Moonlit Kiss

MythTrainerInfinity

MythTrainerInfinity

Yes, a Psycho Shift/Stalk/Flame Orb Cresselia team... or not...

Metagross @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 108 HP/196 Atk/204 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Meteor Mash
- Ice Punch
- Explosion
- Earthquake

373 spd revenge killer. Awesome to take on SD garchomps too.

Machamp (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 HP/108 Atk/114 Def/32 SDef
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Bulk Up
- Dynamicpunch
- Ice Punch
- Stone Edge

Added Defense EVs, so that it gets multiplied with Bulk Ups.

Cresselia (F) @ Flame Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP/136 Def/120 SDef
Calm nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Psycho Shift
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Grass Knot

Psycho Mix Cresselia. Tyranitar hates this thing. I like to first test with GK on a non threatening poke to make sure Hera doesn't come in and rape. Once I hit something with a burn I stall with Restalk. Grass Knot hits everything not named Shedinja and has better PP than its other decent fourth slot options. Burning stuff often times helps Machamp come in too. Added more Def for stuff.

Togekiss (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 228 HP/252 Def/28 SDef
Calm nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Secret Power
- Air Slash
- Roost
- Nasty Plot

With para on board... 69% and the opponent does nothing in a turn (that's taking into consideration if Air Slash misses). It has the potential to kill everything. Calm allows it to have one more Special Defense point.

Zapdos @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 188 HP/148 Spd/172 SAtk
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Thunderbolt
- Roost
- Roar

Garchomps run way more than 303 speed, so why try to force Zappy to out run it? This is slightly tweaked from my advance set in terms of EVs. 368 > 352 HP = more Leftovers and Roost recovery. Still does a little less than 40% to Celebis.

Blissey (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SDef
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Seismic Toss
- Aromatherapy
- Softboiled
- Toxic

So I heard Toxic Blissey destroys special sweepers.

C&C appreciated.

The biggest thing I seem to have problems with is Celebi and Ttar on the same team. Stealth Rock is annoying, but statusing all of the opposing pokes is much more annoying.

Currently testing instead of Cresselia.
Mommy Dearest (Vaporeon) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP/200 Def/56 SDef
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Baton Pass
- Wish
- Surf
- Acid Armor
 
Hello Myth. ;]

lol I guess i'll be the 1st to actually replay to this...

Theres not much to say to this team, it IS a very solid team. The only thing i'd like to say is that maybe you should go more "in deph" with your team EV's. Like, what EV's survives what, kills what, and outspeeds what...
 
Hello Myth, you don't actually know me but w/e lol.
I played you not too long ago on Shoddy and as Bolt stated it IS a very solid team, so if you could go more into the EV's and whatnot it would help us give some suggestions because this is, quite simply, the type of team that any real suggestions are going to be over small stipulations on things like EV spreads. It has no glaring weaknesses, so you have to give us something to tell you about it :P
 
extremely scary team, if a little hera weak... how does togekiss handle him?
overbulky np topgekiss is an extremely cool set that i'd love to try.
i might max attack on gross tbh, since he's your main form of non setup needing offense

the status being spread by cress and bliss seems like it might interfere with togekiss haxing shit up. also i dont like your cress >:) I'd replace it with a semi reliable switch into hera, or something that can SR. gliscor gives you too much ice weak though.. maybe weezing or a bulky ghost or bulk up toxicraok!
 
I played this just last night with my Marowak team. I had an advantage as I still remember this team...you've been using it for months now, I don't know how you do it. I change teams every other day. :X

I was a little shocked to see that Cresselia's only attack was Grass Knot, and that it dealt a paltry 7% to Mismagius - are you sure that is the best option? I mean, it does nothing to Heracross, Gengar, Infernape or other threats. You're hitting Tyranitar, but I'll bet it's a 3-4HKO at best against him.

Skarmory walls everyone except Zapdos pretty convincingly. I think CB Hera over Machamp would be a good investment, as it would also lessen your Tyranitar/Celebi woes, not to mention 2HKO Skarm and Hippowdon.
 
Aww you want me to spell it all out for you?

Well one of the advantages of this particular Cress is you get more PP to do whatever with and in the case of a stall war she'll outlast the opponent. Its fun to harass Milotics who think that they've gained the upper hand since you've burned them.

I figure its not about making something powerful enough to maul everything down, but more or less have everyone work as a team together. Celebi and Tyranitar cannot come in on anyone and not expect to take heavy damage or a status.

Okay, the EVs... well uh... I haven't done too many calcs for it to be honest...

Metagross has just enough speed to outrun Jolly Dugtrio, which is a rarity, but it is nice to strike first against the Adamant Weaviles. Really punishes non-Sashed/Scarfed Alakazam, Gengar, Infernape, etc. leads. I would pull it out against Arcanine and Gyarados, however.

Notice how none of these pokés have a quadruple weakness to something. The metagame is so focused on beating Celebi, Ttar, Garchomp, etc., that I figure this team will last longer without any surprise exploits of a quad weakness. 95% of the time Machamp takes down Gliscor. Plus... No Guard renders Snow Hide and Sand Veil useless.

Vs. Leads:

Gyarados: After one DD it can rid the world of Zapdos with one Stone Edge, so I usually will send out Togekiss. When Gyara thinks its going to T-Wave and decides to Taunt I hit it with a Body Slam and Gyara goes in a mad rush to try to kill it. I usually can get at least 2 Body Slams in fairly safely. That's a 84% chance of para by the end of the second Body Slam (over 90% after the third one). Activate Flinchhax machine and usually Gyarados is done, if your opponent doesn't have Taunt, well then... You can sneak in a Nasty Plot.

Gengar and Alakazam: Unless these to have an uncanny amount of HP/Def or holds a Sash or a Scarf they are forced to switch out.

If I predict Hypnosis coming from Gengar, I switch to Cress and if I suspect Choice Scarf/Specs on a Trick Alakazam I switch to Zapdos, which makes it into an awesome killing machine.

Weavile: If your opp leads with one of these you can be pretty sure its Sashed or they have some sort of death wish.

Be careful of Counter with the above three. I like to throw a burn/some poison their way if I get afraid of them being Sashed. Use Earthquake if you are weary of Magnezone.

Infernape: If your opponent is actually good there's a high chance you won't get to KO the ape so early...Watch out for the Sash. I switch to Cresselia or Togekiss and typically and see what item they have. i can then hax them into submission, go to Blissey to take the Fire attack to get Meta back in for a safer KO or status/stall it with Cress. Its awesome to play Russian Roulette with Sleep Talk. Nobody knows what you will do and neither do you, so they usually play it safe and Nasty Plot or get that Ape out of there.

Tyranitar: EQ or MM, choose your punishment.

Hippowdon: Send in Cresselia, Machamp, or Togekiss and if you use Cress, don't be afraid to pitch PS right off the bat... There's no way Heracross would want to deal with all of that because Hera can only be used once or twice before the bug faints.

Bronzong: I typically switch to Cresselia and see if they use Hypnosis or Stealth Rock. She then can try to throw whatever status she has back at the opponent. If I want to try the safer route I switch to Machamp and Dpunch and Bulk Up.

Ninjask: Kids, this is why its vital to have a decent phazer on the team (Zapdos).

Yanmega: Unless the bug has a Scarf on it Metagross will strike first, which they usually will use Protect. Its a high risk/reward to keep Gross in on the first turn though. I switch to Zappy or Cresselia to take the Hypnosis usually. Yanmega can kill Gross in two hits, don't bother with it with Gross, unless you like playing mind games like I do.

Abomasnow: Meteor Mash does it in pretty nicely.

Roserade: Launch an Ice Punch and you'll know exactly what this thing holds. If it is Scarfed that's a 25% chance of KOing it right off the bat, since they like putting things to sleep. So, keeping Gross in is a good investment.

Jolteon: EQ and they have to run Timid or they die.

Breloom: Ice Punch and it shouldn't be able to set up a Sub.

Crobat: Switch to Cresselia for the Hypnosis (and then to Togekiss or Zapdos) or get U-Turned, if the latter you'll get burned after the new poke is sent in, so that'll allow you for more set up time.

Ambipom: I usually let Gross take the Fake Out and bite a good 50-80% out of the monkey when its U-Turning. If Amby is Orbed, well those two turns are all it should be able to handle.

Metagross: Cresselia or Zapdos for burning or killing. I typically use Cress because Cress can take a bit more if they try to be smart and Ice Punch me.

Azelf: This thing is annoying, but it has a hard time killing something on this team without exploding. Switch to Blissey or Cress (Cress really helps if you can burn it, so Explosion does not so much). If you don't see that Orb, then you can Toxic it with Blissey and feel pretty safe. 95% of the time these guys will be packing a Fire attack, so its wise to get Metagross out of there.

Heracross: Metagross can attack it without worrying about being OHKOed back. If Cross is Scarfed and uses CC then Gross can OHKO the bug with MM.

Swampert: Cresselia with Grass Knot or set up fodder for Togekiss/Machamp, it won't do really more than 45% to Togekiss unless its a really weird set.

Forretress: Instantly send out Machamp, no questiones asked. This might lay some Toxic Spikes down, so while its focusing on that and if you're a bit lucky you can pump Machamp up enough to 6-0.

Zapdos: People say Blissey sucks against it, but its not like Zapdos does anything back. As a lead expect a Sub or U-Turn, so Blissey takes that well.

Togekiss: Anything except Togekiss or Machamp is a good choice here.

When someone sends out their SR poke to do its dirty work I have a variety of options here:

Donphan, I can pretty much switch to anybody not named Metagross and waste it. If it is the large mudfish I tend to switch to Machamp if I'm feelin' a bit risky, but setting up a Bulk Up right under its confused nose is fun.

Cresselia can survive pretty well with that much Def and with burns she gives everyone defense that a Milotic would be jealous of. Just be careful and test out GK if you're worried about guts pokes.

Hah, this is just the beginning of my analysis. Seriosusly, I could go into about 10 pages worth of dicussion of this team and I've been up for a good 27 hours straight right now.

Just ask if you got a question or would like me to explain something specific because if I type something that's too long... Nobody's going to read it.
 
I do not like the idea of Psycho Shift Burn Orb Cresselia. It should never catch any Tyranitars unless they have no choice to take the Burn, as the "Cresselia got a Burn from the Flame Orb" message ruins the set. Plus, Cress dies faster to Sandstorm. The only thing Psycho Shift is notable at is transferring sleep over to the opponent, and the only reason why this idea was ever successful is that people often don't notice that Cress got burned.
 
Shifting a burn is one of the few ways to give someone a burn without running the risk of activating Flash Fire on things like Heatran.

Well that's why you always gotta predict. I try to look in the very least 5-10 moves ahead once I get an idea of my opponent's team. It works as a great psychological trick too. I mean who's going to want to get their Ttar burned?

Have you tested the Psycho Mix set out, Jibaku?
 
i just played you nice team but i would change a few things
MythTrainerInfinity said:
Yes, a Psycho Shift/Stalk/Flame Orb Cresselia team...

Metagross @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 108 HP/196 Atk/204 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Meteor Mash
- Ice Punch
- Explosion
- Earthquake

373 spd revenge killer. Awesome to take on SD garchomps too.

i think adamant would be better

Machamp (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 HP/108 Atk/114 Def/32 SDef
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Bulk Up
- Dynamicpunch
- Ice Punch
- Stone Edge

Added Defense EVs, so that it gets multiplied with Bulk Ups.

definitely a scary sweeper that kills gliscors maybe shift some defense to more attack ev's try bullet punch on him too maybe

Cresselia (F) @ Flame Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP/136 Def/120 SDef
Calm nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Psycho Shift
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Grass Knot

Psycho Mix Cresselia. Tyranitar hates this thing. I like to first test with GK on a non threatening poke to make sure Hera doesn't come in and rape. Once I hit something with a burn I stall with Restalk. Grass Knot hits everything not named Shedinja and has better PP than its other decent fourth slot options. Burning stuff often times helps Machamp come in too. Added more Def for stuff.

i just think psychic would be needed for infernapes

Togekiss (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 228 HP/252 Def/28 SDef
Calm nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Body Slam
- Air Slash
- Roost
- Nasty Plot

With para on board... 69% and the opponent does nothing in a turn (that's taking into consideration if Air Slash misses). It has the potential to kill everything. Calm allows it to have one more Special Defense point.

thunder wave over body slam for guaranteed para its not doing much damage anyway besides paralyzing grounds its just inferior to t-wave

Zapdos @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 188 HP/148 Spd/172 SAtk
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Thunderbolt
- Roost
- Roar

Garchomps run way more than 303 speed, so why try to force Zappy to out run it? This is slightly tweaked from my advance set in terms of EVs. 368 > 352 HP = more Leftovers and Roost recovery. Still does a little less than 40% to Celebis.

you dont need roar except for ninjask try out toxic,t-wave or metal sound.A more bulky spread might be useful too

Blissey (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SDef
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Seismic Toss
- Aromatherapy
- Softboiled
- Toxic

So I heard Toxic Blissey destroys special sweepers.

aroma isnt needed too much.I would put a special attack like ice beam or flamethrower

C&C appreciated.

The biggest thing I seem to have problems with is Celebi and Ttar on the same team. Stealth Rock is annoying, but statusing all of the opposing pokes is much more annoying.
Click to expand...
 
I'm not sure on this, but I think that Togekiss isn't legal. Body Slam is an advance move tutor move, while Nasty Plot is an egg move in D/P.

So you're probably going to have to go with TWave.
 
I have Jolly to take out some faster stuff, Gross can't get to 373 speed with Adamant, plus neutral speed base 130s could outrun it then.

Where would Bullet Punch fit on that Machamp? It'd lose a lot of killing potential if I changed a move to that, to be honest.

GK hits things like Swamperts, Donphans, and Hippowdons. I don't really like Psychic's PP compared to GK though. The fact that nothing is completely immune to grass moves does marginally help against other things. When Ttar sees Psychic that shouts free switch-in. With GK it thinks twice.

Secret Power isn't affected by Taunt, so I can still rip apart Gyarados leads, that's one of the purposes of that Kiss.

Zapdos having Roar helps it against other pokes that try to set up against it.

I tell people status and crippling is the basis of ruling the D/P metagame. I definately need Aroma, helps Cress wake up to be a pyromanic.

Well, thanks anyway.

Edit: Hey I remember you from that other forum.

Ah, ninja posted. OH CRAP... Yeah it is illegal. Well, uh... If I recall correctly Secret Power has the same effect as Body Slam under player v. player battle situations. So I can use that.
 
Well that's why you always gotta predict. I try to look in the very least 5-10 moves ahead once I get an idea of my opponent's team. It works as a great psychological trick too. I mean who's going to want to get their Ttar burned?
Click to expand...
See, it works very much like this.

Cress switches in on a CBQuake
blah blah
Then it says "Cresselia got a Burn from the Flame Orb"

Now, at this point, who would switch TTar into Cress in the fear of burn? They'd switch into their status absorber, who is more often than not be able to absorb Grass Knot (other Cressies, Zapdos, Heatran (who I don't think Psycho Shift even works against, correct me if I'm wrong.), Heracross) and take the Psycho Shift and doesn't care. Obviously, Cress is gonna have Psycho Shift, otherwise simply burning yourself to fake the opponent is just lol.
 
Jibaku said:
See, it works very much like this.

Cress switches in on a CBQuake
blah blah
Click to expand...


Or something like this.

t-tar or weavile switch into cresselia to try to pursuit rap it
t-tar or weavile get burned

kinda situational but still useable.
 
t-tar or weavile switch into cresselia to try to pursuit rap it
t-tar or weavile get burned
Click to expand...
me said:
Then it says "Cresselia got a Burn from the Flame Orb"
Click to expand...
Why would they switch in Vile or Tar when that happens?

It says that on the screen when it happens. If you're playing on WiFi, you'll see both the burn and item activation animation that gives it away for those who don't read text.

This -can- catch your opponent off guard only IF Cress gets burned by the opponent, as self-burning breaks it.
 
Status absorber could only be their Blissey, then I send in Machamp. Point is... Ttar is going to have a hard time switching in without getting statused/KOed.

Or if it is something else it I can just switch to something that'll treat it like set up fodder.

There's a lot of psychological tricks I get to play with this team.
 
Blissey isn't exactly a status absorber. Some teams carry Sleep Talkers to take on Sleep and such.

Now, unless you'll be Psycho Shifting all the time, you're at the risk of TTar coming in and busting up your move anyways. What I mean is that anytime you decide to use anything but Psycho Shift, TTar could come in and mindgame with Cress...whether Cress decides to stay to try and burn Tar, but then dying to CBCrunch, or Cress switching out and then dying into a Pursuit. While it does give more of an advantage against TTar, Burn + Sandstorm can hurt in the long run, and something that's already burned doesn't get affected by Psycho Shift, meaning that Cress is forced to Rest against them (if GK doesn't do much to them), making it vulnerable to TTar, unless you managed to PS the sleep on him, and that's a 33% chance, and Sleep Clause can run over that if you've slept somebody.

Essentially, you'll be taking 18% damage per turn, while the opponent takes 12%.

I could be wrong on the PS mechanics, though, but I'm assuming transferring status on something that can't be statused doesn't seem to work. Considering the description says that the status thingy transfers if you do have one and the opponent doesn't...
 
If Cress puts something to Sleep another one of my pokes usually should be able take it unless I'm unlucky.

Using Psycho Shift cures the user of its current status. Flame Orb has a priority after a burn takes its 12% toll, so yeah if you Shift the burn you don't take damage from burns unles your opponent burns you during that turn...

Sleep Talk still has the 1/3 chance of picking GK, which should do around 24-30% on the standard Ttars... Ttar can't keep switching in on that too, so provided I didn't put something to sleep before it comes in while Cress is sleeping that's a 2/3 chance I hit it with a move it won't want.

This team seems pretty much relying on a lot of chance, but the truth is, I still try to make things tilt in my probably favor. Playing mind games is really fun though.

One could also switch Cress in when a Fire move is used, which is even more fun.

Another advantage of using that Cress is I get to control what kind of status I want her to have. After using PS there is less than a one turn interval where she can get statused by something else other than a burn.
 
Epic thread bump. I've decided to try Vaporeon instead of Cressy, it'll still do the job and Gross will actually be able to recover HP for once.

Mommy Dearest (Vaporeon) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP/200 Def/56 SDef
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Baton Pass
- Wish
- Surf
- Acid Armor
 
Holy Shit Why did you bump this?! I don't think the change is that significant. Good on sticking with this team though. Anyway I liked cressy more and I think you could have just stuck wish on togekiss for metagross.
 
KinglerDude24 said:
Holy Shit Why did you bump this?! I don't think the change is that significant. Good on sticking with this team though. Anyway I liked cressy more and I think you could have just stuck wish on togekiss for metagross.
Click to expand...
Cresselia was the core feature of this team. Vaporeon can now heal stuff AND pass Acid Armor to Togekiss and such I mean...
With that in mind that makes it really hard for Tyrannitar to do much.
 
Well you can try a Baton Pass strategy then with Vappy and Kiss. Basically acid armor and wishpass to kiss. then nasty plot and sub/wish to a special blissey. this could maybe sweep teams. A blissey with +4-+6 defense would be murder.
 
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