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I think Deoxys-LG and Deoxys-E should be allowed in OU.

Ok Infernape has a big movepool but you are kidding yourself if you think it has a better movepool than deoxys LOL not to mention infernape most of the time is mixed and like always has fire/fighting move and the other moves are either a) stat up or b) moves like stone edge or thunderpunch that can hit gyara/salamence/water type
 
Having spammed Deoxys-E since Shoddy allowed it, I'm obliged to think that this thing will be back in Ubers very quickly. I've been running a very straightforward Life Orb set with Psycho Boost/SuperPower/Shadow Ball/Ice Beam and on average I'd say he's taking down at least 3 Pokemon per match. I've made a point of asking my opponent at the end of every match what their opinion on Deoxys is, and 100% of my opponents have said something to the effect of "Why the fuck is that thing allowed in OU?"
 
It would make sense that people are less effective at dealing with DS right now then they will be in, say a month. A lot of people probably aren't even aware of it's approximate stat-build or movepool (let alone standard sets).
After these become common knowledge and people adjust their teams accordingly I expect teams to rely less on pokemon that Deoxys easily counters, and pack more things that do well against him (Dusknoir or Spiritomb, etc).
 
Hmm, with the introduction of Deoxys-E to OU, aswell as the possibility of Lati@s (without souldew), then the entire OU metagame will centralize on counters to them.

I personally think Deoxys should remain in Uber, The variety of his movepool will make a hard solid counter. And why should the metagame be geared to counter the one pokemon?
 
Lati@s - Soul Dew is still too good for OU, simply because all the stats are still above average.

Lee, your set doesn't look too threatening. It's just not walled by Blissey.
 
Well, it's certainly walled by a few things, but if I were to list all the Pokemon that it outspeeds and effortlessly OHKO's it would be a frigging big list. As far as late game sweepers go, it's in a league of it's own.
 
Lee said:
Well, it's certainly walled by a few things, but if I were to list all the Pokemon that it outspeeds and effortlessly OHKO's it would be a frigging big list. As far as late game sweepers go, it's in a league of it's own.
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so its better than say, scarf/SD chomp? i think its power is more suprise and lack of knolage of common sets than its power. think about it when a very good new set is invented it slays pokemon for a while then people start to expect it and counter it, its the same but on a bigger scale due to it being a new pokemon rarther than a new moveset. if we reban it sooner than 2 weeks we will not have done a full test, idealy we should wait 2-3 mounths.
 
Phizzlax said:
After these become common knowledge and people adjust their teams accordingly I expect teams to rely less on pokemon that Deoxys easily counters, and pack more things that do well against him (Dusknoir or Spiritomb, etc).
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So teams become increasingly similar ... how wonderful.
 
It's quite the opposite from what I gather (MrE position here) - allowing a new uber in standards causes people to focus their teams a lot more on countering that uber, both because they'll find it (one of) the most threatening Pokemon in the game and because a lot of people will be trying it out whether they think it's uber or not.
 
I'm not that great of a battler but when I looked at this thread I couldn't help but think of trick room teams. With Deoxys-S his biggest help being his speed trick room could really kill him. Of course the opponent could switch but as long as you can keep trick room up Deoxys will be pretty useless.
 
so its better than say, scarf/SD chomp?
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Yup. Garchomp is really quite easy to revenge kill, and the Scarf variations are easily walled. Deoxys-E has neither of those traits. He's near impossible to revenge kill, and can run so many different sets that he alone chooses who walls him.

if we reban it sooner than 2 weeks we will not have done a full test, idealy we should wait 2-3 mounths.
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Agreed. In the meanwhile, I intend to have some fun using him. :heart:

@Shiny Oddish: You can stop being so pessimistic now and again you know? :toast:
 
E is Speed, LG is Defense, FR is Attack.

Most people nowadays call Speed Deoxys Deoxys-S, and use Deoxys-D and Deoxys-A for Defense and Attack.
 
I at first thought Deoxys-S should be OU, but after being mauled by it for a few battles, I must say: THIS THING IS NO WAY COUNTERABLE IN OU.
 
my team is mauled by nape and stat uping bulky waters you cant counter everything, just ajust your team to have a deoxys-e counter, or a set or pokemon that you can switch between to stall for LO damage and scout its movepool.
 
with no STAB? Not likely, let me check.

EDIT:
Dugtrio Neutral Nature, Choice Banded using Sucker Punch.
Defender Deoxys-E: 31 IV HP, 31 Def IV, 0 EVs on both.
Defender HP: 241
Damage: 209 - 246
Damage: 86.72% - 102.07%

So... there is a CHANCE of OHKO on Neutral, OHKO for sure if Adamant, or if Deoxys uses Mild Nature.
 
Phizzlax said:
It would make sense that people are less effective at dealing with DS right now then they will be in, say a month. A lot of people probably aren't even aware of it's approximate stat-build or movepool (let alone standard sets).
After these become common knowledge and people adjust their teams accordingly I expect teams to rely less on pokemon that Deoxys easily counters, and pack more things that do well against him (Dusknoir or Spiritomb, etc).
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It would be funny if people got it into their heads that they could shunt Deoxys-S back into Ubers simply by boycotting Shoddy for the duration of the testing and refusing to even bother trying to develop Deoxys-S counter strategies.
 
Phox said:
Having spent a good bit of time in the realm of Uber stalling, I can tell you that Deoxys-L is one of the best defensive Pokemon in the whole game. With a movepool easily larger than Clefable's (it has access to moves from all 4 forms) and defenses like that it's the ultimate Spiker. Its ability to Toxistall is so great it can take on whole teams at once. Deoxys-L is a defensive beast.

Deoxys-E seems a lot less impressive. Base 95 offensive stats may seem average, but keep in mind that he's outspeeding most Choice Scarf users already and that you can just put Choice Specs on and he becomes too dangerous. If your team doesn't happen to be carrying a priority move (in other words if you're running a stall team or if you're unlucky) then you're basically screwed.

One thing people don't understand is that most Ubers aren't completely and utterly game breaking. But when you think about how they work in OU, you realize that the metagame would have to change to counter one Pokemon. If that's the situation, then that Pokemon should stay in Ubers.
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What about Garchomp, Salamence and Gliscor...

Isnt there a reason why ppl use Ice Shard on Donphan/Mamoswine, and its not just b/c they are 1st-priority, it is because it is an Ice Move.

PPl use Empoleon/Blissey just so they can handle Specsmence, and use Hp Ice/grass just so they can handle Dragons/Gliscor and Swampert, would you then count those as Ubers too?

Seriously, and ppl use Magnezone just for Skarmary, (and give it HP Fire just for Scizor/Forretress).

Aren't these examples that the metagame had to change, just to counter 1 pokemon.... Just like you said as your reason why these 2 Deoxys forms should stay Uber?

P.S. Remember, ppl use McGar (Sub/Focus Punch/T-bolt/Hp Ice) just so they can hit Tyranitar/Blissey hard. And how many other pokemon use Focus Punch just for that same purpose?
 
There's a difference between using shit like spiritomb just to counter a pokemon and sticking ice beam which is a great offensive type anyway on almost anything that learns it.

lol you dont need magnezone for skarm it is just the best non uber steel trapper. People use HP Ice/Grass on electrics because most of them only get thunderbolt.

Ice hits much more than gliscor salamence and garchomp. Having to put ice beam on a pokemon is much less constricting than having to put spiritomb on your team.

Also you can revenge kill specsmence at least. Try revenge killing deoxys if it's not paralyzed/asleep/ the player is actually there playing

also mcgar sucks it was good in like early-mid rs but its sub is so delicate its lolable. Focus punch also hits much more than bliss/ttar fighting/ice are really good offensive types and i don't think you can compare them to being forced to carry pokemon x on your team.
 
People use Ice Shard on Mamoswine because it's priority STAB and they use it on Donphan because Ground/Ice is a good combo.

Saying that people could adapt to Deoxys-S normally is kind of a stretch. If it was deemed legal it would very likely be a top-tier OU and the game would change quite a bit regardless. Speaking of Deoxys-S, I fought a few battles against it. Most didn't have much decisive evidence, though a Life Orb Psycho Boost managed to come within mere inches of OHKOing my Mirror Coat Milotic. That's a strong Psycho Boost.
 
you know that bliss can revenge kill deoxys if it has T wave right. it takes a super power, criples deoxys with t wave then heals up on the second weakend superpower, of corse no one would keep it in but so many teams have bliss and it can easyly scare bliss off. in fact lots of stuff can revenge it they just need an attack that can do 60%+ (LO damage+other passive damage) to 50/90/90 defences, and to be able to survive 1 attack from 95/95 attacks. not hard without a 4x effective attack.

and phox, realy? my specs mence draco metior only does 75% to milotic (15 less base power, specs over LO), so is yours lacking in sp.def or had you taken prior damage?
 
It did 84%, my 'Tic is Calm with 252 HP (but only 56 in SpD so your set is probably different than mine). Still, that's a strong attack and can OHKO a lot of stuff.
 
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