ORAS FU Metagame Discussion (old)

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Gary

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Nominating Swirlix from Unranked ---> B/B+




Swirlix @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Unburden
Happiness: 0
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Play Rough
- Frustration
- Protect


So this thing is actually a very devastating threat in the FU metagame. After a +6 boost it cleanly ohkos every offensive threat in the metagame, and 2hkos all walls in the tier such as Clefairy and Dusclops. After the unburden boost it hits a speedy 394 speed stat. The fairy typing also keeps Fraxure from spamming it's main STAB in outrage, due to Swirlix getting a free belly drum off it. I have found this works best with Memento support, but it's worth the support. This thing can clean late game without any issues once you drop a memento. The only issue are the 3 steel types in FU that give this trouble, but after they have been weakened slurpuff can still clean late game. Protect is also used to dodge Persians Fake Out.

Heres a replay I had to show it off in action - http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-235015326
While it looks interesting, the replay doesn't really do much in justifying the massive rank jump. While FU is for sure lacking Steel-types, Lairon and Metang are VERY common, and wall the living hell out of Swirlix, which only makes it that much more difficult to sweep. On top of that, unlike Linoone, arguably the only Drummer worth using in FU, it's not nearly as prone to being bopped by Choice Scarf users as well as other forms of priority such as Dodrio's and Flareon's CB Quick Attack, Cate's Sucker Punch, and Murkrow's priority Thunder Wave because ExtremeSpeed is the fastest form of priority bar Fake Out. Linoone also has coverage options such as Shadow Claw to heavily dent Metang, as well as Dusclops. Even Rock Smash is a viable option, as it is able to 2HKO Lairon and OHKO them with hazard support. However for Linoone to succeed it needs a lot of support; Memento support is practically obligatory and Dual Screens/Diglett are both nice too. The biggest factor that separates the two IMO is Swirlix's reliability on Unburden, while Linoone is ALWAYS going to be able to outspeed the entire tier because of E-Speed, meaning that once it gets off a Drum, the only thing it has to worry about is not OHKOing something. Swirlix still has to worry about revenge killers as well as its item activating too early.

Swirlix seems like an interesting sweeper, but I just really can't see it being used over Linoone who has a far superior sweeping move which limits what can revenge kill it as well as its significantly higher Attack stat, which keeps it from being a 100% liability before a Drum unlike Swirlix, as well as being able to muscle through more shit. Anything higher than C rank just seems a way too outrageous. The only major advantage Swirlix has is its Fairy-typing, but that's still not enough to put it in the same rank as Linoone, or anything close to it for that matter.
 

kay

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Yes, everything you said is true about Belly drum Swirlix in what walls it or threatens it after the BD. But the cool thing about Swirlix is that's not the only set it can run. Metang and Lairon both are very common and wal lthe BD set, but what they fail to do is wall the CM Cotton Guard set. Say your opponent is inside with a swirlix, and you have a full hp Metang just sitting in the back and you switch to it. Here is what happens - http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-235273100

Now granted, 30% is a very revenge killable range. But if they're a defensive Metang set, or a custap explosion set, you actually kill it at a very healthy amount of hp. Same thing with Lairon.

Now what about poison types such as Arbok? Doesn't it wall this set? Well yes actually it does. Now it doesn't beat the Belly Drum set, nor does it beat CM 3 attacks Swirlix. The main draw to Swirlix that I like is the fact it can run 3 very different sets, each of them needing their own different counters and switch ins.

Metang/Lairon switches in on the BD set but loses to CM + Cotton Guard, Arbok switches in the on CM + Cotton Guard set but lose to the BD/ CM 3 attacks set, and the CM 3 attacks set is walled by Metang. Not one mon walls all 3 sets which makes this, theoretically speaking, a VERY versatile threat.
 
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Did anyone try Gastly or Abra yet in FU?

While Abra faces competition by Duosion as a Magic Guard Psychic Type and having similar moves and 90 Speed isn't really too impressive, I am sure Abra can still pull off some work with Sash and having access to Encore. Also I don't see a lot of Dark Types that could stop it:
252 SpA Abra Dazzling Gleam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Zweilous: 180-216 (51.7 - 62%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
 
Please correct me if I'm wrong as I haven't actually played this meta, but solely from looking at the viability rankings I'm noticing a few things missing that I thought would've been quite strong.

Firstly there is Dedenne.
I get that it initially seems completely outclassed by Electabuzz but I'm looking at it from a physically defensive pivot perspective.

A set coming to mind would look something like:
Dedenne @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Cheek Pouch
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Nuzzle
- Play Rough
- U-Turn
- Recycle

Sitrus Berry + Cheek Pouch + Recycle obviously isn't the most reliable recovery, but it is still far better recovery than most things in this meta, and more than enough to get by. Also 67/57/67 defences don't seem to crash hot either, but when you play Dedenne to the strengths of its epic unique typing I'm sure you could make do. Nuzzle is an epic support move as it is effectively a Thunder Wave that breaks Sturdy/Sash and isn't prevented by Taunt. U-Turn of course if fantastic for pivoting and Play Rough is a decent STAB move, with a sight chance of decreases the opponents Atk stat.
Anyways, I feel like this might not be selling it too much so I'm gonna jump to what I believe to be the juicy stuff.
This Dedenne set is able to perform as a reliable counter/check to all of the following threats:
Electabuzz, Fraxure, Murkrow, Electrode, Zweilous, Scraggy, Yanma, Luxray, Emolga and I'm sure there's many more.
Its not that largest list but they are only the things that stood out to me due to Dedenne unique set of resists and immunities. Besides, I think that being able to check the 2 S+ rank mons and an S rank mon in one slot is reason enough to consider Dedenne. Not to mention Zweilous who I'm assuming has some extremely hard to wall band sets. Dedenne is then able to threaten most the meta with Nuzzle, while utilising Play Rough to dish out damage where it can, and pivoting around to maintain momentum and what not.
Also I'd like to mention that there would likely be more sets like this. Another jumping to mind would be one that utilises that nice 101 Spe alongside a bit of bulk investment to pull off Recycle and Magnets Rise fantastically. Then fill with Volt Switch and HP Ice or something. A Magnet Rise set would be really strong as it would allow Dedenne to take on the like of other A rank threats such as Krokorok and Gabite.

Another thing which I'm really surprised to see not on the viability rankings is Eelektrik.
I mean I look at it and I just see so much juiciness.
65/70/70 Bulk + Eviolite.
0 Weaknesses.
85 Atk and 75 Spa allowing it to go mixed.
Slow Volt Switch / U-Turn
Passive recovery from Giga Drain.
Coil for boosting Atk, Def and Accuracy.
More Utility in the forms of Knock Off, Super Fang, Thunder Wave, and Acid Spray.
Plenty of coverage options in Crunch, Flash Cannon, Aqua Tail, Bounce, Signal Beam, and all the other moves already mentioned.
Literally the only disappointing thing I'm noticing is that it doesn't get Drain punch, Super Power, Elemental punches, Dragon Tail, Rock SLide, Flamethrower and Roar until it evolves.
Other than that with all the positives I've mentioned I'd imagine it to be an amazing pokemon able to act as a great defensive pivot, or even a Coil sweeper.

The last thing I'm considering should possibly be ranked is Croconaw, but it may be outclassed by Whiscash.
It hits some nice speed tiers. At +1 Jolly it can out pace scarfed Lampent, Rock Polish Magcargo and max speed Electabuzz.
Adamant is still faster than Jolly Scraggy.
Its niche over Whiscash would be that is hits a bit harder, with Sheer Force and Life Orb boosting Waterfall to pretty sweet levels.
But I guess the more important thing would be Sheer Force boosted Ice Punch, allowing Croconaw to muscle pass Grass types which would otherwise cock block Whiscash.

If I had to rank them I'd be personally cautious due to not actually playing the meta. But in theory I'd imagine Dedenne and Eelektrik to be B- at the very least. And Croconaw either C or D, assuming it is outclassed by Whiscash. That said though Croconaw's niches over Whiscash may be considered far more valuable, and the electric types mentioned may also prove to be outstanding pivots.
Idk. Thoughts?
 
Hey Guys!

I've been playing this tier quite a bit in the run up to the PUPL, and I have to say this meta is something else. Its got a great blend of mons you never see usually and its quite balanced to say the least.
When my friends and I (specifically Sir Kay 9 , Realistic Waters and Mistress Remilia ) were testing out a couple team archetypes and cores, a couple caught my eye and more so theirs as possibly a bit too much to handle.
We are mainly talking about the play style archetype Rain
I have been experimenting with Rain quite a bit over the past few days and I have to say its quite a strong play style in the current meta, I would go even as far as to say its broken. There's very little counterplay to rain at the moment.

There are hardly any water resists (lapras is probably the best one, arti causes some problems), no real viable "rain counters" (like scarf snow warning aurorus in NU), and the only real archetype that has rain kinda troubled is the perma-weather hail (sand doesn't have any good sweepers to abuse). Rain has everything it needa to function right now as well. A fantastic Rock Setter / Sturdy Lead / Rain Setter suicide lead in Relicanth, a priority rain setter in Illumise, with access to t-wave encore and u-turn, several sweepers (my favourites currently are huntail, golduck and beartic).
I have been beaten with this archetype, and I understand that some mons do well vs Rain, but the all important filler Mon can decide matches as well. I choose vibrava for a greater chance vs scarf ebuzz but you could equally choose something else to help with Articuno if you really wanted.

I don't know if this has been discussed in the past, but rain, to me, seems quite strong in the current meta. I would like to know if I'm not alone with this theory.^.^
 

Gary

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Rain is definitely something I've noticed is pretty ridiculous at the moment. At first it was heavily overshadowed by Sun, which was so obviously broken but as I said before, what was left of the playerbase at the time wasn't enough to give it a proper suspect + people were so dead set on banning Fraxure that putting anything else as a potential suspect seemed unreasonable and futile. However, now that Sawsbuck, Victreebel, AND Rapidash are gone, Sun is no where near as good as it used to be; Bellossom, Flareon, and Simisear are practically the only viable Pokemon left that can abuse sun. Rain has Golduck, which is already a very solid Pokemon with very minimal switch-ins, as well as Beartic, both of which wear down each others counters. Huntail is also viable on rain because it can Shell Smash and basically beat everything, although there's not much room for it on rain if using Golduck (which is a superior swimmer IMO). Relicanth is an outstanding lead thanks to Sturdy which guarantees rain up for 8 turns unless Taunted, as well as Stealth Rock if given the chance and a great suicide move in Head Smash. Fraxure is also very good on rain for its useful resistances/obligatory Buzz check.

Rain is definitely a very good playstyle, but I don't think it's game breaking enough to ruin PUPL or anything of that nature. Pokemon such as Buzz and Utility Krow can give it a lot of issues, as well as Electrode, and Fraxure to an extent. In my honest opinion, I feel that Volbeat and Illumise have been more of the issues for breaking weather than their abusers. Think about it, Illumise is practically guaranteed to get up rain unless it's Taunted by Murkrow or bopped by Persian's Fake Out, which doesn't come close to OHKOing. Relicanth on the other hand is very slow, and outpaced by practically every Taunt user in the tier. While Head Smash is a great weapon against most of them, it still keeps rain from getting up. After that, the only things left are Golduck and Buzz, the latter being the only decently bulky one while the other is slower and frail.

So all in all, I think Illumise is more of the problem than rain itself, because of how easy it is for it to keep rain on the field. Otherwise, rain would be much more of a high risk, high reward playstyle. As it stands now with Illumise in the tier, rain is a pretty low risk, very rewarding playstyle because of how easy it is to keep it up + good abusers. I'm not just going to give Illumise the boot or anything of that nature, because I can't be 100% sure of it unless we actually give it a suspect.
 
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How is this not a tier yet...

But can I mention meinfoo?

Meinfoo @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- U-turn

Meinfoo is diamond in the rough of FU having the option of running Regenerator as a bulky set or any other ability for offensive, but with it having a great attack stat, and the ability to hurt a lot of Pokemon (mostly the steel types and zweilous, Lairon, Bastiodon, Linoone, Regigigas Purgly, Ect, Ect) but with access to many good stat raising moves, some good attacks and speed, it can be a good threat in FU, and it can also have Eviolite for extra defenses if using bulk up, but it needs. It a lot of team support, only needing a steel type or a bulky rock type to hurt flying, psychic, and fairy types, so you only really need Lairon, for that, so I think meinfoo should be C/C+ (or B- at the most)
 
How is this not a tier yet...

But can I mention meinfoo?

Meinfoo @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- U-turn

Meinfoo is diamond in the rough of FU having the option of running Regenerator as a bulky set or any other ability for offensive, but with it having a great attack stat, and the ability to hurt a lot of Pokemon (mostly the steel types and zweilous, Lairon, Bastiodon, Linoone, Regigigas Purgly, Ect, Ect) but with access to many good stat raising moves, some good attacks and speed, it can be a good threat in FU, and it can also have Eviolite for extra defenses if using bulk up, but it needs. It a lot of team support, only needing a steel type or a bulky rock type to hurt flying, psychic, and fairy types, so you only really need Lairon, for that, so I think meinfoo should be C/C+ (or B- at the most)
I think your better off using Reckless which powers up high jump kicks power to threatening levels, regen isn't really going to help considering Meinfoo's bulk is really lacking with 45/50/50 anything can just about kill it. It gets a lot of OHKO's against offensive pokemon and is able to get past most defensive threats by just u-turning or removing important items with knock off. I've used it quite frequently particularly on hyper offensive teams and it's a great late game cleaner/revenge killer with choice scarf, FU lacks solid fighting resists (most of them are reliant on eviolite) Also there's better options over Drain punch such as Stone edge to hit flying/fires/bugs like Articuno, Swanna and Swoobat and Poison Jab to hit Faires like Clefairy and Spitzee.
 
I think your better off using Reckless which powers up high jump kicks power to threatening levels, regen isn't really going to help considering Meinfoo's bulk is really lacking with 45/50/50 anything can just about kill it. It gets a lot of OHKO's against offensive pokemon and is able to get past most defensive threats by just u-turning or removing important items with knock off. I've used it quite frequently particularly on hyper offensive teams and it's a great late game cleaner/revenge killer with choice scarf, FU lacks solid fighting resists (most of them are reliant on eviolite) Also there's better options over Drain punch such as Stone edge to hit flying/fires/bugs like Articuno, Swanna and Swoobat and Poison Jab to hit Faires like Clefairy and Spitzee.
That was just a sample set from the site, I wasn't my own...
 

Gary

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Hopefully I'm not asking a dumb question but why was machoke banned?
Machoke was banned for similar reasons why Throh was banned in PU. Its combination of bulk and power made it very difficult for offensive and defensive teams to deal with, and thanks to its Guts ability it couldn't be crippled by burn or toxic. It also had access to Knock Off which allowed it to muscle through most of its switch-ins as well as heavily wear shit down, and between Close Combat / Knock Off / Earthquake / Heavy Slam it was nearly impossible to wall or switch into. No Guard Dynamicpunch was also a factor because of its ability to create a ton of 50/50s with confusion as well as beating practically everything with a bit of luck.

Overall Machoke was deemed very unhealthy for the tier, and it was banned because of it.
 
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Gary

Can be abrasive at times (no joke)
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Reserved for Sample Sets

I'm adding a sample sets section to the OP, so unless people are too lazy to read the OP (so practically everyone) it should help out a LOT if you're having trouble finding what kind of sets to use/what are good. Anyone who doesn't bother to read can go fuck themselves I guess lol.

Keep in mind that this is a heavy WIP and I probably wont make any significant progress on it until the end of the month when I'm back from the field.


Offensive Pivot

Electabuzz @ Eviolite
Ability: Vital Spirit / Static
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice] / Hidden Power Grass
- Thunder Wave / Toxic / Focus Blast

Choice Specs

Electabuzz @ Choice Specs
Ability: Vital Spirit
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice] / Hidden Power Grass
- Focus Blast



Dragon Dance

Fraxure @ Eviolite
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Taunt / Low Kick
- Poison Jab / Low Kick

Swords Dance

Fraxure @ Eviolite
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Dragon Claw
- Taunt / Low Kick / Aqua Tail
- Iron Tail


Calm Mind

Murkrow @ Eviolite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 212 Def / 48 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Dark Pulse
- Taunt
- Roost

Bulky Support

Murkrow @ Eviolite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 212 Def / 48 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Foul Play
- Taunt
- Thunder Wave / Feather Dance
- Roost

Offensive

Murkrow @ Life Orb
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Sucker Punch
- Pursuit
- Thunder Wave / Taunt / Tailwind / Roost




Offensive

Articuno @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Ice Beam
- Hurricane
- Hidden Power [Ground]
- Roost

Agility

Articuno @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 24 HP / 252 SpA / 232 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Agility
- Ice Beam
- Hurricane
- Roost

SubRoost

Articuno @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Roost
- Ice Beam
- Hurricane



Mixed Attacker

Simisage @ Life Orb
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Knock Off
- Rock Slide
- Gunk Shot / Taunt / Low Kick

Choice Scarf

Simisage @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Knock Off
- Rock Slide
- Gunk Shot / Seed Bomb



Choiced

Dodrio @ Choice Band / Choice Scarf
Ability: Early Bird
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Frustration
- Knock Off
- Pursuit

Agility

Dodrio @ Lum Berry / Life Orb
Ability: Early Bird
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Agility
- Brave Bird
- Frustration
- Knock Off

All-Out-Attacker

Dodrio @ Sharp Beak / Life Orb
Ability: Early Bird
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Frustration
- Knock Off
- Pursuit / Roost

Natural Gift

Dodrio @ Salac Berry
Ability: Early Bird
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Frustration
- Knock Off
- Natural Gift



Agility

Kingler @ Life Orb
Ability: Shell Armor
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Agility
- Crabhammer
- Knock Off
- X-Scissor

Choice Band

Kingler @ Choice Band
Ability: Shell Armor
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Crabhammer
- Knock Off
- X-Scissor
- Superpower

Sub Salac

Kingler @ Salac Berry
Ability: Shell Armor
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Crabhammer
- Flail / Knock Off


Tank

Lairon @ Eviolite
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Head Smash
- Earthquake
- Heavy Slam / Roar

Specially Defensive

Lairon @ Eviolite
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Head Smash
- Earthquake
- Roar

Rock Polish

Lairon @ Life Orb / Eviolite
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 40 HP / 252 Atk / 216 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rock Polish
- Head Smash
- Earthquake
- Heavy Slam



Guts Swords Dance

Raticate @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Facade
- Crunch
- Sucker Punch

Choice Band

Raticate @ Choice Band
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- U-turn
- Return
- Crunch
- Quick Attack / Sucker Punch



Nasty Plot +3 Attacks

Simisear @ Life Orb / Charcoal
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Fire Blast
- Grass Knot
- Focus Blast / Hidden Power Ice / Taunt

Sub Salac

Simisear @ Salac Berry
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Substitute
- Nasty Plot
- Fire Blast
- Grass Knot / Focus Blast

Choice Specs

Simisear @ Choice Specs
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fire Blast
- Grass Knot
- Focus Blast / Hidden Power Ice
- Overheat



Calm Mind

Clefairy @ Eviolite
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 76 SpD / 4 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast
- Softboiled
- Thunder Wave / Knock Off

Cleric

Clefairy @ Eviolite
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 76 SpD / 4 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Thunder Wave / Healing Wish
- Heal Bell / Knock Off
- Softboiled



Offensive Milk Drink

Gogoat @ Life Orb
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Rock Slide
- Earthquake
- Milk Drink

All-Out-Attacker

Gogoat @ Life Orb
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Horn Leech
- Rock Slide
- Earthquake
- Aerial Ace

Specially Defensive

Gogoat @ Leftovers
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 248 HP / 240 SpD / 20 Spe
Careful Nature
- Horn Leech
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Milk Drink

Bulk Up

Gogoat @ Life Orb / Leftovers
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Bulk Up
- Horn Leech
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide / Aerial Ace



Shell Smash

Huntail @ Life Orb
Ability: Water Veil / Swift Swim
EVs: 68 Atk / 188 SpA / 252 Spe
Rash Nature
- Shell Smash
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Sucker Punch

Coil

Huntail @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Veil
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Coil
- Waterfall
- Ice Fang
- Sucker Punch / Baton Pass


Choice Scarf

Krokorok @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Earthquake
- Pursuit
- Stone Edge

Offensive Pivot

Krokorok @ Eviolite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly / Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off
- Earthquake
- Taunt / Pursuit



Pivot

Metang @ Eviolite
Ability: Light Metal
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Meteor Mash
- Earthquake
- Toxic / Bullet Punch



Speedy Spiker

Quilladin @ Eviolite
Ability: Bulletproof
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spikes
- Taunt
- Wood Hammer
- Synthesis

Defensive Spiker

Quilladin @ Eviolite
Ability: Bulletproof
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 28 Spe
Impish Nature
- Spikes
- Super Fang / Taunt
- Seed Bomb / Wood Hammer
- Synthesis



Wallbreaker

Seviper @ Life Orb
Ability: Infiltrator / Shed Skin
EVs: 40 Atk / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
Rash Nature
- Sludge Wave
- Earthquake / Knock Off
- Giga Drain
- Sucker Punch

Choice Scarf

Seviper @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Sludge Wave
- Earthquake
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Ice] / Knock Off



Work Up

Zweilous @ Eviolite
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 248 HP / 240 SpD / 20 Spe
Careful Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Work Up
- Crunch

Offensive Shuffler

Zweilous @ Eviolite
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 232 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 20 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Crunch
- Dragon Tail / Outrage



Standard Tosser

Dusclops @ Eviolite
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 248 HP / 196 Def / 64 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Will-O-Wisp
- Seismic Toss



Stallbreaker

Electrode @ Life Orb / Magnet
Ability: Aftermath
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Taunt



Choice Band

Flareon @ Choice Band
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Superpower
- Quick Attack
- Flame Charge

Specially Defensive

Flareon @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 232 SpD / 28 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Lava Plume
- Wish
- Protect
- Toxic / Heal Bell



Offensive Pivot

Gabite @ Eviolite
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Roar / Toxic

Choice Scarf

Gabite @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Dragon Claw
- Iron Tail



Offensive Custap

Gigalith @ Custap Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 132 HP / 252 Atk / 124 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Rock Blast
- Earthquake
- Explosion

Specially Defensive

Gigalith @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Rock Blast
- Earthquake
- Toxic / Protect



Utility

Gourgeist-Small @ Leftovers
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 248 HP / 100 Def / 160 Spe
Impish Nature
- Substitute
- Leech Seed / Disable
- Will-O-Wisp
- Phantom Force

Offensive

Gourgeist-Small @ Life Orb
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Seed Bomb
- Phantom Force
- Rock Slide
- Destiny Bond / Synthesis



Defensive

Marshtomp @ Eviolite
Ability: Damp
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Scald
- Earthquake
- Yawn



Scout

Persian @ Silk Scarf / Life Orb
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Double-Edge / Return
- Knock Off
- U-turn / Taunt

Nasty Plot

Persian @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpD
- Nasty Plot
- Hyper Voice
- Water Pulse
- Hidden Power [Ghost]



Substitute

Regigigas @ Leftovers
Ability: Slow Start
EVs: 248 HP / 104 Atk / 156 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Return
- Thunder Wave / Knock Off
- Drain Punch



Defog

Swanna @ Life Orb
Ability: Keen Eye
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Hurricane
- Defog
- Roost



Calm Mind

Swoobat @ Life Orb / Colbur Berry / Lum Berry
Ability: Simple
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA / 30 SpD / 30 Spe
- Calm Mind
- Stored Power
- Heat Wave
- Hidden Power [Fighting]



Rapid Spin

Wartortle @ Eviolite
Ability: Rain Dish / Torrent
EVs: 248 HP / 172 Def / 88 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Rapid Spin
- Foresight / Toxic
- Mirror Coat / Counter



Quiver Dance

Butterfree @ Life Orb / Focus Sash
Ability: Tinted Lens
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 SpD
- Quiver Dance
- Sleep Powder
- Bug Buzz
- Hidden Power [Ground] / Roost



Hazard Lead

Dwebble @ Custap Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Spikes
- Rock Blast
- Knock Off

Shell Smash

Dwebble @ Eviolite
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Shell Smash
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- X-Scissor / Knock Off



Swift Swim

Golduck @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Focus Blast
- Rain Dance



Weather Setter

Illumise (F) @ Damp Rock / Heat Rock
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- U-turn
- Rain Dance / Sunny Day
- Encore
- Thunder Wave

Utility

Illumise (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- U-turn
- Tailwind / Roost
- Encore
- Thunder Wave



Tank

Lapras @ Life Orb / Assault Vest / Choice Specs
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 172 HP / 252 SpA / 84 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Freeze-Dry
- Surf / Thunderbolt

LapDance

Lapras @ Liechi Berry
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 16 HP / 220 Atk / 24 SpA / 248 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Natural Gift
- Ice Beam



Belly Drum

Linoone @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Quick Feet
EVs: 8 Def / 252 Atk / 248 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Extreme Speed
- Shadow Claw
- Rock Smash / Protect



Choiced

Luxray @ Choice Scarf / Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly / Adamant Nature
- Wild Charge
- Volt Switch
- Superpower
- Ice Fang

Guts

Luxray @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Wild Charge
- Ice Fang
- Superpower
- Facade



Choice Specs

Politoed @ Choice Specs
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 156 HP / 252 SpA / 100 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power Grass / Focus Blast

Specially Defensive

Politoed @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Perish Song
- Protect / Ice Beam
- Toxic



Defiant Priority

Purugly @ Life Orb
Ability: Defiant
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Frustration
- Knock Off
- Sucker Punch



Rain Lead

Relicanth @ Damp Rock
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Rain Dance
- Head Smash
- Waterfall

Choiced

Relicanth @ Choice Band / Choice Scarf
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Head Smash
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Double-Edge



Contrary

Servine @ Eviolite
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Ground
- Knock Off
- Glare / Giga Drain



Physically Defensive

Solrock @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 176 Def / 84 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge
- Will-O-Wisp
- Morning Sun

Offensive

Solrock @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant / Jolly Nature
- Rock Polish / Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge
- Zen Headbutt
- Earthquake



Cleric

Spritzee @ Eviolite
Ability: Aroma Veil
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Wish
- Protect
- Heal Bell



Defog

Vibrava @ Eviolite
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
Careful Nature
- U-turn
- Earthquake
- Roost
- Defog



Defog

Vullaby (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Overcoat
EVs: 248 HP / 176 Def / 84 Spe
Impish Nature
- Foul Play
- Taunt / Knock Off / U-turn
- Defog
- Roost



Choice Specs

Whiscash @ Choice Specs
Ability: Anticipation / Hydration
EVs: 40 HP / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Scald

Dragon Dance

Whiscash @ Leftovers
Ability: Anticipation / Hydration
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Substitute
- Waterfall
- Earthquake



Wallbreaker

Wigglytuff @ Choice Specs
Ability: Competitive
EVs: 108 HP / 252 SpA / 108 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hyper Voice
- Dazzling Gleam
- Fire Blast
- Psychic

Offensive Stealth Rock

Wigglytuff @ Life Orb
Ability: Competitive
EVs: 108 HP / 252 SpA / 108 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock
- Dazzling Gleam
- Hyper Voice
- Fire Blast
 
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Gary

Can be abrasive at times (no joke)
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Pro triple posting, but I'm here to announce a new member to the FU council, unfixable

He has shown a lot of interest in the tier over these past few weeks and has proved his usefulness by helping me test a shit ton of teams/Pokemon for PUPL. We also are in desperate need of knowledgeable FU players so we can get a council back and we can begin suspecting shit.

Also Mambo has been "promoted" to the co tier leader seeing as how Halcyon is dead. He's fucking dead. He will help lead things while I'm gone for the month or he will take a shit all over this tier. Most likely the latter.

Anyways, see you guys next month!
 

Megazard

The turtle moves
is a member of the Site Staffis a Community Leaderis a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Battle Simulator Moderatoris a Top Team Rater Alumnus
PU Leader
where is this playable?
While I believe it's only playable on Aqua technically, there's normally someone in the PU room willing to play, especially with it being in PUPL right now

Edit: other metas too but occasionally some people are a little down on fu

Edit 2: since I'm here, I'd reccomebd adding rest/cm/wisp or sleep talk/ice beam dusclops to sample sets, standard pu croclops is kinda dumb lol
 
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Kushalos

Everything is better when you're everything
is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
Ah glad you've updated the Agility Articuno spread Gary was about to tell you to change it to that if you still had 40 HP evs xd
 
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-239807946

K so what is one of the first FU tournament games was played just showing off some innovative sets on some of the most popular standard builds (balance and Rain HO). First of all Choice Scarf Relicanth is incredibly cool and clutch innovation and then the underrated Rain Dance lead Relicanth also put in work with entry hazards support (as well as Duosion which is stupid fat). Everything came down to the wire also because Clefairy (which is stupidly good and miles better than Spritzee hahaah) got frozen but in the end Kushalos still managed to bring it home with Intimidate support to take out the always so threatening Fraxure.
 

mambo

paint me as a villain
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Hi, sorry for the delay

I guess I'm running the show now in Gary's absence. I'll be sorta busy with LCPL and WCOP in the coming weeks but I'll always be able to make room for FU :] J/ust as before, this thread will be open for discussion regarding anything FU so feel free to share new discoveries or vent about your frustrations with the meta. Also, if you're participating in PUPL and you have an FU replay to share (and possibly analyze) that's more than welcome (galbia's post above is a perfect example).

I've also brought back the FU IRC channel, #fu . Everyone is more than welcome to stop by and discuss the metagame, seek teambuilding advice, or coordinate some matches, all in real time. If you're interested in getting more involved with FU, be sure to add #fu to your list of autojoin channels and definitely come on by.

Unfortunately, I won't be continuing Gary's sample sets project in this thread, as I don't have the ability to edit his post and update his current list. I will however be playing around with a variety of sets and updating a pm I have with Gary with said sets, so that when he returns he can update his post and this incredibly useful tool will be complete. If you have a set that you think is quite good in the metagame that you think should be added, find me on IRC or on PS and share it.

I guess that's about it, I look forward to seeing all of you contribute to the growth of FU and I'm especially looking forward to some sweet discussion. If anybody ever wants to scrap a bit, my door's always open.
 

Gary

Can be abrasive at times (no joke)
is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
Okay so I'm continuing to do the sample sets and so far I've finished all of them up to B+. My goal is to finish sets for every Pokemon B- rank and higher because anything past that just seems too niche to provide sets for, seeing as how those Pokemon are usually tailored very specifically for certain teams and don't really have standard sets.

Also after watching a few PUPL matches, it's very safe to say Clefairy is an A+ Pokemon. Much like Clefable in OU, its typing and bulk allows it to blanket check a wide majority of top tier threats, and anything that can take on practically every Dragon-type in the tier (especially Fraxure AND Zweilous) so well makes it a very useful tool for practically any team. It also provides so much immense support with Knock Off, T-wave, Heal Bell, and Calm Mind gives teams a solid win condition. It's only true flaw and what prevents it from being as influential in FU as Clefable is in OU, is that it's VERY reliant on Eviolite, and without it, the amount of Pokemon it checks is literally cut it in half. Knock Off is a very common coverage move in FU and is spammed quite frequently, so Clefairy has to be very careful or else it goes from being a top tier Pokemon to about mid B without Eviolite. Still, when played correctly, it never fails to impress, and is a quintessential glue Pokemon in this current metagame.

Also Mambo has been proving to me that Dragonair needs to be ranked somewhere, I'm thinking somewhere in the high B ranks. Unlike most of the Dragon-types in FU, its special movepool allows it to take advantage of many of the Dragon checks such as Metang and Lairon, and its extra special bulk + Marvel Scale allows it to sponge hits a lot better than Fraxure or Gabite. While its Special Attack may seem very underwhelming, its strong STAB and coverage moves allows it to be threatening enough, and it can abuse a very cool strat with Haze + Draco Meteor, much like what Dragalge would do in RU. Mambo was really gunning for B+, but at the moment I will keep it in B until I can test it more. However, I do see it rising in the future, as it is a very cool Pokemon that I think has potential. Besides, every Dragon-type is good in FU as long as it has a few good qualities, so it comes to no surprise to me that Dragonair is useful.
 
Welcome back Gary, its nice to see you again. I just want to get this threads General Opinion on the threat that is Clamperl. Clamperl often likend to a shitmon I feel is particularly good in this tier. With its Special Attack after a shell smash reaching a dizzying 1000 SpA (close enough) and enough speed to outspeed most scarfers in the tier (see krokorok, it misses out on ebuzz Scarf speed though).
It's also not that difficult to give it a shell smash, with the likes of the afformentioned Clefairy in the tier, or Baton Pass support, dual screen support, you would be surprised at the ease at which Clamperl setsup, and particularly the power it can pump out.

+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Electabuzz: 309-364 (114 - 134.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Fraxure: 624-736 (228.5 - 269.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 212 HP / 0 SpD Arbok: 492-580 (156.6 - 184.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Hidden Power Grass vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Simipour: 524-618 (179.4 - 211.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Articuno: 333-393 (103.7 - 122.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO<--- mental
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Clefairy: 255-300 (74.1 - 87.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO <- that's a lot lol
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Gogoat: 444-524 (98.6 - 116.4%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Metang: 325-384 (100.3 - 118.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Quilladin: 558-658 (171.1 - 201.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Zweilous: 326-384 (93.6 - 110.3%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Dusclops: 216-255 (76 - 89.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Hidden Power Grass vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Lapras: 376-444 (81 - 95.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO


these were the bulkiest pieces of shit this tier had to offer, and Clamperl sweeps them aside at +2.
The main thing that Clamperl offers that Huntail cannot is a massively powerful Ice Beam. Often, when a Huntail smashes, its life orb Adamant waterfall will do more damage to a resist than its minimal investment ice beam. Clamperl on the other hand offers huge power in its moveset, to the extent where switchins are nonexistent. I guess you could call Marill a counter, or Tentacool, but both take huge damage from surf at +2, and are basically irrelevant.

Due to Clamperls mxiture of immense power and OK enough speed, I think that Clamperl should be promoted to at least C maybe even B Rank in the Viability Rankings, now it is unlisted, and I don't really understand why.
 

Gary

Can be abrasive at times (no joke)
is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
Welcome back Gary, its nice to see you again. I just want to get this threads General Opinion on the threat that is Clamperl. Clamperl often likend to a shitmon I feel is particularly good in this tier. With its Special Attack after a shell smash reaching a dizzying 1000 SpA (close enough) and enough speed to outspeed most scarfers in the tier (see krokorok, it misses out on ebuzz Scarf speed though).
It's also not that difficult to give it a shell smash, with the likes of the afformentioned Clefairy in the tier, or Baton Pass support, dual screen support, you would be surprised at the ease at which Clamperl setsup, and particularly the power it can pump out.

+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Electabuzz: 309-364 (114 - 134.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Fraxure: 624-736 (228.5 - 269.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 212 HP / 0 SpD Arbok: 492-580 (156.6 - 184.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Hidden Power Grass vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Simipour: 524-618 (179.4 - 211.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Articuno: 333-393 (103.7 - 122.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO<--- mental
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Clefairy: 255-300 (74.1 - 87.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO <- that's a lot lol
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Gogoat: 444-524 (98.6 - 116.4%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Metang: 325-384 (100.3 - 118.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Quilladin: 558-658 (171.1 - 201.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Zweilous: 326-384 (93.6 - 110.3%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Surf vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Dusclops: 216-255 (76 - 89.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252 SpA Deep Sea Tooth Clamperl Hidden Power Grass vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Lapras: 376-444 (81 - 95.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO


these were the bulkiest pieces of shit this tier had to offer, and Clamperl sweeps them aside at +2.
The main thing that Clamperl offers that Huntail cannot is a massively powerful Ice Beam. Often, when a Huntail smashes, its life orb Adamant waterfall will do more damage to a resist than its minimal investment ice beam. Clamperl on the other hand offers huge power in its moveset, to the extent where switchins are nonexistent. I guess you could call Marill a counter, or Tentacool, but both take huge damage from surf at +2, and are basically irrelevant.

Due to Clamperls mxiture of immense power and OK enough speed, I think that Clamperl should be promoted to at least C maybe even B Rank in the Viability Rankings, now it is unlisted, and I don't really understand why.
Yeah Clamperl seems interesting. The only reason it has been unranked at this point is because like most Pokemon still not on the VR, there are still many things to test out. Clamperl will definitely get a spot on this list, but I definitely want to test it a bit before I immediately rank it somewhere.
 

Megazard

The turtle moves
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PU Leader
I totally agree with Clefairy going to A+, it's going to leave next tier shift with a huge spike in PU but is great right now. With that, I think Spritzee could stand to drop a rank, lack of Magic Guard in such a hazard centric mega kinda sucks and being forced to run WishTect doesn't give it Clefairy's versatility. Clef has way more options in Knock Off, Twave, CM, Flamethrower, Stealth Rock etc while Spritzee feels a lot more one dimensional right now. Taunt immunity is cool but most of the main Taunt users don't stack up well against Clef anyway, and Krokorok knocks both off. This is 80% theorymon tho, have tested a bit but a lot of this is on paper so I could be all wrong about this.
 
Hi, just sharing a replay and a few thoughts because there's only been one other PUPL replay and I really enjoyed my game vs Mambo, so yeah.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-pu-71159
This is pretty standard matchup for this tier, Mambo bringing a nice looking balance team with picks like Lapras, Regigigas and Quilladin while I brought an offensive team with Pokemon like Lapras, Flareon and offensive Gourgeist-Large. Flareon is really cool right now (and was my favorite pokemon on this team) because it checks Simisear and serves as a slower Rapidash (rip) with a stronger Flare Blitz and access to priority Quick Attack, which still does a number to offensive with its monstrous 130 attack. It also has access to BP which is nice for luring in pokemon like Marshtomp and BPing out to a check. Flareon did a number to his team since his only fire resist was easily 2HKOd and I could pivot into it and absorb Fire Blast, so as long as I weakened stuff with my other breakers I figured I had team matchup. Ultimately, when I lured out Lairon and smacked it with EQ with Seviper it put him in a bad position, which let me keep up the offensive pressure for the rest of the match and finish him off with Flareon. To explain the endgame play, I was worried that for whatever reason he was running max speed Lapras because this was a tournament match and I wanted to be safe as possible, but ultimately because of a waterfall flinch on my Metang I just ended up sacking the rest of my team to Lapras and then risking a roll with Superpower on his Regigigas, and fortunately for me I did get the roll and won. Avalanche Lapras should have clicked for me that it wouldn't be max speed but the result was still the same, I suppose. Overall a pretty cool match showing off pokemon like Charcoal Flareon and physically offensive (I assume AV) Lapras.
 

Gary

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THESE CHANGES WILL NOT EFFECT PUPL.

Okay so I have a pretty big announcement.

The new stats came out today and while we still have to wait until next month for the tier shift, PU has done it again, and decided to gift us with quick drops/fuck us with quick rises. However, I must say the things we lost and the stuff we got was well worth losing one of our favorites....again.

Quick Rises:

Arbok
Simipour
Duosion

Quick Drops:

Stunfisk
Rampardos
Meowstic

We lost Arbok again, which sucks but it happens practically every other tier shift so I expect to see it coming back sometime in the future. Duosion is a pretty cool Pokemon in FU, but it's not THAT relevant, so us losing it wont really effect much of the tier. Simipour is what makes this quick-change so interesting. For months and months PU has been trying to get Simipour to rise, but because the ladder is shitty, they had yet to succeed. Finally Simipour seems to be getting the recognition it deserves in PU as a top tier threat, and now FU will have to adapt to one of its top S rank Pokemon leaving.

Stunfisk is actually a drop I'm really excited for. We had Stunfisk a while ago, and it was a great addition to the tier for its ability to check very notable Pokemon such as Electabuzz, Murkrow, and Viper. It's very bulky, and has access to Stealth Rock, so I can see it carving out a good niche for itself in this tier. Rampardos is back again, and while I felt like it never got as much recognition as it deserved, I really look forward to using it again. Meowstic-M was also a cool support Pokemon to use on HO and it was a staple on teams with Linoone, so that's pretty cool. Meowstic-F is very niche in the current metagame, and I don't see it getting much usage as long as Sticky Web is absent.

So what does this mean for FU? Well with Simipour gone, Golduck will take its place as the premier Water-type in FU, although it's not nearly as good. Lapras will also see some more usage, considering it's a good check to most Water-types and it has very strong STABs as well. Specs Politoed is also really cool, as is the defensive set, although definitely more of the former now that Simipour is gone. Stunfisk finally gives FU something that can heavily punish Electabuzz/Electrode, so that's really cool. I don't expect to see too much of a meta change, but as I said earlier, we will definitely start to see more of a diversity of Water-types as the meta develops.

Please keep in mind though, THESE CHANGES WILL NOT EFFECT PUPL. I REPEAT, THE PUPL FU METAGAME IS NOT AFFECTED BY THIS. So Arbok, Duosion, and Simipour are still legal there, while Stunfisk, Rampardos, and Meowstic are still PU, so if I see anyone using these in a PUPL match, their win wont count. However, outside of PUPL, these changes are 100% legal.
 
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