the move.

Hoopa-U is an excellent new asset for Tailwind teams; it fits the bill of being an extremely powerful mixed attacker with kinda middling speed, and its incredible movepool lets it plow through some prominent defensive cores in CAP with ease. Definitely give it a shot if you haven't yet.

also sorry if this post is kinda jumbled, I'm posting from my phone. I might edit/elaborate on this later.
Both Tailwind + Trick Room boost Hoopa's effectiveness tremendously. To note is that Hoopa itself can learn Trick Room, letting it act as an offensive setter of the move as a backup. Hoopa also destroys common Pokemon in the tier, like Tomohawk, Colossoil (Drain Punch does like 90% or something), Metagross, most Fairies, and tons more if given speed control support.
To complete the speed-control trifecta, I've been running Hoopa-U with Sticky Web Necturna (and paralysis support from bulky pivot Malaconda - the king of snakes), and it definitely helps. Obviously, you've got to look out for hazard removal, but that little tweak to the speed tiers obviously does Hoopa a lot of favors. It's also a bit more permanent than Tailwind or Trick Room, which is handy.

That said, Hoopa should definitely be saved for the late game, at least in my experience. Its mixed set is obviously quite destructive, but even with a LO I'd find myself NEARLY KOing things, as opposed to cleanly OHKOing threats I really needed removed. It's best used once you've built up some prior damage on your opponent's team - that's when Hoopa-U can come in and truly clean house. Here's some numbers....

0 SpA Life Orb Hoopa Psychic vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Tomohawk: 484-569 (116.9 - 137.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
0 SpA Life Orb Hoopa Psychic vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Cyclohm: 269-317 (64.2 - 75.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Life Orb Hoopa Drain Punch vs. 0 HP / 80 Def Colossoil: 294-346 (72.2 - 85%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

That's the bulky CAP trio right there. Pretty good. Additionally....

252 Atk Life Orb Hoopa Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 220+ Def Sylveon: 385-455 (97.7 - 115.4%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Hoopa Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 351-413 (89 - 104.8%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO

Gunk Shot makes a great coverage move. Enjoy it while you can, kids, I have a feeling Hoopa-U won't be around for too long.

EDIT: Here's Tomo with some SpD investment, as I suppose not everyone runs pure physical Tomohawk...

0 SpA Life Orb Hoopa Psychic vs. 252 HP / 184+ SpD Tomohawk: 354-421 (85.5 - 101.6%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
Is it okay to discuss anything related to Naviathan yet? If so, here is his relevant competitive info, according to the Final Product:

Water / Steel
Water Veil / Heatproof / Light Metal
HP 103 / Atk 110 / Def 90 / SpA 95 / 65 SpD / 97 Spe / BST 560

Anyway, I don't actually play the game myself, but from reading analyses on the site, the Dragon Dance set seems outclassed by Mega Charizard X and Mega Gyarados, because unlike them, it seems to require Life Orb, which, if I recall correctly, is bad on a Dragon Dance set. Calm Mind is the way to go because it can afford to boost multiple times due to its decent physical bulk and Speed, as well as the capability to run Leftovers and Slack Off.

Whoever reads this first: If I have posted about Naviathan too early, please just say so. I've seen Naviathan mentioned in analyses, so I thought this was up for discussion.
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Navi discussion seems fine, it's been out for long enough.

And yeah, the Dragon Dance set is just outclassed by the multitude of other dancers, and the Calm Mind set is a great way to beat stall/slow offense once Water immunities are gone.
Semi-Stall core

Shedinja-stall isn't used much because of all of the threats in OU and CAP having access to Knock Off mainly and other moves that hit it but, Shedinja can burn Lando-T (Switch and Sashed)
and Scizor (other random switches into it) etc.. It really isn't a "meta-mon" but I really like it because of its ability to switch into Scizor (Without Knock Off), CAP Gothitelle, MGyara switches,Lati twins and can basically wall MegaGross because most of this meta isn't really preparing for Shedinja so it's just a cool mon to surprise people & a cool pivot . BTW I know (Surprise=/=Good).

Focus Sash
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 Atk / / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- X-Scissor
- Protect / Baton Pass
- Shadow Sneak

Full attack investment to hit as hard as possible to Colo & other switches and full speed to outspeed slow walls.


With Colo running around I think Arghonaut fits on this core just to make it harder for it to just switch into Will-O-Wisps and wreck havoc. Arghonaut is great on semi-stall because of its' movepool and ability to recover efficiently. It can Taunt Chansey and take care of Heatran (Shedinja's worse nightmare). Heatran is a threat to Shedinja but with the right prediction you will be able to Baton Pass into Arghonaut to stop it completely in its' tracks.

Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Toxic
- Waterfall / Drain Punch
- Recover
- Taunt / Roar

Full SpD investment to stop Heatran, Full HP investment to increase bulk, 4 Attack for Waterfall/ Drain Punch


Colo still has the possibility to kill Arghonaut because of the full investment of SPD instead of full Def, with Toxic Orb / Flame Orb Guts Colo Arghonaut can get 2HKOed by an EQ and can't kill at full in return so MAlt really takes care of Colo for good. Heall Bell will make status effects go away so Arghonaut doesn't get worn down fast. All around MAlt is a great mon offensively and defensively. Takes care of MCham/MGallade/MGyara/Caw(Without Iron Head)/Cyclohm/Rev and Voodoom etc.

  • Bold
  • Impish
  • Relaxed
  • 248 HP
  • 104 Def
  • 156 SpD
By Smogon because I got lazy
The given EV spread, along with a Bold or Impish nature, allows Altaria to avoid being 2HKOed by Icy Wind from Keldeo, sun-boosted Fire Blast from Mega Charizard Y, Earthquake from maximum Attack Adamant Landorus-T, and Psyshock from Life Orb Latios. Alternatively, you can bump the Defense EVs to 136 to avoid being KOed by Azumarill's Play Rough followed by Aqua Jet. Use a Relaxed nature if you plan on using both a special and physical attack (i.e. Hyper Voice and Earthquake, or Return and Flamethrower). If you do, also invest a minimum of 4 Speed EVs to outrun uninvested base 70s such as Skarmory. Cloud Nine is the ability of choice, as it makes switching into Mega Charizard Y, Politoed, Omastar, and other weather-reliant Pokemon much easier prior to Mega Evolving. Heal Bell is a required move even though non-Mega Altaria has Natural Cure, because Altaria typically Mega Evolves immediately.

This core is kinda fairy weak so I recommend adding Plasmanta or & Skarm to deal with them

Dont slay me please this is my first semi-stall core and I just want to help out the community since stall looks kinda nice right now in CAP imo .
Shedinja's always been a weird mon because it's really shitty, unless you support it EXTREMELY well, then it becomes a real threat. I'd suggest for that core that you have both hazard removal, and Mega Sableye, because otherwise your Shedinja is just worthless. I would recommend Safety Goggles so that sandstorm doesn't eat your face off, but honestly, sandstorm is so uncommon in CAP that you can probably get away without it.
Shedinja's always been a weird mon because it's really shitty, unless you support it EXTREMELY well, then it becomes a real threat. I'd suggest for that core that you have both hazard removal, and Mega Sableye, because otherwise your Shedinja is just worthless. I would recommend Safety Goggles so that sandstorm doesn't eat your face off, but honestly, sandstorm is so uncommon in CAP that you can probably get away without it.
I have Skarm to get rid of rocks (which I suggested) and I was debating on whether or not to mention Weather goggles because I dont see sand much in CAP except Tyranitar + Excadrill and with Argh taking care of both of them I used Focus Sash to cripple the more common threats such as Caw and MGyara. Thanks for the feedback anyway :]
Although there isn't any CAP Ubers, is it still possible for the CAP meta to have bans (outside of the ones OU already imposes)? A CAP might be broken when released or when a mechanics change indirectly buffs a CAP over the edge.


Tier 3 Audino sub
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You have no idea how much I want a certain CAPmon banned because its existence supercentralises the meta, but atm, we haven't talked about banning stuff
Although there isn't any CAP Ubers, is it still possible for the CAP meta to have bans (outside of the ones OU already imposes)? A CAP might be broken when released or when a mechanics change indirectly buffs a CAP over the edge.
As it currently stands, the CAP metagame strictly adheres to OU's banlist and does not ban any CAP Pokemon. One of the main purposes of the CAP metagame is to provide an environment in which all of CAP's past creations can be used, and sticking to "OU+CAP" keeps the ruleset simple.

This is definitely not an ideal way of creating a balanced metagame as we have virtually no control over the banlist, but "OU+CAP" is the status quo for CAP's ruleset, and has been for quite a long time.
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Queen, I can only assume you're referring to the centralizing nightmare that is Malaconda.

On CAP Meta-related notes, what is the general consensus with the banning of STag? Tomo can now run free of its cumbersome Shed Shell (though I'll still run Sub-Pass, thanks), and things such as Cawmodore, that greatly appreciated its ability to target and remove threats, must now find another way to remove the roadblocks standing in the way of their sweeps. In general, I'm glad to see it gone (and to see Mega-Sableye live to fight another day), but I'm sure there's plenty of teams that'll miss it. It might let Chansey breath a little easier as well, which could be all the better considering that Mega-Charizard Y is getting quite trendy.

It'll be interesting to see the impact on Stall as well, since with the exception of a couple teams, you didn't see Goth/M-Sab stall all too often in CAP, though that may just be the smaller userbase and not a fundamental difference in balance..
I actually really like the banning of STAG, as with everyone other than TSB. I'll never let you live that down, by the way. It gives me a lot more freedom with stall, so I don't have to use pursuit and shed shell all the time.

Stall isn't gonna change much. Goth stall wasn't too popular because CAP has a lot of good stall mons, such as Tomohawk, Colossoil, Cyclohm, and Naviathan. My favorite and most effective stall team remains unchanged and extremely effective, except now I can run Rocky Helmet Tomo.

Mega Sableye will remain supreme, god-stall mon, RIP Trick Rest garbage.

... but yeah QOL is right, this meta is hyper-centralized almost to Pdon level and that's not cool.


spin, spin, spin
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I think its really less of a matter of the metagame being over centralized and more off people being lazy with their building and using Tomohawk and Colossoil as a crutch. Both mons are really easy to take advantage of, especially Colossoil and defensive Tomohawk, and its not only possible to make teams without them but more rewarding imo. In regards to the insane amount of usage stats both have, you have to take into account the massive usage boost both mons get as a result of them being CAP.

Maybe once people stop running those incredibly boring Tomohawk/Colossoil balance teams and they'll realize how much hidden potential people are ignoring.


Let's Keep Fighting
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Sparky and I talked about the centralization of the CAP meta a while back, and we both seemed to agree that calling the meta over centralized is a bit misleading. Yes, Tomohawk and Colossoil and a few others are used a LOT. However, a typical team might be made up of half really common mons and half not-so-common ones. And a ton of the lesser common ones are still really viable. So yes, we have some centralizing mons, but we also have a really diverse variety of great/viable mons as well.

If that makes any sense...


Tier 3 Audino sub
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I didn't actually think I'd have to say which mon is the real issue here...

Hint: It's the only 'Gen 6' mon that isn't weak to Ground
Maybe once people stop running those incredibly boring Tomohawk/Colossoil balance teams and they'll realize how much hidden potential people are ignoring.
The problem is that Colossoil is good on far more than balance teams. I play hyper-aggro and stall, and Colossoil is excellent in both. It's basically the Landorus-I of the format, now that we don't have actual Landorus-I to be the Landorus-I of the format. It's well positioned against every CAP except Tomohawk and Physical Krillowat. If you look at the top 20 most played mons in OU, less that one third have a positive match-up against Colossoil. Among the ones that do have a positive match-up, only Talon and Scizor don't mind having to take a Knock Off to get in, and only if Talon is an Acrobatics set. He's a better Spinner than Starmie, who's seeing almost 10% play in OU right now solely as a high quality Spinner (if the 97% usage on Rapid Spin on Starmie is any indication). Heck, he's one of the only Ground types that forces a 50/50 on Cawmodore. His Guts build breaks M-Sableye. Basically, he's the teammate every team wants to have.
^^ That. No other mon really requires the same amount of elbow grease to check properly, not even char-X who is weak to rocks before evo, and still weak to em after in addition to spikes. and even then there's a good amount of counters who can retaliate well, such as azu and slowbro. But caw isn't weak to rocks and immune to spikes + toxic so it's really damn hard to check passively, and the only real counter is cyclohm... which can falter pretty damn easy. Choice special attackers are good and all, but lets be honest, that's 99% of the choice scarfers run on CAP teams. And you run them because of Caw.

Of course, Godohawk and Godosoil are extremely centralizing for being so damn splashable, diverse, and powerful, and these three mons combined are pretty much dictating the entire meta.

What numbercruncher just said about Colo is true as well. It has characteristics every team archetype wants, except hard stall, and even THEN we still run it, cause we lose out on NOT using it.

Just like Tomohawk, who has characteristics every single team archetype wants.

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