Ghosting while streaming and the implications regarding BSSC

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cant say

twitch.tv/jakecantsay
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hey guys, got a serious topic I want to discuss with the whole community so I'm making a thread to properly gather opinions.

As a lot of you know, I've started streaming the cart ladder on twitch (check it out if you haven't already !!). I'm doing this for a couple reasons; the first is obviously to give you guys an easy way to see what the cart ladder is actually like, but it also helps me because I'm now playing it more than I ever have, and we can all laugh at my salt rather than me just shitting up the discord chat with it.

However, streaming is actually hard as fuck. At least for me right now. I'm still learning to describe my thought process out loud, and I find that I don't actually think everything out properly while doing this, leading to suboptimal plays. I often try to take advice from that twitch chat but the delay doesn't help (:tony:).

I'm also not really entertaining on my own. I like to think the teams I use are at least interesting, but while I'm still figuring this shit out I'm not able to be as charismatic as I want to be. The salt hasn't helped with this either but that's a whole other thing haha

So what I want to do, and have done, is get people on stream with me to hang out. chemcoop and NOVED joined me last season for an episode and we had a great time, climbing up to a modest score of 1714 with the infamous hippo/mence/aegi/koko/kart/gren team everyone loves.

However, once the season was done and I submitted my cart rank to the BSSC thread, we all realised this technically counts as ghosting, and it might not be fair for me to possibly qualify for the 2018 playoffs this way, so my season 8 score was redacted.

So this is why I've decided to make this thread; I want you guys to discuss what you think about all this. Should streamer's / content creator's cart ranks not count towards the BSSC because they're getting "ghosted?" Or does it set a dangerous precedent where people will think it's okay to ghost while laddering to get into playoffs? I am obviously 100% against ghosting of any kind during tournaments, and understand how this is a similar situation, so I'm fine either way. If the community thinks it's unfair for me (or anyone else) to get a playoff invite this way then so be it. I'm enjoying streaming (even though it doesn't look like it sometimes ... ) and care about doing this for you guys more than qualifying for the playoffs, but getting an invite would be really nice obviously :psysly:


discuss!!
 
This is a tough subject, I feel like it does give you an advantage when you have people like NOVED and chemcoop on stream with you, but at the same time if we were to ban that then whos to stop anybody from just being in a call together while not streaming. I think it becomes a problem when the people who you're playing with are also competing for a spot in bssc. Say you're streaming and you've got chemcoop on with you, it's hard to ignore that any points you gain are partly due to him being there helping out. I think back to last year when I laddered with GroudonEmpire in some of his videos, we were using his account, but using one of my teams and I was making most of the plays, in that case if that rank were submitted to bssc I would absolutely think that is unfair. In your case it's a little different, you aren't actually asking for any help but everyone (especially me) always tries to give their input and it sometimes effects the plays you make. I think the solution would be to have a separate pgl account for when you stream or make videos so that you can still have the entertaining streams and avoid any controversy around ghosting and whatnot.
 

DragonWhale

It's not a misplay, it's RNG manipulation
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Cart ladder points contribute towards the invitational, which goes towards a reward on the forums: a ribbon postbit.

That alone makes this pretty clear to me that we should abide with sitewide tournament rules, which includes ghosting.

It sucks that your score doesn't count, but I'm not going to let our ribbon have some dumb "ghosting is allowed" stigma just because you want to ladder with friends on stream. If you want to have your scores count, then do what I told you before and have a separate account from the one you stream on for BSSC. I'll say the same for any user, regardless of their status as a co-leader.

Anyway, there's really no reason this should be allowed, nor any reason to keep this thread open any longer. It's clear you'll be biased against this decision considering it affects you directly, but this is a decision I am not willing to make compromises for.
 

cant say

twitch.tv/jakecantsay
is a member of the Site Staffis a Top Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Battle Simulator Moderatoris a Team Rater Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
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I think the solution would be to have a separate pgl account for when you stream or make videos so that you can still have the entertaining streams and avoid any controversy around ghosting and whatnot.
do what I told you before and have a separate account from the one you stream on for BSSC
I agree this is the best decision, however for me personally it is not possible because I don't have a spare cartridge to ladder on and I'm not going to go buy another anytime soon. I'm also not going to risk a PGL ban by using two saves on the same cart. Even if I could do this, I don't have the spare time to both ladder seriously off-stream and also do streams, so I guess I'll just focus on streaming and forget about BSSC...

It's clear you'll be biased against this decision considering it affects you directly
I said explicitly in the OP that I wouldn't mind either way, and that if it came down to it I would just focus on streaming instead (a point which I've reiterated above). There's no need to assume I'm going be biased. As I mentioned in the OP this affects anyone wanting to stream BSS content, not just me, which is why I felt it important to create an avenue for the community as a whole to discuss. Since I started streaming, several people have said to me that they now want to do it. I think it's important to encourage and promote content creation because it directly benefits the BSS community and will help it grow, but now we need to tell these people that they won't be eligible for the biggest tour we have (unless they qualify through PS tours). I'm worried that if they're in a similar situation to me they will choose the same path and give up BSSC.

I would have liked to keep the thread open so we could hear from more people, even if we're going to go with this decision in the long run. Discussion doesn't hurt.
 
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