Online Competition Jump! Magikarp!

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Finally a wacky ruleset for us to have fun with. This is 2v2 Doubles where one Pokemon has to be a Magikarp. You can have up to 6 Pokemon in your team, but one of the two you choose for battle has to be Magikarp.


RULES:
  • 2v2 Doubles
    • Teams can have 2-6 Pokemon
  • Magikarp must be selected for battle
  • Item clause
  • Open to all Pokemon usable in Sword Shield EXCEPTfor anything classed as a legendary
    • Articuno, Articuno-Galar, Zapdos, Zapdos-Galar, Moltres, Moltres-Galar, Mewtwo, Mew, Raikou, Entei, Suicune, Lugia, Ho-Oh, Celebi, Regirock, Regice, Registeel, Latias, Latios, Kyogre, Groudon, Rayquaza, Jirachi, Uxie, Mesprit, Azelf, Dialga, Palkia, Heatran, Regigigas, Giratina, Cresselia, Victini, Cobalion, Terrakion, Virizion, Tornadus, Thundurus, Reshiram, Zekrom, Landorus, Kyurem, Keldeo, Genesect, Xerneas, Yveltal, Zygarde, Diancie, Volcanion, Type: Null, Silvally, Tapu Koko, Tapu Lele, Tapu Bulu, Tapu Fini, Cosmog, Cosmoem, Solgaleo, Lunala, Nihilego, Buzzwole, Pheromosa, Xurkitree, Celesteela, Kartana, Guzzlord, Necrozma, Magearna, Marshadow, Poipole, Naganadel, Stakataka, Blacephalon, Zeraora, Meltan, Melmetal, Zacian, Zamazenta, Eternatus, Kubfu, Urshifu, Zarude, Regieleki, Regidrago, Glastrier, Spectrier, Calyrex
  • Pokemon become level 50 for the battle


Tagging Lego and Marty to get this on Showdown ASAP :psyglad:
 

Heracross2.0

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Considering Magikarp is a waste of a slot, this is basically just 1v1 with Dynamax and the spread move penalty and 5 potential partners. I'm excited to see how the meta pans out!

I can see Rain strats being passable. DMax your Magikarp first (preferably with a Sash), set up Rain with Hydro Pump, and let something like Ludicolo plow through everything. Of course, with 5 slots available, you can make all sorts of strategies that can hopefully counter your opponent.
 
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Considering Magikarp is a waste of a slot, this is basically just 1v1 with Dynamax and the spread move penalty and 5 potential partners. I'm excited to see how the meta pans out!

I can see Rain strats being passable. DMax you Magikarp first (preferably with a Sash), set up Rain with Hydro Pump, and let something like Ludicolo plow through everything. Of course, with 5 slots available, you can make all sorts of strategies that can hopefully counter your opponent.
Sadly, I don't think there is a single Swift Swim mon who wouldn't want to just Dynamax and set rain themselves.

Furthermore, there are synergies to be had, even if they're limited. The biggest players here in my opinion are going to be Gastrodon :gastrodon:, Cradily :cradily:(Storm Drain users who can absorb Magikarp's Hydro Pump) and Coalossal :coalossal:(good old fashion Steam Engine / WP strats.) Coalossal will thrive because its basically the meta threat that can still abuse its doubles niche. Gastrodon and Cradily will rise with it because they can steal its Hydro Pumps and beat it back; they both get Earth Power and can live any unboosted move Coalossal can throw at them with minimal investment (yes, Gastrodon can live Max Overgrowth from Coalossal.)
 
To get the ball rolling, I had a lot of time to think about this meta (the #jump-magikarp channel on the Battle Stadium discord is 99% me and Photon theorymonning I am so sorry) so here are some early thoughts on Magikarp!

This metagame is not playable on PS! as of writing and everything below is how I think the metagame will play out with no frame of reference. What I expect the metagame to end up like may (and probably will) differ greatly from what it actually ends up being!


Magikarp might seem like deadweight because... well, it is. But Magikarp's uselessness is ironically its greatest strength in this competition — attacking a foe's Magikarp with anything but your own Magikarp is, in most cases, a waste of a turn since for the most part your gameplan should be to force a 2v1 against your opponent's Karp. Magikarp can take advantage of the extended turns it's been given of its very short life and can make use of it by say, setting up Airstream buffs or Max Geyser for its teammate to take advantage of, but I don't think this will be Magikarp's strongest asset since it eats up the team's Dynamax. What I think Magikarp's biggest and most frequent contribution in a battle will be is the ability to have effectively three turns of uninterrupted chip damage with a 110 BP move, which can add up even with Magikarp's pathetic offense and can be crucial for putting the opponent in range of a KO.

So what's the best moveset, considering everyone's gonna be lugging this stupid fish around? Well, the moves are pretty objective - Bounce / Hydro Pump / Flail / Splash, with Splash chosen over Tackle because Flail will outdamage Tackle early on (you won't click either anyways) and Splash can be powered up to Max Guard. As for spreads, to me, there's 2 that stand out that I think are the most viable:
  • 228 HP / 252 SpA / 28 SpD, Modest, Focus Sash. This spread ensures that opposing max Special Attack Magikarp can only muster a feeble 3HKO on your superior Chad Karp, strengthening its bones so that Pidgeotto can't even lift it up for a quick meal. Personally, I think this one is generally the way to go. 0 Speed with a Quiet nature is a niche modification that can be ran alongside Azumarill so that your Magikarp dies after the opponent's in the event that your Azumarill faints before the Perish count is over.
  • If you're running G-Max Coalossal alongside Magikarp for the ol' Steam Engine + WP, 228 HP / 28 SpD / 252 Speed, Jolly, Choice Scarf with minimum Special Attack investment achieves the same defensive calcs as the earlier spread, but ensures that you get off a Hydro Pump as early as possible and minimizes the damage that Coalossal takes from it. Wide Lens is also an option to avoid the pesky 10% miss.
Really excited to see how this meta develops! I think this is a really fun and unique competition and I'm kinda shocked it took them until nearly the end of the game's life to make one like it. :dewgong:

The game FORCES you into picking Magikarp


If you time out at team preview the game selects Magikarp for you and the first non-Magikarp teammate from the top-down.
I WOULD HAVE PICKED FUNNIER MONS IF I HAD KNOWN THIS IMAGE WOULD BE IN THE THREAD.... no one is allowed to make fun of the blipbug i found lying around in my box

EDIT: Also real quick — I think Coalossal (:coalossal:) has potential but if you do plan on using one I can promise you that you're gonna get the 10% miss on Hydro t1 like 50 games in a row and enter your Joker Phase. I can taste the salt already
 
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I mean like so far, I'm loving the format. It has a genuine meta developed and has a ton of variety. I just love predicting a Cinderace using Max Knuckle and being obliterated by a +2 atk Rhyperior Earthquake turned Max Quake. Who knows? Maybe there'll be more things like this in the future.​
 
A Gyarados with Moxie killing both Magikarp with one Earthquake seems like a good strategy.

The dynamax in turn 2 and use Max Airstream for the speed.
 
cradily is too op. Every team needs it because it is just sogood and really restricting, too. cradily beats gastro and coalossal and its coverage is really good and its just really powerful as you can boost yourself with storm drain. It takes a lot of hits and is just absurd and really hard to beat without resisting its dual stab
 
ally switch, cinderace, and ally switch cinderace is making me unconditionally upset at this, but otherwise its a really fun format. Porygon Z goes "Max strike go brrrr"
 
cradily is too op. Every team needs it because it is just sogood and really restricting, too. cradily beats gastro and coalossal and its coverage is really good and its just really powerful as you can boost yourself with storm drain. It takes a lot of hits and is just absurd and really hard to beat without resisting its dual stab
Very true. The meta is cinderace, cradily, answers to them and magikarp. I think dracovish is a great pick cuz the most cinderace can do against it is sucker punch - and even then, dracovish has fighting type coverage in low kick. And the best cradily answer (from my experience) is ferrothorn since it resist all of cradily attacks except ground coverage - which Ferro is neutral to
 
:sm/lapras-gmax:
Lapras is my favorite Pokémon in the format. It neatly takes +2 G-Max Volcalith from Coalossal, can set up the screens for a bulky endgame with my favorite tool so far, Perish Song

The fact that you're slower than Magikarp means that if they have another fast Pokémon, it will most likely be impossible to stop it.

Hydro Pump, Freeze-Dry, Thunder and Perish Song is my favorite set right now.


:sm/durant:
Durant is another Pokémon that I really like. It's fast, deals crazy damage and it's weak to Fire-types only, which my Lapras can pressure on Team Preview.

:sm/cradily:
I don't think Cradily is that OP right now, but it pressures alot on Team Preview and I like that, but inside the match it doesn't do much.

:sm/dragapult:
Dragapult is a very oppresive Pokémon in my experience so far and I'd like to hear more from others. Max Phantasm is great for 2HKO's
 
cradily is too op. Every team needs it because it is just sogood and really restricting, too. cradily beats gastro and coalossal and its coverage is really good and its just really powerful as you can boost yourself with storm drain.
Fun tech for Storm Drain team; Milotic gets Hydro Pump and Imprison, and outspeeds the Magikarp. You can then use Recover and Ice Beam/ Triple Axel (if you're extra spicy) to win 1 v 1
 
Today, I'd like to talk about the most influential pokémon in the Jump! Magikarp! metagame. When I teambuild, I look to find pokémon that check the popular picks - such as Cinderace and Dragapult.

:sm/lapras-gmax:
The name of the game with Lapras is to get up Aurora Veil via G-Max Resonance. It also has the ability Water Absorb - which is useful for the long term. Not many pokémon can reliably 1 hit ko Lapras, and even less can through Aurora Veil. It also has the option of Perish Song stall - which is usually less effective seeing as more and more people are developing answers to it and learning Bounce makes you immune to Perish Song (if your in the invulnerability stage). A solid pokémon that has very few things that can stop its bulk and Perish Song antics.


:sm/cinderace:
Cinderace is just power. Its ability Libero, one of the highest speed stats and great coverage, the only way you can reliably handle it is to OHKO it. Scarf Dracovish can do this nicely seeing as all cinderace can do against it is Sucker Punch. Aside from that, you can only predict it with a Weakness Policy and hope you KO it.


:sm/dragapult:
Dragapult is the fastest legal pokémon in the Jump! Magikarp! format (though there's Ninjask - but it is unreliable and gimmicky). Its blazing 142 speed stat along side decent offenses makes it a very versatile pick on a team slot. It can Ally Switch (though this soon became irrelevant), use Weakness Policy, and can even stall out dynamic via Substitute. The only real way you can deal with it is outspeed, or KO it. Blaziken can use the combination of Speed Boost and Night Slash to get the job done - though it needs a speed increase to outspeed Dragapult or use Weakness Policy prediction to OHKO it.


:sm/cradily:
Cradily is possibly the best pokémon in the metagame. Its typing, bulk and ability Storm Drain makes it offensive, take a hit and deal one back with a ton of power. Its also the most reliable Coalossal check (who I will get to later) - another popular pick in the meta. Another Storm Drain user in Gastrodon is actually quad weak to Cradily's Grass STAB. Ferrothorn is the single best answer to it since it can cripple it with Knock Off and resists all of its attacks or is neutral to them. Without a Ferrothorn, your best bet is to predict the hell out of it and hope for the best. A great pokémon to have on any Jump! Magikarp team, and a consistent performer on both sides of the spectrum.

:sm/coalossal-gmax:
Coalossal is one of the most potentially best pokémon if not for Cradily. Its ability Steam Engine and Weakness Policy combination from the early days for gen 8 VGC return with a vengance. The simple fact is if you don't deal with it via cradily or power, your most likely gonna get crushed. Im making it sound like VGC even though its 2v2 - but it is true. You must have an answer to Coalossal or its a humiliating defeat. The best answer to it is Cradily (as mentioned prior) as it shuts down its Steam Engine + Weakness Policy antics and OHKOs with Earth Power turned Max Quake. Aside from this minor setback, it is yet another solid pick in the meta.

I know there's more stuff like Metagross and the occasional Wobuffet or Unburden Hawlucha, but they are anything between not used enough, niche and gimmicky. Let me know your guys' picks to counteract these pokemon, or your success with them.
 
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Omastar has an interesting place, it beats Cinderace, Dragapult, and Coalossal, but can't win vs Cradily. I run weak armor omastar with scarf karp.

Cinderace: tackle omastar to outspeed cinderace. Life orb or expert belt pushes it into guaranteed OHKO.
252+ SpA Omastar Max Rockfall vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Dynamax Cinderace: 306-360 (98.7 - 116.1%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO

Dragapult: Tank the first hit and max hailstorm. Second turn you outspeed it either from pult's hit or tackle from scarf karp.
252+ SpA Omastar Max Hailstorm vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Dynamax Dragapult: 190-224 (58.2 - 68.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Coalossal: If you win the scarf speed tie, you OHKO coal. If you lose, max overgrowth knocks you out.
252+ SpA Omastar Max Geyser vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Dynamax Coalossal: 528-624 (121.6 - 143.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
 
So I have a theory

:sm/sirfetch
Sirfetch'd threatens (quite literally) everything that has a lower speed stat than it. The sheer power of Choice Band Meteor Assault that Ghost-types can't negate cannot be overstated. It also has coverage options in Leaf Blade for Gastrodon and Rhyperior, Throat Chop for Perish Song antics, Poison Jab for Fairy's and many more. While an underdog, Sirfetch'd can deal some hurt against anything slower than it - as they all fear the sheer damage it dishes out
 

Marty

Always more to find
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Research Leader
Attached are the 1630 stats from when the format was implemented until yesterday. Good luck to those entering!
Code:
 Total battles: 15645
 Avg. weight/team: 0.027
 + ---- + ------------------ + --------- + ------ + ------- + ------ + ------- + 
 | Rank | Pokemon            | Usage %   | Raw    | %       | Real   | %       | 
 + ---- + ------------------ + --------- + ------ + ------- + ------ + ------- + 
 | 1    | Magikarp           | 100.00000% | 31290  | 100.000% | 8176   | 156.264% | 
 | 2    | Cinderace          | 59.78722% | 10396  | 33.225% | 1905   | 36.409% | 
 | 3    | Porygon2           | 41.78692% | 5239   | 16.743% | 814    | 15.558% | 
 | 4    | Cradily            | 36.67148% | 10703  | 34.206% | 2406   | 45.985% | 
 | 5    | Dragapult          | 36.04163% | 9241   | 29.533% | 1451   | 27.732% | 
 | 6    | Gastrodon          | 33.98597% | 8351   | 26.689% | 1253   | 23.948% | 
 | 7    | Primarina          | 23.15086% | 3663   | 11.707% | 531    | 10.149% | 
 | 8    | Dracozolt          | 20.98755% | 3123   |  9.981% | 493    |  9.422% | 
 | 9    | Ferrothorn         | 19.88553% | 4859   | 15.529% | 628    | 12.003% | 
 | 10   | Lapras             | 16.43717% | 4997   | 15.970% | 1054   | 20.145% |
 

Attachments

Fun tech for Storm Drain team; Milotic gets Hydro Pump and Imprison, and outspeeds the Magikarp. You can then use Recover and Ice Beam/ Triple Axel (if you're extra spicy) to win 1 v 1
The Magikarp might run scarf though, so I would be careful.
 
I think that this formats main thing are mindgames in team preview. On my team I've got a Maractus that kills Cradily and Gastrodon with Giga Drain and Drain Punch. But this Maractus does not have storm drain, but Water Absorb. If I have my Maractus out against a coalossal they will pretty much never go for the hydro pump strat because of the potential storm drain. What I do instead is to use Magikarp's Max to use Max Geyser on the opposing magikarp to set the rain up and one shot the enemy coalossal with rainboosted life orb weather ball for the safe one hit even through Max.
 
So I'm making my Jump! Magikarp! team. And I want it to counter most of the metagame. The team consists of the bottom four:
:rillaboom-gmax: - :magikarp: - :cradily: - :inteleon-gmax:
https://pokepast.es/5ce30c4f97d56d64 (team in detail)

In making this team, I wanted it to be Hyper Offense in the sense that the pokémon counter the common picks in the meta. Everyone on the team counters multiple pokémon efficiently and effectively.

The Magikarp set is pretty straightforward - the same moves you'd see normally and max speed with a nature that doesn't lower its attacking stats. Its gonna die in one hit - so a Focus Sash gives it that little extra push needed. If not running Sash, you can run Choice Scarf for activations or to just... hope Bounce lands and paralyzes.

Cradily is probably my favorite mon in the entire format. The sole fact that it has an excellent type combination, Storm Drain, amazing bulk and power makes it (imo) one of the first to consider on your team. The pokémon that its good against is not limited to: Coalossal (:coalossal:), Gastrodon (:gastrodon:), Palossand (:palossand:), Dragapult variants (:dragapult:) and Rillaboom with the right set/prediction (:rillaboom:). The set of Meteor Beam, Energy Ball, Earth Power and Protect gives it coverage against almost everything, the strongest moves of its typing and the ability to live any one hit - such as a Max Move if Protect is powered up into Max Guard. Of all the moves, Energy Ball (imo) is the least replaceable. Meteor Beam could be subbed out for Ancient Power in case of a non max senario, but its lower power, dependency on the 10% omni-boost and lower PP makes it unreliable at times. Energy Ball can be replaced with Giga Drain for reliable longevity and damage, or Sludge Bomb/Sludge Wave for Max Ooze making it even more powerful - though it does not have many issues with power. Max sp atk and def with a modest nature and Keep Berry gives it special attacking prowess and makes it incredibly bulky. Its word matchup is Ferrothorn (:ferrothorn:) - seeing as it threatens it with powerful STAB steel-type damage and resists or is neutral to all of the type coverage it has. Aside from this, Cradily remains a consist performer no matter if it's in Team Preview or on the battlefield.

Inteleon was on my team for one sole purpose: it's A Cinderace (:cinderace:) answer. The whole idea of Inteleon is to outspeed things and do big damage. Blizzard, Air Slash and Dark Pulse are for Dynamax scenarios (yes. You will max a scarf pokemon). Hydro Cannon is the name of the game. You can alternatively run max speed timid and max sp atk for a more max centered Inteleon - which also happens to keep Hydro Cannon 100% accurate and you still outspeed Cinderace. Its good matchup are anything prone to powerful, special attacks made of water. However, at the cost of beating one of the best pokémon it has little defensive utility. One can MAYBE justify running a defensive calc after the speed and damage ones - but it is frail and folds to just about every strong attack in the meta.

Rillaboom was probably the hardest pick on the team. When making this team, I feared bulky, stall pokemon. And the #1 bulky stall pokémon is Lapras. Its G-Max Resonance + Perish Song stall antics are A surefire way to make anyone new feel enraged at such a cheap strategy (or that's just me). I was trying to find a way to outspeed and OHKO Lapras when dynamaxed with maximum hp ev's and no bulk elsewhere. And I used super effective hits only since I found those to have consistent results. These were the calcs I got:
252+ Atk Choice Band Reckless Mienshao High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Dynamax Lapras-Gmax: 510-602 (107.5 - 127%) -- guaranteed OHKO

244 Atk Choice Band Sirfetch’d Meteor Assault vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Dynamax Lapras-Gmax: 474-558 (100 - 117.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 252 P / 0 Def Dynamax Lapras-Gmax: 482-570 (101.6 - 120.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

76+ Atk Choice Band Archeops Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Dynamax Lapras-Gmax: 474-558 (100 - 117.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Hustle Dracozolt Bolt Beak (170 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Dynamax Lapras-Gmax: 480-566 (101.2 - 119.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 Atk Miracle Seed Rillaboom-Gmax G-Max Drum Solo vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Dynamax Lapras-Gmax in Grassy Terrain: 498-588 (105 - 124%) -- guaranteed OHKO. With these calcs I decided my best bet was to use Rillaboom. It has a good matchup into the aforementioned Lapras (:lapras:), Dracozolt (:dracozolt:), Gastrodon (:gastrodon:), some Cradily variants (:cradily:) and frail waters such as Barraskewda (:barraskewda:). It doesn't like the presence of Cinderace or Dragonite, but the positive matchup vs 2 of the metagames best is always valuable.

Future updates on the team will occur, and I will take any suggestions you guys may have.
 
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:kommo-o:

Kommo-o @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Bulletproof
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 212 Atk / 44 Def
Adamant Nature
- Reversal
- Iron Tail
- Outrage
- Protect

This is one of my favorite sets rn. It beats a lot of the meta, and I use it with power herb bounce magikarp to self proc. it is really good vs a lot of stuff and imo its really underrated as it can take a super effective hit then OHKO back a lot of the time
 

zee

I'll keep you safe in these arms of mine
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VGC Leader
Had nothing to do today so joined on a whim and just finished my day 1 games, 13-2 and number 2 worldwide at the time I finished

1658453487536.png


This is the team I'm using:

1658453525835.png


I live tweeted my run on twitter (and will do so again when I play next) but here's my matchups in table form if you're curious. Magikarps omitted for brevity.

games 1-5games 6-10games 11-15
:durant: vs :clefable: Win:cradily: vs :shedinja: Win:rhyperior: vs :dracozolt: Win
:rhyperior: vs :dracozolt: Win:cradily: vs :primarina: Win:durant: vs :porygon2: Loss
:cradily: vs :dragapult: Win:durant: vs :dracozolt: Win:rhyperior: vs :cinderace-gmax: Win
:durant: vs :porygon2: Loss:primarina: vs :cinderace-gmax: Win:rhyperior: vs :cinderace-gmax: Win
:rhyperior: vs :cinderace-gmax: Win:primarina: vs :cinderace-gmax: Win:durant: vs :cradily: Win

As far as my team's stats


pokemonbring %win %
:cradily:20%100%
:rhyperior:33%100%
:durant:33%60%
:primarina:14%100%
:cinderace:0%N/A
 
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