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Norway Jihad

oh for fucks sake please don't start something here, as earlier stated this thread is for awareness purposes and should probably be closed now having served it's purpose. unless of course someone has a personal attachment to the victims and would like to say something.
 
Poppycock said:
oh for fucks sake please don't start something here, as earlier stated this thread is for awareness purposes and should probably be closed now having served it's purpose. unless of course someone has a personal attachment to the victims and would like to say something.
Hope I'm in the clear then...

I'm Norwegian, and my brother and others I know were working almost right next to where the bomb went off, but got. The reality of the chaos and anxiety within these attacks is unreal. Furthermore one girl (ex-gf or something) from my hometown is hospitalized and another is missing.

For those of you who want to play the blame game; every person involved in the trial and interrogation are saying he had to "save Norway and Western-Europe from the cultural marxists and muslims" (article's in Norwegian), so yeah, ridiculously far right-wing, and claims to be part of a larger terrorist network. In addition to the employees at the governmental office and the Labor Youths, the dipshit forced a police officer (crown princess's step brother) to sacrifice himself. The official death toll has now been reduced to 76 (68+8) now, which is still a fucking lot. I still wonder why the supplier didn't wonder why he ordered that much fertilizer for his fake company though...

Curtains said:
Norway needs to create the death penalty to deal some kind of justice here.
We actually held on to it long enough to get Quisling, then we (thankfully) got rid of that shit. I'd like to thank you for creating the topic though!

Mew said:
Well, it was a Socialistic camp apparently, the "wrong wing" in his opinion.
Social democratic =/= socialist. If you find an actual socialist who consider NLP to be socialists though, I'll retract this statement.

This guy should be tortured the rest of his life, should be kept alive as long as possible to suffer as long as possible.
While being far from patriotic, I am proud to say that I live in a country that doesn't have sentences like death penalty, life long imprisonment or torture. Our entire legal system are trying their best to get him a fair and safe (in terms of assassination attempts) trial as possible, as they should. Though as things seem:
If his lawyer's good: 21 years imprisonment and/or life time psych ward
If his lawyer's bad: 21 years imprisonment and/or life time psych ward

Eiganjo said:
yeah, the guy was a crazy lunatic. seemingly he admired the party leader of one of our dutch government parties. If I mention Geert Wildera that might ring a little bell to people, maybe not.
Is he that guy trying to get the Quran banned?

Stagnant said:
Also, people die from the stupidest shit like shootings, starvation, overdose, accidents, "accidents", "freak" accidents, etc.. everyday 24/7. The fact that this strikes people so radically is what disgusts me.
But it's not every day someone makes a conscious attempt to kill as many as possible, and more or less succeeding.

Neonian said:
Jesus christ, hollow point bullets are designed to destroy everything inside the body and keep the flesh intact. Using them was considered a war crime even before the world wars, that's how extreme they are.

How he got them and what they'll do about this is beyond me.
Considering they are regular hunting bullets, I'd imagine he bought it at some wilderness store.
---
I hope at least some of what I wrote will seem understandable grammar/spelling-wise.

Edit: Seems like it's my first post, and it's for the most depressing thing to have hit Norway since WWII -__-
 
Authorities lowered the death toll -- originally reported at 93 -- to 76, announcing Monday eight people were confirmed dead in the downtown bombing and 68 in the shooting on Utoya Island

My mom literally avoids watching/reading the news because she wants to avoid shit that is this depressing. Words cannot express how tragic this event is. One individuals ability to intentionally plan out and do this (and similar things) is just utterly incomprehensible.
 
He did all these attacks so that he could have a trial and so he could explain why he did it. He did it to create an impact and so he would have an audience. He's a sick man. I believe that everybody should have a chance to voice their opinion, but I believe that he has forfeited his right to voice his opinion. I think that he should not be allowed an open trial. I think that he should be locked away for the rest of his miserable life, he shouldn't be allowed any interaction for the rest of his life. He doesn't deserve anything, let alone a release from this world. He doesn't deserve any effort to be made towards him. I pity him, and I offer my condolences to everybody who was affected
 
No matter what ideology it stands for, religious terrorism and political terrorism suck.

It additionally sickens me when religious terrorism goes directly against the religion it stands for-which not only makes it meaningless, but discrediting.

The fact that so much life was taken also sickens me.
 
I hope that anyone directly impacted by these attacks manages to get through this horrible time in their lives.

Oh, and that you're not insulted that the Amy Winehouse thread on her death has more posts than this.
His kill/death ratio is insane.
I found this pretty funny. To all those people calling people who made jokes about this atrocity douchebags, I believe it was Benny on George Lopez who said, "If we don't laugh, we cry."

I hope/believe that this is the philosophy those people are following. If not, they really are absolute douches; bash them at will.
 
I'm not going to touch this one with a 10-foot pole but you all need to ask yourselves why there's such variance in the media's "facts".
Because the media is too busy trying to be the first to post news that they don't bother waiting for facts to be verified? This isn't new or unique.
 
yeah

On Friday night's news, they were calling him something else. He was a suspected terror cell with probable links to al-Qaida. Countless security experts queued up to tell me so. This has all the hallmarks of an al-Qaida attack, they said. Watching at home, my gut feeling was that that didn't add up. Why Norway? And why was it aimed so specifically at one political party? But hey, they're the experts. They're sitting there behind a caption with the word "EXPERT" on it. Every few minutes the anchor would ask, "What kind of picture is emerging?" or "What sense are you getting of who might be responsible?" and every few minutes they explained this was "almost certainly" the work of a highly-organised Islamist cell.

In the aftermath of the initial bombing, they proceeded to wrestle with the one key question: why do Muslims hate Norway? Luckily, the experts were on hand to expertly share their expert solutions to plug this apparent plot hole in the ongoing news narrative.

[...]

When it became apparent that a shooting was under way on Utoya island, the security experts upgraded their appraisal. This was no longer a Bali-style al-Qaida bombing, but a Mumbai-style al-Qaida massacre. On and on went the conjecture, on television, and in online newspapers, including this one. Meanwhile, on Twitter, word was quickly spreading that, according to eyewitnesses, the shooter on the island was a blond man who spoke Norwegian. At this point I decided my initial gut reservations about al-Qaida had probably been well founded. But who was I to contradict the security experts? A blond Norwegian gunman doesn't fit the traditional profile, they said, so maybe we'll need to reassess . . . but let's not forget that al-Qaida have been making efforts to actively recruit "native" extremists: white folk who don't arouse suspicion. So it's probably still the Muslims.

[...]

While I slept, the bodycount continued to rise, reaching catastrophic proportions by the morning. The next morning I switched on the news and the al-Qaida talk had been largely dispensed with, and the pundits were now experts on far-right extremism, as though they'd been on a course and qualified for a diploma overnight.

Some remained scarily defiant in the face of the new unfolding reality. On Saturday morning I saw a Fox News anchor tell former US diplomat John Bolton that Norwegian police were saying this appeared to be an Oklahoma-style attack, then ask him how that squared with his earlier assessment that al-Qaida were involved. He was sceptical. It was still too early to leap to conclusions, he said. We should wait for all the facts before rushing to judgment. In other words: assume it's the Muslims until it starts to look like it isn't – at which point, continue to assume it's them anyway.

[...]

If anyone reading this runs a news channel, please, don't clog the airwaves with fact-free conjecture unless you're going to replace the word "expert" with "guesser" and the word "speculate" with "guess", so it'll be absolutely clear that when the anchor asks the expert to speculate, they're actually just asking a guesser to guess. Also, choose better guessers. Your guessers were terrible, like toddlers hypothesising how a helicopter works. I don't know anything about international terrorism, but even I outguessed them.

[...]

These "but" commenters then go on to discuss immigration, often with reference to a shaky Muslim-baiting story they've half-remembered from the press. So despite this being a story about an anti-Muslim extremist killing Norwegians who weren't Muslim, they've managed to find a way to keep the finger of blame pointing at the Muslims, thereby following a narrative lead they've been fed for years, from the overall depiction of terrorism as an almost exclusively Islamic pursuit, outlined by "security experts" quick to see al-Qaida tentacles everywhere, to the fabricated tabloid fairytales about "Muslim-only loos" or local councils "banning Christmas".

fucking muslims i swear :V
 
No matter what ideology it stands for, religious terrorism and political terrorism suck.

It additionally sickens me when religious terrorism goes directly against the religion it stands for-which not only makes it meaningless, but discrediting.

The fact that so much life was taken also sickens me.
surely you don't see this as an act of political or religious terrorism? political terrorism tends to be associated with radical separatist/independence movements whilst religious terrorism seems to me to imply that the perceived word of god is the sole justification of one's actions. he was an atheist, and his political movement was really just an insane plan to revive the "knights templar", remove immigrants and liberate the world from marxist ideals. it can't be called either of those terms - it's simply self-delusion.
 
While being far from patriotic, I am proud to say that I live in a country that doesn't have sentences like death penalty, life long imprisonment or torture. Our entire legal system are trying their best to get him a fair and safe (in terms of assassination attempts) trial as possible, as they should. Though as things seem:
If his lawyer's good: 21 years imprisonment and/or life time psych ward
If his lawyer's bad: 21 years imprisonment and/or life time psych ward

Call me a fat, uneducated American, but I cannot wrap my mind around only getting 21 years for this. We give more time than that for the death of one person (sometimes) in America.
 
Twenty-one years are a very long time. Half that time can radically alter lives. Punishment to fit the crime is a tired way of making us feel better by preserving the logic of our sense of justice. Besides, if you really think about it, it's rather silly to assume that "punishment measure" should have a linear correlation with punishment duration.
 
Call me a fat, uneducated American, but I cannot wrap my mind around only getting 21 years for this. We give more time than that for the death of one person (sometimes) in America.
the maximum is 21 years but Norway has a system wherein if someone is deemed "high risk" the state prosecutor can seek a 5-year extension, so he may well be jailed forever.

it's just a European thing, based on the European Convention of Human Rights. rehabilitative approaches and liberal solutions have been trialed in Europe and have largely worked, but the American political system is too expansive and federal to allow such sweeping reforms, except on a small scale.
 
surely you don't see this as an act of political or religious terrorism? political terrorism tends to be associated with radical separatist/independence movements whilst religious terrorism seems to me to imply that the perceived word of god is the sole justification of one's actions. he was an atheist, and his political movement was really just an insane plan to revive the "knights templar", remove immigrants and liberate the world from marxist ideals. it can't be called either of those terms - it's simply self-delusion.

My understanding of this is limited. As is that of most people, apparently.

First off-Political terrorism simply means "terror for the sake of a political goal." Even if he's trying to "liberate the world from marxist ideals" via terror, that's still political terrorism. He's certainly made his views public.

If he is indeed an atheist...whoops. My bad. If he isn't, then my counterargument is that one can have both political and religious motives for committing an illegal action.

Note that terrorism never has a positive connotation among moderates and sane men, and those two uses are not exceptions.


Either way, my condolences to the families of those killed.
 
@ Tort: No one will ever be able to understand this. Ever.
First, we have the actual guy who did this. He's insane. Period. He is deluded beyond understanding, and his ideas make sense to no one. I've skimmed his "document," and it's a combination of random cross-sections of radical documents and his own insane musings.
Then, we have the Norwegian government. They have not been very liberal with direct info, so most of this is coming from indirect sources. At lease, more indirect than the government.
Also, there's this stupid little thing called American media. They attempt to make sushi with butcher knives, but eventually, it just becomes a botched mess that we have to dissect for what's good information and what's bad. Unfortunately, most of it ends up being bad, which puts us at a worse position.
Personally, I believe before his legal punishment is given, he should be tied to a chair, and anyone directly affected by the attacks should go up to him and give him a pimpslap across the face. He sure as hell deserves a little more than 21 years of prison. Life in a psych ward sounds sufficient IMO.

EDIT: Oh good god. For the sake of what little I have left in my faith in humanity, PLEASE don't tell me that's actually an advertisement for the game.
Christ, even the quote is taken out of context. He played WoW, not COD.
 
:[[[[[
the article said:
Picture1-155.png
What the fuck is that shit.
 
Ugh, I hate the scapegoating that the media always tries to do. It always reminds me of the Columbine shootings back in 99 and all the rhetoric that came out of it blaming violent media, music types, games, etc.

I'm pretty sure there's been a million threads over nature vs nurture, which is what the basis of the arguments are anyways; otherwise I would suggest making a new topic for the people that want to discuss how video games did/didn't play a part in this...

But, to get back on topic, I was just browsing the news and clicked on a slideshow of some of the victims. Holy shit, most of them were soo young. I know that it was mentioned a million times over but I guess just actually seeing their pictures/ages and knowing they're dead... it's just completely mind blowing when a tragedy like this targets the youth.

Anyways, if you're interested in seeing the pictures (no blood or gore), here's a link:
http://www.reuters.com/news/pictures/slideshow?articleId=USRTR2PDI3#a=1
 
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