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Social LGBTQIA+

Flufekinsdworb said:
Well what does this say about people who don’t go either way. I think I might agree with you but the way u wrote it confused me.

Me personally, I agree that gender is a social construct, but I don’t get why that puts people in categories that have nothing to do with anything. Labeling ur gender on the way u wannna act really seems confusing based on what u said earlier. Anyways if this was how it worked id be trans but I’m nb.

Still, nice to hear your opinion and take on the matter, sorry that I came off as angry
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You can view gender as it's own thing and completely seperate from everything else about you, but then your gender says nothing about you. (which is fine, I'm not critizising your point of view)
The way I see it gender represents certain social classes in most societies. Your gender influences how you are expected to look, act dress, etc. With this interpretation of gender being nb means that you don't entirely belong to the male or female social class. Gender is a spectrum and the male/female social classes aren't very well defined in most western societies. Some societies have more than 2 genders while others have a very strict binary system where one is expected to adhere to the norm.
Gender isn't something you can touch. As our societies evolve, gender evolves with them.
I say I'm a woman because I think that I roughly fit into my understanding of that social class. I don't need a gender for myself. It's there to communnicate information about myself to others.
In my opinion, arguing over someone's gender or asking "how many genders are there?" yields no right or wrong answer because by definition there can't be.
As always, you're free to disagree. What gender means to you could and will probably be different from my view
 
I think gender in general is a concept that will mean different things to different people. In my opinion, that's one of the most important things that many people fail to realize when complaining about how others may not identify as the gender they were born as. It's a social construct that is completely fluid, so it's form can change between cultures, times, and even individual people. Some people may not want to be gendered at all, others may want a specific label, some may feel as if different labels apply to them at different times. These are all valid interpretations, and this fluidity is what makes gender such a fascinating topic. Overall, I think it is important to respect each Indvidual's own idea of what gender means to them. I think everyone deserves to be able to feel comfortable in the way they're labeled, or if they're labeled at all. That's how I see it, anyway, and I'm sure others will see it in a completely different way which is completely valid as well.
 
Hobe
Elyk said:
I think gender in general is a concept that will mean different things to different people. In my opinion, that's one of the most important things that many people fail to realize when complaining about how others may not identify as the gender they were born as. It's a social construct that is completely fluid, so its form can change between cultures, times, and even individual people. Some people may not want to be gendered at all, others may want a specific label, some may feel as if different labels apply to them at different times. These are all valid interpretations, and this fluidity is what makes gender such a fascinating topic. Overall, I think it is important to respect each Indvidual's own idea of what gender means to them. I think everyone deserves to be able to feel comfortable in the way they're labeled, or if they're labeled at all. That's how I see it, anyway, and I'm sure others will see it in a completely different way which is completely valid as well.
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Honestly, I feel like what i say my gender is, is based on what i want my friends to see. Like they judge me by my gender. I feel like they would like me more if I was a girl.
 
Flufekinsdworb said:
Hobe

Honestly, I feel like what i say my gender is, is based on what i want my friends to see. Like they judge me by my gender. I feel like they would like me more if I was a girl.
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That's understandable, it's hard not to sort of meet people's expectations. However, if it's possible, I think you should ask yourself about who you want to be as a person, even if it's different from what others would judge or see you as. If they're good friends, they should like you as you, whether you're gendered or not. I know it's a lot easier said than done, but it's a very personal thing that only you can decide for yourself. It's also valid if you sometimes feel like one gender, no gender, or any other combination. You shouldn't feel forced in any way to be anything. I hope you're able to feel comfortable in whatever way you choose to be.
 
tl:dr Sarah McBride is a c**t.

So, for those who haven’t heard, Sarah McBride and a bunch of other high rank dems had a conversation about reshuffling their approach on trans people, and that entails allowing democrats who have drasticly different opinions on trans people (I.e. transphobic ones) to not feel alienated by the party.

I’m so sick of this moderate appealing bullshit that they always try to do which never fucking works. It’s why they have the lowest approval rating that they’ve had in YEARS. And of course, it’s at our expense, the group that represents 0.1% of the population.

I had a terrible feeling that Sarah McBride was going to pull this card the moment she didn’t say anything about the fact that she can’t use the fucking bathroom she wants to use. Stop acting like a fucking punching bag and have a backbone.
 
Optics do not fucking matter in the face of a fascist government that in 2 months has already started disappearing people to Guantanamo Bay and CECOT in El Salvador. There is no ally worth having if all it takes is saying "transphobia is bad" for them to go "wow you guys are all so hateful, I'm going to go join the side of the people who want to genocide you." Never compromise with these people, fight them, make their lives miserable, and do not comply in advance. It is genuinely baffling that people are still tone policing and talking about voting in the face of an administration ran exclusively by neo-nazis and christian nationalists. This is not a democracy and you will not simply vote the republicans out in 2026 or 2028, if you still believe this you are deluded.
 
I will say it, if you still support republicans at this point you are a fascist, period, they have been extremely clear about their platform and goals and ignorance is not an excuse

“Historians have a word for Germans who joined the Nazi party, not because they hated Jews, but out of a hope for restored patriotism, or a sense of economic anxiety, or a hope to preserve their religious values, or dislike of their opponents, or raw political opportunism, or convenience, or ignorance, or greed. That word is "Nazi." Nobody cares about their motives anymore. They joined what they joined. They lent their support and their moral approval. And, in so doing, they bound themselves to everything that came after. Who cares any more what particular knot they used in the binding?”
― A.R. Moxon
 
whenever looking about the current state of American politics there is essentially 0 purpose in doing outreach to Republican voters. Harris-Walz tried this, and it only served to alienate their progressive base and prospective "undecided" voters. Winning over those "undecided" voters is the key to winning elections and by extension real political power in America. appealing to the Republicans and backing down on our principles serves no one other than the people who would have us all put into concentration camps.

i am not the biggest fan of the current media environment and how we constantly police each other's actions and morality, but transphobic views should not be tolerated at any level. it's directly socially and politically harmful to not only trans people but also GNC and cis people whose presentation does not always align with their actual gender. it helps no one and hurts so so so many. in the wake of so much anti-trans backlash we need to firmly hold to our values and not capitulate for a hypothetical median voter.
 
I just realized I went a bit too into politics rather than LGBTQIA+ in my previous posts, my apologies. I'm going to refocus a bit with agreeing completely with:
gephicka said:
i am not the biggest fan of the current media environment and how we constantly police each other's actions and morality, but transphobic views should not be tolerated at any level. it's directly socially and politically harmful to not only trans people but also GNC and cis people whose presentation does not always align with their actual gender. it helps no one and hurts so so so many. in the wake of so much anti-trans backlash we need to firmly hold to our values and not capitulate for a hypothetical median voter.
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There is no world in where transphobia should be tolerated. It is not a simple difference of opinion; it's the rights of other human beings who deserve to be able to live their lives as they wish. The fact that the Republicans were allowed to run so many anti-transgender commercials that treated them like shit is already disgusting as hell, and it's even worse that it worked for some areas. Transgender people have become a political attack tool used to fearmonger and stoke flames rather than just being fucking treated equally. It's things such as this where I truly believe that there is no "middle-ground" or negotiating. Transgender people are human beings and should be treated as such, end of story.
 
After seeing the short derailment to politics, I pondered a bit about one video I saw recently on a female conservative influencer reporting on a topic about a woman making a safe-space gym for woman. She obviously stated that it's only for women, but a thing that has given me a mental infighting with my morals (due to my famioy household) is when she also anounces that trans woman are not allowed. And the conservative influencer I was watching was cherry picking some mean/nasty comment from trans activist like death threats and such (btw I only watch her as a middle ground or tug back into reality as her content does have some points in some social or moral issues, I don't like her in general though). While watching that headache inducing video it gave me a question that I don't think was ever brought out since it will definetly give the gym owner a dillema. Are transgender men (ftm) allowed in that gym? Since base on her stance, she wants cis men to not infiltrate their women only safe space, but what if a female that transitioned to a man goes into the gym, isn't he technically allowed to go in due to her stance on trans women not being women so won't the same apply for transgender men? If she won't accept the transgender men then won't that be called hypocrisy to her believing that trans woman are not real woman kind of deal since she treats the transgender men as well, men?
(P.S. Not into politics but this situation did give me quite a spin on the conservatives or transphobic take on such stuff)
 
Their position on trans men is that they're confused girls who got tricked into transitioning and "back in my day that was called being a tomboy, we didn't take testosterone because of that," if they even bother to remember that transition isn't just "men transitioning to women." So no, that person has never even considered the idea of a trans man existing and wouldn't allow them in either, because bioessentialist ideology is incoherent
 
Sabelette said:
Their position on trans men is that they're confused girls who got tricked into transitioning and "back in my day that was called being a tomboy, we didn't take testosterone because of that," if they even bother to remember that transition isn't just "men transitioning to women." So no, that person has never even considered the idea of a trans man existing and wouldn't allow them in either, because bioessentialist ideology is incoherent
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Yup, these people don't think "transgender" is a real concept, and they deny every part of it despite not understanding any of it. They take zero time to actually understand the incredibly nuanced science on what it means to be transgender. It's shameful, especially since they could educate themselves but refuse to do so out of ignorance. I never quite understood the difficulty in simply...calling someone by what they want to be called by and supporting them in what they want to do. It really is not that difficult, and people work their asses off to be accepted for who they really are. As I've said before, these people deserve to be treated as equals just as much as anyone else in the world. It's really quite baffling when you think about just how insane it is that it's become some big issue to have empathy for others and treat them well.

(Also, deleted my previous posts that were leaning into politics too much. My bad for the off-topic posts in here, I definitely got carried away.)
 
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I mean, at that point, it goes to what Sabelette said:
Sabelette said:
I will say it, if you still support republicans at this point you are a fascist, period, they have been extremely clear about their platform and goals and ignorance is not an excuse

“Historians have a word for Germans who joined the Nazi party, not because they hated Jews, but out of a hope for restored patriotism, or a sense of economic anxiety, or a hope to preserve their religious values, or dislike of their opponents, or raw political opportunism, or convenience, or ignorance, or greed. That word is "Nazi." Nobody cares about their motives anymore. They joined what they joined. They lent their support and their moral approval. And, in so doing, they bound themselves to everything that came after. Who cares any more what particular knot they used in the binding?”
― A.R. Moxon
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In the future, no one cares why you voted for Trump; no one cares why people voted for Hitler back in the day. We still call the latter Nazis.
 
The current political situation in the US can best be described as a fascist takeover. I wouldn't say all republicans are fascists. I'd say some republicans are fascists and the others are ok with fascism. I think you need to give these others a chance to change their mind by not labeling them as irredeemable.

You need to actually take to the streets and make your voices heard. There is no use appealing to fascists, but you can change the minds of those who follow them.
Fascism is inherently flawed an cannot win against all of you at once. "United we stand, divided we fall." The worst mistake you can do is giving up on minoriy rights bit by bit.

Unless you actually start a revolution, be prepared to be part of the resistance. When social safety nets get cut, you will need to replace them as a community. When safe access to hrt is impossible through legal means, you will need to provide it as a community. When the police refuse to protect you, you will need to take care of eachother as a community.
 
Mandatory modpost to say that this topic has somewhat ran its course and posts are getting a little repetitive. While I don't want Politics Thread V2 for hopefully obvious reasons I'm not going to put a hard-stop on this topic right now, but consider before posting whether A) what you're saying needs to be said and actually adds to the discussion and B) hasn't been said before (you can show you agree with posts by liking them!)

Mandatory trans person with a conscience-post to say that yeah, no, don't roll over to try and appease bigots and get their vote- why would anyone vote for the party that stands for nothing? The idea that you're gonna win these people over by passively accepting their ideas is hilarious when there's a party built to directly empower horrible people like them that also currently runs the country lol. Focus on actually appealing to the people who don't like republicans
 
Now back to lgbtq+ stuff, I am nb. I think I have known for a while but it didn’t mean much to me to not be thought of as a guy till recently

But some of my friends still just see me as a guy. I don’t think it would have mattered that much, but in our friend group, there is definitely some stuff where my friends think of me as a man when I don’t want to be thought of as that and honestly there is some of this reverse sexism in my friend group. Specifically, some people call me a gay stereotype because I act feminine and what I say and just from the atmosphere and language used.

I’m growing my hair long but I don’t want to change my name. My name is perfectly unique and nice and pretty gender neutral actually (my name is calder). But in my mind I’ve kinda made this alter ego for me. Their name is cedar and they are just better at life than me. They don’t just randomly say stupid things, they don’t just never do anything because they are so lazy, and they are actually respected for who they are.
 
this is super off topic but i really want to make a post about why The Rise and Fall of a Midwest Princess is a queer masterpiece

i don't even necessarily know how to explain it, but as soon as i heard the beat change in Femininominon I just knew it was something special. there was just so much raw queer aura to it. it was probably just a vibes thing but it CLEARS so much other "queer music" that's really only beloved because it's queer rather than because it's actually quality music (sorry lesbian jesus, but i'm definitely talking abt you Hayley Kiyoko). honestly a treasure to have such a generational queer artist and icon like Chappell Roan. every song from Femininominon to Kink is Karma to Coffee to Red Wine Supernova to the iconic Pink Pony Club. she just oozes charm in a way that no straight artist could. "i got a wand and a rabit!", "ruined my credit, stole my cute aesthetic", "um, can you play a song with a fucking beat?". it's just pure, charming, campy queerness– and by a lesbian in drag no less! there's just something so special about Chappell Roan and her music and how it brings even a bit of the queer experience to a wider audience.

the pure energy of songs like HOT TO GO! and Femininominon just make me want to gush– it's some much needed queer joy in a time where there honestly isn't a whole lot going around. midwest princess came back around at the perfect times to deliver one of the most poignant portrayals of queerness through music.
 
Strong opinions are to be expected for political topics such as this, so people are going to become unsurprisingly a bit heated about them. Those among the LGBTQIA+ community in particular have been constantly barraged with an endless stream of bullshit that tries to belittle them and their existence for decades. It's become even worse in recent years, and the current American administration seems hellbent on ensuring that they have the hardest time possible, and most likely want them to not exist at all. That's not even taking into account their own personal experiences that are probably also full of people (even their own families) trying to deny them for simply being themselves. I don't know if I would call it passive aggressive or aggressive, as I think it's people with experience just trying to say how it is after they've continually been told that they don't matter.

I think many are just tired of trying to appeal to those who won't listen or outright just hate them. As you say, there are people in the government trying to fight this as we speak. At this point, we also have to fight because we're left with no other options with the current administration and it's completely anti-LGBTQIA+ ideology that may aim to eradicate it entirely on a whim down the line. The entire LGBTQIA+ community and its fight for rights were pretty much started by a riot against those who wished to erase them with Stonewall fifty-five years ago, so this is how the community has always been. It has always had to fight for its rights, and we seem to be way past the point of simple compromise with people who either support or are leaning into fascist ideologies. I understand the annoyance with the laughing reactions and all that and I get that you mean well, but you also have to understand the feelings of those within the community are that of being tired of having to play nice with people that hate them. I'm one of those people myself, admittedly. I can't help but feel that anyone that is still a part of the Republican Party today and is supporting these anti-LGBTQIA+ fascist-leaning nutjobs are people that will never support us or our community. I don't know the answer to it all, but that's my view of it.
 
ohko by scald said:
Unless you actually start a revolution, be prepared to be part of the resistance. When social safety nets get cut, you will need to replace them as a community. When safe access to hrt is impossible through legal means, you will need to provide it as a community. When the police refuse to protect you, you will need to take care of eachother as a community.
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this is something more people need to emphasize imo. politicians have never been our friends and they won't be for a while. we might not even see it in our lifetimes. it's important to put our foot down and make it clear that even if they don't have our backs, we have each other's. this comes in the form of creating safe spaces when public spaces aren't protected for us anymore. it comes in the form of mutual aid when queer (and other) necessities become less accessible, be that monetarily or just in terms of availability. it comes in the form of being ready to listen to other queer people when they're expressing discontent with everything going on and not trying to sound like you have all the answers, bc frankly nobody really does. this isn't a guaranteed thing. the people who fought for our rights decades ago didn't have a guidebook to getting shit done, and we don't either, but they managed to give us some legroom to work with and it's up to us to leverage that while also ensuring the future generations of guys, gals and enby pals can put up a fight as well.

i'm gonna be so honest - i'm feeling sort of exhausted myself despite everything that i'm saying. i'm sorry if that sounds bad coming from a canadian, but it's so tiring. the two party system is fucking garbage for marginalized people because if you're not a cishet able bodied rich christian white man, you're somewhere on the chopping block and there isn't a point where the knife will stop as democrats keep trying to pander to more "moderate conservatives". it's not an overnight change, but i don't buy that we need to sacrifice trans lives in order to save them later down the line. that's not a compromise i'm willing to accept. we all get through this together or we all get fucked over, but if we divide ourselves in a time where community is more important than ever then they'll just pick us off one by one.

and if you think you're safe just because you aren't trans - or even because you're just an ally to the queer community, you're not. they'll come for all of us at one point or another and it'll be a lot easier to answer that when we unite rather than when we push people towards the guillotine being like "just keep walking, we'll stop it before you get there".

one more thing - there's absolutely no reality where you should be entertaining sacrificing trans rights when marsha p. johnson, sylvia rivera, zazu nova and miss major griffin-gracy were some of the most influential figures in the stonewall riots and fight for lgbtq+ rights in general. every single one of those people were trans and being willing to compromise the rights of trans people fought for by trans people is beyond disrespectful to their legacy. if empathizing with trans people seeing their rights being taken away isn't enough for you to not settle for that compromise (and it really should be), let it be the knowledge that you'd be disrespecting people so important to our history and culture
 
First they came for the communists and I did not speak out because I was not a communist.
Then they stopped and it was all sunshine and flowers from there on.

That's how the poem goes, right?

Fascist movements inherently require an out-group whom can be responsible for all of society's ills. Once they've suppressed or eliminated that outgroup, they will always move onto another. They need to; they aren't building a functioning society and someone has to take the blame for its woes. Other members of the LGBTQ+ community, documented immigrants who don't tow the MAGA line, and 'radical leftists' (read: anyone to the left of a center-right establishment Democrat) will be next on the chopping block. Appeasing fascists has literally never, not even once, been a winning strategy, and you're a fool if you think throwing trans people to the wolves is a tactically sound idea even from a completely cold, moralless, win-at-all-costs perspective.
 
Cancel cult said:
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I suggest you turn off notifs for reactions for a while, it'll help a little bit to not feeling hurt on people just haha'ing you.

Anyways, favorite cartoon that has lgbtq+ representation in a positive light? Mine are a bit vanilla like Steven Universe and Adventure Time. Steven Universe made me more accepting and open-minded to such matters, while Adventure Time just made me enjoy the sweet romances in all forms like Marceline and PBB of course ^^
 
I'm not a fan of normal romance in media, and it's in so many things at this point. It's very hard to find a show, movie, book, anime, or manga without a shoehorned romantic subplot for some reason or another. I'm always looking for things that center around LGBTQ+ representation or romance because I find it much more interesting to watch personally. No offence to anyone who is a fan of romcoms and the like, I just find cishet romances to be so overdone that it's boring to me. A person can only take so much of watching an anime where the male main character is forced into some weird romance with the female main character just...because they're male and female I guess? I wish more things tried to go for a different dynamic instead of romance, y'know? Have two different gender main characters that are just friends and really delve into that kind of friendship dynamic. I might be ranting at this point, but the point about LGBTQ+ representation in media got me thinking. Also, shout out to the asexuals that also deserve some love in media where a lot of things are unfortunately based around sex all the time.
 
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