Actually...You uhh still kinda get walled by Rotom....Why are you saying there is no Rotom now?Rotom is probably going to see less usage but it still walls you non the less.And when i say Rotom i mean Wash cuz the others seem kind of weird.
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Metagross
- Thread starter Misa
- Start date
Aye, only Rotom Wash seems a true problem for Metagross anymore. Of course he still gets forced out by Heat too, but still.
There's no point in using Light Metal; it sucks as its only merit is to reduce Low Kick's power. Clear Body is still way superior.
Metagross hasn't changed much, its Explosion got weaker, but so did others that loved it (read: Gengar). Rotom forms still make a problem to some extent (water and heat), but not like it matters much.
Claw Sharpen, while it boosts its attack and MM's Accuracy, it's not that good for Metagross without some kind speed aid (if you can set it up with Agility, or paralysis support/speed pass).
EDIT: The CS bulky set seems plausible, but still not that good, would've been much better if Meta got Bulk Up or Curse :/
Metagross hasn't changed much, its Explosion got weaker, but so did others that loved it (read: Gengar). Rotom forms still make a problem to some extent (water and heat), but not like it matters much.
Claw Sharpen, while it boosts its attack and MM's Accuracy, it's not that good for Metagross without some kind speed aid (if you can set it up with Agility, or paralysis support/speed pass).
EDIT: The CS bulky set seems plausible, but still not that good, would've been much better if Meta got Bulk Up or Curse :/
Metagross@lefties (survivability is needed here, due to lack of HP EVs)
4HP, 252 Atk, 252 Spe
Claw sharpen
Meteor Mash
Zen Headbutt
Earthquake
Pair this with Baton Passing Zapdos, who can also help you deal with bulky waters and maybe even Skaymory before you begin your sweep. They've got very nice type synergy, although you will definitely need a reliable answer for fire types on your team.
That having been said, this should be able to function okay by itself. Not amazing, but okay. A rather interesting variation on this might be:
Metagross@Choice scarf
4 HP, 252 Atk, 252 Spe
Claw Sharpen
Meteor Mash
Earthquake
Trick
Use as a random scarfer on the first turn you use him. Bring him out again and use trick on their counter, who is hopefully Skarmory, or something highly crippled by choice scarf. If you have the jaw-dropping luck to have kept him in good health this whole time, you may then attempt a speed pass and claw sharpen sweep.
4HP, 252 Atk, 252 Spe
Claw sharpen
Meteor Mash
Zen Headbutt
Earthquake
Pair this with Baton Passing Zapdos, who can also help you deal with bulky waters and maybe even Skaymory before you begin your sweep. They've got very nice type synergy, although you will definitely need a reliable answer for fire types on your team.
That having been said, this should be able to function okay by itself. Not amazing, but okay. A rather interesting variation on this might be:
Metagross@Choice scarf
4 HP, 252 Atk, 252 Spe
Claw Sharpen
Meteor Mash
Earthquake
Trick
Use as a random scarfer on the first turn you use him. Bring him out again and use trick on their counter, who is hopefully Skarmory, or something highly crippled by choice scarf. If you have the jaw-dropping luck to have kept him in good health this whole time, you may then attempt a speed pass and claw sharpen sweep.
How about gravity? It might not be as good as agiligross, but it does cripple his common counters.
Metagross @ Leftovers
Adamant
252 HP / 232 Atk / 20 Spe
-Gravity
-Meteor Mash
-Earthquake
-Zen Headbutt/Thunderpunch/Ice Punch
With Gravity in effect, Earthquake now hits Skarmory, Bronzong, and Rotom-A super effectively, three of his most common counters, and also raises Meteor Mash/Zen Headbutt accuracy to 100%. Last slot is mostly filler, but Thunderpunch is for Gyarados and bulky waters, Ice Punch for Gliscor and Dragons, Zen Headbutt for neutral coverage. It can even set up SR or explode, but SR is better suited for other pokemon and explosion got a nerf this gen so...yeah that's pretty much it. 252 HP for bulk and 232 Atk for attacking power. 20 Spe EV's outruns standard Skarmory.
Metagross @ Leftovers
Adamant
252 HP / 232 Atk / 20 Spe
-Gravity
-Meteor Mash
-Earthquake
-Zen Headbutt/Thunderpunch/Ice Punch
With Gravity in effect, Earthquake now hits Skarmory, Bronzong, and Rotom-A super effectively, three of his most common counters, and also raises Meteor Mash/Zen Headbutt accuracy to 100%. Last slot is mostly filler, but Thunderpunch is for Gyarados and bulky waters, Ice Punch for Gliscor and Dragons, Zen Headbutt for neutral coverage. It can even set up SR or explode, but SR is better suited for other pokemon and explosion got a nerf this gen so...yeah that's pretty much it. 252 HP for bulk and 232 Atk for attacking power. 20 Spe EV's outruns standard Skarmory.
Seems the same as a standard GravityGross from Gen 4. Would work well in Doubles or Triples if your team is based around it. Besides, Explosion, if it's still a neutral hit, will still hurt a FUCKTON off Metagross's Attack, especially with an Attack boost off Meteor Mash.
I didn't know it was standard. There's no mention if it in the Gen 4 analysis so I thought I was being orininal. :(
Though explosion would hit rotom now being that it is no longer ghost so yeah that would be good.
The reason it's not in the analysis instead of just the Gravity Article can be answered by one simple question: Who the hell runs Gravity in Singles as a main team gimmick?
True, true. It could still be other options. Iron Ball + Trick accomplish the same thing though, with the added bonus of also be able to fuck up fast sweepers.
Rock Polish is for n00bs. Everyone knows Agility is 10x the boosting move RP ever wishes it was
The problems with Metagross are as follows:
1) Steel is still a terrible attacking type.
2) Sand/Stall teams have no trouble with him whatsoever. You have Hippowdon and Gliscor, who wall him forever, Forretress, Skarmory, and Nattorei, who set up on him, and Doryuuzu, who's still faster after +2 Speed. :/
3) Outside of Sand, he's STILL easy to wall. I cannot stress enough how poor his offensive STABs are. Meteor Mash is just not enough.
1) Steel is still a terrible attacking type.
2) Sand/Stall teams have no trouble with him whatsoever. You have Hippowdon and Gliscor, who wall him forever, Forretress, Skarmory, and Nattorei, who set up on him, and Doryuuzu, who's still faster after +2 Speed. :/
3) Outside of Sand, he's STILL easy to wall. I cannot stress enough how poor his offensive STABs are. Meteor Mash is just not enough.
For the Agiligross in OP...
Can someone explain to me why Ice Punch > Earthquake? (and what are the types of these Borutorusu, Randorosu, Torunerosu?)
I always thought that for Metagross, Meteor Mash > Earthquake > Thunderpunch Ice punch (I think Tpunch is overall better) > Zen Headbutt. Also why is Metagross Jolly?
Can someone explain to me why Ice Punch > Earthquake? (and what are the types of these Borutorusu, Randorosu, Torunerosu?)
I always thought that for Metagross, Meteor Mash > Earthquake > Thunderpunch Ice punch (I think Tpunch is overall better) > Zen Headbutt. Also why is Metagross Jolly?
Shadow Tag Shandera says hi to Choice Band Hammer Arm. That is the only issue in my opinion. If Shandera isn't troubling or you're playing non-dream world, go for it. Hammer Arm also hits Balloon Heatran which 4x resists Meteor Mash and will try to switch in and kill you since it resists everything else. And being able to 2 hit ko Nattorei is awesome and there usually is little difference against common steels who normally are neutral to both Earthquake and Hammer Arm with only 10 less power.
I just think it's hilarious that a person with a mushroom for an avatar is accusing people of being scrubs.
Anyway, yeah... I have to agree that Metagross doesn't really seem like he'll be one of the hugescary threats this gen. I only hope that time will prove me wrong...
BandGross is the set my money's on this gen. Agility doesn't hit hard enough, and Claw Sharpen sets essentially take a turn to get roughly the same boost as a CB set-- ergo, Band is better. Although, Metagross still makes the best BP recipient ever with Clear Body and a moveset of ZHeadbutt/EQ/Thunderpunch/Ice Punch, in case that's worth mentioning.
Anyway, yeah... I have to agree that Metagross doesn't really seem like he'll be one of the hugescary threats this gen. I only hope that time will prove me wrong...
BandGross is the set my money's on this gen. Agility doesn't hit hard enough, and Claw Sharpen sets essentially take a turn to get roughly the same boost as a CB set-- ergo, Band is better. Although, Metagross still makes the best BP recipient ever with Clear Body and a moveset of ZHeadbutt/EQ/Thunderpunch/Ice Punch, in case that's worth mentioning.
It seems most sets will have to drop the Explosion :'(
im pretty sure metagross' explosion was the hardest non-boosted attack in the game.
I think the choice band set has some potential with MM, Thunder/ice punch, hammer arm and earthquake. Maybe im missing something but i reckon that would be a decent set coming off metagross' 135 base attack. Metagross hasnt really gained many attacking options too.
I am so sick of dream world abilities.. OMG, they give metagross light metal and milotic CUTE CHARM and then they give bidoof Inconsistent raaaaage
2 of my fave pokes getting useless abilities and barely any attacking options.
But the claw sharpen set looks promising, we can load up Metagross with semi inaccuate moves and fix his accuracy and attack. MM might not be from the best attacking type but it certainly hits hard and the attack boost is nothing to laugh about on a already 1+ and almost fully accurate Meteor Mash coming off metagross
im pretty sure metagross' explosion was the hardest non-boosted attack in the game.
I think the choice band set has some potential with MM, Thunder/ice punch, hammer arm and earthquake. Maybe im missing something but i reckon that would be a decent set coming off metagross' 135 base attack. Metagross hasnt really gained many attacking options too.
I am so sick of dream world abilities.. OMG, they give metagross light metal and milotic CUTE CHARM and then they give bidoof Inconsistent raaaaage
2 of my fave pokes getting useless abilities and barely any attacking options.
But the claw sharpen set looks promising, we can load up Metagross with semi inaccuate moves and fix his accuracy and attack. MM might not be from the best attacking type but it certainly hits hard and the attack boost is nothing to laugh about on a already 1+ and almost fully accurate Meteor Mash coming off metagross