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As a person whos father is a pastor, i feel like the bible on its own is not actually the problem with the correlation between Christians and being Homophobes as is just twisting messages in the bible and wrong interpretations. Just to start off with an interesting fact, the Old and New Testament iirc never mentions anything other than gay men in sexual acts, no passages on them loving each other romantically and on lesbian women. However, most of these "examples" are likely just wrong interpretations of something else that is much more serious (for example, the verses in Leviticus 18 and 20 that are basically "you as a man, shall not sleep with another man" is likely just a wrong interpretation of what is actually basically "you as a man shall not sleep with another man of your family" basically incest.) So there's nowhere in the bible where it states "you shall not support a gay person" or whatever, nor is there anywhere where they say to hate them.

More so i feel like the issue more so stems in the conservativeness of most christians. Also,
Kin+ak (✧∇✧) don't use christianity and the bible as an excuse to not support lgbt people. There is nowhere in the bible where it states that and saying “oh i don’t hate them but i cant support them” means nothing and is homophobia in my opinion.
 
Nah I was making excuses based on the bible sorry. The truth Is, i go at church Once iN two years. I live on china it's hard to support you With always somebody checking What you do on your phone, let's say I dont hate your community. I live With lots of homophobic people so we Never bring The topic iN a conversation cause we all know that my dad Will start to shout and menace everything from talking ever again. I Don't hate you, i Don't say aloud that I support you, be strong and affirm yourself iN your surroundings. I Never said discrimination isn't bad, i meant that you're probable strong enough. What do you want me to do about discrimination You endure
 
In general people who use religion for bigotry and hate really miss the point to begin with. Speaking as someone who has practiced Christian faith both in and out of a church setting (and am LGBTQ+ myself), conservative/fundamentalist Christians twist the use of the Bible and the real teachings of their own religion to act like they have the moral high ground, and from my own understanding, they are ironically going against everything Jesus ever stood for in doing so.

Like, in addition to what's already been stated, even if we were to assume that homosexuality hypothetically speaking was a "sin", that doesn't actually justify hating them and condemning them, much less not giving them love and compassion. The underlying theme of the Bible and its stories is that everyone is a sinner in some form, no exceptions, and that following Jesus and showing the selfless compassion he did to the people around us is the way, same with accepting him into our lives and that through his death, he bears the burden of the sins of all of us. In that sense fundamentalist/conservative Christians either don't really get that or don't care, and they instead twist it around to act like they have the moral high ground and that they will be saved and everyone else will be condemned: from what I've read, it would actually be the other way around. Those people would be the ones who would be condemned for being hateful and judgmental to others, which in and of itself *is* a sin based on it.

So really there is no value in using religion as an excuse for bigotry and hatred: if anything speaking from a Christian standpoint, fundamentalists who use their Christianity to spread hate are actually going against the core spiritual philosophy their own religion intends to teach in the first place. Really it should be the other way: spread love, compassion, and understanding, not hate. That is what Christianity truly stands for as far as I can tell.
 
On another topic has anyone realized how fucking dire body and race representation is in games geared towards women/gay men (even just gay aligned games like Stardew)
anyways this is largely pedantic so I'm gonna indulge myself because I'm the only person who matters

Like you'll get your white fem twinks every genshin guy, maybe a couple buff hairless white guys(I was shocked that FEE gave us a guy with a beard lol). obv representation in every game sucks ass but it really does feel like those are the only 2 options 99% of the time lmao. only time you ever see a chubby guy it's usually for comedic reasons just like in regular media which is a whole other issue.

Hell just for an example you really only have 5 skinny white guys to choose from in Stardew, Alex is more jock than the others but that's about it (women's the same but Maru is at least poc)

same issue with the FE gays until Engage too, Lindhart, Yuri, and to a lesser extent Niles fall into the same fem leaning twink area so that was your only choice, Mauvier/Diamant and sorta Fogado(they were allies) are a better range of choices so -w-
Timerra is slightly less they were roommates than Fogado was so the lesbians won there
 
Tenshi said:
On another topic has anyone realized how fucking dire body and race representation is in games geared towards women/gay men (even just gay aligned games like Stardew)
anyways this is largely pedantic so I'm gonna indulge myself because I'm the only person who matters

Like you'll get your white fem twinks every genshin guy, maybe a couple buff hairless white guys(I was shocked that FEE gave us a guy with a beard lol). obv representation in every game sucks ass but it really does feel like those are the only 2 options 99% of the time lmao. only time you ever see a chubby guy it's usually for comedic reasons just like in regular media which is a whole other issue.

Hell just for an example you really only have 5 skinny white guys to choose from in Stardew, Alex is more jock than the others but that's about it (women's the same but Maru is at least poc)

same issue with the FE gays until Engage too, Lindhart, Yuri, and to a lesser extent Niles fall into the same fem leaning twink area so that was your only choice, Mauvier/Diamant and sorta Fogado(they were allies) are a better range of choices so -w-
Timerra is slightly less they were roommates than Fogado was so the lesbians won there
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  • it's densely political, "fatness" doesn't sell as a commodity because it isn't associated with the privileges that beauty ("thinness") awards. I wish all your examples didn't scream no shit but they really do, there's a reason gay fanservice anime like Free! and Yuri on Ice starred.. what? Thin white twinks lol, and I sadly don't see inclusion in that way becoming any more meaningful unless sex stops selling..
 
It's honestly hard to be LGBTQ+, not only due to your sexual or romantic interests/tastes, but as well due to being accepted as a human being like any other considered "normal", as straight people. Saddens me that after our ancient roots, we still are seen as some kind of "abnormal" and out of the social pattern, even if our form of loving and pleasure is just as old as everything else. I'm bisexual, even if nobody reminds of us, we still exist.
 
Added a list of users restricted from responding to this thread to the OP for posterity and transparency.

AstemBloom said:
It's honestly hard to be LGBTQ+, not only due to your sexual or romantic interests/tastes, but as well due to being accepted as a human being like any other considered "normal", as straight people. Saddens me that after our ancient roots, we still are seen as some kind of "abnormal" and out of the social pattern, even if our form of loving and pleasure is just as old as everything else. I'm bisexual, even if nobody reminds of us, we still exist.
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+1, there's so many eastern examples of 3rd gender individuals such as hijras from South Asian cultures that transcend gender and sexuality binaries that throw wrenches into the eurocentric/anglosaxon limitations. I usually say "standard," but "limitations" feels more and more appropriate considering western traditions have historically been developed as a means of controlling a populace through tight, closed-minded definitions that create hierarchy.
 
Damn, I remember when this thread wasn't pinned back in the day, neat that it is now. Also that it's a whole new thread, but eh, thats to be expected I guess. Wanna say it was Jumpluff who started the initial thread, but memory is probably faulty there

But yeah, lesbo trans girl here. It's always been a feeling of odd amusement that I can trace back realizing I was trans to Smogon of all places back in the day lol. Talked to someone else that realized she was trans, looked it up to get a better idea, and it was like a whole ass dam had broken and the currents took me somewhere new and honestly scary at the time. A teenager with deep issues mentally and 0% love for her own body for a long time suddenly having to grapple with her whole ass perception of herself being washed away and replaced with a thing she barely knew anything about? Shit's not easy at all I gotta say

But at the same time, I likely would have ended up dead or something if I hadn't figured it out eventually, so hey, even if it's not been the kindest journey, sure beats ending up in a river I guess

Feels kinda weird honestly, thinking back to when first getting that realization, and how much more meek and scared and out of place I felt, and now I'm sitting here just kinda nonchalantly describing it all. Can't call myself a queer elder or anything close to that, but definitely got a whole lot more mature and worldly. Maybe we'll end up helping some new queer folks figure stuff out as well like they did with me
 
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Hello there. I'm an asexual and aromantic fellow who has been identifying as non-binary for almost nearly two years but have been going back and forth figuring myself out for well over a decade even before that. While I am mostly open online with every group I feel comfortable interacting with, I cannot say the same for real life due to not wanting to take any risks due to the part of the State I am in being rather conservative in addition to having a parent who is associated with the Witnesses. I'm not very good at really articulating my experiences with understanding my identity in general but I wanted to come in to say hello and be happy to be here and hope that is enough.
 
dave said:
Added a list of users restricted from responding to this thread to the OP for posterity and transparency.


+1, there's so many eastern examples of 3rd gender individuals such as hijras from South Asian cultures that transcend gender and sexuality binaries that throw wrenches into the eurocentric/anglosaxon limitations. I usually say "standard," but "limitations" feels more and more appropriate considering western traditions have historically been developed as a means of controlling a populace through tight, closed-minded definitions that create hierarchy.
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The first half of your sentence is spot on (especially when one recalls the anti-hijra actions by British colonial officers), but I'm not sure what you mean by the latter half because societies with genders beyond a binary are often still extremely hierarchal and often these genders are constructed to reinforce culturally-enforced sociopolitical hierarchies. IIRC Hijras often had roles as servants and sex workers, and Balkan sworn virgins were forced to give up sex to have the same rights as men. There are also constructed gender roles that aren't hierarchal, well known examples being Two-Spirit and Mahu people in indigenous societies in Canada, the US, and Hawaii. I think that's really one of the fascinating things about how gender is constructed- there really aren't a whole lot of rules for how a culture constructs genders, leaving a wide variety of outcomes.
 
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used to post here a ton 4ish years ago as a Very nervous closeted baby gay so I thought it’d be cute to have my first post after my 3+ year hiatus be in this thread. All those old posts are long gone so you’ll have to just guess which flavors of the rainbow I am if you don’t already know me. I never liked making coming out posts and I’ve no intention of re-doing it now :P

To all the people who read this thread and use this site as a gateway to self-expression otherwise totally inaccessible: I’ve been there. Stuff gets better “with time,” but more than that, we have it in us to make our lives into what we need and want them to be. You’ll get there, you’re strong enough, just follow your convictions and stick to those who treat you right.

It’s been almost three years since the first time my partner and I traded “I love you”s. We didn’t start dating till like three months later but don’t worry about that. This year, my mom invited both of us to Christmas Eve for the first time. I just think that’s pretty neat.
 
AstemBloom said:
It's honestly hard to be LGBTQ+, not only due to your sexual or romantic interests/tastes, but as well due to being accepted as a human being like any other considered "normal", as straight people. Saddens me that after our ancient roots, we still are seen as some kind of "abnormal" and out of the social pattern, even if our form of loving and pleasure is just as old as everything else. I'm bisexual, even if nobody reminds of us, we still exist.
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I was almost killed by my mother for being trans, my country isn't usually that awful about LGBTQ+ but I had terrible luck with my family... Hopefully in 20-30 years, young people will be truly free to be themselves because we sure weren't.
 
Alice Kazumi said:
I was almost killed by my mother for being trans, my country isn't usually that awful about LGBTQ+ but I had terrible luck with my family... Hopefully in 20-30 years, young people will be truly free to be themselves because we sure weren't.
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I hope that one day we can achieve a world where LGBTQ+ people need no fear of harm or death being brought upon them for being who they are. For everyone's sake.
 
Can anyone help me out? I'm a mega straight dude and don't really have much knowledge about the etiquette of asking somebody about their sexuality/other stuff. I often am pretty curious and ask alot of questions, and sometimes offend people with them. I just recently lost a good friend because of this, so I wanna learn to fix my mistakes. I won't say who it is, but if you are reading this (I hope you are >.<) I would just like to say i'm very sorry and am trying to change my ways. Anyways, I come from an Asian family, so LGBTQIA+ wasn't something discussed much with us. I am in no way Homophobic/Transphobic/all the other stuff though. If any of ya'll could answer my questions, I would be very happy :)

1. If you are a Guy and you are Gay then become Trans --> Transfemme, Do you now like Women? My logic for this one is that Gay = U like the same sex, and because you now are a Woman, you like other Women.

2. What is a polite way to ask for somebody's sexuality, gender and other stuff?

3. How do you identify feelings of being gay/not straight (idk how to call the rest)?

4. Saying that a Transfemme's voice is not feminine is offensive (I think). Can anyone tell me why? Because thats what you hear so why would it be offensive to them? Just a bit confused.

5. For my fellow Asians/or anyone else, can you tell me your story about coming out to your parents/not coming out?

Anyways, I thank ya'll for your help, I really want to amend my mistakes by changing my ways, and to the person that I offended, I'm very sorry and hope that we can be friends again (not just accepting my friend request on discord and ignoring me!!)
 
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matte said:
1. If you are a Guy and you are Gay then become Trans --> Transfemme, Do you now like Women? My logic for this one is that Gay = U like the same sex, and because you now are a Woman, you like other Women.
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Transfemme is being male at birth but identify more with a feminine gender expression than a masculine one. It says nothing about a person sexual preferences.

Sex is about your body, gender is about who you feel yourself to be, and sexual orientation is about to whom you’re attracted sexually. Transfemme falls under the gender category.

2. What is a polite way to ask for somebody's sexuality, gender and other stuff?
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In which context? A person you just met? A friend? Someone you are interested in? There is no reply that fits all but the more you know the person the easier is to get them to tell you, just don't be rude about it.
3. How do you identify feelings of being gay
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A lot of people can't even identify it until late in life. I know someone that came out as gay in their late 60s. It can be that someone gradually realizes it that they prefer men/women or just you have x experience and something clicks in you and you realize it. I'm not gay myself so I can't reply this well.
4. Saying that a Transfemme's voice is not feminine is offensive (I think). Can anyone tell me why? Because thats what you hear so why would it be offensive to them? Just a bit confused.
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It's just rude in general, it doesn't need to be transfemme. Don't go out there calling people not femenine or masculine when it's uncalled.
 
matte said:
1. If you are a Guy and you are Gay then become Trans --> Transfemme, Do you now like Women? My logic for this one is that Gay = U like the same sex, and because you now are a Woman, you like other Women.
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Usually, that just means you become straight. The example you gave would probably go from a man that only liked other men to a woman who only likes men. Of course, things aren't super straight (haha) forward, as transitioning can often lead people to explore, question and doubt their sexuality alongside their gender. It can be case by case.
In general though, gender and sexuality are separate, so shifts, changes etc don't necessaritly change the other.

matte said:
2. What is a polite way to ask for somebody's sexuality, gender and other stuff?
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It depends a lot on context. First, make sure that its a safe space for people to ask, some can be in the closet because of personal hurdles, family issues, discriminatory laws etc. If someone doesn't want to reply, don't push it.
If its safe and chill though, for friends and acquaintances you can probably just ask "are you gay/trans?". For people who are distant/strangers, if you're not in a context that requires it (i.e dating scene, medical etc), it's often better to move on or let them bring it up.
This isn't a 100% guaranteed guide though, it really depends on who you're talking to, how close you are to them and what's the context of your convo.

matte said:
3. How do you identify feelings of being gay/not straight (idk how to call the rest)?
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For some it's always been a basic fact. In the same way someone looks at a dog and goes I like dogs, they realize they like the same gender or that they're a different gender. For others, it comes from exploration, interacting with queer folk, sometimes facing of denial etc. I went through the entire LGBT acrononym before I settled on being a trans lesbian lol. Some people figure it out in one go, others end up changing what they are etc. It's part of finding yourself

matte said:
4. Saying that a Transfemme's voice is not feminine is offensive (I think). Can anyone tell me why? Because thats what you hear so why would it be offensive to them? Just a bit confused.
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In the same way saying "your hair looks bad" to someone who knows they got a bad haircut is rude. for some transfems it can feel insensitive and trigger dysphoria. They know their voices are low, and its something they dont like about their bodies and knowing others can notice it can make you feel worse. Of course, we're not a monolith, and some of us enjoy our deep voices or don't care, but just be considerate :)

I am asian but I'm an orphan so I can't really answer the parents one LOL
 
hi there, am i nonbinary?
i am a male, and i dont care that i am a male. i dont care what i am. i dont care what pronouns describe me, and if i knew for a fact i was non binary, i would take absolutely no action in being refered to as such. i physically couldnt care less avout my gender. does this make me non-binary, or am i something else?
 
Cancel cult said:
hi there, am i nonbinary?
i am a male, and i dont care that i am a male. i dont care what i am. i dont care what pronouns describe me, and if i knew for a fact i was non binary, i would take absolutely no action in being refered to as such. i physically couldnt care less avout my gender. does this make me non-binary, or am i something else?
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You'd be nonbinary in that case if you preferred the label, or you could just be "cis in the sense that you aren't super concerned about being cis." There are both nonbinary people and cis people who feel the same way as you.

The lines of gender are weird and complicated, and ultimately no one can make the call but you. That's smth you gotta explore a bit, try things on, try being an "any pronouns" sort and see if it feels right. The cool thing about labels is, you can always change your mind and shift to something that feels more right.

Take it from someone who thought he was happy just being a butch lesbian for a long time lmao.
 
Treble Kats said:
The lines of gender are weird and complicated, and ultimately no one can make the call but you. That's smth you gotta explore a bit, try things on, try being an "any pronouns" sort and see if it feels right. The cool thing about labels is, you can always change your mind and shift to something that feels more right.
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this is a great way of putting it. do some exploring! gender and sexuality are both practically impossible to describe perfectly. we just use words since humans like to categorize by nature. if you think you're non-binary, cool! if not, great! what matters is that you're happy with it and you think it fits you.

Cancel cult said:
hi there, am i nonbinary?
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with that said, and the disclaimer i'm just a boring trans girl and not NB, i think one identity you might be keenly interested in looking into is agender. i know some peeps who are agender and one of them has described something very similar to what you've described in your OP. not saying it's your silver bullet, but that'd be my recommendation for your next research :)
 
I feel like I have a very weird relationship with gender because of me being in the closet and it make it awkward to me internally. Especially when I know that, for the foreseeable future, I am absolutely staying in the closet- socially conservative parents and it is not reasonable to move out yet because community college.

Do any other trans people here who've had a similar experience tell me ways y'all've coped with this? I only really accepted I am trans this year, so I am not entirely sure how to deal with it. And my own mind with internalized transphobia at times.

Sorry if this is not an appropriate post, let me know if it isn't.
 
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