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New and "creative" moveset/EV spread thread "Mark 2"

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Why is everyone suddenly stealing the best avatar on smogon? Also, you forgot to write "maybe someday" with terrible childish handwriting, silly.

Ha, it's mostly luck that I've been experimenting with him. I was looking for Stealth Rock / Explosion users that weren't weak to SS that could beat Azelf and Aerodactyl offensively, and I got him as the only result that could take on both. From there I'm like "hey his typing rocks I should work with that" and I theorymonned that set.

With better Special Defense and (now) access to Earth Power, this may be more up Lunatone's alley, by the way.
 


199-m.png




" Its 'Me First' effective "
Slowking @ Leftovers
Trait: Oblivious/Own tempo
EVs: 252 HP / 58 Def / 200 Spd - 0 Spe IV
Sassy Nature
- Trick Room
- Slack Off
- Me First
- Skill Swap/ Psychic/ Surf /Substitute

I've used this on a Trickroom/Sandstorm-team that I thought first as a gimmick team but then I realized that it actually worked much better than i tought .

The idée is to use this as a Tank that set up Trick Room. And on the 2nd turn u switch to something that can abuse Trick Room (Rypherior comes to mind) or if the opponets attack did less than 50% use Slack Off and wait for the opponents next move or if u know he/she will attack abuse Me First as u will now attack first with opponents attack x1.5 (Free STAB?).
Skill Swap is mostly filler that can be replaced with any good attacking move to make sure u always are able to attack if u want. But I like to be able to take Jolteons Volt absorb to be able to switch in easier on electric moves, or to take any other good abilitys or to cripple the opponent by taking thier.
This thing works great aginst things like Starmie that will attack u with moves it self are week to i.e. Thunderbolt. A modest Maxed SpA Stamie can't even kill it with even with two Thunderbolts (Maybe if Starmie had Choice Specs, but with leftovers Slowking would probobly survive). And the Me First will allways 2HKO it and have big possibility to kill with one hit and some resudial damage from SR/spikes or LO.

I haven't done any big calculating because I am not really sure what I should compare with. Because with this I have killed such a range of diffrent things Starmie, Lucario and even Weavile.

Any comments or critique?
Iam quite new here and this is my first post in this thread
 
Physical Choice Azelf?
Item: Choice Scarff
Nature: Naughty
EVs: 168 Spe, 252 Atk, 90 SpA
~ U-Turn
~ Explosion
~ Zen Headbutt
~ Fire Blast

U-Turn for Weavile, Deoxy-S, Explosion for Blissey (or just Zen Headbutt), Fire Blast for Skarmory. Zen Headbutt is some nice STAB. It'll be your main tool once the walls and counters are gone. Hondoom is still a problem, but at least you can flee with U-Turn for some nice damage. This thing is gold on paper:

Fire Blast on 252/0 Skarmory: Damage: 99.40% - 117.07% (Garunteed OHKO after SR damage)
Fire Blast on 252/96 Bronzong: Damage: 59.76% - 70.12% (2HKO)
Fire Blast on 252/0 Tangrowth: Damage: 106.19% - 125.00% (OHKO)
U-Turn on Hasty 0/0 Deoxy-S: Damage: 131.54% - 154.77% (OHKO)
U-Turn on 6/0 Weavile: Damage: 82.98% - 97.52% (OHKO after SR damage)
Zen Headbutt on 0/252 Blissey: Damage: 42.70% - 50.23% (Not that impressive, but Explosion will kill)

More later (school now)! Haven't tried it yet, if anyone wants to go ahead!
 
Petope said:


199-m.png




" Its 'Me First' effective "
Slowking @ Leftovers
Trait: Oblivious/Own tempo
EVs: 252 HP / 58 Def / 200 Spd - 0 Spe IV
Sassy Nature
- Trick Room
- Slack Off
- Me First
- Skill Swap/ Psychic/ Surf /Substitute

I've used this on a Trickroom/Sandstorm-team that I thought first as a gimmick team but then I realized that it actually worked much better than i tought .

The idée is to use this as a Tank that set up Trick Room. And on the 2nd turn u switch to something that can abuse Trick Room (Rypherior comes to mind) or if the opponets attack did less than 50% use Slack Off and wait for the opponents next move or if u know he/she will attack abuse Me First as u will now attack first with opponents attack x1.5 (Free STAB?).
Skill Swap is mostly filler that can be replaced with any good attacking move to make sure u always are able to attack if u want. But I like to be able to take Jolteons Volt absorb to be able to switch in easier on electric moves, or to take any other good abilitys or to cripple the opponent by taking thier.
This thing works great aginst things like Starmie that will attack u with moves it self are week to i.e. Thunderbolt. A modest Maxed SpA Stamie can't even kill it with even with two Thunderbolts (Maybe if Starmie had Choice Specs, but with leftovers Slowking would probobly survive). And the Me First will allways 2HKO it and have big possibility to kill with one hit and some resudial damage from SR/spikes or LO.

I haven't done any big calculating because I am not really sure what I should compare with. Because with this I have killed such a range of diffrent things Starmie, Lucario and even Weavile.

Any comments or critique?
Iam quite new here and this is my first post in this thread
Click to expand...

To be honest in the current metagame I'd rather use Slowbro for this job as it gives you a chance to counter DD / Outrage Salamence. Using a 252 HP / 76 Atk / 180 Def spread, a +1 LO Outrage does 92% maximum, whilst Me First does a minimum of 82% to a 4/0 Salamence after Trick Room, enough to always KO after 3 Sandstorm hits. If you're using Stealth Rock early game though you could probably ignore the Attack EVs and just concentrate on bulk for more assurance. Ice Beam could also be an option in the last slot for the rare bulky Leftovers DD Mence that gets greedy with more than one DD.
 
Nothing in the OP mentioned anything about Battler Tower movesets so I don't know if this is appropriate or not.

Infernape: Battle Tower lead
Ability: Blaze
Nature: Naive/hasty
Item: Life orb
EVs: 0/252/0/20/0/236
- Close combat
- Overheat
- U-turn
- Fake out

Fake out (turn 1) brings many Pokemon into KO range for one of Ape's excellent STAB attacks. It handily ruins focus sash as well. Overheat is more accurate and more powerful than fire blast, and does not suffer from recoil like flare blitz. U-turn is here if you cannot KO on turn 2 or cannot OHKO the new Pokemon on turn 3. Repeatedly abusing life orb with fake out/u-turn quickly brings blaze into play as well. The EVs let it hit 173 speed at level 50 with a 31 IV, thus beating +speed 105 base and neutral 120 base Pokemon who max out at 172.

I thought up this moveset because Infernape fails with anything else in Battle Tower. Nothing else with fake out can boast double 120/140 base STAB attacks with such good attacking stats and speed.
 
MetaNite said:
Physical Choice Azelf?
Item: Choice Scarff
Nature: Naughty
EVs: 168 Spe, 252 Atk, 90 SpA
~ U-Turn
~ Explosion
~ Zen Headbutt
~ Fire Blast

Fire Blast on 252/0 Skarmory: Damage: 99.40% - 117.07% (Garunteed OHKO after SR damage)
Fire Blast on 252/96 Bronzong: Damage: 59.76% - 70.12% (2HKO)
Fire Blast on 252/0 Tangrowth: Damage: 106.19% - 125.00% (OHKO)
U-Turn on Hasty 0/0 Deoxy-S: Damage: 131.54% - 154.77% (OHKO)
U-Turn on 6/0 Weavile: Damage: 82.98% - 97.52% (OHKO after SR damage)
Zen Headbutt on 0/252 Blissey: Damage: 42.70% - 50.23% (Not that impressive, but Explosion will kill)

More later (school now)! Haven't tried it yet, if anyone wants to go ahead!
Click to expand...

This looks like it's pretty awful on anything that's not weak to Fire and has any physical bulk to speak of. Heatran, for example. Salamence. Cresselia. Fuck, Thick Fat Hariyama beats it. It's a gimmick that deals with "counters" that Azelf could already deal with.
 
Chris is me said:
This looks like it's pretty awful on anything that's not weak to Fire and has any physical bulk to speak of. Heatran, for example. Salamence. Cresselia. Fuck, Thick Fat Hariyama beats it. It's a gimmick that deals with "counters" that Azelf could already deal with.
Click to expand...

You talk as if Fire Blast is the only move on the set. Quite how Hariyama beats anything with STAB Zen Headbutt and 383 Attack is beyond me. Any Cresselia switching in risks a U-Turn which does a chunk of damage and could end up facing a Pursuiter, whilst Heatran, Tyranitar and others can be dealt with using U-Turn + Dugtrio support.

U-Turn on 6/0 Weavile: Damage: 82.98% - 97.52% (OHKO after SR damage)
Click to expand...

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think on Shoddy Pursuit goes first against U-Turn for maximum power regardless of speed, so it'll only be useful against switch-ins. Fire Blast would be the better option otherwise.
 
McGraw said:
Infernape: Battle Tower lead
Ability: Blaze
Nature: Naive/hasty
Item: Life orb
EVs: 0/252/0/20/0/236
- Close combat
- Overheat
- U-turn
- Fake out
Click to expand...

Fake Out Ape does indeed work wonders in the BT (http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1306695&postcount=509). I found Focus Sash to be useful, even though there's a loss of power, as random natures sometimes mean Ape doesn't outspeed something it 'should', and its frail defences mean it can get very killed very quickly. Using U-Turn to escape the stat drops from CC and Overheat is neat, as is using Life Orb to activate Blaze.
 
deuteronopia said:
Fake Out Ape does indeed work wonders in the BT (http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1306695&postcount=509). I found Focus Sash to be useful, even though there's a loss of power, as random natures sometimes mean Ape doesn't outspeed something it 'should', and its frail defences mean it can get very killed very quickly. Using U-Turn to escape the stat drops from CC and Overheat is neat, as is using Life Orb to activate Blaze.
Click to expand...

Cool, I should have figured the idea was too good not to have popped up somewhere before =] I searched this thread for Infernape, but not the BT thread.

Regarding your original: I suppose the situation is different because you were trying the Wifi tower, which is more likely to have +speed Pokemon; I think life orb would be optimal in the normal tower. I also considered thunderpunch, but figured it really only covers water/psychic and water/flying Pokemon. U-turn doesn't let Slowbro/King hit you =]
 
Chris is me said:
This looks like it's pretty awful on anything that's not weak to Fire and has any physical bulk to speak of. Heatran, for example. Salamence. Cresselia. Fuck, Thick Fat Hariyama beats it. It's a gimmick that deals with "counters" that Azelf could already deal with.
Click to expand...

STAB Zen Headbutt with flinch is nothing to laugh at. Think Gallade... Messed up Fire Blast calcz, nothing major. Heres more:

Fire Blast on 252/0 Skarmory Damage: 90.72% - 106.89% (OHKO with SR)
Fire Blast on 252/96 Bronzong Damage: 54.44% - 64.20% (2HKO)
Fire Blast on 252/0 Tangrowth Damage: 96.78% - 114.11% (Garunteed OHKO with SR)
Fire Blast on 252/162 Forretress Damage: 153.95% - 181.36% (OHKO, lol)
U-Turn on Hasty 0/0 Deoxy-S: Damage: 131.54% - 154.77% (OHKO)
U-Turn on 6/0 Weavile: Damage: 82.98% - 97.52% (OHKO after SR damage)
U-Turn on 252/0 Tyranitar Damage: 37.87% - 44.55% (Wear 'em down)
Zen Headbutt on 0/252 Blissey: Damage: 42.70% - 50.23% (2HKO after SR)
Zen Headbutt on 252/252 Hariyama Damage: 61.99% - 72.97% (2HKO, not a counter)
Explosion on 20/0 Heatran Damage: 84.45% - 99.39% (Likely OHKO with SR)
U-Turn to 20/252 Cressalia Damage: 30.05% - 35.49% (not impressive)

Basically it kills it's counters, revenge kills, and sweeps some-what. It outspeeds jolly ninjask making it pretty awesome in my opinion. Heatran is still a problem, but is against any Azelf. Anyone wanna' test?

EDIT: Choice Band is a good option actually, if you're not worried about Weavile. Ice Punch could work too.
 
Anti-Scizor
212.png

Scizor@LO
Technician
brave/lonenly 252 on both attacks 6hp
-Hp fire 60
-superpower
-u-turn
-bullet punch
This set offers quiet the surprise, it OHKOs opposing scizor or fortress with an amazing hp fire that has 90bp after technician (the ivs for it:28/28/29/30/31/28). It can surely 2HKO skarm, but I need some one to do some calc for me. U-turn for the obvius reason and superpower for snorlax, tyranitar and luke(who would come in to resist u-turn) and also for coverage. Bullet punch because it's awesome. Super power can OHKO ttar and snorlax, u-turn can do about 50% to cress.
 
1234gjy said:
Anti-Scizor
212.png

Scizor@LO
Technician
brave/lonenly 252 on both attacks 6hp
-Hp fire 60
-superpower
-u-turn
-bullet punch
This set offers quiet the surprise, it OHKOs opposing scizor or fortress with an amazing hp fire that has 90bp after technician (the ivs for it:28/28/29/30/31/28). It can surely 2HKO skarm, but I need some one to do some calc for me. U-turn for the obvius reason and superpower for snorlax, tyranitar and luke(who would come in to resist u-turn) and also for coverage. Bullet punch because it's awesome. Super power can OHKO ttar and snorlax, u-turn can do about 50% to cress.
Click to expand...

Only 156 EVs are required for a guaranteed 2HKO on 252 / 0 Skarmory factoring in Lefties, but currently outruns you, so the remainder is well worth investing in speed. You can go up to 200 EVs to always 2HKO the 12 / 0 ScarfGross that is very popular at the moment, and still have enough EVs left over for 177 speed, which sits conveniently above Skarmory. Take 12 Evs from Attack and you can outrun neutral nature Shedinja.

EDIT: Never mind, missed that for some reason.
 
I also need a way to hit zapdos hard on that scizor, or zapdos just comes in without shit done to it.
Lemmiwinks MkII said:
Only 156 EVs are required for a guaranteed 2HKO on 252 / 0 Skarmory factoring in Lefties, but currently outruns you, so the remainder is well worth investing in speed. You can go up to 200 EVs to always 2HKO the 12 / 0 ScarfGross that is very popular at the moment, and still have enough EVs left over for 177 speed, which sits conveniently above Skarmory. Take 12 Evs from Attack and you can outrun neutral nature Shedinja.
Click to expand...
But what nature should it be?
 
Well, here's just some random set I made up for Infernape with the new Platinum updates.

Infernape @ Life Orb
Timid or Hasty///Blaze
252 Sp.Atk/252 Spd/6 HP
~Nasty Plot
~Flamethrower
~Vacuum Wave
~HP Ice/Grass Knot/Close Combat

Here, Nasty Plot up on something that is most likely to switch. From here on, you can Flamethrower away for nice STAB while killing your HP in hope to be alive to use Blaze XD. You use Vacuum Wave for things like Mamo/Lucario who may try to Shard/ES your sweep into oblivion. Also VW can be used to destroy things with low HP. Now, last moveslot can be tough. Close Combat can help VS Blissey so she can't wall your sweep, but lowers coverage. HP Ice can help you vs. Salamence, Gliscor and other things frail to Ice. While Grass Knot helps you against the likes of Swampert/Hippo and other Water types, ground types, rock types, or just things plain heavy.
 
Just personally, my scizor uses a nature that will take away from one of the defs and adds to another. Which of these depends on the metagame, but if both defs are required, then you could easily run a neutral nature.
 
But what nature should it be?
Click to expand...

Well you need both offensive stats and Speed, so either a Lonely or Naughty nature is the way to go. I'd prefer Lonely as you're lowering your defense with Superpower anyway so you shouldn't be relying on it. That and Scizor's typing is more useful for taking special attacks in general, especially from Gengar.

Forget about Zapdos, you just have to accept that it is now a perfect Scizor counter. It will outrun and OHKO you every time, and roost off any little damage you inflict. If you were going to use any other move it should be Night Slash for hitting Heat Rotom hard on the switch, but I'm struggling to see what move can be dropped without losing something key.
 
0472Front_m.png


Gliscor for Sandstorm...

Gliscor @ Brightpowder
Impish
252 HP 252 DEF 6 Attk

-Swords Dance
-Brick Break/Eartquake
-Night Slash
-Mud Slap

This is pretty standard a,d it may be a real pain in a sandtorm.
The only moves that never misses are Aerial Ace, Shock Wave and Aura Sphere, so the only possible thread to this set, may be Specario, whick is easily OHKo by Brick Break or Earthquake.


Also the combination of:
( Snow Cloack+Blizzard/Sandstorm+ Sand Veil ) + Bright Powder + Mud Slap is a really anoying strategy, so maybe the hax clause will be inside Standard format really soon.

Also I was trying to make a snow cloack + brightpowder + mud slap Frosslass bu I didnt workes as expected by some reason... you can see why in this set:

Frosslass@ Brigthpowder

Thunderbolt
Ice Beam
Mud Slap
Toxic ( I originally thought about curse but... It is illegal)
 
Renown's Bibarel

Anyone noticed how kewl Bibarel is since platinum movesets were released? How do you guys like my Bibarel that i created:

dpmfa400.png

Bibarel @ Leftovers
Adamant / Simple
80 HP / 252 Atk / 178 Def
- Curse
- Last Resort

Not to mention that Steelix also got curse, although he has many common weaknesses.

- Renown
 
Xrinix said:
0472Front_m.png


Gliscor for Sandstorm...

Gliscor @ Brightpowder
Jolly
120 HP / 200 Atk / 188 Spe

-Swords Dance
-Earthquake
-Ice Fang / Stone Edge
-Substitute / Roost

This is pretty standard a,d it may be a real pain in a sandtorm.
The only moves that never misses are Aerial Ace, Shock Wave and Aura Sphere, so the only possible thread to this set, may be Specario, whick is easily OHKo by Brick Break or Earthquake.

Wrong. Specario outruns and KOs with HP Ice. Also, Physical Luke with Ice Punch. This set works a lot better with substitute. Put it over mud slap. Use the EV spread mentioned above, it outruns Luke and a lot of stuff in the base 100 group. Yes, it is the physical sweeper set, only with sub an option in place of roost.


Also the combination of:
( Snow Cloack+Blizzard/Sandstorm+ Sand Veil ) + Bright Powder + Mud Slap is a really anoying strategy, so maybe the hax clause will be inside Standard format really soon.

Also I was trying to make a snow cloack + brightpowder + mud slap Frosslass bu I didnt workes as expected by some reason... you can see why in this set:

Frosslass@ Brigthpowder

Thunderbolt
Ice Beam
Mud Slap
Toxic ( I originally thought about curse but... It is illegal)
Click to expand...

Wat's the point of a Froslass BP set? It has better things to do than rely on hax. Also, unlike Chomp, which has fairly sturdy defenses to work with, Froslass is fragile.

Renown said:
Anyone noticed how kewl Bibarel is since platinum movesets were released? How do you guys like my Bibarel that i created:

dpmfa400.png

Bibarel @ Leftovers
Adamant / Simple
80 HP / 252 Atk / 178 Def
- Curse
- Last Resort

Not to mention that Steelix also got curse, although he has many common weaknesses.

- Renown
Click to expand...

Totally and utterly walled by steels.
 
Just for the sake of discussion, while I'm not entirely sure I'm convinced at the effectiveness of the bibarel's set, pairing it with CBTar to take care of Ghosts with Pursuit and Magnezone to trap steels, would allows for a sweep to open up.

That still leaves a couple pokemon to watch out for. Rock types like Tar are an issue, as well as Metagross who Magnezone cannot trap effectively.

Basically it requires a lot of support. I find that the only certain pokemon can get away with running a stat up move + one stabbed attacking move. Resttalk Gyara, Crocune, Cursepert are all good examples. But normal just has to many resistances and then the ghost type immunity.
 
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