Resource ORAS NU Viability Rankings

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Ares

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NU VIABILITY RANKING

Welcome to the official NU Viability Ranking thread. If you've visited the Viability Ranking thread for any other tier, you should be familiar with the concept of this thread - we will organize the Pokemon in our tier into ranks, varying on how good they are. You are encouraged to post your thoughts on where Pokemon should be ranked. Please note that each section is going to be in alphabetical order.

The way that rises / drops are decided is through input from the NU Council, your nominations, and my personal experience with these Pokemon.

In order to cut down on shitposting, please do not bandwagon posts. Unless you have new or different experiences to share, you are defending a nomination, or if the nomination has not been discussed for ~3 days, try to avoid repeating the same information someone else said before you.

If you click on an sprite it will take you to the dex page :)


Last Update: May 31st

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Preliminary NU Rankings

S Rank:
Reserved for Pokemon who can sweep or wall significant portions of the metagame with little support, and Pokemon who can support other Pokemon with very little opportunity cost ("free turns"). Also the home of Pokemon who can easily perform multiple roles effectively, increasing their versatility and unpredictability. If the Pokemon in this rank have any flaws, those flaws are thoroughly mitigated by their substantial strengths.



S
Archeops
Klinklang
Tauros
Xatu




A Rank:

Reserved for Pokemon who can sweep or wall significant portions of the metagame, but require some support or have some flaws that prevents them from doing this consistently. Supporting Pokemon in this rank may give opponents free turns or cannot create free turns easily themselves, but can still do their job most of the time.


A+
Garbodor
Jynx
Kabutops
Kangaskhan
Lanturn
Lilligant
Mawile
Mesprit
Musharna
Rhydon
Samurott
Sawk
Uxie



A
Audino (Mega)
Carracosta
Exeggutor
Fletchinder
Gurdurr
Liepard
Ludicolo
Magmortar
Malamar
Pyroar
Scyther
Torterra


A-
Aurorus
Cacturne
Quagsire
Rotom
Swellow
Weezing​


B Rank:

Reserved for Pokemon who cannot sweep through or wall significant portions of the metagame, but can properly fulfill a given offensive/defensive niche. Support Pokemon in this category have flaws that prevent them from doing their job or are setup bait for dangerous sweepers. Pokemon who are partially outperformed by a Pokemon in A or S Rank, but are otherwise very dangerous, may also fall into this category.


B+
Barbaracle
Claydol
Combusken
Electivire
Floatzel
Gourgeist-S
Hariyama
Haunter
Mismagius
Piloswine
Pinsir
Prinplup
Regirock
Tangela
Vivillon
Zangoose


B
Beheeyem
Bouffalant
Crustle
Ferroseed
Golurk
Gourgeist-XL
Kecleon
Pawniard
Pelipper
Poliwrath
Roselia
Rotom-Fan
Sandslash
Vileplume


B-
Articuno
Cryogonal
Flareon
Gorebyss
Granbull
Mantine
Misdreavus
Leafeon
Ninetales
Primeape
Ursaring
Vanilluxe​


C Rank:

Reserved for Pokemon who can be effective given the right support, but either have crippling flaws that prevent them from consistently executing their strategy or are completely eclipsed by a Pokemon in the above ranks.


C+
Arbok
Audino
Avalugg
Chatot
Cradily
Dodrio
Drifblim
Fraxure
Gogoat
Golem
Grumpig
Huntail
Jumpluff
Kadabra
Linoone
Miltank
Muk
Ninjask
Probopass
Raichu
Rampardos
Rapidash
Rotom-Frost
Sawsbuck
Servine
Shedinja
Simipour
Stoutland
Victreebel
Zebstrika
Zweilous


C
Carbink
Ditto
Dusknoir
Frogadier
Hippopotas
Kricketune
Leavanny
Lickilicky
Marowak
Meowstic-M
Mr. Mime
Quilladin
Regice
Simisage
Stunfisk
Swanna


C-
Basculin
Kingler
Lampent
Lapras
Metang
Monferno
Torkoal
Volbeat
Vullaby​


D Rank:

Reserved for Pokemon who have a small niche in the current metagame, but have very noticeable flaws that make them more trouble than they're worth the majority of the time. These Pokemon are, for the most part, daft to use.


D
Ariados
Delibird
Dragonair
Duosion
Dusclops
Frillish
Heatmor
Relicanth
Simisear
Swoobat​


E Rank:

E is for "Everything Else". You should probably not be using Pokemon in this rank.

...everything else. :mad: :pirate: :mad:
 
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soulgazer

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first

ok as much as I like Seismitoad, I think it should drop to A-. Don't feel like writing a huge TLDR man, but its just because its not as good as it used to be and face competition from other good SR setter. lots of mons beat it too so eh.

make Mantine C+ or maybe even B-: its a good mon rn able to switch on Camerupt's STABs, handling waters, Gurdurr, Fire-types, etc. still is a mantine but ey its better rn.

make Walrein D+, its a god and walls GLALIE AND YES THATS A NICHE

DROP MIGHTYENA AND NINJASK IN D HNNG

Regice / Ursaring / Sawsbuck / Beheeyem should be C-

Why is Dodrio not in D-rank?

Rise Serperior a bit. since Sceptile left Serperior is now the only Grass-type that i know of that can outspeed Archeops. Can use a nice SubCM set and since Sceptile is gone, isn't that outclassed with its physical sets. JUMPLUFF ISNT RELEVANT
 
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Ares

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No more Slurpuff and the gigantic rise of Dark-types make Gurdurr slightly better. That would be my guess anyways.

Add Vibrava to D rank pls #BrokeVibrava
Can you maybe give some reasoning as to why provided with maybe some high level replays, cause tbh a problem in the last thread is we would rank things that had the tiniest niche. Unless there is something I'm missing I would rather use multiple other things as defoggers.

Edit @ below: there were some even worse Pokemon that got removed before, and walling m-camerupt would of been a great thing to point out in the initial post as opposed to just saying pls add.
 
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soulgazer

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how is walling M-Camerupt and resisting ground/rock coverage (there's more im sure) a 'tiny' niche ? most of the mons in ranked in D are complete trash so i don't see the problem with adding a Pokemon that can actually do something there

@ above smh

i am mad
 
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trc

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I think Pangoro should be in A+ rank, it's easily one of the most threatening Pokemon in the ORAS meta and I think it fits quite nicely with the rest of the Pokemon in there. Pangoro is brilliant against defense; with Knock Off, Taunt, and Swords Dance, Pangoro is very difficult to wall, as most of its checks lose to specific sets, for example, Weezing loses to Taunt variations, offering a free Swords Dance, or CB Mold Breaker Earthquakes. Offensive teams lack switch ins to Knock Off and typically possess a Pokemon that give Pangoro a free turn, such as Xatu, Liepard, and Uxie, and unlike some other Dark-types, Hariyama isn't a free switch in because Pangoro's Fighting move of choice does a lot. Pangoro has many viable sets, including Scrappy CB, Mold Breaker CB, SD + 3 Attacks, Taunt + SD + 2 Attacks, Iron Fist Taunt + 3 Attacks, and nicher sets like AV and Scarf (I've been surprised by it lol).

I agree with a Seismitoad drop, a Mantine rise, and I also think that Weezing should move down because of most of the things it used to wall being gone, current Pokemon having ways to get around it, and Psychic-type being quite common and can usually switch into it without repercussion. It also gives a free switch into Mega Camerupt too which is not something you want.
 
i would like to see beheeyem raise from C rank to C+ or B-. It can nearly 2-hit ko the tier with analytic psychic and psyshock. It also has access to signal beam for coverage. It is slow but being slow allows it to hit things hard with its ability analytic. Also, it has good bulk which allows it to take hits and drop some ohko's
 
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Alright I have a few comments on the meta after playing it for a bit :D

Mega-Glaile A+ ---> S

This thing is easily the biggest threat in the game with very few things that can switch in. Hariyama is supposed to be a solid response to ice spam but it cant's repeatedly switch in on glalie and typh.

252 Atk Refrigerate Glalie-Mega Double-Edge vs. 0 HP / 128 Def Thick Fat Hariyama: 151-178 (35.1 - 41.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

in addition to that most are able to carry freeze-dry which does a solid amount of damage to water types since it's SpA is also base 120 which is still great uninvested. It can also outspeed most shit and has eq which nails fire types and steel types. Then it has priority ice shard to hit the few things that outspeed it like swellow, accelgor, and archeops. It has access to spikes even though I would not recommend it showing it can run multiple sets effectively.

To build around this just through on something to take care of hazards IE: Xatu, Prinplup, Mantine, Sandslash. Then have stops to shit like pyroar, liepard(?), mismagius, tauros, and common scarfers and you should be good to go.

Pangoro A ---> A+

This thing speaks for itself with it's extremely reliable dual stabs, knock off and drain punch, along with coverage options like gunk shot for fairies (Granbull and Togetic most common atm) It can run scrappy to hit ghosts with drain punch (Only good for situations when ur banded and have to predict. Knock off is solid most timez) or mold breaker to hit weezing with eq. It can run a number of sets including scarf, band, or even swords dance. This thing deserves high honors :}

Mega-Steelix A ---> A+

I made a case about this awhile back so I'm just going to link my other post :}

http://www.smogon.com/forums/posts/5895717/

Mantine C- ---> B+

Huge jump yes but I can fully back up this mon cause it deserves it. Personally I thought it was quite under rated in XY and now with ORAS it counters a lot of mons essential to the metagame. The first major one being camerupt. With the ability to resist both of it's stabs camerupt often will run rock slide to hit it but even that is not very reliable. Second it is the best full counter to smash pass. It comes in and gorebyss cannot do anything to it. If they try to pass you haze. Nice and EZ.

Then u have typhlosion who is easily walled by it, and even musharna which specializes in slow calm mind attacks. Personally I see this as a pretty big factor in the metagame.

Stoutland C- ---> C+

With the addition of mega steelix sand has become a shit ton more viable. In sand this fucker can sweep as soon as you take care of all normal resist suck as steel, rock or ghost types. Rock and steel type will struggle with steelix while stoutland has access to pursuit allowing it to take care of ghost types itself.

The reason I would not put baby hippo up with it is because there are other ways to set sand and stoutland IS STILL USEFUL OUT OF SAND. It has a base 90 speed which is not bad at all and pretty decent bulk. I've even got it to work on non sand teams with scrappy. But if hippo dies this does not become useless even if ur using the sand rush set.

Bouffalant B- ---> B+

I have got to hype this thing. I've been using it lately on one of my most solid squads and it switches in on so much, sets up, and then snags a kill or two. Not only that with dragalge being booted from the tier this is now probably the best response to lilligant. It's coverage options include zen headbutt to hit ghosts, weezing, and plume. Head charge as a reliable and powerful stab. superpower to hit rock and steel types. Or if you want to run a sub set you can use eq and head charge to have coverage of all the things that give u problems :} But the sub set will often struggle with mismagius.
 

After using Qwilfish for a while, I'm going to go ahead and nominate it to go from B+ -> A-. It does a great job of stopping Pangoro (which is on like every team) as long as it's not carrying earthquake. It's also a really good spike stacker if you feel Garbador is too ugly. Speaking of ugly, it works great on stall teams as a stacker that can also force switches on physical sweepers like Glalie, or Zangoose if you're feeling adventurous. You can also run a waterfall on qwilfish to revenge kill mega camerupt.
 
Ludicolo A- --> A
With mega-steelix running around, in general a lot of things have troubled to beat this pokemon. In general ludicolo is A- for multiple reasons;
typing, benefits from rain, power with hydro + life orb, in general a solid mon. I feel that in Oras, it has an added niche of being a very reliable switch in on mega-steelix which has been quite the hit on ladder as far as I can tell. Resisting both stabs with the ability to knock it out. Yes, it does hurt from a heavy slam, however you can change spread easily to adapt to this or even make a completely versatile set with synthesis or running hp. Basically, it has a new niche which i feel puts it above the A- rank pokemon putting it with the big boys at A. In general I feel that weather is a lot more dangerous as less people are preparing for rain and more people are preparing for these new pokemon which makes it even more successful at its job.

Not gonna go into too much detail but a few more things that I will suggest and will add to when I have time:

Pangoro A --> A+ / S ; this thing is complete monster to balance teams and hyper offense depending on set. Drain punch v-v-v-v- good

Mega-steelix A --> A+ ; really dangerous mon in the tier, bulky, powerful, versatile with sets + utility, although it's slow it is still a monster

Mega-audino A --> A+ ; from experience on ladder, it's certainly an extremely dangerous mon now... 1 calm mind which it can do rather easily and it could potentially sweep teams with it's power... it has no "counter". Either cro-dino sits there and sets up on you or you switch steelix in thinking it's cro-dino and you get bopped by a fire blast.

Hariyama A+ --> S ; Was just a matter of time. This pokemon is the best team mate in NU, it can fit on any team, resists ice, fire, dual priority, powerful, versatile with ability of guts + thick fat and in my opinion definitely is my preferred choice to kanga, which was the previous go-to priority user. Its defensive capabilities are insane right now with both fire spam + mega-glalie. Also, since dragalge + altaria have gone, it's by far the best switch into typhlosion in the tier (one of very few that are able to force typh out) and for this deserves S rank imo.
 

Ares

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Hariyama A+ --> S ; Was just a matter of time. This pokemon is the best team mate in NU, it can fit on any team, resists ice, fire, dual priority, powerful, versatile with ability of guts + thick fat and in my opinion definitely is my preferred choice to kanga, which was the previous go-to priority user. Its defensive capabilities are insane right now with both fire spam + mega-glalie. Also, since dragalge + altaria have gone, it's by far the best switch into typhlosion in the tier (one of very few that are able to force typh out) and for this deserves S rank imo.
I disagree with this for a number of reasons; it is easily worn down throughout a match wanting to check multiple things when placed on a team and can only switch in so many times to things like Typhlosion and other things it wants to check. It's dual priority is no longer that great, it was really good as a way to check Slurpuff, but with that mon having left the tier an unSTAB Bullet Punch and Fake Out are rather underwhelming when it comes to priority and other mons like Kangaskhan can do the whole double priority much better. It struggles to muscle past its counters and has to decide on its last move slot to try and beat certain things, i.e. Fake Out / Ice Punch / Heavy Slam / Earthquake. It also really struggles with Mega Glalie as right now you have to invest in Defense to avoid a 2HKO and even then it comes close to a 2HKO with 128 Defense investment, while Explosion can easily take it out with a Return + Explosion. Like I said it wants to check way to much and is easily worn down, not worthy of S rank in my eyes.
 

soulgazer

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Why are you guys already discussing S-rank? I know we posted the Viability Rankings, but its still too early to tell whats really S and whats just something you guys are hyping because it did well in the first few weeks of ORAS lol

edit: inb4 'but sg, you suggested stuff to drop and rise too D:' well bro there's a difference between S and the rest sigh

and quoting the OP:
S-Rank is being left open for now because the meta is still young and changing and nothing is a clear cut fit for this rank right now.
 
A ----> A+
Camerupt is a great new addition to NU, being one of the best wallbreakers around, as not much wants to take a SF Fire Blast. Earth Power and HP Grass hit things that could potentially wall it. I would say S (when the time to discuss that comes) but its Speed is lackluster, as even if it has no switchins, it can't take a hit 1v1 from things like Water types that would otherwise be nuked by the coverage mentioned above. Its defensive capabilities are no slouch either, as aside from super effective moves, it can take some hits pretty well.
 
Aurorus is actually a decent Pokemon now with Hyper Voice and Earth Power. Life Orb + Rock Polish works as a late game sweeper, and despite its awful typing it has more than enough bulk to set up on anything lacking a super effective move.
 
can probably go up to A rank. It is still as awesome and underrated as it was at the and of XY. Then people only ran Hariyama as their Ice resistance and it was completely fucked over by Psyshock on the switch paving the way for a lot of stuff. Now with Glalie in the tier (which is probably the best mon we have and can probably go to S in the future as ppl already said) she is a key component of Ice spam teams with her access to a reliable sleep move to take out possible Ice checks and STAB Psyshock to help break through Bulky Water-types. As a Psychic-type she has the amazing ability to donk Pangoro with its strong Ice-STAB making her unique in that role too. The Choice Scarf set is still an awesome revenge killer even with two less targets to hit in Lopunny and Sceptile and is a solid answer to threats such as SD Feraligatr (if you have Eball or is a bit weakened) and outspeeding +1 Lilligant and Vivillon. The Focus Sash set was also great in XY but i haven't tested it in ORAS yet and i don't see how it could have gotten worse. Overall this mon is pretty unpredictable in what Item and moves shes running and her matchup against common threats and niche over other Psychic- and Ice-types makes her worthy of A.

In my opinion Huntail isn't really that worse than Gorebyss to be 4 ranks below anymore. Now that it got Sucker Punch it is able to get around Choice Scarf user such as Jynx and a strong priority move that hits all the Psychic-types in the tier for decent damage is actually pretty cool. Gorebyss has always been put higher in VR because of its better offensive movepool having a strong Hydro Pump and Ice Beam but i guess that now with the new tool Huntail got it could rise to B+ as they are exactly as threatening when Baton Passing.
I think Weezing should go down to B+. Now that Slurpuff and mega Lopunny are gone it doesn't really check as many threats to be still worth using on so many teams. It isn't that good of a switch in to Pangoro as CB and even Life Orb Knock Off do all around 50% and remove its Leftovers while Taunt and SD sets just set up on it or OHKO if they SD as it comes in most of the time. Mega Glalie simply 2HKOs Weezing with Adamant Double Edge after Stealth Rock especially if its running Rocky Helmet (which is cool i guess but limits his limited recovery even more LOL). Weezing also gives a free switch in (and kill depending on the team) to the very threatening Mega Camerupt. And then there are Psychic-types, Guts users, Garbodor that just stacks on it... still ok but drop imo

I also agree on Camerupt rising to A+ and Glalie to S in the future while i have some doubts on Mantine really :/
 
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Quite Quiet

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A- > B+/B Can we drop this already? It's outperformed as a wallbreaker by Pangoro, who have the same Attack, better bulk and STAB Knock Off. The extra speed doesn't make much difference against defensive teams since Pangoro still outspeed the same walls Sawk do. Sawk can't even boost its attack fast enough to make a difference with either. It even have a worse match up vs Granbull since Pjab can fail to 2hko while LO+ Pangoro always 2hko with Gunk Shot.

It's still a great wallbreaker, don't get me wrong but it just seem worse than Pangoro in every relevant way except for some niche sets like Sturdy Scarf. But it's outdone by a better mon, which is pretty much spot on for B+.
 

Punchshroom

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make Walrein D+, its a god and walls GLALIE AND YES THATS A NICHE
So why use this over Lapras, which actually has relevant moves like Freeze-Dry and Heal Bell plus greater versatility and even overall stats, to hammer home the fact how outclassed Walrein is. Why even rank Walrein at all?

Why is Dodrio not in D-rank?
Initial damage over Swellow (and any other Flying-type in the tier) is notable, as is its access to Knock Off and Pursuit to allow it to perform supportive offensive roles. I mean being a strong offensive Flying-type is already pretty good for Dodrio, not sure why you'd want to drop it lower than the likes of Dusclops and Avalugg.

Also, Pangoro to A+; it is easily the most effective wallbreaker in the tier right now, the most powerful Knock Off in the tier, Drain Punch to keep itself from being whittled down, and as assortment of other moves to help it wallbreak much more effectively, such as Taunt, Gunk Shot, Mold Breaker Earthquake, and even Substitute. Pangoro is easily capable of manhandling almost every defensively oriented team with its Swords Dance set alone, with its scarce responses varying simply based on the 4th move it carries. With some minimal speed control support (Trick Room, Sticky Web, Baton Pass, even Tailwind), Pangoro can very easily lay the hurt on offensive teams as well due to its wonderful STAB combo that offensive teams have very little answers for.
 
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Raseri

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because Walrein has Thick Fat which lets it check Fire-types as well :) not a great niche, but its still a niche worth mentioning. If Lapras was fat I would drop Walrein for sure


Things that I'd like to see changed:

  • Mega Glalie to S-rank: Yeah I support this. The meta is young but right now Glalie is the king, it kills everything and isn't afraid of Soulgazer.
  • Pangoro to A+: Also support, not only is it really strong, its also versatile. I've seen a bunch of different sets run, though they all have a lot in common, the choices you do make with Pangoro really changes what beats it. Its also not frail which is nice.
  • Mantine up to B-. B+ is to high for it imo, its definitely good now, and way better than it was in XY, but its still complete fodder for a lot of things, and weak to SR which really limits its walling potential. Good mon tho
  • Typhlosion down to A: It just doesnt kill things as well right now. There are even more Hariyamas than usual, Mega Camerupt can eat a few hits. It just isnt as effective right now as it was before
Other changes I'd like to see discussed:

Dropping Gorebyss and raising Huntail to the same rank: Now that Huntail can use SMash + Sucker the difference between then shouldnt be so pronounced. What rank should it be?
Dropping Musharna and Weezing: Both arent as good right now as they were in the past. I think both should be around B-rank, they arent bad, but Weezing is complete MegaRupt bait, and Musharna is Pangoro bait unless it runs Gleam, then its losing vs a lot of other things
Kecleon: What do we do with it? I think B- is a little low, I think it would fit in nice at B-rank, but im not adamant on iit.
 

soulgazer

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I hate you guys

:(

ok then, M-Glalie and M-Camerupt to S!

anything else is trash haha

edit: you guys needs to use Hidden Power Water Weezing :)
 
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Lord Alphose

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Pertaining to what Ras said, I actually think that Kecleon fits well into B-. It does have a great damage output, true, but I just see so many Fighting-types everywhere that I've never had trouble with a Kecleon. Pangoro got buffed, leading to a huge spike in usage, Gurdurr, Hariyama, and Sawk are loving no Slurpuff, and so I'm think that stays.
 
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For the record I think Huntail is better than Gorebyss now. You're never using Gorebyss to sweep because it's still too slow even after a boost, and you can actually attempt to sweep with Huntail because Sucker Punch. In terms of SmashPass, they both do that job identically well because the only difference in their stat spreads is with their Attack and Special Attack. Huntail is also a slightly better Coil user because of Water Veil and higher Attack.
 
  • Typhlosion down to A: It just doesnt kill things as well right now. There are even more Hariyamas than usual, Mega Camerupt can eat a few hits. It just isnt as effective right now as it was before
Dropping Musharna and Weezing: Both arent as good right now as they were in the past. I think both should be around B-rank, they arent bad, but Weezing is complete MegaRupt bait, and Musharna is Pangoro bait unless it runs Gleam, then its losing vs a lot of other things
Dropping typhlosion and musharna, very much disagree.

Musharna is still a monster, it is no where near B- bait, i'd very much keep it at A- for a few very good niches it's gained from ORAS being around; you have psyshock + calm mind, meaning you can beat cro-dino in calm mind wars, hence beating it nicely. The second niche is against the "king of the tier" (i think it's still kinda meh as a mega but oh well) as you can switch in reliably on mega-glalie;

252+ Atk Refrigerate Glalie Frustration vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Musharna: 180-213 (41.2 - 48.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Refrigerate Glalie Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Musharna: 193-228 (44.2 - 52.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
or the most common spread for m-glalie;
252 Atk Refrigerate Glalie Frustration vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Musharna: 165-195 (37.8 - 44.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Of course you're not going to live explosion, but nothing in the game does really tbh. These + the ability to run dazzling gleam to stop pangoro is easily reasonable to keep it at A-, not to mention the fact it still beats every other calm mind user in the tier, it's not gotten any worse at all.

For typhlosion, well the answer is simple;
Previously I have been completely against this poke becoming S rank, which it shouldn't, but after using it a lot in the ORAS NU scene right now, i can easily tell it's just as good as it was before, if not potentially better. For a number of reasons, it should stay A+;
Due to tiering changes, dragalge + altaria have gotten out of nu, meaning that if you don't run a hariyama, your whole team gets 2 hit ko'd or ohko'd. That's disregarding the odd prinplups you see, but even then, hariyama REALLY doesn't like typhlosion right now. Since it's running mixed defenses to beat mega-glalie, it simply doens't like taking eruptions.
252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 128 SpD Assault Vest Thick Fat Hariyama: 136-162 (31.7 - 37.7%) -- 90.8% chance to 3HKO
2 good predictions and you've destroyed their whole team with typhlosion, not to mention you can force out mega-glalie if they're adamant.
Not only does it poop on mega-glalie, but also mega-steelix which is becoming hugely popular with their specially defensive sets, meaning that if they're running spdef steelix, it's going to become increasingly hard to kill especially if they have rest-talk curse, heavy slam which is more dangerous than you think on paper.

And Soulgazer , mega-camel is outclassed by typh on offensive teams as it is way too slow to use well on balance or even in general. Yes it gets sheer force earth power and fire blast, but it's slow as shit and can't outspeed the most common of walls and still gets forced out by hariyama in most scenarios. It's really not that threatening as it is easily outsped and damage output is still weaker than typhlosion as typh gets options of specs + outspeeding for eruptions. As a wallbreaking fire type, it's really not that great at all, definitely NOT S rank material.
 
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