Legalization of Cannabis

Wretch

So, I'm interested, what is your guys' view on the legalization of cannabis for recreational use?

As a smoker and resident of Southern California, I support it 100%. It's extremely silly for such a harmless drug to be illegal and shunned upon by the nation when much more dangerous things such as tobacco and alcohol are legal. I'm quite dumbfounded by it.

Makes me happy that legalization is right around the corner for California.

Thoughts?
 
If it is legalized here in California, I hope they tax the shit out of it. Mo' money for the state and whatnot
 
Im worried about it being decriminalized. Or at least I was when I smoked a lot. A few times I got caught with a gram or a blunt and the cop would just be like eh w/e and let me off. If it were decriminalized it would save them a trip to court, all they would do is just give you a hefty fine and send you on your way.
 
I think it should be fully legalized, 1st of may this year (New zealand) we have an event called J day, where every one comes together with live bands to basically just smoke pot, i don't smoke as much as i did in the past but i still think it should be legal
 
The way we have it here in the netherlands is fine (tolerated, not legal, apperently there is a difference). The main thing is it is actually happening less because of this (seems some people only do it for the thrill of doing something illegal) and the people who do it know the consequences and stuff.

But yeah, legalizing actually takes away a big part of the problems (crime) whilst what people seem to eb afraid off (mass drug abuse) is just not true.
 
bugcatcherjasonn said:
harmless? that shit impairs my driving.
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so does a lot of legal, over-the-counter stuff.

i'm all for legalizing cannabis. this "war on drugs" really causes a lot more problems than it claims to be solving. and all of the money spent on putting minor offenders in jail, all the money spent campaigning against drugs, etc. would be a lot better off being spent on something that can actually produce results. like education.

i came across this a while ago and found it pretty interesting:

What's Wrong With the Drug War?

Everyone has a stake in ending the war on drugs. Whether you’re a parent concerned about protecting children from drug-related harm, a social justice advocate worried about racially disproportionate incarceration rates, an environmentalist seeking to protect the Amazon rainforest or a fiscally conservative taxpayer you have a stake in ending the drug war. U.S. federal, state and local governments have spent hundreds of billions of dollars trying to make America “drug-free.” Yet heroin, cocaine, methamphetamine and other illicit drugs are cheaper, purer and easier to get than ever before. Nearly half a million people are behind bars on drug charges - more than all of western Europe (with a bigger population) incarcerates for all offenses. The war on drugs has become a war on families, a war on public health and a war on our constitutional rights.

Many of the problems the drug war purports to resolve are in fact caused by the drug war itself. So-called “drug-related” crime is a direct result of drug prohibition's distortion of immutable laws of supply and demand. Public health problems like HIV and Hepatitis C are all exacerbated by zero tolerance laws that restrict access to clean needles. The drug war is not the promoter of family values that some would have us believe. Children of inmates are at risk of educational failure, joblessness, addiction and delinquency. Drug abuse is bad, but the drug war is worse.

Few public policies have compromised public health and undermined our fundamental civil liberties for so long and to such a degree as the war on drugs. The United States is now the world's largest jailer, imprisoning nearly half a million people for drug offenses alone. That's more people than Western Europe, with a bigger population, incarcerates for all offenses. Roughly 1.5 million people are arrested each year for drug law violations - 40% of them just for marijuana possession. People suffering from cancer, AIDS and other debilitating illnesses are regularly denied access to their medicine or even arrested and prosecuted for using medical marijuana. We can do better.
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Source
 
I think it should be legalised. Despite what some may say, cannabis is dangerous. But so are smoking, drinking, driving, skydiving, rock climbing, football, welding, shooting, and thousands of other things many people do. I don't want a nanny state.

Unfortunately, legalising cannabis isn't simple. An international treaty, the Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs, agreed in 1961, "ties the hands" of the states party to it, requiring them to outlaw the use of cannabis and any drug deemed to have a similar effect.
 
I am not only all for the legalisation of Cannabis, but I think there would be considerable advantages in the legalisation of all drugs.

The case regarding cannabis is rather obvious. Cannabis is roughly as harmful as alcohol and tobacco, possibly less so, and both of these are legal. It is also not "addictive" as such, although the definition of this word is vague (it is addictive in the same way that video games are.) As such the disadvantages of legalising Cannabis are relatively weak.

Cannabis as it is is certainly not difficult to obtain here in the UK, or in most other places for that matter. The issue is the sources from which it comes. These not only encourage the use of other more dangerous drugs, but also provide links with criminals. In the case of Cannabis, legalisation could mean that the strength of the drug could be controlled, preventing the most dangerous forms of the drug from being consumed without warning. Information on safe consumption could be more easily supplied, through controls on packaging, preventing people from consuming too much.

And finally there is the issue of abuse of so-called "medicinal" use - when does it become acceptable to take it? In california it seems as though people can obtain Cannabis legally for such ailments as "anxiety." In fact, there are doctors you can visit who prescribe cannabis for anything.

In the case of other drugs, there is often the risk of them being "cut" with other substances. Not only is this ripping off the consumer, but many of these substances are somewhat more dangerous than the drugs themselves. The criminal connections argument still applies in the case of these other drugs, though the level of dependence that some of them inspire makes this problem significantly worse.

In Britain at the moment a large outcry has surrounded a synthetic drug named Mephedrone (sounds confusingly like methodone - whose idea was that?) This drug has some circumstatial evidence showing it as dangerous, though nothing has been proven as of yet. A government advisor was recently sacked after explaining his justification for Mephedrone maintaining its legal status. In this case, since the drug in synthetic, a slight change in the recipe can simply be made along with the name, and it could be back on the high street in no time at all. Enforcing such a change would be a large waste in government time and money, as would, arguably, the fight against drugs in general.

Allowing drugs to be grown legally can also help us to defeat terrorism. Afghanistan produces a huge proportion of the world's opium, which is helping to fund them. Cocaine is also used to fund rebels in South America, though they have less direct impact among us. The use of drugs as funding for criminal circles extends right down to the british drug dealers.
 
From my viewpoint, I always seem to associate the laws against weed to be similar to those of the Prohibition. It doesn't really achieve much, except for some unlucky sods who get caught with it, and it's just sinking money for the government. They lose potential tax money, and time police could be spending doing other things, they have to spend part of it trying to arrest people for weed.

I'm completely in favour of legalizing cannabis.
 
cantab said:
I think it should be legalized. Despite what some may say, cannabis is dangerous. But so are smoking, drinking, driving, skydiving, rock climbing, football, welding, shooting, and thousands of other things many people do. I don't want a nanny state.
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This.

I would not have a problem with it legalized. Handful of my friends already do it, and I don't see them doing unresponsive things. The whole "war on drugs" has been drawn out and needs to end.
 
One does have to be wary of legalising drugs though. Once it's legalised it can be commercially exploited. I expect most of us are familiar with the actions of the tobacco industry in the past, seeking to downplay the health risks of their products by underhanded means. Legalise any currently illegal drug and that is likely to happen all over again. Ideally, relevant health warnings would be mandated BEFORE a drug was legalised, but unsurprisingly there are issues with quality of research on illegal drugs and that approach is no good for new drugs.

Maybe approve recreational drugs in a manner similar to therapeutic ones. They would have to meet standards of non-addictiveness and safety. But of course that is sidestepped by marketing "legal highs" as "not for human consumption", as was the case with mephedrone. The government can't (or at least shouldn't) regulate what people ingest, inhale, or inject, they can only regulate sale and possession.
 
Wretch said:
So, I'm interested, what is your guys' view on the legalization of cannabis for recreational use?

As a smoker and resident of Southern California, I support it 100%. It's extremely silly for such a harmless drug to be illegal and shunned upon by the nation when much more dangerous things such as tobacco and alcohol are legal. I'm quite dumbfounded by it.

Makes me happy that legalization is right around the corner for California.

Thoughts?
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i think that the original poster is one of those "yeah! let's legalize pot!" types that don't really know too much on the subject. sorry, but that's what i got from reading this.
throw in a few "big" words like "dumbfounded" and "shunned" to make it more appealing/thought out, i guess. and "harmless???!??!?"
 
Optimusje said:
The way we have it here in the netherlands is fine (tolerated, not legal, apperently there is a difference). The main thing is it is actually happening less because of this (seems some people only do it for the thrill of doing something illegal) and the people who do it know the consequences and stuff.

But yeah, legalizing actually takes away a big part of the problems (crime) whilst what people seem to eb afraid off (mass drug abuse) is just not true.
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basically sums it up, but if the police catch you smoking it on the streets you're still going to get a nice trip to the station, then again I never did smoke anything so I don't care what people do as long as they dont annoy me with it.


we have the so called coffee shops (not at all like the US versions) where they sell softdrugs mostly.
 
The problem with the Dutch approach is that having any activity that is officially criminal, but laxly enforced, provides a way for selective enforcement to be used to target individuals or groups. Your new girlfriend's previous man was a cop? Find yourself arrested and hauled down the nick after you leave a 'coffee shop'. You're <insert ethnic minority here>? Find yourself stopped and searched on suspicion of possession when walking down the street the head shop is on. And so on.
 
I know I'm going against the general trend but I don't think it should be legalized. For one, the only reason smoking is legal is the money the government can get from taxing it and Cannabis is 15 times worse for you. The only reason smoking kills more people is because it's legalized.
Another reason is all of the chemicals that can be found in it. For instance there was a trend of putting pieces of glass in it to make it look shiny so that it looks like it has a high concentration of the chemical that gives you a high.
One of the reasons it is banned is because even once you quit the effects can last, which it doesn't with smoking or alcohol, and, because although it is somewhat OK for people in early 20s, but after 30 it really starts to fuck you up (that was told to me by somebody who has done drugs).
While it may seem that alcohol and cigarettes are worse in the short term, which is all people seem to care about anyway, Cannabis is much worse in the long term.
And it's not exactly good financially for you, or the government (hence the country as a whole) which will affect you even more.
Also if we legalize it and then reevaluate and then make it illegal again (which probably could happen) there could be a scenario not unlike the Prohibition in America where gangs pretty much ruled and there was many killings etc because of it.
However it should be used for medicinal purposes (if necessary) and I know someone who was given Heroine for medicinal purposes shortly after she died and was resuscitated, which, according to her, worked well.

The only positives I can think of is getting high (which doesn't exactly last for an eternity all though it is good while it lasts) and my dad met Russell Brand (who most of you probably haven't even heard of anyway) at an NA (narcotics anonymous) meeting. And hash-fudge, -brownies and -cakes are amazing.
 
sce4 said:
I know I'm going against the general trend but I don't think it should be legalized. For one, the only reason smoking is legal is the money the government can get from taxing it and Cannabis is 15 times worse for you. The only reason smoking kills more people is because it's legalized.
Another reason is all of the chemicals that can be found in it. For instance there was a trend of putting pieces of glass in it to make it look shiny so that it looks like it has a high concentration of the chemical that gives you a high.
One of the reasons it is banned is because even once you quit the effects can last, which it doesn't with smoking or alcohol, and, because although it is somewhat OK for people in early 20s, but after 30 it really starts to fuck you up (that was told to me by somebody who has done drugs).
While it may seem that alcohol and cigarettes are worse in the short term, which is all people seem to care about anyway, Cannabis is much worse in the long term.
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Where are you getting this information from? I've never heard of cannabis being more harmful than tobacco and alcohol (especially 15x worse. Where did you get that number from?). In fact I've heard the opposite, from a health textbook. I'd very much like to see your sources.

Also you are grossly misinformed if you think the effects of smoking and alcohol just magically vanish once you stop smoking/drinking. It can takes years for some of the negative effects of smoking to go away, and sometimes the damage is permanent. The damage done by alcohol can also be near permanent.

Also you don't seem to understand that legalization would help prevent people putting things like glass into the weed to make it look shiner. It would become a regulated substance. At worst companies would just add the shit they add to tobacco cigarettes, but there really wouldn't be a reason for them to do so (well besides nicotine).

sce4 said:
Also if we legalize it and then reevaluate and then make it illegal again (which probably could happen) there could be a scenario not unlike the Prohibition in America where gangs pretty much ruled and there was many killings etc because of it.
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So if we legalize it, and then make it illegal again we would end up with the situation we pretty much have today, therefore we shouldn't legalize it?

Let me clarify: We have problems with gangs distributing cannabis. Hence why legalizing it would solve a very big problem. Your argument against legalizing it is actually an argument against keeping it illegal.
 
Obsessed said:
Where are you getting this information from? I've never heard of cannabis being more harmful than tobacco and alcohol (especially 15x worse. Where did you get that number from?). In fact I've heard the opposite, from a health textbook. I'd very much like to see your sources.

Also you are grossly misinformed if you think the effects of smoking and alcohol just magically vanish once you stop smoking/drinking. It can takes years for some of the negative effects of smoking to go away, and sometimes the damage is permanent. The damage done by alcohol can also be near permanent.

Also you don't seem to understand that legalization would help prevent people putting things like glass into the weed to make it look shiner. It would become a regulated substance. At worst companies would just add the shit they add to tobacco cigarettes, but there really wouldn't be a reason for them to do so (well besides nicotine).
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I had thought that one joint was roughly equivalent to three cigarets in terms of "amount" tar iirc from grade 9 health but my memory is a little hazy. Obviously your not going to be smoking one joint for every cigaret though, its more like you might be smoking eight cigarets a day vs one joint shared between multiple people every week.
 
Ive never had and probably wont, but i have friends who do. Im for legalizing it, honestly as some others said, theres more dangerous stuff thats legal
 
I whole heartedly support legalization of marijuana for 2 reasons:

1. Tax money to provide services
2. No users or dealers getting raped in a terrible prison system for drug crimes that shouldnt be punished institutionally (imo) I think its 100 times worse for a person mentally and probably physically to be put in prison for narcotics then using them is.
 
sce4 said:
One of the reasons it is banned is because even once you quit the effects can last, which it doesn't with smoking or alcohol, and, because although it is somewhat OK for people in early 20s, but after 30 it really starts to fuck you up (that was told to me by somebody who has done drugs).
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so my liver will be fine as soon as i put my beer down.
and my lungs will be fine once i put this cigarette out.
 
I support the legalization of marijuana from a ideological and economic point of view. The government has no say, as we are all aware, in what we can do in the privacy of our own home so long as it does not threaten anyone (or is not part of a plan to threaten someone). This extends to marijuana. In fact, I'd say that statement applies more to marijuana than to the "socially acceptable" alcohol which impairs judgement. The Lancet, an esteemed medical journal, wrote that "The smoking of cannabis, even long term, is not harmful to health." The fact that we keep the only drug that never kills anyone, never causes an overdose, has a wide variety of medical usages, all while being free from the possibility of physical addiction is a great triumph of ignorance over knowledge and reason.

From an economic standpoint, marijuana is a godsend. Everyone is willing to spend money on and get the cash flowing, it creates a whole new industry with plenty of jobs, plus the fact that marijuana can be grown in America which would boost agriculture, and it can be taxed by the government as well, and I'm sure the gov't wants all the help it can get with that debt.

Besides, marijuana is easier to get than a happy meal. If I want weed, I'll get weed, whether or not the government wants me to. As far as the government should be concerned, the only difference between legalization and the current state is the fact that they do not receive tax revenue, while the illegal status supports drug cartels the US spends money fighting. All the while, people are still getting marijuana, and continuing to keep it illegal is simply stubborn. Furthermore, and this applies to the people, if marijuana was legal, regulated, grown legitimately and sold by licensed vendors, there wouldn't be the chance that the marijuana was laced with any harder drugs.

*ding ding* here comes the ignorance train

sce4 said:
I know I'm going against the general trend but I don't think it should be legalized. For one, the only reason smoking is legal is the money the government can get from taxing it and Cannabis is 15 times worse for you. The only reason smoking kills more people is because it's legalized.
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Wrong. The only reason tobacco kills more than pot is tobacco is worse for you. Marijuana shows no signs of noticeable health risk.

Another reason is all of the chemicals that can be found in it.
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There are thousands upon thousands of chemicals in your own body that are essential to your health. Chemicals aren't necessarily a bad thing even if school health programs like to say "u shouldnt smoke bcuz there are 1614 chemicals in it!!"

For instance there was a trend of putting pieces of glass in it to make it look shiny so that it looks like it has a high concentration of the chemical that gives you a high.
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Yeah, and this kind of shit wouldn't be happening if the stuff was being sold legitimately rather than by uneducated high school dropouts trying to put one over on everyone.

One of the reasons it is banned is because even once you quit the effects can last, which it doesn't with smoking or alcohol, and, because although it is somewhat OK for people in early 20s, but after 30 it really starts to fuck you up (that was told to me by somebody who has done drugs).
While it may seem that alcohol and cigarettes are worse in the short term, which is all people seem to care about anyway, Cannabis is much worse in the long term.
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cite me multiple reputable sources that can back this up. here, ill give you some in my favor:

article from the lancet describing how marijuana has negligible negative effects.
marijuana showing signs of positive effects on the brain
large, comprehensive study refutes connection between marijuana and lung cancer

etc

And it's not exactly good financially for you, or the government (hence the country as a whole) which will affect you even more.
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besides the fact that a huge number of economists agree that marijuana would be good for the economy, any personal indulgence can be 'bad' for you if you're an idiot about it.

Also if we legalize it and then reevaluate and then make it illegal again (which probably could happen) there could be a scenario not unlike the Prohibition in America where gangs pretty much ruled and there was many killings etc because of it.
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and what do you think is going on right now? because as far as im concerned we're still in a state of prohibition but instead of gang violence there are international drug cartels working to get cannabis (laced with harder drugs, thanks to the government, who would die before letting anyone get their hands on a safe, regulated version of what they want) across into america.
 
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