M&M Mix and Mega Resources

xavgb

:xavgb:
is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Last edited:

xavgb

:xavgb:
is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Mix and Mega Viability Rankings

S Rank

:Arcanine: Arcanine (Altarianite, Pinsirite)
:Lunala: Lunala (Heavy-Duty Boots, Metronome, Rocky Helmet)

A Rank

A+

:Gengar: Gengar (Lucarionite, Diancite, Manectite)
:Mew: Mew (Manectite)
:Terrakion: Terrakion (Lucarionite, Lopunnite, Tyranitarite)
:Zeraora: Zeraora (Lopunnite, Metagrossite, Pinsirite)

A

:Corviknight: Corviknight (Sablenite, Venusaurite)
:Toxapex: Toxapex (Banettite, Gyaradosite, Latiasite)

A-

:Clefable: Clefable (Ampharosite)
:Ditto: Ditto (Choice Scarf)
:Hydreigon: Hydreigon (Diancite, Blastoisinite, Lucarionite)
:Mandibuzz: Mandibuzz (Sablenite)
:Necrozma-Dusk-Mane: Necrozma-Dusk-Mane (Weakness Policy, Leftovers)
:Rhyperior: Rhyperior (Tyranitarite, Altarianite)

B Rank

B+

:Dragapult: Dragapult (Diancite)
:Excadrill: Excadrill (Metagrossite, Latiosite, Lucarionite)
:Mamoswine: Mamoswine (Lucarionite)
:Mewtwo: Mewtwo (Life Orb, Leftovers)
:Kommo-o: Kommo-o (Altarianite)
:Rotom-Wash: Rotom-W (Manectite, Latiasite, Sablenite)

B

:Gastrodon: Gastrodon (Sablenite)
:Hippowdon: Hippowdon (Sablenite, Altarianite)
:Kyurem: Kyurem (Lucarionite, Cameruptite)
:Lucario: Lucario (Pinsirite, Altarianite)
:Noivern: Noivern (Salamencite)
:Zekrom: Zekrom (Roseli Berry, Life Orb, Rocky Helmet)

B-

:Indeedee: Indeedee (Diancite)
:Jellicent: Jellicent (Banettite)
:Jirachi: Jirachi (Ampharosite)
:Reshiram: Reshiram (Heavy-Duty Boots, Life Orb)
:Rotom-Heat: Rotom-H (Manectite)
:Shuckle: Shuckle (Gyaradosite, Ampharosite)
:Tyranitar: Tyranitar (Gyaradosite, Pinsirite)

C Rank

C

:Barraskewda: Barraskewda (Lopunnite)
:Dugtrio: Dugtrio (Lucarionite, Lopunnite, Diancite)
:Keldeo: Keldeo (Lucarionite, Diancite)
:Toxtricity: Toxtricity (Glalitite)
:Weavile: Weavile (Glalitite)
 
Last edited:

xavgb

:xavgb:
is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Mix and Mega Speed Tiers


The Speed Tiers are designed to be a resource that you can look at while building your teams, so that you can easily see what benchmarks you might need to EV your Pokemon for. The current list is mostly based off Pokemon + Mega Stone combinations that are listed on the Viability Rankings. Huge shoutouts to Gmansour20 for compiling this.

Speed​
Sprite​
Pokemon​
Base​
Nature​
Ivs​
Evs​
±​
662​
:Tyranitar:
Metagrossite Tyranitar​
101​
Positive​
31​
252​
+2​
612​
:zekrom:
Zekrom​
90​
Positive​
31​
252​
+2​
602​
:tyranitar:
Metagrossite Tyranitar​
101​
Neutral​
31​
252​
+2​
585​
:Excadrill:
Metagrossite Excadrill​
128​
Positive​
31​
252​
+1​
574​
:tyranitar:
Pinsirite Tyranitar​
81​
Positive​
31​
252​
+2​
556​
:necrozma-dusk-mane:
Necrozma-Dusk-Mane​
78​
Positive​
31​
252​
+2​
553​
:Dragapult:
Diancite Dragapult​
202​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
525​
:Excadrill:
Lucarionite Excadrill​
110​
Positive​
31​
252​
+1​
522​
:Tyranitar:
Pinsirite Tyranitar​
81​
Neutral​
31​
252​
+2​
511​
:Zeraora:
Metagrossite Zeraora​
183​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
508​
:Kommo-o:
Pinsirite Kommo-o​
105​
Positive​
31​
252​
+1​
506​
:Necrozma-dusk-mane:
Necrozma-Dusk-Mane​
78​
Neutral​
31​
252​
+2​
503​
:dragapult:
Diancite Dragapult​
203​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
496​
:tyranitar:
Metagrossite Tyranitar​
101​
Positive​
31​
252​
+1​
489​
:zeraora:
Lopunnite Zeraora​
173​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
482​
:gengar:
Diancite Gengar​
170​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
474​
:barraskewda:
Lopunnite Barraskewda​
166​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
467​
:zeraora:
Pinsirite Zeraora​
163​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
465​
:zeraora:
Metagrossite Zeraora​
183​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
459​
:zekrom:
Zekrom​
90​
Positive​
31​
252​
+1​
456​
:hydreigon:
Diancite Hydreigon​
158​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
451​
:tyranitar:
Metagrossite Tyranitar​
101​
Neutral​
31​
252​
+1​
449​
:indeedee:
Diancite Indeedee​
155​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
442​
:kommo-o:
Altarianite Kommo-o​
85​
Positive​
31​
252​
+1​
438​
:dugtrio:
Lopunnite Dugtrio​
150​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
430​
:tyranitar:
Pinsirite Tyranitar​
81​
Positive​
31​
252​
+1​
427​
:Weavile:
Glalitite Weavile​
145​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
423​
:Noivern:
Salamencite Noivern​
143​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
417​
:Necrozma-Dusk-Mane:
Necrozma-Dusk-Mane​
78​
Positive​
31​
252​
+1​
416​
:Gengar:
Manectite Gengar​
140​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
412​
:Terrakion:
Lopunnite Terrakion​
138​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
399​
:Gengar:
Lucarionite Gengar​
132​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
394​
:Terrakion: :Keldeo:
Lucarionite Terrakion/Keldeo​
130​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
394​
:Mewtwo:
Mewtwo​
130​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
391​
:Tyranitar:
Pinsirite Tyranitar​
81​
Neutral​
31​
252​
+1​
390​
:Excadrill:
Metagrossite Excadrill​
128​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
389​
:Weavile:
Glalitite Weavile​
145​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
368​
:Terrakion:
Tyranitarite Terrakion​
118​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
366​
:Kyurem:
Lucarionite Kyurem​
117​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
361​
:Arcanine:
Pinsirite Arcanine​
115​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
350​
:Excadrill:
Lucarionite Excadrill​
110​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
350​
:Lucario:
Pinsirite Lucario​
110​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
339​
:Kommo-o:
Pinsirite Kommo-o​
105​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
335​
:Terrakion:
Tyranitarite Terrakion​
118​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
333​
:Mamoswine:
Lucarionite Mamoswine​
102​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
333​
:Kyurem:
Lucarionite Kyurem​
117​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
331​
:Tyranitar:
Metagrossite Tyranitar​
101​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
329​
:arcanine:
Pinsirite Arcanine​
115​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
325​
:mew:
Manectite Mew​
130​
Neutral​
31​
116​
0​
324​
:hydreigon:
Blastoisinite Hydreigon​
98​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
322​
:lunala:
Lunala​
97​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
319​
:excadrill:
Lucarionite Excadrill​
110​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
319​
:lucario:
Pinsirite Lucario​
110​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
309​
:kommo-o:
Pinsirite Kommo-o​
105​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
306​
:lucario:
Altarianite Lucario​
90​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
306​
:zekrom: :reshiram:
Zekrom/Reshiram​
90​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
303​
:mamoswine:
Lucarionite Mamoswine​
102​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
302​
:excadrill:
Latiosite Excadrill​
88​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
296​
:mew:
Manectite Mew​
130​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
295​
:kommo-o:
Altarianite Kommo-o​
85​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
293​
:lunala:
Lunala​
97​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
287​
:tyranitar:
Pinsirite Tyranitar​
81​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
279​
:lucario:
Altarianite Lucario​
90​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
278​
:necrozma-dusk-mane:
Necrozma-Dusk-Mane​
78​
Positive​
31​
252​
0​
268​
:rotom-wash:
Manectite Rotom-Appliance​
116​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
266​
:arcanine:
Pinsirite Arcanine​
115​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
261​
:tyranitar:
Pinsirite Tyranitar​
81​
Neutral​
31​
252​
0​
230​
:lunala:
Lunala​
97​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
226​
:arcanine:
Altarianite Arcanine​
95​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
216​
:zekrom: :reshiram:
Zekrom/Reshiram​
90​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
216​
:jirachi:
Ampharosite Jirachi​
90​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
208​
:rotom-wash:
Latiasite Rotom-Appliance​
86​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
206​
:kommo-o:
Altarianite Kommo-o​
85​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
198​
:tyranitar:
Pinsirite Tyranitar​
81​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
190​
:necrozma-dusk-mane:
Necrozma-Dusk-Mane​
78​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
176​
:jellicent:
Banettite Jellicent​
70​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
170​
:corviknight:
Venusaurite Corviknight​
67​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
158​
:tyranitar:
Gyaradosite Tyranitar​
61​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
148​
:rotom-wash:
Sablenite Rotom-Appliance​
56​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
136​
:rhyperior:
Tyranitarite Rhyperior​
50​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
136​
:clefable:
Ampharosite Clefable​
50​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
130​
:hippowdon:
Altarianite Hippowdon​
47​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
126​
:toxapex:
Banettite Toxapex​
44​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
125​
:corviknight:
Venusaurite Corviknight​
67​
Negative​
0​
0​
0​
116​
:rhyperior:
Altarianite Rhyperior​
40​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
106​
:toxapex:
Gyaradosite/Latiasite Toxapex​
34​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
94​
:mandibuzz:
Sablenite Mandibuzz​
50​
Negative​
0​
0​
0​
71​
:corviknight:
Sablenite Corviknight​
37​
Negative​
0​
0​
0​
70​
:Hippowdon:
Sablenite Hippowdon​
17​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
54​
:Gastrodon:
Sablenite Gastrodon​
9​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
46​
:Shuckle:
Gyaradosite Shuckle​
5​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
38​
:shuckle:
Ampharosite Shuckle​
1​
Neutral​
31​
0​
0​
 
Last edited:

xavgb

:xavgb:
is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Alright, let's talk about the first gen 8 VR!

The original VR ranks were created by taking the average of each pokemon's rank between the 6 council members' personal VRs. Pokemon with more than 3 UR votes were left unranked. Below I'll leave all the personal VRs in hide tags for each council member.

S
Corviknight (Sablenite, Venusaurite, Banettite, Metagrossite)

A+
Arcanine (Altarianite, Pinsirite)
Toxapex (Banettite, Sablenite, Latiasite, Gyaradosite)
Hydreigon (Blastoisnite, Diancite, Lucarionite)

A
Kommo-o (Altarianite, Pinsirite, Lucarionite)
Dragapult (Diancite, Lucarionite)
Gengar (Lucarionite, Diancite, Manectite)
Noivern (Salamencite)

A-
Excadrill (Metagrossite, Lucarionite, Latiosite, Venusaurite)
Mamoswine (Lucarionite, Scizorite)
Jellicent (Banettite, Manectite, Sablenite)
Rotom-W (Latiasite, Manectite, Glalite)
Rhyperior (Tyranitarite, Pinsirite)
Mew (Lopunnite, Cameruptite)

B+
Ditto (Choice Scarf)
Dracozolt (Metagrossite, Diancite)
Toxtricity (Glalite, Pinsirite, Altarianite)
Rotom-H (Glalite, Latiasite, Charizardite Y)
Chandelure (Cameruptite, Diancite, Lucarionite)
Dracovish (Metagrossite, Sharpedonite, Swampertite, Diancite)

B
Corsola-Galar (Gyaradosite)
Cursola (Ampharosite)
Tyranitar (Pinsirite, Metagrossite)
Hippowdon (Venusaurite, Sablenite, Pinsirite, Altarianite)
Lucario (Pinsirite, Altarianite)
Barraskewda (Lopunnite, Aerodactylite)
Haxorus (Lopunnite)
Mandibuzz (Sablenite)
Reuniclus (Sablenite, Banettite, Cameruptite)

B-
Weavile (Glalite, Lucarionite, Scizorite)
Gyarados (Salamencite)
Clefable (Ampharosite, Cameruptite).
Gastrodon (Sablenite, Venusaurite)
Golisopod (Aerodactylite)
Indeedee (Diancite)
Wobbuffet (Leftovers, Slowbronite)
Shuckle (Ampharosite, Gyaradosite)
Cinderace (Lopunnite)

C
Milotic (Manectite)
Dugtrio (Lopunnite)
Darmanitan-Galar (Choice Band)
Sylveon (Sablenite)
Alcremie (Sablenite)
Pelipper (Damp Rock)


S
Corviknight (Sablenite, Venusaurite, Banettite, Metagrossite)

A+
Arcanine (Altarianite, Pinsirite)
Toxapex (Banettite, Sablenite, Latiasite, Gyaradosite)

A
Kommo-o (Altarianite, Pinsirite, Lucarionite)
Dragapult (Diancite, Lucarionite)
Excadrill (Metagrossite, Lucarionite, Latiosite, Venusaurite)
Gengar (Lucarionite, Diancite, Manectite)
Hydreigon (Blastoisnite, Diancite, Lucarionite)
Noivern (Salamencite)

A-
Mamoswine (Lucarionite, Scizorite)
Ditto (Choice Scarf)
Dracozolt (Metagrossite, Diancite)
Jellicent (Banettite, Manectite, Sablenite)
Mew (Lopunnite, Cameruptite)
Rotom-W (Latiasite, Manectite, Glalite)
Toxtricity (Glalite, Pinsirite, Altarianite, Metagrossite)

B+
Dracovish (Metagrossite, Sharpedonite, Swampertite, Diancite)
Hippowdon (Venusaurite, Sablenite, Pinsirite, Altarianite)
Lucario (Pinsirite, Altarianite)
Rhyperior (Tyranitarite, Pinsirite)
Rotom-H (Glalite, Latiasite, Charizardite Y)
Tyranitar (Pinsirite, Metagrossite)

B
Chandelure (Cameruptite, Diancite, Lucarionite)
Clefable (Ampharosite, Cameruptite)
Dugtrio (Lopunnite)
Gyarados (Salamencite)
Mandibuzz (Sablenite)
Reuniclus (Sablenite, Banettite, Cameruptite)

B-
Barraskewda (Aerodactylite, Lopunnite)
Cinderace (Lopunnite)
Corsola-Galar (Gyaradosite)
Cursola (Ampharosite)
Gastrodon (Sablenite, Venusaurite)
Golisopod (Aerodactylite)
Indeedee (Diancite)
Haxorus (Lopunnite)
Shuckle (Ampharosite, Gyaradosite)
Salazzle (Charizardite-Y, Black Sludge)

C
Darmanitan-Galar (Choice Band)
Milotic (Manectite)
Mimikyu (Lucarionite, Diancite)
Pelipper (Damp Rock)
Sylveon (Sablenite)
Vikavolt (Cameruptite)
Weavile (Scizorite, Glalite, Lucarionite)
Wobbuffet (Leftovers, Slowbronite)

S
Corviknight
Arcanine

A+
Hydreigon
Kommo-o
Toxapex

A
Dragapult
Excadrill
Noivern
Rhyperior

A-
Dracovish
Dracozolt
Gengar
Mamoswine
Mew
Jellicent
Rotom-Wash
Tyranitar

B+
Barraskewda
Corsola-Galar
Ditto
Hippowdon
Lucario
Rotom-Heat
Toxtricity

B
Cursola
Gastrodon
Indeedee
Mandibuzz
Reuniclus
Salazzle

B-
Chandelure
Cinderace
Clefable
Darmanitan-Galar
Golisopod
Gyarados

C
Dugtrio
Mimikyu
Pelipper
Shuckle
Sylveon
Vikavolt
Weavile
Wobbuffet
Zamazenta-Crowned

S
Corviknight (Sablenite, Venusaurite, Banettite, Metagrossite)

A+
Arcanine (Altarianite, Pinsirite)
Toxapex (Banettite, Sablenite, Latiasite, Gyaradosite)
Excadrill (Metagrossite, Lucarionite, Latiosite, Venusaurite)

A
Kommo-o (Altarianite, Pinsirite, Lucarionite)
Dragapult (Diancite, Lucarionite)
Gengar (Lucarionite, Diancite, Manectite)
Hydreigon (Blastoisnite, Diancite, Lucarionite)
Ditto (Choice Scarf)

A-
Jellicent (Banettite, Manectite, Sablenite)
Rotom-W (Latiasite, Manectite, Glalite)
Mew (Lopunnite, Cameruptite)
Noivern (Salamencite)
Rotom-H (Manectite, Glalite, Latiasite, Charizardite Y)

B+
Mamoswine (Lucarionite, Scizorite)
Dracozolt (Metagrossite, Diancite)
Rhyperior (Tyranitarite, Pinsirite)
Wobbuffet (Leftovers, Sitrus Berry)
Chandelure (Cameruptite, Diancite, Lucarionite, Charizardite Y)
Reuniclus (Sablenite, Slowbronite Banettite, Cameruptite)
Dracovish (Metagrossite, Sharpedonite, Swampertite, Diancite)

B
Corsola-Galar (Gyaradosite)
Indeedee (Diancite)
Tyranitar (Pinsirite, Metagrossite)
Lucario (Pinsirite, Altarianite)
Clefable (Ampharosite, Cameruptite)
Dugtrio (Lopunnite)
Haxorus (Lopunnite)
Mandibuzz (Sablenite)
Toxtricity (Glalite, Pinsirite, Altarianite)

B-
Gyarados (Salamencite)
Barraskewda (Lopunnite, Aerodactylite)
Gastrodon (Sablenite, Venusaurite)
Cursola (Ampharosite)
Hippowdon (Venusaurite, Sablenite, Pinsirite, Altarianite)
Shuckle (Ampharosite, Gyaradosite)
Cinderace (Lopunnite)
Golisopod (Aerodactylite)
Weavile (Glalite, Lucarionite, Scizorite)
Pelipper (Damp Rock)

C
QT thinks he's cool or something idk
View attachment 218842

S
Corviknight

A+
Arcanine
Toxapex

A
Dragapult
Hydreigon
Kommo-O
Rhyperior
Noivern

A-
Ditto
Excadrill
Gengar
Jellicent
Mamoswine
Rotom-W

B+
Dracovish
Dracozolt
Rotom-Heat
Toxtricity
Mew
Tyranitar

B
Barraskewda
Chandelure
Gastrodon
Hippowdon
Indeedee
Lucario
Mandibuzz
Reuniclus

B-
Clefable
Corsola-Galar
Cursola
Dugtrio
Golisopod
Gyarados
Salazzle
Shuckle

C
Cinderace
Darmanitan-Galar
Haxorus
Pelipper
Sylveon
Vikavolt
Weavile
Wobbuffet



And I'll also provide a short description of the contents of each rank (mostly similar to Chazm's though if you've already read that):

Corviknight stands out in the current metagame as the best mon due to its place on a large amount of builds. In particular, Corviknight is one of the metagame's only Defogging options right now and also the best user of the most effective defensive stone (Sablenite). Its access to U-turn gives the player a lot more flexibility with how it's used in games and where it fits in the builder. While there are many threats that can break past Corviknight, namely the Electric type breakers and various other offensive threats such as Hydreigon and Gengar, various team support options can help to cover those, and Corviknight's ability to pivot often makes it slippery enough to avoid having to confront these mons in unfavourable scenarios. In addition to the success of its bulky sets, Corviknight can also run Bulk Up variants which can get out of hand if the opponent doesn't carry specific checks such as Sablenite Toxapex or an Electric type breaker. Overall, Corviknight has a huge impact on the current metagame and definitely has enough tools to be worthy of S rank.

This rank features mons that aren't quite at the level of Corviknight, but are still defining forces of the metagame.

Arcanine brings a lot of utility with it, thanks to its fantastic typing and access to Extreme Speed. This helps it keep a lot of the major metagame threats in check, while putting pressure on the opposing team at the same time. Generally all Arcanines will carry Flare Blitz, Extreme Speed, and Morning Sun, but the last slot is open to fit various techs such as Psychic Fangs, Will-O-Wisp, Wild Charge, or Howl, each of which allows Arcanine to punish different checks and different types of teams.

Toxapex is the second best defensive option in the metagame due to its great bulk and typing. While Gyaradosite sets have fallen out of relevance due to the less useful typing and ability (and the prevalence of opposing Pex to absorb Tspikes), other sets such as Banettite and the less common Sablenite have picked up traction. Access to Scald+Toxic allows Pex to threaten mons trying to come in safely vs it with status - thanks to its Regenerator ability pre-mega, it can also find extra ways to sustain itself over the course of a game whilst spamming these moves.

Hydreigon is the first breaker to be listed here, taking advantage of a very spammable Dark Pulse from its Blastoisinite set. Hydreigon's fantastic coverage also helps out here, allowing it to work around softer checks such as Arcanine, Rhyperior, and Kommo-o with Surf or Flash Cannon. The Diancite set is also a solid breaking option on top of being much faster, though it has to make use of different coverage options due to the lack of Mega Launcher Dark Pulse, such as Fire Blast for Corviknight and Earth Power over Surf to maintain damage on Toxapex. Draco Meteor is a fantastic tool for Diancite Hydreigon too, widening the range of scenarios where it's able to force threats out and equipping it with a way to nuke most special walls in the meta. As a whole Hydreigon finds itself high up on the VR due to these factors, as well as the fact that most teams currently are carrying a bulky Water (Toxapex, Jellicent, etc) that Hydreigon will be able to abuse in order to force the opponent into difficult situations.

Dragapult boasts great coverage and decent power to go with a sky high speed stat, making it a big threat to a lot of Bulky Offense builds and a solid speed control option. However it can be pretty prediction reliant and struggles to break past fatter playstyles that will normally keep it in mind during the building process.

Excadrill resists -atespeed and gains the ability to boost its Speed with Rapid Spin in Gen 8, which means it can get out of hand quickly if it isn't prepared for. In particular the more popular Defog Corviknight variants generally don't carry a move to hit Excadrill back which allows it to set up on them. However, Body Press or Bulk Up Corviknight both take care of Excadrill, and Defog variants can still be paired with appropriate speed control options to cover all bases such as Ditto. More niche walls such as Latiasite Toxapex are also able to handle Excadrill comfortably. Despite all of this Excadrill still isn't a threat to be taken lightly, and it still provides utility with Rapid Spin in any case.

Gengar is another potent breaker thanks to it gaining Nasty Plot this gen, allowing it to break past almost the entire meta after a boost. The main thing that holds it back from being higher is its lack of bulk, which can create various scenarios where Gengar is less effective in practice than in theory. For example, if it gets chipped during the game it can be put into range of Corviknight Brave Bird, or if Gengar is going up against a Ditto team, it may struggle to set up fearing a counter-sweep from +2 Ditto Shadow Ball, which has very few resists to imposter proof with.

Kommo-o is one of the few available Stealth Rock setters this gen and gains access to Boomburst, allowing it to run -ate sets effectively. Even though it can struggle with Sablenite Corviknight and to a lesser extent Banettite/Sablenite Toxapex, it is still able to put pressure on most of the metagame thanks to the sheer power of Boomburst, so in the event that Corviknight gets chipped, Kommo-o can set Stealth Rock or dish out damage on the opposing team. Altarianite also allows it to check threats such as Dragapult and some variants of Hydreigon so it can definitely be of use defensively as well. Pinsirite is an alternative option to the Altarianite set running the same moves Boomburst/Flamethrower/Rocks/Taunt, except it gains a nicer matchup vs Toxapex and can be paired with Altarianite Arcanine. Lucarionite is worth a mention for its ability to muscle through Corviknight and other bouncers with Swords Dance, though it is generally less efficient than the -ate sets.

Noivern is a neat pick right now, as it is able to take out a large portion of the metagame with Boomburst, whilst also annoying Corviknight heavily with Super Fang and Roost (Defog sets can't do enough damage back to it). It's also a solid check to some more niche breakers such as Lopunnite Mew and one of the only Defoggers, notably freeing up the team around it to run Bulk Up over Defog on Sab Corv, which is significantly less abusable in comparison to the Defog set.

Ditto is very useful this gen due to its reliability in revenge killing MnM threats, particularly as it doesn't have to worry about adjusting its happiness anymore with no Return/Frustration in the meta. It also benefits from the general lack of good mons, making it easier to fit on a team and very hard to work around for more offensive builds. Ditto also does a fantastic job of covering one of the main ways that people break Corviknight, by taking advantage of setup and generally acting as damage control when pivoted in by Corvi's U-turn.

Jellicent can be a solid alternative to Toxapex as a bulky water, being able to handle a slightly different range of threats such as Excadrill, Mew, and Mamoswine. Similar to Toxapex, Jellicent can threaten incoming mons with status, and having access to Prankster Will-O-Wisp brings some perks that make it harder to force out, like the fact that Metagrossite Dracozolt can't take advantage of it in the same way it can take advantage of Pex.

Mamoswine is another good breaker in the meta with access to SR, and can also fill some roles as an Electric immunity. While its matchup against Sablenite Corv can be saved due to Icicle Crash's solid flinch chance, Venusaurite Corv is a much tougher nut for Mamoswine to make progress against, but at least it can buy a free turn for a teammate whilst Corviknight spends a turn defogging.

Mew's Psychic/Fighting STABs with Lopunnite allow it to consistently threaten the metagame's walls. The last coverage slot is generally pretty open but Gunk Shot and Flare Blitz are the main options to hit Altarianite mons and Sab Corvi respectively.

Rhyperior is another major rocker with its SD+SR Tyranitarite set, allowing it to both break conventional defensive cores and check a variety of threats. Sand support can be nice depending on its teammates, notably cutting down Arcanine's recovery.

Rotom-W can run various Nasty Plot sets, either pairing its STABs with Thunder Wave or Glalitite Hyper Voice to punish Dragon types trying to switch in. Latiasite focuses on checking Grounds such as Excadrill and Mamoswine whereas Manectite can soften Arcanine and provide Intimidate support for the team.

Dracovish can run a bunch of variations of sets that mostly do the same thing, which is spamming Fishious Rend. It's a pretty decent breaker long-term as it lacks switchins with recovery, but its low speed can cause it to struggle against some teams even if they only have temporary checks.

Dracozolt can act as a decent check to Corviknight that also takes out its main defensive partner in Toxapex. While it is better than Dracovish vs CorviPex and can run better coverage to take out BO/balance builds, it can struggle harder against stall builds that can opt to carry a check such as Gastrodon. Another small issue is that Dracozolt struggles with the Banettite Bulk Up variant of Corviknight, so that needs to be accounted for elsewhere in the team.

Rotom-Heat does similar things to Rotom-Wash, but the typing provides a slightly different niche. Although its Glalitite set still carries STABs + NP + Hyper Voice and still breaks roughly the same targets, the Manectite and Latiasite sets have to adapt to running Will-O-Wisp over Thunder Wave so that they can catch Rhyperior on the switch. Defensively, Rotom-Heat's Fire typing allows it to resist Arcanine better than Rotom-Wash, however it also becomes weak to Rocks and loses its Water resistance.

Toxtricity is yet another Electric type breaker that benefits from the popularity of CorviPex, and it also carries a powerful Boomburst to take out the likes of Rhyperior with its Glalitite set. It can also use its -ate resistance and access to Shift Gear to threaten some teams with a lategame sweep.

Tyranitar's generally solid statline allows it to pull off Dragon Dance sets pretty well this generation. Although its speed tier is still somewhat lacking even at +1, most of the faster options in the meta aren't really capable of hitting it that hard, which can make it annoying to play against without carrying something like Bulk Up Corviknight.

Barraskewda can pull off some 4 Attacks sets with either Lopunnite or Aerodactylite, as it has enough power to pressure Corviknight and Toxapex heavily when running an Adamant nature, however it still lacks notable defensive utility so it can be hard to fit on a team.

Chandelure has fantastic power and coverage as well as the ability to pull of an OTR set, but it still suffers from being difficult to fit onto teams, with its defensive utility being limited to taking on Arcanine and a few other mons in 1v1 scenarios.

Corsola-Galar's role is to force Rocks up against fat builds in general, since they rely on Magic Bounce as a large part of their hazard control. On top of this it is capable of pressuring most of the meta by threatening incoming mons with Will-O-Wisp. Unfortunately it still needs quite a bit of team support to function, because Corsola itself doesn't switch into many threats.

Hippowdon can act as a support option on bulkier teams that can check the likes of Alt Arcanine and Dracozolt, but it also struggles with the presence of Sab Corviknight in the meta, as it is unable to set Rocks against it and gives it free turns to heal up or regain momentum. Curse -ate sets are better positioned to handle Corviknight though, at the cost of some utility.

Lucario is another offensive threat to watch out for, being able to hurt most of the meta after a Swords Dance while also having access to Espeed, but similar to a few other mons on this list it lacks notable defensive utility and struggles in less than ideal matchups.

Mandibuzz is largely overshadowed by Corviknight, with its main niche being that Defog sets still have a way to deter physical setup with Foul Play. Its bulk is also slightly better than Corviknight's but it doesn't really hit a relevant benchmark here.

Reuniclus does exactly the same thing that it has done for 4 generations; click Calm Mind and click Recover. This is another thing that can get seriously out of hand if it's not prepared for, as it doesn't lose to conventional revenge killing options unlike most offensive threats.

Cinderace's main niche comes with its signature move Court Change, which can help some teams against hazards, especially if it's directly dealing with HO setters such as Shuckle. However, it's pretty poor at breaking in general and can struggle to find opportunities to switch hazards against a lot of teams.

Clefable is another option for Mold Breaker Rocks. Compared to Corsola, Clefable can check most of the Dragons to an extent with the right spread, however it does struggle to beat them reliably sometimes due to its poor recovery options. It also struggles with some 4MSS, mainly to do with the fact that the more reliable recovery option in WishTect takes two moveslots. Cameruptite doesn't check the fossils but can still somewhat check Dragapult and Hydreigon, with more immediate power to boot.

Cursola is yet another option for Mold Breaker Rocks, this time with a lot more Special Attack as another means to keep threats out. The bulk drop from Corsola-Galar can be annoying though.

Dugtrio can trap a lot of the breakers available, ranging from Electric types to Rhyperior and Blastoisinite Hydreigon. This can be a powerful tool for balance teams that may want them outright removed. Similar to Ditto, Dugtrio benefits from the general lack of mons available in the meta.

Gastrodon is a nice pick for the bulkier teams in the metagame, notably being a bulky Water that also takes on Electric types. Compared to Corviknight as a Sablenite user it's definitely not as friendly to building and can lead teams to become quite passive, so it's best to stick with stall/fat balance when using Gastrodon.

Golisopod loses out on the ability to run Blue Orb this gen but it can still break decently with Swords Dance and Drill Run, backed with either Aqua Jet or Sucker Punch as a priority option. In any case it's still hard to separate from the various other breaking options in the meta.

Gyarados struggles with Corviknight and some other defensive threats, but it still has some potential to sweep with support. Generally it's still worse than things like Tyranitar, only gaining pre-mega Intimidate and a mostly irrelevant Speed boost.

Haxorus is another Dragon Dance user, however it trades in a neutrality to Espeed for significantly improved breaking power. Earthquake is useful for deterring Alt Arcanine and Toxapex.

Indeedee fills an interesting role of offensive cleric, while providing some speed control and Psychic Terrain support lategame. Its effectiveness as a cleric is helped by the fact that it comes in on Toxapex, which is the main status spreader in the metagame.

Salazzle is a strong offensive Fire type with a few options against its checks. Will-O-Wisp can punish Rhyperior whereas Encore helps it push past Banettite Toxapex, but both of these mons are common and the fact that it can only deal with one of them in its set, as well as the fact that it still struggles against bulkier teams carrying the likes of Gastrodon is not ideal. Rotom-Heat will generally bring more to your team.

Shuckle is a weird case. On the one hand, it has a solid matchup vs some balances and bulky offenses due to setting Rocks through Magic Bounce or setting webs to slow down speed control options. On the other hand, there's just too many things that webs really struggles with right now. Ditto, Noivern, Excadrill, Arcanine, and even Dragapult (thanks to pre-mega Clear Body) are all top tier threats right now while also being major difficulties to work around, leaving webs in a difficult situation when attempting to cover all of these on top of maintaining a solid matchup vs the rest of the meta.

Darmanitan-Galar doesn't really find much use out of the mega stones, but it can still run a banded set with very few switchins given correct prediction. Various scouting options such as Venu Corviknight and Pex give it issues though.

Pelipper is mandatory support for rain teams, which can make use of sets such as Swampertite Dracovish, so it is ranked here despite not being a good mon in its own right.

Sylveon is one of the most consistent Hydreigon/Dragapult answers in the game, but it doesn't do much else outside of Wishpassing and potentially winning lategame if running Calm Mind.

Vikavolt is the last Electric type breaker listed, mainly gaining niches from its ability to hit Gastrodon/Rhyperior with Energy Ball, or in the case of its Lucarionite set it can double up as a webs setter. Note that the Lucarionite set is less efficient than Shuckle at setting webs for teams that commit fully to the style; it should be treated as an Electric type breaker first and a webs setter second.

Weavile mainly fills the role of priority support, but it really struggles with common picks such as Arcanine and Toxapex. Pinsirite sets can mitigate this weakness and break slightly better, but it's generally not worth building with.

Wobbuffet can trap various breakers, losing out on the ability to cover Hydreigon and some other breakers in comparison to Dugtrio, but it can also switch in directly on most of its targets which is very neat. Certain combinations such as Wobb+Ditto can be annoying to play against, but they're also taking up two teamslots so it needs careful teambuilding to work consistently.


One last thing, this VR was made with the meta still being pretty undeveloped, so there's definitely things missing that should be listed. Let us know if there's anything that you think is major and hasn't been added.
 
Last edited:

Fardin

Never won a tour.
Nomming mr.mime to B-

very unexplored mon. its typing and and ability soundproof lets it get an easy free switch in on noivern and kommo + a 1 time (maybe more if they boomburst) vs toxa. add it up with lucarionite, it not just outspeeds glalil toxa, it ohkos a fuck ton of mons thanks to nasty plot.

it also gets thunder for annoying cele.

great wall breaker in general, and has a unique role not many other does.

here is a replay of it in work and the amount of pressure it can put on most teams with the common toxa + corvi core.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8mixandmega-1047650714
 

Nakeeb

formerly DubFreaknakeeb
I'd like to suggest a new set for Dragapult. I suggest Altarianite.
:swsh/dragapult:


Dragapult @ Altarianite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Last Resort

Dragapult @ Altarianite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Body Slam / Double-Edge
- Dragon Darts
- U-turn / Psychic Fangs

These 2 variants of Altarianite Dragapult I've seen on ladder. For the last resort set, this pokemon is the real deal for wallbreaking/stallbreaking. Once you get a dd up, you can just spam the shit out of Last Resort and it really has 0 switchins. To win the game all you have to do is get rid of the -ate speeders on the opposing team and chip the steels... then Dragapult just cleans. You can also run a regular DD set with U-Turn. If you don't want to run U-Turn, you can go with Psychic Fangs to hit pokemon like Toxapex. In conclusion, Dragapult is a great cleaner with altarianite.
 
I'd like to suggest a new set for Dragapult. I suggest Altarianite.
:swsh/dragapult:


Dragapult @ Altarianite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Last Resort

Dragapult @ Altarianite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Body Slam / Double-Edge
- Dragon Darts
- U-turn / Psychic Fangs

These 2 variants of Altarianite Dragapult I've seen on ladder. For the last resort set, this pokemon is the real deal for wallbreaking/stallbreaking. Once you get a dd up, you can just spam the shit out of Last Resort and it really has 0 switchins. To win the game all you have to do is get rid of the -ate speeders on the opposing team and chip the steels... then Dragapult just cleans. You can also run a regular DD set with U-Turn. If you don't want to run U-Turn, you can go with Psychic Fangs to hit pokemon like Toxapex. In conclusion, Dragapult is a great cleaner with altarianite.

Both of these sets run into one common problem: Arcanine, who more than happily switches in and proceeds to OHKO back with Espeed. Corviknight also doesn't care at all about boosted Dragapult unless it's the Last Resort set, but that set is also going to find itself dealing with a variety of issues related to very common mons.
Generally speaking, Dragapult isn't very good at physical sets due to its extremely limited physical movepool and doesn't have the bulk to run a Last Resort set(which is already gimmicky) because of how many things just simply don't die to one Last Resort. It's better off using stones that boost sp. atk, and using its solid special movepool and high speed to hit key threats to your teams with coverage options. That's not to say an Altarianite set CAN'T work, but it likely wants to run Tri-Attack as its primary fairy STAB instead of a physical move so it can abuse the aforementioned coverage options.

Just so this is actually adding something to the discussion, let me introduce you to something I've been working with on a few of my teams.

1579469803216.png
Obstagoon @ Banettite or @Aerodactylite or @Loppunite
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Parting Shot
- Close Combat/ Coverage of choice
- Gunk Shot
- Throat Chop



Jesus CHRIST this thing has way too much coverage. If you ever wanted a solidly bulky offensive pivot, Obstagoon's your 'Mon. Unlike Pangoro, Obstagoon has both the bulk to take hits and the speed to actually outrun the things it might actually want to hit. While lacking the raw strength Pangoro has, Obstagoon makes up for it with a massive movepool with options to hit basically anything you want for SE damage, as well as a few nice support tools in Taunt and Thunder Wave as well as its signature move Obstruct, allowing it to punish switchins like Arcanine when they attempt to revenge it, or support mons looking to take advantage of it. Decent speed, as well as access to Bulk Up allow it to potentially sweep with its coverage options and its solid bulk keeps it from being easily revenged by most anything except the likes of Arcanine. Of course, the main draw of Obstagoon isn't really any of these things, moreso a cherry on top. The real draw of it is the fantastic pivoting option that is Parting Shot, of which in my opinion; Obstagoon is the best user of it yet thanks to excellent coverage letting it quickly come in and smack something and then retreat with a quick Parting Shot, keeping the opponent from taking advantage of the pivot with dropped atk and sp. atk., as well as being able to take advantage of Magic Bounce to force opponents to switch when they least want to.
Of course, Obstagoon's not all sunshine and rainbows, and has a number of letdowns, the first and foremost being its typing. In a meta full of fairies and Obstagoon being a Dark type, it can struggle a lot. Normal typing doesn't do it any favors, but thankfully doesn't do too much to hurt it either. Its main drawbacks outside of this are its lack of any recovery and only "Pretty Good" speed pre-mega means it tends to give something up when choosing a stone, namely power or the ability to outrun key threats.

TL;DR: Obstagoon is a versatile Pokemon with a fantastic pivoting option, and can fit a variety of coverage onto its sets to hit whatever your team needs it to. The stones I suggested are only that, suggestions, and Obstagoon can run an even larger number of stones viably with its well balanced stats, as well as an easily replaced Normal typing. However, it doesn't fit on every team due to an unfortunate Dark primary typing, and it tends to have to pick between speed or power when picking a stone.
 
hey since posthome update is gonna come soon I thought I would share my thoughts on the main changes I expect
gonna start with the new mons we got from home:
-:necrozma-dusk-mane: to A/A- (Weakness policy/Leftovers)
Havent used this too much so I can see it being lower, but Dragon Dance sets can easily annoy teams that use Defog Corv + Gyara Pex / Alt Arcanine, Prism Armor + Weakness Policy can be annoying since you cant kill it with Lunala / Dragapult and risk getting swept, still the rise in popularity of mandibuzz and defensive lunala holds it back, it also cant get past bulk up corv. Last slot is free so you can see things like Morning Sun, Stone Edge, Knock Off, or Photon Geyser. I havent seen a single defensive set yet, honestly Steel/Psychic isnt that great of a typing this gen, but it gets teleport which is cool I guess?
-:zekrom: to B/B+ (Roseli Berry)
Dragon Dance Zekrom is a nice wincon, but it still isnt easy sweeping with it since Ampharosite Clefable, Altarianite Rhyperior and Sab Hippo (some even run Audinite/Altarianite) are seeing a lot more use, It also suffers competition as an Electric-type from Zeraora. I liked a lot Metagrossite Zeraora + Zekrom since it can lure Zekrom answers with Prough/Gknot.
-:reshiram: to C/UR (Heavy-Duty Boots)
ehh reshiram is a cool mon for sure but it dislikes Ampharosite Clefable rising and cant realiably beat Pex, it also isnt really splashable either, I'd be fine seeing it UR
-:Mewtwo: to A/A- (Life Orb)
Nasty plot is really hard to switch into, its best coverage seems to be Psystrike/Shadow Ball/Thunderbolt, allowing it to pressure answers like Corv/Lunala or Mandibuzz, Necrozma-DM is a nice check, while Gyaradosite Toxapex is still a good counter which is getting a lot more usage thanks to broke Lun and Gengar.
Honestly this is one of those mons which seem to have a really good mu on preview but is still really hard to use so I think A- is good enough for it.
:Lunala: to A+ (Heavy-Duty Boots/Metronome/not sure if it runs anything else)
Losing a one-time 200BP Stab-attack is definetely annoying but Lunala remains one of the best mons in mnm for sure, it's really hard to answer defensively since Mandi loses to Metronome if it switches with rocks up, Gyaradosite Toxapex is a good counter to it but still dislikes getting burnt by defensive variants, it also isnt easy to revenge kill either with SShield being harder to break if it's Heavy-Duty Boots, Defensive Lunala also is pretty cool since it's a good check to Terrakion and has nice support options such as Defog, Will-O-Wisp, Toxic or Teleport.
-:Terrakion: to A+ (Lucarionite/Diancite/Lopunnite/Tyranitarite/Pinsirite? Not too sure on the stone order)
I'm sure you all know what terrakion does, it's incredibely hard to switch into, its a good rkiller and really flexible, for example you can check it with manec mew (which still cant switch on luc if not megad) and cry if it's Lop, or check it with Lunala and cry if it's Tyranitarite or even if it burns it and then it reveals to be Facade Pinsirite, Defensive Ampharosite Clefable cant switch into Lucarionite Terrakion, which is definetely the most threatening one. Still, being weak to Alt Speed can be annoying and I've seen a bit more Lop/Dia Dugtrio to try trapping it.
-:zeraora: to A/A- (Pinsirite/Lopunnite/Metagrossite, not sure about stone order here)
yay zeraora is back and really hard to answer unless you're good and avoid the Mega Kicks, being an Electric-type which can beat most ground types (pins is immune to ground and only loses to rhyp, Lop only loses to Hippo and Metagrossite has Gknot) without being too slow (looking at you Toxtricity) is really nice, it has been really nice to use and hard to play against on ladder.
-:Keldeo: to C/UR (Lucarionite/Absolite? not sure)
keldeo isnt really in a good spot, being walled by pex and Ampharosite Clefable is pretty annoying, I can see something like taunt keldeo being annoying since it can shut pex but even then being weak to Altspeed sucks. I havent used keldeo at all so I'm not really sure about this.
-:Jirachi: to C (Ampharosite)
Ok havent used this at all either so dont trust me but I saw this on ladder and it was kind of annoying, Mold Breaker Rocks are good but it still wants more than 4 moves, u-turn, wish + protect, Doom Desire, Dmeteor are all useful but hard to fit.

I dont think anything else really should get ranked from the new mons, but a lot of old mons got better thanks to home!

-:mew: from A- to A, (Manectite/Lopunnite/Sablenite/Cameruptite is what my prefearence looks like but I'm really not sure about the stone order)
Mew got back roost, not being able to use aggronite anymore sucks but manectite is one of the most splashable soft check to Terrakion, Zeraora,
Arcanine and most physical attackers, it doesnt like too much how team tries to fit toxic on their attackers which is why sablenite is also not a bad option, acting as a bulkier but slower mewtwo with np soft boiled, it can be annoying to some passive teams.
-:clefable: from B- to A- (Ampharosite)
Probably our best and most reliable rocker rn, it's a nice hydreigon and non-pins Zeraora check and gaining soft boiled back means it can run something else in the 4th slot which usually is Heal Bell/Wish/Toxic/Twave or w/e you want. It's probably one of the most splashed mons along with manec mew thanks to its utility on Balance/Bulky Offense.
-:Toxapex: still A+ but stone orders becomes (Banettite, Gyaradosite, Sablenite, Latiasite)
Gyaradosite became a lot better being able to counter Ghost-type Mons like Gengar or Lunala while being our best defensive answer to Mewtwo, Tspikes are p nice, even if not as much as last gen, being corv bait can also be annoying (I've seen some gyara pexs with scald>payback to punish steels but becoming an uncheck to gengar sucks)
-:mandibuzz: from B to B+ (Sablenite)
Similiarly to Gyarapex, Mandibuzz became easier to fit with Lunala, Gengar, Mewtwo getting a lot of use, it's main problem is if rocks are up it can easily be pressured, Metronome Lunala beats it after rocks, mewtwo Life Orb Thunderbolt is a OHKO after Rocks at +2, Diancite Gengar is a roll ohko it at +2 after rocks. Either way it has a better niche here than in prehome meta and this should be reflected in the vr
there may be more but I got tired and gotta go outside :(
 
Last edited:

Nakeeb

formerly DubFreaknakeeb
hey since posthome update is gonna come soon I thought I would share my thoughts on the main changes I expect
gonna start with the new mons we got from home:
-:necrozma-dusk-mane: to A/A- (Weakness policy/Leftovers)
Havent used this too much so I can see it being lower, but Dragon Dance sets can easily annoy teams that use Defog Corv + Gyara Pex / Alt Arcanine, Prism Armor + Weakness Policy can be annoying since you cant kill it with Lunala / Dragapult and risk getting swept, still the rise in popularity of mandibuzz and defensive lunala holds it back, it also cant get past bulk up corv. Last slot is free so you can see things like Morning Sun, Stone Edge, Knock Off, or Photon Geyser. I havent seen a single defensive set yet, honestly Steel/Psychic isnt that great of a typing this gen, but it gets teleport which is cool I guess?
-:zekrom: to B/B- (Roseli Berry)
Dragon Dance Zekrom is a nice wincon, but it still isnt easy sweeping with it since Ampharosite Clefable, Altarianite Rhyperior and Sab Hippo (some even run Audinite/Altarianite) are seeing a lot more use, It also suffers competition as an Electric-type from Zeraora. I liked a lot Metagrossite Zeraora + Zekrom since it can lure Zekrom answers with Prough/Gknot.
-:reshiram: to C/UR (Heavy-Duty Boots)
ehh reshiram is a cool mon for sure but it dislikes Ampharosite Clefable rising and cant realiably beat Pex, it also isnt really splashable either, I'd be fine seeing it UR
-:Mewtwo: to A/A- (Life Orb)
Nasty plot is really hard to switch into, its best coverage seems to be Psystrike/Shadow Ball/Thunderbolt, allowing it to pressure answers like Corv/Lunala or Mandibuzz, Necrozma-DM is a nice check, while Gyaradosite Toxapex is still a good counter which is getting a lot more usage thanks to broke Lun and Gengar.
Honestly this is one of those mons which seem to have a really good mu on preview but is still really hard to use so I think A- is good enough for it.
:Lunala: to A+ (Heavy-Duty Boots/Metronome/not sure if it runs anything else)
Losing a one-time 200BP Stab-attack is definetely annoying but Lunala remains one of the best mons in mnm for sure, it's really hard to answer defensively since Mandi loses to Metronome if it switches with rocks up, Gyaradosite Toxapex is a good counter to it but still dislikes getting burnt by defensive variants, it also isnt easy to revenge kill either with SShield being harder to break if it's Heavy-Duty Boots, Defensive Lunala also is pretty cool since it's a good check to Terrakion and has nice support options such as Defog, Will-O-Wisp, Toxic or Teleport.
-:Terrakion: to A+ (Lucarionite/Diancite/Lopunnite/Tyranitarite/Pinsirite? Not too sure on the stone order)
I'm sure you all know what terrakion does, it's incredibely hard to switch into, its a good rkiller and really flexible, for example you can check it with manec mew (which still cant switch on luc if not megad) and cry if it's Lop, or check it with Lunala and cry if it's Tyranitarite or even if it burns it and then it reveals to be Facade Pinsirite, Defensive Ampharosite Clefable cant switch into Lucarionite Terrakion, which is definetely the most threatening one. Still, being weak to Alt Speed can be annoying and I've seen a bit more Lop/Dia Dugtrio to try trapping it.
-:zeraora: to A/A- (Pinsirite/Lopunnite/Metagrossite, not sure about stone order here)
yay zeraora is back and really hard to answer unless you're good and avoid the Mega Kicks, being an Electric-type which can beat most ground types (pins is immune to ground and only loses to rhyp, Lop only loses to Hippo and Metagrossite has Gknot) without being too slow (looking at you Toxtricity) is really nice, it has been really nice to use and hard to play against on ladder.
-:Keldeo: to C/UR (Lucarionite/Absolite? not sure)
keldeo isnt really in a good spot, being walled by pex and Ampharosite Clefable is pretty annoying, I can see something like taunt keldeo being annoying since it can shut pex but even then being weak to Altspeed sucks. I havent used keldeo at all so I'm not really sure about this.
-:Jirachi: to C (Ampharosite)
Ok havent used this at all either so dont trust me but I saw this on ladder and it was kind of annoying, Mold Breaker Rocks are good but it still wants more than 4 moves, u-turn, wish + protect, Doom Desire, Dmeteor are all useful but hard to fit.

I dont think anything else really should get ranked from the new mons, but a lot of old mons got better thanks to home!

-:mew: from A- to A, (Manectite/Lopunnite/Sablenite/Cameruptite is what my prefearence looks like but I'm really not sure about the stone order)
Mew got back roost, not being able to use aggronite anymore sucks but manectite is one of the most splashable soft check to Terrakion, Zeraora,
Arcanine and most physical attackers, it doesnt like too much how team tries to fit toxic on their attackers which is why sablenite is also not a bad option, acting as a bulkier but slower mewtwo with np soft boiled, it can be annoying to some passive teams.
-:clefable: from B- to A- (Ampharosite)
Probably our best and most reliable rocker rn, it's a nice hydreigon and non-pins Zeraora check and gaining soft boiled back means it can run something else in the 4th slot which usually is Heal Bell/Wish/Toxic/Twave or w/e you want. It's probably one of the most splashed mons along with manec mew thanks to its utility on Balance/Bulky Offense.
-:Toxapex: still A+ but stone orders becomes (Banettite, Gyaradosite, Sablenite, Latiasite)
Gyaradosite became a lot better being able to counter Ghost-type Mons like Gengar or Lunala while being our best defensive answer to Mewtwo, Tspikes are p nice, even if not as much as last gen, being corv bait can also be annoying (I've seen some gyara pexs with scald>payback to punish steels but becoming an uncheck to gengar sucks)
-:mandibuzz: from B to B+ (Sablenite)
Similiarly to Gyarapex, Mandibuzz became easier to fit with Lunala, Gengar, Mewtwo getting a lot of use, it's main problem is if rocks are up it can easily be pressured, Metronome Lunala beats it after rocks, mewtwo Life Orb Thunderbolt is a OHKO after Rocks at +2, Diancite Gengar is a roll ohko it at +2 after rocks. Either way it has a better niche here than in prehome meta and this should be reflected in the vr
there may be more but I got tired and gotta go outside :(
Since you forgot one pokemon, I'll take the honor to do so.

to A (lucarionite and glalitite)
This pokemon serves as pretty hard pokemon to switch into. While only needing just it's dual stabs to put in work. It's a good switchin to toxapex and other bulky waters in the tier, and is able to scare them off or kill them with adapablity boosted freeze dry. I included glalitite because that's just another stone I've seen other Kyurem's run, but I wouldn't recommend it.
 
Since you forgot one pokemon, I'll take the honor to do so.

to A (lucarionite and glalitite)
This pokemon serves as pretty hard pokemon to switch into. While only needing just it's dual stabs to put in work. It's a good switchin to toxapex and other bulky waters in the tier, and is able to scare them off or kill them with adapablity boosted freeze dry. I included glalitite because that's just another stone I've seen other Kyurem's run, but I wouldn't recommend it.
I would actually disagree here on Kyurem to A. I think that while the Lucarionite set is strong, especially with Freeze Dry, it struggles to break Corviknight, and it loses to the premier -ate speeders in this tier. Additionally, newcomers like Necrozma-Dusk-Mane takes advantage of no Earth Power and comes in for free. Personally, I think it should be B+, at best. The A ranks are for those who are proven several times over, and Kyurem is just simply enjoying how several common bouncers / spdef mons are weak to it. The amount of bulky waters in the tier also dwindled to only Toxapex right now, since that has actual use with Banettite and Gyaradosite. Kyurem still suffers from how it has a hard time breaking past steels, unless it has Earth Power.
Don't get me wrong - it's good. But right now, it's just that it struggles to break past even Sablenite Corviknight, which isn't the best look for it right now. B+ is a great starting place, IMO.
 

Nakeeb

formerly DubFreaknakeeb
I would actually disagree here on Kyurem to A. I think that while the Lucarionite set is strong, especially with Freeze Dry, it struggles to break Corviknight, and it loses to the premier -ate speeders in this tier. Additionally, newcomers like Necrozma-Dusk-Mane takes advantage of no Earth Power and comes in for free. Personally, I think it should be B+, at best. The A ranks are for those who are proven several times over, and Kyurem is just simply enjoying how several common bouncers / spdef mons are weak to it. The amount of bulky waters in the tier also dwindled to only Toxapex right now, since that has actual use with Banettite and Gyaradosite. Kyurem still suffers from how it has a hard time breaking past steels, unless it has Earth Power.
Don't get me wrong - it's good. But right now, it's just that it struggles to break past even Sablenite Corviknight, which isn't the best look for it right now. B+ is a great starting place, IMO.
I use earth power on my kyurem lol, and just bc it can't break Corviknight, doesn't mean it shouldn't be A ranked... there are many A ranked pokemon who can't even touch corviknight. Kyurem is still able to beat corviknight 1v1 aswell, potentially freezing the pokemon with the 32 freeze dry's you're provided with, or stalling out the amount of roosts it has. Toxapex is also NOT the only relevant bulky water in the tier, we got Vaporeon, Gastrodon, Jellicent (which is A-) and Milotic. There are probably more that I can't think of as of right now.
 
Last edited:
I use earth power on my kyurem lol, and just bc it can't break Corviknight, doesn't mean it shouldn't be A ranked... there are many A ranked pokemon who can't even touch corviknight. Kyurem is still able to beat corviknight 1v1 aswell, potentially freezing the pokemon with the 32 freeze dry's you're provided with, or stalling out the amount of roosts it has. Toxapex is also NOT the only relevant bulky water in the tier, we got Vaporeon, Gastrodon, Jellicent (which is A-) and Milotic. There are probably more that I can't think of as of right now.
I think u misunderstood what SectoniaServant meant and as someone who used lucarionite Kyurem a lot in the ladder, I agree with Kyurem being appointed B+ in the vr. The main issue with Kyurem is that it gets threatened and forced out way too easily by metagame staples like lopunnite zeraora,terrakion,diancite users,arcanine,metagrossite excadrill etc due to its typing and speed tier(since it runs modest)
While Kyurem does beat corvi but this only happens in a last mon situation, otherwise corvi can easily click u-turn and then go to the aforementioned threats to force Kyurem out.
Necrozma dm can take 2 earth powers from Kyurem and can ko it in return so even running earth power doesn't really help u much against it
252+ SpA Kyurem Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Prism Armor Necrozma-Dusk-Mane: 171-202 (42.9 - 50.7%) -- 2.3% chance to 2HKO


I also wanna touch on the fact that u think other water types than toxapex are also relevant which is incorrect.
The vr is outdated after home and hence is not the correct depiction of the metagame. Both gastrodon and jellicent has fallen off as viable mons as manectite mew has seen tremendous usage as the premier physical wall. Vaporeon was never good to begin with as it was not ranked even pre-Home.Same goes for milotic.

I also have some noms which I would make when I get time.
 

Nakeeb

formerly DubFreaknakeeb
I think u misunderstood what SectoniaServant meant and as someone who used lucarionite Kyurem a lot in the ladder, I agree with Kyurem being appointed B+ in the vr. The main issue with Kyurem is that it gets threatened and forced out way too easily by metagame staples like lopunnite zeraora,terrakion,diancite users,arcanine,metagrossite excadrill etc due to its typing and speed tier(since it runs modest)
While Kyurem does beat corvi but this only happens in a last mon situation, otherwise corvi can easily click u-turn and then go to the aforementioned threats to force Kyurem out.
Necrozma dm can take 2 earth powers from Kyurem and can ko it in return so even running earth power doesn't really help u much against it
252+ SpA Kyurem Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Prism Armor Necrozma-Dusk-Mane: 171-202 (42.9 - 50.7%) -- 2.3% chance to 2HKO


I also wanna touch on the fact that u think other water types than toxapex are also relevant which is incorrect.
The vr is outdated after home and hence is not the correct depiction of the metagame. Both gastrodon and jellicent has fallen off as viable mons as manectite mew has seen tremendous usage as the premier physical wall. Vaporeon was never good to begin with as it was not ranked even pre-Home.Same goes for milotic.

I also have some noms which I would make when I get time.
I only brought up the whole 1v1 scenario because people always go to Corvinkight on a switchin to my Kyurem, which ends up to them spamming roost while I spam freeze dry pressuring the corviknight, since Freeze Dry 3hko's corviknight. If they U-Turn out then Corviknight will be weak for most of the game until somehow it finds a chance to roost up.
 

xavgb

:xavgb:
is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnus
The first update after the Home release is here! Technically this is more of a revamp than an update due to large metagame changes, and as such we have opted for the same system where we each submit full VRs and average the rankings. In future updates we will be sticking to smaller changes instead of recalculating the placement for every mon. In The Hills decided to sit this update out due to lack of experience with the post-home meta, but I'll drop the other 5 VRs in hide tags below.

S
Arcanine (Altarianite, Pinsirite)
Lunala (Heavy Duty Boots, Metronome, Rocky Helmet)

A+
Gengar (Lucarionite, Diancite, Manectite)
Mew (Manectite, Lopunnite)
Zeraora (Lopunnite, Metagrossite, Pinsirite)

A
Terrakion (Lucarionite, Lopunnite, … Tyranitarite (vomit), Pinsirite
Toxapex (Banettite, Gyaradosite, Latiasite, Sablenite)
Rhyperior (Tyranitarite, Altarianite)
Corviknight (Sablenite, Venusaurite)

A-
Clefable (Ampharosite, Sablenite)
Ditto (Choice Scarf)
Hydreigon (Diancite, Blastoisnite)
Excadrill (Latiosite, Metagrossite, Lucarionite)

B+
Mandibuzz (Sablenite)
Mewtwo (Life Orb, Leftovers)
Necrozma-Dusk-Mane (Weakness Policy, Leftovers)
Mamoswine (Lucarionite)
Dragapult (Diancite, Lucarionite)
Gastrodon (Sablenite)
Kommo-o (Altarianite, Pinsirite)
Noivern (Salamencite)

B
Zekrom (Roseli Berry, Life Orb, Rocky Helmet)
Kyurem (Lucarionite, Cameruptite, Audinite)
Rotom-W (Latiasite, Manectite)
Lucario (Pinsirite, Altarianite)
Tyranitar (Gyaradosite, Pinsirite)
Hippowdon (Sablenite, Altarianite, Audinite)
Reshiram (Heavy Duty Boots, Life Orb)

B-
Rotom-Heat (Latiasite, Manectite)
Toxtricity (Glalite, Altarianite)
Jellicent (Banettite)
Dugtrio (Lucarionite, Diancite)
Jirachi (Ampharosite)
Indeedee (Diancite, Lucarionite)
Shuckle (Ampharosite, Gyaradosite)

C
Chandelure (Cameruptite, Charizardite Y, Diancite, Lucarionite)
Barraskewda (Lopunnite, Aerodactylite)
Keldeo (Lucarionite, Diancite)
Vikavolt (Cameruptite)
Weavile (Glalite, Lucarionite, Scizorite)


S

Lunala (Heavy-Duty Boots)
Arcanine (Altarianite, Pinsirite)
Terrakion (Lucarionite, Tyranitarite, Lopunnite)

A+

Mew (Manectite, Lopunnite)
Gengar (Lucarionite, Diancite, Manectite)
Zeraora (Aerodactylite, Pinsirite, Lopunnite)
Corviknight (Sablenite, Metagrossite, Venusaurite, Aerodactylite)
Toxapex (Banettite, Sablenite, Latiasite)

A

Rhyperior (Tyranitarite, Altarianite)
Ditto (Choice Scarf)
Necrozma-Dusk-Mane (Weakness Policy, Leftovers)

A-

Hydreigon (Diancite, Lucarionite)
Mamoswine (Lucarionite, Scizorite)
Clefable (Ampharosite, Cameruptite)
Kommo-o (Altarianite, Pinsirite)
Rotom-W (Sablenite, Manectite, Latiasite)
Mandibuzz (Sablenite)

B+

Mewtwo (Life Orb)
Zekrom (Roseli Berry)
Dragapult (Diancite)
Gastrodon (Sablenite)
Excadrill (Metagrossite, Lucarionite, Latiosite)

B

Kyurem (Lucarionite)
Noivern (Salamencite)
Hippowdon (Altarianite, Sablenite, Pinsirite)
Reshiram (Life Orb)

B-

Jirachi (Audinite, Ampharosite)
Tyranitar (Pinsirite, Gyaradosite)
Jellicent (Banettite)
Marshadow (Choice Band)
Indeedee (Diancite)
Rotom-Heat (Manectite)
Shuckle (Gyaradosite, Ampharosite)

C

Lucario (Altarianite, Pinsirite)
Incineroar (Banettite)
Dugtrio (Lopunnite)
Keldeo (Lucarionite)
Golisopod (Aerodactylite)
Corsola-Galar (Gyaradosite)
Weavile (Glalitite)
Barraskewda (Lopunnite)
Dracovish (Sharpedonite, Metagrossite)


S

Arcanine (Altarianite, Pinsirite)
Lunala (Heavy-Duty Boots, Metronome)


A+

Mew (Manectite, Lopunnite)
Gengar (Lucarionite, Manectite, Diancite)
Zeraora (Lopunnite, Metagrossite, Pinsirite)

A

Toxapex (Banettite, Gyaradosite, Latiasite, Sablenite)
Terrakion (Lucarionite, Tyranitarite, Lopunnite)
Hydreigon (Diancite, Blastoisinite, Lucarionite)
Mandibuzz (Sablenite)

A-

Corviknight (Sablenite, Venusaurite, Metagrossite)
Mamoswine (Lucarionite)
Clefable (Ampharosite, Cameruptite)
Rotom-W (Manectite, Latiasite, Sablenite)
Ditto (Choice Scarf)


B+

Necrozma-Dusk-Mane (Weakness Policy, Leftovers)
Rhyperior (Tyranitarite, Altarianite)
Zekrom (Roseli Berry, Leftovers, Life Orb)
Dragapult (Diancite)
Excadrill (Metagrossite, Latiosite, Lucarionite)
Gastrodon (Sablenite)
Kommo-o (Altarianite, Pinsirite)

B

Mewtwo (Life Orb)
Kyurem (Lucarionite, Cameruptite)
Noivern (Salamencite)
Hippowdon (Altarianite, Sablenite, Pinsirite, Venusaurite)
Lucario (Pinsirite, Altarianite)
Rotom-Heat (Manectite)

B-

Indeedee (Diancite)
Reshiram (Life Orb, Choice Scarf)
Jirachi (Ampharosite, Audinite)
Tyranitar (Pinsirite, Gyaradosite)
Marshadow (Choice Band)
Jellicent (Banettite)


C

Weavile (Glalitite, Pinsirite)
Keldeo (Lucarionite)
Raichu (Altarianite, Pinsirite)
Dugtrio (Lopunnite)
Barraskewda (Lopunnite)
Cobalion (Lopunnite)
Dracovish (Sharpedonite, Metagrossite)
Golisopod (Aerodactylite)
Celebi (Absolite)
Shuckle (Gyaradosite, Ampharosite)


S
Lunala (Heavy-Duty Boots, Leftovers)
Arcanine (Altarianite, Pinsirite)

A+
Mew (Manectite, Lopunnite)
Gengar (Lucarionite, Diancite, Manectite)
Zeraora (Lopunnite, Metagrossite, Pinsirite)
Terrakion (Lucarionite, Lopunnite)

A
Toxapex (Banettite, Gyaradosite)
Corviknight (Sablenite, Venusaurite)
Clefable (Ampharosite)

A-
Ditto (Choice Scarf)
Excadrill (Metagrossite, Latiosite, Lucarionite, Pinsirite)
Lucario (Pinsirite, Altarianite)


B+
Necrozma-Dusk-Mane (Weakness Policy, Leftovers)
Noivern (Salamencite)
Rotom-W (Manectite, Latiasite, Sablenite)
Hydreigon (Diancite, Blastoisinite, Lucarionite)
Mandibuzz (Sablenite)
Mewtwo (Life Orb, Leftovers)

B
Rhyperior (Tyranitarite, Altarianite)
Kommo-o (Altarianite)
Dragapult (Diancite)
Mamoswine (Lucarionite
Rotom-Heat (Manectite)

B-
Hippowdon (Altarianite, Sablenite, Pinsirite, Venusaurite)
Indeedee (Diancite, Cameruptite)
Jellicent (Banettite, Sablenite)
Kyurem (Cameruptite, Lucarionite
Shuckle (Gyaradosite, Ampharosite)


S
Arcanine (Altarianite, Pinsirite)

A+
Lunala (Heavy Duty Boots, Metronome, Rocky Helmet)
Gengar (Lucarionite, Diancite, Manectite)
Mew (Manectite)

A
Zeraora (Lopunnite, Metagrossite, Pinsirite)
Toxapex (Banettite, Gyaradosite, Latiasite, Sablenite)
Hydreigon (Diancite, Blastoisnite)
Terrakion (Lucarionite, Tyranitarite, Lopunnite)
Corviknight (Sablenite, Venusaurite)

A-
Clefable (Ampharosite)
Rhyperior (Tyranitarite, Altarianite)
Necrozma-Dusk-Mane (Weakness Policy, Leftovers)

B+
Ditto (Choice Scarf)
Dragapult (Diancite, Lucarionite)
Hippowdon (Sablenite, Altarianite, Audinite)
Mandibuzz (Sablenite)
Mamoswine (Lucarionite)
Mewtwo (Life Orb, Leftovers)

B
Excadrill (Latiosite, Metagrossite, Lucarionite)
Gastrodon (Sablenite)
Kommo-o (Altarianite, Pinsirite)
Zekrom (Roseli Berry, Life Orb, Rocky Helmet)
Kyurem (Lucarionite, Cameruptite)
Rotom-W (Latiasite, Manectite)
Lucario (Pinsirite, Altarianite)
Noivern (Salamencite)
Tyranitar (Gyaradosite, Pinsirite)
Reshiram (Heavy Duty Boots, Life Orb)

B-
Rotom-Heat (Latiasite, Manectite)
Toxtricity (Glalite, Altarianite)
Jellicent (Banettite)
Dugtrio (Lucarionite, Diancite)
Jirachi (Ampharosite)
Indeedee (Diancite, Lucarionite)
Shuckle (Ampharosite, Gyaradosite)

C
Chandelure (Cameruptite, Charizardite Y, Diancite, Lucarionite)
Barraskewda (Lopunnite, Aerodactylite)
Keldeo (Lucarionite, Diancite)
Vikavolt (Cameruptite)
Weavile (Glalite, Lucarionite, Scizorite)



I don't have much else to say here, I write up explanations a lot of the time but we know what these mons do by now.
 

Chazm

Chazm is free on PS!
is a Pre-Contributor
Two short nominations to update how I feel about the current metagame:
:arcanine: S -> A+
:lunala: S -> A+

I don't really think anything has changed for Lunala and Arcanine but I would agree that they don't really stand out among the rest of A+ besides Terrakion right now. Zeraora and Gengar have been shown to exhibit similar levels of offensive capabilities whilst also having utility options like Arcanine and Lunala, whereas Mew has been taking the spot as the defensive pivot on teams compared to Lunala, which is highly dependent on its Shadow Shield staying up. With Sandstorm still being somewhat prevalent in the metagame, these two Pokemon can tend to be neutered slightly in their actual effectiveness, but it doesn't necessarily mean they are much worse in the real games - often times these two will and can sweep, but I find that compared to the other mons in A+ they just don't really feel above them.

:terrakion: A+ -> A

This however, has been taking a toll to the recent adaptations to the metagame. Massive amounts of Manectite Mew as well as a heavily VoltTurn based metagame has left Terrakion in shambles as a wallbreaker as it is no longer able to really get up momentum against opponents. The abundance of faster wallbreakers like Hydreigon, Zeraora (and Arcanine) also don't really leave Terrakion much room to take multiple Pokemon with it either, and this tends to leave it in a fairly awkward position against offense and against balance teams. Even though Tyranitarite Terrakion can surpress this dynamic to an extent, it still suffers from the same issues as the other sets to the point where I do not feel like Terrakion can keep up its current ranking.
 
Last edited:

Chazm

Chazm is free on PS!
is a Pre-Contributor
Double post but this includes a lot more nominations than last time:

:excadrill: B+ -> A-

Whilst it had some stagnant periods early on in the metagame, Excadrill has come back overall in viability. Corviknights are struggling a lot more to fit Body Press on their sets right now, and whilst they can circumvent dealing with Excadrill a bit with Zeraora, Excadrill can still utilize Rapid Spin to gather Speed boosts that make it a considerably bigger threat than it usually would be. And with the rise of Clefable balances, Excadrill has multiple chances to get into the match and spin away hazards, which means that it is an excellent support for other Defoggers. Latiosite has some pretty neat role compression right now for most builds as a result - with Rhyperior bulky offense still being a strong going core and solid hazard setters in general being quite limited, Latiosite Excadrill being able to take on two of four common hazard setters is an excellent boon for it. In general, I am finding that Excadrill is managing to fill more roles on a team, and, especially with more CorviMew teams on the rise, Excadrill is looking to be a suitable breaking partner for the current metagame, as Exca pairs incredibly well with Zeraora and Arcanine, which continually put pressure on Mew so that it can find it easier to sweep.

:kommo-o: B+ -> B-

Corviknight is still fantastic, Arcanine is one of the top 5 and Gengar is kicking about. So what does Kommo-o have at the moment that really justifies its slot right now? High competition with the Altarianite stone is already something that pushes its viability down from its previous point, and the rise of Clefable also heavily hurts it, with builds prefering Clefables overall lower power for recovery and more utility, as well as Mold Breaker. It isn't even a very solid check to Zeraora right now as a lot of them carry Toxic + Volt Switch which can be crucial for chipping health off of most of Zeraora's counters fast. It doesn't seem like a very good pick right now as a result.

:mewtwo: B+ -> B-

Mewtwo is also another one of these sufferers - in a Ghost heavy metagame as well as a metagame where 130 Speed is not as good as it would have been pre-Home, Mewtwo generally suffers from trying to break teams efficiently due to its poor typing that it will often share with Mew on most builds and general preference for faster breakers like Gengar and Zeraora. The increase in usage of Gyaradosite Toxapex also takes a massive toll on its breaking capabilities as balance now has ways around it aside from revenge killing. I am not majorly convinced that Mewtwo deserves to be with Mamoswine either, and feels better off with Reshiram and its more niche partners.

:lucario: B -> B+

Conversely, I feel like Lucario is quite underrated on the current viability rankings. Despite heavy increases of usage in Mew, due to Lucario's premega and the buff to Inner Focus it tends not to struggle too much with it in reality. Mega Kick Lucario in tandem with Inner Focus is capable of Mega Evolving and guaranteed beating Mew with Stealth Rock up as long as it hits, which can be an incredible boon to more offensive teams that depend on instant damage. Stealth Rock also allows Lucario to be a semi-consistent revenge killer to Gengar, which whilst not exclusive to it is a role that teams highly appreciate.

:incineroar: UR -> B- (Metagrossite, Banettite)

Incineroar is a pretty solid mon in the metagame, with decreased usage of Fire resists like Rhyperior, and having super effective coverage against most of the metagame, Incineroar is a pretty solid pick for bulky offense as a compressed resist to Lunala and a decent wallbreaker which can substitute for Arcanine if the Altarianite slot is already taken. Access to Stomping Tantrum for Metagrossite helps prevent the problems that can be underlayed with Dark/Fire coverage as it hits Toxapex and Arcanine for solid damage, and Banettite can apply Will-o-Wisp and Parting Shot to its moveset to be a pretty solid offensive support option. Darkest Lariat also allows it to be a fairly competent stallbreaker as it can use its stats ignoring effect to its advantage in the matchup to wear down important targets for teammates in the early game. Overall, I feel like Incineroar's niches are valid enough to grant it a spot on the Viability Rankings.

:kyurem-white: UR -> C (Life Orb)

Kyurem-White has a worse Speed tier than regular Kyurem, but it has a few distinct advantages that actually help it break faster than Kyurem would be able to do. Access to Fusion Flare and a clone of Mold Breaker allow Kyurem-White to take advantage of teams utilizing Corviknight + Mew cores, and a high Special Attack stat with a free item actually allows it to hit harder than Kyurem in certain situations. Kyurem-White however is not a direct upgrade: it suffers a lot more than Kyurem with residual damage and it is generally inferior to it if it needs to run Draco Meteor due to Kyurem's higher power STABs as a result of Adaptability and the ability to run a Modest Nature.

Edit because I forgot to write it:

:ditto: A- -> B

Despite the ghost-filled metagame, Ditto fails to find much of a placement on modern teams right now. Due to the introduction of Zeraora, and continued prominence of Arcanine, teams already have good speed control options that are excellent offensive Pokemon in their own right. As such, the demand for Ditto on these teams is considerably less than it would have been before Pokemon HOME.
 
Last edited:

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 2, Guests: 0)

Top