Monotype Viability Rankings V2

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Vid

The Trilogy
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Moderator
#1

Approved by scpinion Art by Disbelief
Monotype C&C BW Viability Rankings
~ If a link is dead, then no writeup has been written for that Pokemon. Feel free to reserve it. ~
Introduction & General Information
Welcome to the Monotype Viability Rankings. As most of you know, Monotype is completely different from OU in terms of viability. Instead of focusing on a Pokemon's flaws and the amount of roles they can perform, we're mainly focusing on how each Pokemon can fare against other type matchups. Abilities are valued more than normal, so consider them when you rank something. Pokemon are placed in either S, A, B, C, or D rank, with S only having Pokemon that can easily influence the game against a majority of type matchups, while D has Pokemon that are solely used for their moves or abilities. Pokemon with 2 typings will need 2 ranks. An example of this would be Lanturn being more useful on Water Monotypes than Electric Monotypes due to its Electric immunity patches up holes on Water teams while it doesn't provide much for Electric teams.

Rules:
  • Flaming will not be tolerated.
  • Post smartly, don't just be like "I like Gogoat so it should be in S Tier!!!"
  • Stay on topic. As much as I would like to see a petition saying that Ho-oh should be unbanned, not here please. :)
  • You have 5 days to write the stuff you reserve.
How to rank: If you want an example just click a Pokemon.
  • Include the Pokemon you're rating, the type, and what rank you want it to be.
  • (This is recommended not required) Include at least 1 set. Some Pokemon may have more than one set.
  • Provide an explanation as to why you put it in that rank and how it fares in Monotype.
Monotype Viability Reviewers These people will have the final say if a decision by the community cannot be reached or a pokemon is completely misplaced. If you have any questions or need help, please PM / VM these people.
VR Council
iVid
Wanka
Zarif
Monotype Viability Rankings (Subject to change, they are in no particular order)
S Rank
Chansey
Porygon2
Staraptor
A Rank
Diggersby
Mega-Lopunny
Mega-Pidgeot
Meloetta
B Rank
Heliolisk
Ditto
Porygon-Z
Snorlax
C Rank
Smeargle
Mega-Audino
Exploud
Miltank
D Rank
Blissey
Cinccino
Pyroar
Staravia
S Rank
Keldeo
Mega-Medicham
Terrakion
A Rank
Breloom
Mega-Gallade
Cobalion
Infernape
Heracross
B Rank
Conkeldurr
Lucario
Hawlucha
C Rank
Chesnaught
Heracross-Mega
Pangoro
D Rank
Hitmontop
Scrafty
Mienshao
Toxicroak
Machamp
Combusken
S Rank
Landorus-I
Mega-Gyarados
Skarmory
Zapdos
A Rank
Mega-Charizard Y
Dragonite
Landorus-T
Thundurus-I
Togekiss
Gliscor
B Rank
Thundurus-T
Aerodactyl
Tornadus-T
C Rank
Gyarados
Hawlucha
Honchkrow
Salamence
Aerodactyl-Mega
D Rank
Vivillon
Articuno
Yanmega
Mega-Pidgeot
Staraptor
Tornadus-I
Mandibuzz
S Rank
Mega-Venusaur
Scolipede
Gengar
A Rank
Drapion
Nidoking
Nidoqueen
Skuntank
Crobat
B Rank
Dragalge
Mega-Beedrill
Tentacruel
Amoonguss
C Rank
Toxicroak
Golbat
Weezing
Roserade
D Rank
Qwilfish
S Rank
Excadrill
Hippowdon
Landorus-I
A Rank
Gastrodon
Mamoswine
Mega-Garchomp
Seismitoad
Garchomp
B Rank
Gliscor
Landorus-T
Mega-Camerupt
Krookodile
Nidoking
C Rank
Mega-Steelix
Diggersby
Zygarde
D Rank
Dugtrio
Torterra
Quagsire
Mega-Swampert
S Rank
Mega-Aggron
Mega-Diancie
Terrakion
Tyranitar
A Rank
Cradily
Omastar
Rhyperior
Shuckle
B Rank
Areodactyl-Mega
Tyrantrum
Diancie
C Rank
Tyranitar-Mega
Aerodactyl
D Rank
Archeops
Aurorus
Kabutops
S Rank
Armaldo
Mega-Pinsir
Volcarona
Scizor
A Rank
Forretress
Galvantula
Heracross
Mega-Heracross
Shuckle
B Rank
Yanmega
Mega-Scizor
Scolipede
C Rank
Mega-Beedrill
Vivillon
Durant
D Rank
Volbeat
Scyther
S Rank
Gengar
Sableye
A Rank
Chandelure
Golurk
Jellicent
Doublade
B Rank
Gourgiest-Super
Hoopa
C Rank
Spiritomb
Rotom
Cofagrigus
Mega-Banette
Froslass
D Rank
Trevenant
Mismagius
Misdreavus
S Rank
Heatran
Skarmory
Mega-Scizor
A Rank
Bisharp
Doublade
Excadrill
Ferrothorn
Jirachi
Magnezone
B Rank
Empoleon
Klefki
C Rank
Lucario
Cobalion
Scizor
Durant
D Rank
Forretress
Magneton
Mega-Steelix
Bronzong
Mega-Aggron
S Rank
Mega-Charizard Y
A Rank
Entei
Heatran
Infernape
Torkoal
Victini
Volcanion
B Rank
Volcarona
Rotom-H
Darmanitan
C Rank
Arcanine
Chandelure
Fletchinder
D Rank
Mega-Houndoom
Ninetales
Camerupt-Mega
S Rank
Azumarill
Keldeo
A Rank
Empoleon
Lanturn
Mega-Gyarados
Mega-Sharpedo
Starmie
Swampert
Volcanion
Manaphy
B Rank
Politoed
Gyarados
Cloyster
Alomomola
Tentacruel
Mega-Swampert
Quagsire
Kingdra
Slowbro
Rotom-W
Seismitoad
C Rank
Sharpedo
Suicune
Feraligatr
Kabutops
Ludicolo
D Rank
Jellicent
Crawdaunt
Mega-Blastoise
Mantine
Slowking
Gastrodon
S Rank
Ferrothorn
Mega-Venusaur
A Rank
Breloom
Cradily
Serperior
Whimsicott
B Rank
Rotom-M
Celebi
C Rank
Ludicolo
Roserade
Mega-Sceptile
Shiftry
Gourgeist-Super
Tangrowth
Amoonguss
D Rank
Leavanny
Chesnaught
S Rank
Rotom-W
Thundurus
Zapdos
A Rank
Magnezone
Mega-Ampharos
Mega-Manectric
Raikou
B Rank
Luxray
Eelektross
C Rank
Electivire
Jolteon
D Rank
Stunfisk
Thundurus-T
Magneton
S Rank
Hoopa-Unbound
Mega-Gardevoir
Mew
Slowbro
Victini
Mega-Medicham
A Rank
Gardevoir
Latios
Jirachi
B Rank
Azelf
Mega-Gallade
Meloetta
Deoxys-S
Mega-Latias
Starmie
Gothitelle
Celebi
C Rank
Mega-Alakazam
Latias
Alakazam
Deoxys-D
Gallade
Bronzong
D Rank
Uxie
Metagross
Cresselia
Reuniclus
Wobbuffet
Espeon
S Rank
Avalugg
Kyurem-B
Mamoswine
A Rank
Weavile
Piloswine
Lapras
Walrein
B Rank
Rotom-F
Articuno
Froslass
Mega-Abomasnow
Mega-Glalie
Cloyster
Aurorus
C Rank
Cryogonal
Jynx
D Rank
Kyurem
Regice
S Rank
Garchomp
Kyurem-B
Latios
Dragonite
A Rank
Hydreigon
Mega-Latias
Latias
B Rank
Dragalge
Mega-Garchomp
C Rank
Goodra
Zygarde
Salamence
Tyrantrum
D Rank
Kingdra
Haxorus
Druddigon
Noivern
S Rank
Bisharp
Mandibuzz
Tyranitar
Hoopa-Unbound
A Rank
Hydreigon
Mega-Sharpedo
Weavile
Sableye
B Rank
Krookodile
Sharpedo
Crawdaunt
Mega-Houndoom
Mega-Tyranitar
C Rank
Honchkrow
Umbreon
Mega-Absol
D Rank
Drapion
Spiritomb
Zoroark
Cacturne
Scrafty
S Rank
Azumarill
Clefable
Klefki
Mega-Diancie
A Rank
Togekiss
Gardevoir
Sylveon
B Rank
Whimsicott
Mega-Gardevoir
C Rank
Diancie
Slurpuff
D Rank
Florges
Granbull
Aromatisse
Mawile
Carbink
Blacklist
These Pokemon have been brought up multiple times for discussion or are just awful these Pokemon will be blacklisted from discussion. A type can be blacklisted if it is an extreme circumstance.
  • (Ice) It fulfills a specific role on Ice teams in Blizzard Spam Ice teams
  • (Bug) Brought up multiple times with same arguments
  • FEAR Pokemon should not be brought up because they are just gimmicky and do not warrant a rank
 
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Vid

The Trilogy
is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor
Moderator
#2
Alright some quick updates to VR I added
  • Added a blacklist to prevent some shitposting mainly with lower tier types and niche Pokemon that were issues in previous thread
  • New VR council member will be added shortly once I find a person that I think will do a job as well as very knowledgeable
  • Adding 3 to 5 Pokemon Rank discussions for controversial Pokemon every 1 or 2 weeks to make VR more organized and direct while also giving controversial Pokemon the best possible rank
Ranking Discussion Week #1
(Psychic) A--->B
(Psychic) B--->A
(Flying) A--->B
(Bug) B--->A
(Fire) B--->A
Change(s)
C--->D- It's just bad outclassed by everything on fairy nothing much to say it's just outclassed and hard to fit on fairy team.
 

Zarif

Paradise in our minds
is a Contributor to Smogon
#3
Great to see that the VR thread isn't dying because Ant quit. I'll share my views on the discussions of the week:

Mega Gallade A -> B on Psychic



Not gonna lie, I was one of the people who wanted Mega-Gallade banned from Psychic asap when ORAS came out. But honestly, after it got unbanned, I really don't understand why I thought it was broken. Although it has a great Speed tier (150), amazing Attack (165) and somewhat decent Defensive stats(95/115), it's just outclassed by the other Mega Evolutions Psychic has access to. Mega-Gallade doesn't particularly beat anything that is a problem for Psychic unlike the other two Megas (Gardevoir and Medicham). The fact that Gardevoir can almost single-handedly beat Dark and Medicham has almost no switch ins in the metagame shows that there really isn't any point in running Gallade over them. Thus, I agree Gallade should be put to rank B on Psychic.


Jirachi B -> A on Psychic



Right now I think most people will agree that Fairy is a great type to use in Tournaments and in general due to it being good overall and as it can beat the top types including Psychic. But Jirachi can help significantly against Fairy due to it's Steel typing and great overall defensive and offensive stats (100). It can be run as a Specially Defensive Stealth Rock set with Wish support or as a Choice Scarfer that will hax everything in its way. And with the increasing use of a particular Mega-Latias Psychic team, I think most people will agree that Jirachi deserves to be A rank on Psychic.


Thundurus-T A -> B on Flying



Thundurus-Therian used to be a must on Flying due to it's great Ability for Flying types which lets it become Immune to Electric attacks and even heal from them. But after Zapdos got unbanned again from Flying, the usage of Thundurus-T started to drop down as people used that as their Switch-in to Electric moves. But Thundurus-T wasn't just an Electric Immunity, it was a common Choice Scarf pokemon for Flying teams as it can gain momentum through Volt Switch and as it has a great movepool.It has a good Special Attack stat (125) and a speed tier which makes it outspeed base 100s which are very common in Monotype (101). Honestly,I'm kinda torn on this one.


Yanmega B -> A on Bug



Yanmega has one of the best Abilities in the game in my opinion in Speed Boost which lets it somewhat Average speed (95) increase by 1 stage at the end of every turn. This makes it turn into a great Sweeper late game as it has a decent Special Attack stat (116) and with Life Orb as it's item, it can do heavy damage to an unprepared team if it get's 1 or 2 Speed Boosts. It has a decent movepool as well as it has access to Giga Drain which can threat Ground,Water and Rock type pokemons. Bug Buzz and Air Slash are it's primary STAB moves and it also runs Protect to insure that it gets atleast 1 Speed Boost every time. Sabella made a very good Bug team with Yanmega in it. Thus I agree with Yanmega being put as A rank on Bug.


Volcanion B -> A on Fire



I made a seperate post on this in the first VR thread. Link

TL;DR: Agree on everything other than Thundurus-T as I'm not sure on that one.
 
#4
Yanmega is fine in B imo, it can be effective if played right but with mega pinsir around, bug is doing good in terms of flying coverage. Also eating 50% from rocks sucks, and it can't boost its attack without an item.

The best mileage I've ever gotten with it is as a tail glow recipient from volbeat (this is usually gg if I could pull it off, provided the other team doesn't have SE priority). However even this is a niche strategy and B rank suits it in the current meta
 

Zarif

Paradise in our minds
is a Contributor to Smogon
#5
Yanmega is fine in B imo, it can be effective if played right but with mega pinsir around, bug is doing good in terms of flying coverage. Also eating 50% from rocks sucks, and it can't boost its attack without an item.

The best mileage I've ever gotten with it is as a tail glow recipient from volbeat (this is usually gg if I could pull it off, provided the other team doesn't have SE priority). However even this is a niche strategy and B rank suits it in the current meta
Mega-Pinsir and Yanmega aren't supposed to be used together. Yanmega is for the Bug teams that use Mega Heracross/Mega Scizor. It pressures a team if it gets 1 or more Speed Boosts as it lures in specific pokemon to counter it. Also Yanmega doesn't need Volbeat support or well any extra support for it as it is more than capable of beating teams on its own. The Stealth Rock argument doesn't really work against it either as there are other Pokemon like Volcarona who take 50% from it as well, again most Bug teams should run Hazard Control to prevent that. Yanmega also helps clear out Offensive threats and in turn lets pokemons like Volcarona/Mega-Scizor to sweep.

Yanmega also helps the Bug user against Fighting/Psychic and Water due to its access to Bug/Flying and Grass moves. It forces out Victini/Meloetta on Psychic, Terrakion,Cobalion on Fighting and Tentacruel,Empoleon on Water. I stand by my post of making it A rank.
 
#6
It is a hard mon to think of as A but It for sure isnt only a good mon for receiving tailglow. Two things yanmega does that make bug a very versatile type is it allows you to use mega heracross (since yanmega provides the flying coverage without taking a mega slot), a fantastic wall breaker that gets supported by sticky web, and it also compliments volcarona beautifully. You can mix you coverage moves up between volc and yanmega to cover what you want to cover since they both have 4MSS. You can even run tailwind on it to make mega heracross even more of a threat.

Again, its still iffy about whether it is worthy of A rank but I can assure you it is far more than just a tailglow receiver lmao.
 
#7
Obviously the tail glow receiver isn't the only way (or probably even the best way) to use a yanmega... It was simply the most fun I've had with it and if I pulled it off I never lost..
 
#8
what traits does yanmega have to make it deserve of a higher rank than vivillon, who strikes me as a fairly similar niche, a flying stab user on hera teams? i immediately see speed boost but compoundeyes sleep powder on a relatively sleep-less type as well a a more powerful flying stab, and the ability to be a secondary setup sweeper.

also is yanmega so good at flying stab on non-pins teams that its as good as the non-pins megas? (i.e. the actual anchors of the teams). i'm a little skeptical of yanmega to a
 

Zarif

Paradise in our minds
is a Contributor to Smogon
#9
what traits does yanmega have to make it deserve of a higher rank than vivillon, who strikes me as a fairly similar niche, a flying stab user on hera teams? i immediately see speed boost but compoundeyes sleep powder on a relatively sleep-less type as well a a more powerful flying stab, and the ability to be a secondary setup sweeper.

also is yanmega so good at flying stab on non-pins teams that its as good as the non-pins megas? (i.e. the actual anchors of the teams). i'm a little skeptical of yanmega to a
Yanmega and Vivillon are two very different Pokemon. Vivillon has to set up to get it's boost while Yanmega get's its boost at the end of every turn. Albeit Vivillon does get more boosts if it Quiver Dances up, but the thing that separates these two is that Yanmega can come in anytime and just Protect and get going while Vivillon has to come in on a Slower pokemon to put to Sleep and then has to waste another turn Quiver Dancing up. Again the fact that Vivillon is kinda forced to run Focus Sash so that it can live a hit kinda puts it down as well. Vivillon also must run Sleep Powder and Quiver Dance while Yanmega has to just run Protect which allows it to use another move such as Hidden Power Ice or Giga Drain based on what Volcarona runs as Wanka said. With all of this in mind, I think Yanmega outclasses Vivillon as Vivillon takes more time and effort to get going while on the other hand Yanmega can just start attacking after one turn.
 

Eien

I'll face myself
is a member of the Site Staffis a Community Leaderis a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor
Monotype Leader
#10
I pretty much agree with Disbelief on everything except for his sketchy base stats knowledge.

Here's why Thundurus-T should be dropped:

Thundurus-T suffers a similar problem to Landorus-T, you cannot use the Incarnate forme with it. Thundurus does the Nasty Plot set better, it has Prankster Thunder Wave, and it outspeeds most notably Keldeo, but also the other base 105-110 Speed threats. The only niches Thundurus-T has over Thundurus is the Double Dance set that no one uses and its ability to use Choice Scarf to outspeed the Choice Scarf base 100s and proceed to not beat any of them 1v1 anyway. I mean, I guess it does help with Focus Blast on Kyurem-B against Ice, but Thundurus can also suicide to paralyze it while being generally more useful in other matchups. I think taking it from A down to B makes sense to emphasize the Incarnate forme's superiority.
 
#12
Jirachi has been long overdue it's A ranking in my opinion, with the wealth of defensive and offensive presence it gives psychic, alongwith varied utility. I heartily support its rise to A rank.

And I very much agree with Eien that the opportunity cost of running Thundurus-Therian outweighs any of the benefits of using it. And the very same argument can be used for Mega-Gallade. I agree with both revised rankings.



P.S. Where is non-mega Sableye in Ghost viability rankings?
 
#13
Could someone explain me why Dragon Dragalge is B rank, but Goodra is C? I used them both for a very long time, and there is no way one is just better than another. And as I noticed, Goodra was already nominated for B rank in the older thread but I don't get how did it become C again.

If needed, I can provide my sorta-analysis of "Goodra vs. Dragalge" debate.
 

Day Healer

formerly .Rawr!
#14
Some reminders out there:

- Durant is still unranked on bug :/. I think it is deserving at least C, maybe even B. I could explain why, but I think Omega-xis post explain it far better than I could do.

- Here I was going to write about how outrageous is having mega glalie in C-rank, but i realized other ice mons like aurorus have questionable ranks too, and I found this discussion was already brought up by average fella and Broccol1. So yeah, a reorganization on ice type is needed (my personal opinion is mega glalie on B, Aurorus on C, don't have a word about Articuno, cryogonal is terrible, is like considering donphan on ground to make a comparison)

- Why is Delphox even ranked on psychic?


About the ranking discussion of this week, the only one I have experience with is Volcanion on fire.

- Volcanion: I think it pretty much deserves A rank: It grants monofire finally what they wanted so bad for so long, a water immunity. Thats not all, like it can hit hard back at waters with no-turn-charge Solarbeams by the Drought from mega char-y. It have problems again dragons, is true, but then again fire is supposed to always suck again dragons so meh...
I use this set, if someone is interested:

@ Air Balloon/Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 Spe
Modest Nature
- Steam Eruption
- Fire Blast
- Solar Beam
- Hidden Power [Ice]
I prefer Air Balloon like it helps again the ground matchup. I don't like using Choice scarf on it because I think victini or darmanitan are better in that role. Also sometimes is slow even with the choice scarf (70 speed isnt the best tho)
 
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#15
Could someone explain me why Dragon Dragalge is B rank, but Goodra is C? I used them both for a very long time, and there is no way one is just better than another. And as I noticed, Goodra was already nominated for B rank in the older thread but I don't get how did it become C again.

If needed, I can provide my sorta-analysis of "Goodra vs. Dragalge" debate.
I'd be interested in this; Goodra and Dragalge seem to offer slightly different roles to dragon.

Dragalge can wallbreak, sponge fairy hits, and KO fairies back. Goodra has fire coverage, grass immunity (leech seed/spore/stun spore), more overall special bulk, and less exploitable weaknesses to ground and psychic.

But that poison STAB is pretty valuable... Again, I'd like to hear your thoughts.
 
#16
Don't forget that gooey is also viable to slow down or force out threats, as well as being able to run sludge wave, although dragalge's is much more powerful. Personally, I prefer Goodra due to its absurd special bulk, and I honestly think it's better and should be B.
 
#17
Golem For C (Rock)


<Insert Name Here> (Golem) @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge/Rock Slide
- Stealth Rock/Rock Polish

The Weakness Policy gets activated by a ton of pokemon, So really, there isn't many matches you don't get Times 2 attack, and most pokemon take a huge chunk or get 1 shotted by a plus 2 Golem

+2 252+ Atk Golem Sucker Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Jirachi: 362-426 (89.6 - 105.4%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

+2 252+ Atk Golem Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 96+ Def Mega Venusaur: 238-282 (65.5 - 77.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

+2 252+ Atk Golem Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Swampert: 229-270 (56.6 - 66.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock + +2 252+ Atk Golem Sucker Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Swampert: 122-144 (30.1 - 35.6%)

+2 252+ Atk Golem Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 16+ Def Mega Scizor: 228-268 (66.4 - 78.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
 
#20
Agreed. The only things it has over rhypherior is sturdy, which is easily broken due to Rock's poor hazard removal; having to risk mega-diancie to bounce back or run mediocre hazard removal like Defog aerodactyl or rapid spin Kabutops.

It has sucker punch but is entirely reliant on weakness policy boosts to do anything, not having Rhypherior's massive 140 attack stat to work with. It's just all around worse. Keep it in D.
 
#21
Meloetta A --> S Rank on Psychic



Meloetta has a very unique typing being Normal and Psychic as well as very good stats and moves. Why I think it should be S rank is because its ability to wall or deal with most, if not all, high ranked Pokemon in the Ghost rankings. As a ghost user, Meloetta is such a difficult Pokemon to deal with. An assault vest set is very annoying to Ghost users in general because Ghost has one or two viable physical attackers. Meloetta also has the ability to turn into a fast, physical threat to Dark teams and Ghost teams with Relic Song + Close Combat and Knock Off. In my opinion, Meloetta plays a very important role on Psychic type teams and deserves to be S rank.

Jynx D --> C Rank on Ice




Jynx (F) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Lovely Kiss
- Ice Beam
- Psyshock / Psychic
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Even though Jynx seems to be bad or not useful, she can actually be quite a threat. Jynx is fast and can revenge kill especially with a focus sash. She can live a hit from Scizor's Bullet Punch and return with an HP Fire. Psychic STAB on Ice also becomes very handy since Ice is weak to Fighting. Putting something to sleep is also great to have since Jynx is pretty fast. All in all, I don't think Jynx deserves D rank on Ice; she actually has a lot of uses.
 
#22
Meloetta A --> S Rank on Psychic



Meloetta has a very unique typing being Normal and Psychic as well as very good stats and moves. Why I think it should be S rank is because its ability to wall or deal with most, if not all, high ranked Pokemon in the Ghost rankings. As a ghost user, Meloetta is such a difficult Pokemon to deal with. An assault vest set is very annoying to Ghost users in general because Ghost has one or two viable physical attackers. Meloetta also has the ability to turn into a fast, physical threat to Dark teams and Ghost teams with Relic Song + Close Combat and Knock Off. In my opinion, Meloetta plays a very important role on Psychic type teams and deserves to be S rank.

Jynx D --> C Rank on Ice



Jynx (F) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Lovely Kiss
- Ice Beam
- Psyshock / Psychic
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Even though Jynx seems to be bad or not useful, she can actually be quite a threat. Jynx is fast and can revenge kill especially with a focus sash. She can live a hit from Scizor's Bullet Punch and return with an HP Fire. Psychic STAB on Ice also becomes very handy since Ice is weak to Fighting. Putting something to sleep is also great to have since Jynx is pretty fast. All in all, I don't think Jynx deserves D rank on Ice; she actually has a lot of uses.
I am not quite sure about those suggestions, tbh. Although Meloetta does handle Ghost pretty well, Hoopa-Unbound also offers a reliable way to handle most of them, as well as posing to be a very powerful wallbreaker against most types (there's also Victini, which can be very threatening for Ghost teams once Chandelure is weakened or dead). Furthermore, I believe Ghost teams aren't really an issue for Psychic after Aegislash's ban (it could go even lower on usage if sableye gets banned in the suspect). In short, Meloetta doesn't really ''define'' Psychic teams, but it can offer lots of utilities on its own (pretty sure everything you mentioned, such as excelling at taking down Ghost types and a diverse movepool). That being said, I think A rank is perfectly fine for it.

About Jynx, I really couldn't tell since Ice isn't a type I use much, but Broccol1 and Dece1t, who are experienced at the type, should be able to tell you about it.
 
#23
While it's nice to see someone bring up the goodra vs dragalge debate, the whole point of having only 5 mons up for debate per week appears to be to focus our efforts and actually get stuff changed in an efficient manner...

That said, here are my thoughts for this week:

Yanmega can stay in B, see my earlier post

Thundy-t comes with the opportunity cost of not using the incarnate form (as discussed above), should move to B

Volc on fire should be an easy A, and seems to be the general consensus anyway

Jirachi to A I'm having trouble with, as it is a great Pokemon but there is already such fierce competition for teamslots on psy and mega Medicham already gives fairies lots of trouble w/ fake out / bullet punch. Ultimately could go either way

Mega gallade is still a dangerous mon and deserves nothing less than A (and is certainly better than jirachi). The fact that you can't run another mega sucks, but if you can get your SD in you are usually golden and is psychic's best set up mon. Also for those complaining about the psy vs poison matchup, gallade is the best mega overall as you get psycho cut, fighting moves for the poison/darks and shadow sneak which destroys gengar after rocks and seriously dents scolipede (snag an extra SD on the predicted 1st turn protect). You also aren't weak to poison moves like mega gardevoir, and sit at a way better speed tier than both mega gardevoir and mega Cham who are always forced to run from gengar
 
#24
Alright some quick updates to VR I added
  • Added a blacklist to prevent some shitposting mainly with lower tier types and niche Pokemon that were issues in previous thread
  • New VR council member will be added shortly once I find a person that I think will do a job as well as very knowledgeable
  • Adding 3 to 5 Pokemon Rank discussions for controversial Pokemon every 1 or 2 weeks to make VR more organized and direct while also giving controversial Pokemon the best possible rank
Ranking Discussion Week #1
(Psychic) A--->B
(Psychic) B--->A
(Flying) A--->B
(Bug) B--->A
(Fire) B--->A
Change(s)
C--->D- It's just bad outclassed by everything on fairy nothing much to say it's just outclassed and hard to fit on fairy team.
I've been meaning to put my thoughts out about this. I agree with everything, except Volcanion. I don't see tbh why that wouldn't be S ranked. Fire now has a reliable check to Azumarill (even when Belly Drummed), and a Water Absorber in general. It's versatile, being able to effectively run Specs, Scarf, or AV sets (I've personally been loving Scarf, seen as it can check Mega Diancie). Zard Y has been the only S ranked mon since forever on Fire, I think Volcanion is up to par with it.

While I'm at it, I'd also like to suggest Infernape for S rank (Fire). Like Volcanion, it can check rock, its absurdly versatile, and can use a variety of coverage attacks to fit the needs of a team (ex: HP Ice for Dragon/Garchomp/Landorus, Thunder Punch for Gyarados, Stone Edge for Dnite/Gyarados, Grass Knot, ect). Not to mention, awesome mixed attacker with a pretty good Speed Tier to back it up. I think it should be considered at the very least.

Meloetta A --> S Rank on Psychic



Meloetta has a very unique typing being Normal and Psychic as well as very good stats and moves. Why I think it should be S rank is because its ability to wall or deal with most, if not all, high ranked Pokemon in the Ghost rankings. As a ghost user, Meloetta is such a difficult Pokemon to deal with. An assault vest set is very annoying to Ghost users in general because Ghost has one or two viable physical attackers. Meloetta also has the ability to turn into a fast, physical threat to Dark teams and Ghost teams with Relic Song + Close Combat and Knock Off. In my opinion, Meloetta plays a very important role on Psychic type teams and deserves to be S rank.

Jynx D --> C Rank on Ice



Jynx (F) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Lovely Kiss
- Ice Beam
- Psyshock / Psychic
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Even though Jynx seems to be bad or not useful, she can actually be quite a threat. Jynx is fast and can revenge kill especially with a focus sash. She can live a hit from Scizor's Bullet Punch and return with an HP Fire. Psychic STAB on Ice also becomes very handy since Ice is weak to Fighting. Putting something to sleep is also great to have since Jynx is pretty fast. All in all, I don't think Jynx deserves D rank on Ice; she actually has a lot of uses.
Disagree with Meloetta. Yea, it's a great Ghost immunity, but Ghost is extremely redundant as a type now (unfortunately), and it's very rare to see Ghost coverage. Even if, Hoopa-U can easily siwtch into those types of attacks thanks to its part Dark typing, and awesome natural special defense. It's A at the very best, if not B.

As for Jynx, TheThorn used a successful team with it that made Top 10 on the ladder way back when. It can help vs Fighting, and even set up Trick Room (great way to abuse Mega Aboma). I'd be alright with it C ranked.
 

Vid

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#25
Discussion #2
(Dark) B--->A
(Water) A--->B
(Steel) B--->A
(Dragon) B--->A
(Fighting) S--->A
Discussion #1 Change(s)
(Psyshic) A-->B - Has such a high opportunity cost and is not the greatest mega on Psyshic
(Psyshic) B--->A- Good Stealth Rocker and good fairy check. It also can run Choice Scarf and has Healing Wish
(Flying) A--->B Same reason as Gallade but not being able to use incarnate form
(Bug) Stays B- Way too controversial to change
(Fire) B--->A- B was placeholder Rank and now A seems nice seeing how it has fit into the metagame

Other Change(s)
(Grass) Unranked--->C- It's not that bad has Wil-o-Wisp and can block Rapid Spins it's alright
(Ice) D--->C- It's a decent suicide lead and summons hail
(Ice) C--->B- Both Megas on Ice should be same rank
(Ice) D--->C Was a change before just didn't get applied
(Bug) Unranked--->C- Durant is fast and can pick off some threats Omega's post says it all
 
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