ORAS UU Viability Ranking Thread M2

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aim

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credits to Meru for the previous Viability Ranking OP

Welcome to the UnderUsed Viability Thread! The preliminary rankings for each metagame (every three months, or any other important release) will be decided on by a handpicked group of people who have shown a deep and relevant understanding of the metagame and contributed to the last UU Viability thread. This group, though, is obviously subject to change.

So where do you come in? Well, after the preliminary rankings have been worked out by us, it's the entire community's job to refine those rankings to more accurately reflect the true viability of all relevant Pokemon in the UU metagame. Because our guesses will come before much meaningful experience using Pokemon will have occured, we can't be accurate enough without your help. Post about the Pokemon that you're experienced using, but try not to let your personal bias oversell any Pokemon.

Another key change is in the definition and variety of ranks available. While the S and A tiers still mostly reflect the best of the best Pokemon in the metagame, the B tier is now slightly more expansive, with the B+ tier representing Pokemon that are fairly common and threatening, and the B- tier representing Pokemon who fill minor, but relevant niches. Below this B tier, we have a new generic C tier that displays all Pokemon that are usable in UU, but don't have a niche that is appreciated by most teams in UU. There will now be a D-rank, however this will function like the E-rank of other viability threads, and will only include Pokemon that are currently in the UU tier. The broad-based lower tier serves as a measure to counteract the extreme subjectivity that occurs historically when discussing Pokemon that people have very little experience using.

credits to alexwolf for the base definitions

S Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are almost flawless in the UnderUsed metagame. These Pokemon are usually able to perform a variety of roles effectively, or can just do one extremely well. Their use has low risk involved and almost always brings a high reward. Pokemon in this rank have very few flaws that are more than made up for by numerous positive traits.

Mega Aerodactyl
Feraligatr
Hydreigon
Mega Pidgeot


A Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are fantastic in the UnderUsed metagame, and can sweep, support, or wall significant portions of the metagame. These Pokemon require less support than most others to be used effectively and have few flaws that can easily be compensated for when compared to their positive traits.

A+ Rank


Entei
Krookodile
Mamoswine
Mienshao
Salamence
Suicune


A Rank

Mega Ampharos
Mega Beedrill
Mega Blastoise
Chandelure
Cobalion
Cresselia
Crobat
Empoleon
Florges
Forretress
Heracross
Nidoqueen
Porygon2
Reuniclus
Shaymin
Slowking
Snorlax
Mega Swampert
Whimsicott


A- Rank

Mega Abomasnow
Mega Aggron
Azelf
Chesnaught
Dragalge
Heliolisk
Infernape
Kyurem
Lucario
Mandibuzz
Rotom-C
Mega Sharpedo
Slurpuff
Swampert
Tentacruel
Tyrantrum


B Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are good in the UnderUsed metagame. These Pokemon have more notable flaws than those above them that affect how they function in the tier. They can all still function very well given the right team support, but they have numerous flaws that minimize their impact on the tier.

B+ Rank


Mega Absol
Bronzong
Darmanitan
Doublade
Froslass
Haxorus
Machamp
Nidoking
Porygon-Z
Qwilfish
Rhyperior
Roserade
Mega Sceptile
Seismitoad
Tornadus
Yanmega


B Rank

Alomomola
Arcanine
Aromatisse
Dugtrio
Escavalier
Honchkrow
Jellicent
Magneton
Meloetta
Noivern
Pangoro
Rotom-H
Sharpedo
Shuckle
Toxicroak
Umbreon


B- Rank

Aerodactyl
Amoonguss
Blissey
Donphan
Drapion
Fletchinder
Galvantula
Mega Glalie
Gligar
Goodra
Granbull
Mega Houndoom
Kingdra
Moltres
Tangrowth
Vaporeon
Virizion
Zoroark


C Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that have small niches in the UnderUsed metagame, but have numerous notable flaws that prevent them from being effective the majority of the time. Pokemon in the C tier require extensive support to be effective. Pokemon from this rank tend to face a lot of competition with the more commonly used Pokemon, or their niches aren't all too useful for the current metagame.

Blastoise
Braviary
Mega Camerupt
Cloyster
Cofagrigus
Durant
Emboar
Espeon
Exploud
Flygon
Gourgeist (Super)
Hitmonlee
Jolteon
Milotic
Mismagius
Quagsire
Spiritomb
Mega Steelix
Togetic
Weezing
Xatu


D rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are still in the UnderUsed tier, but are, simply put, ineffective in this meta.
Trevenant
 
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WHY is crobat A rank. it's not bad, move it back up to A+ imo
edit: vap b- rank????????????????????????
edit 2: ok why have some things changed that i don't think were even discussed on the last thread.
 

Sam

i say it's all just wind in sails
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Some changes were made in #uucouncil for the new thread
 
Put simply: Vaporeon isn't good anymore. Actually, it was never good. It was kind of mediocre and overhyped because it came down from OU, but then people realized it isn't good. I could see it going to RU in the future...

As for why, Alomomola outclasses it almost completely as a wish-passer. The immense physical bulk is much more appreciated than Vaporeon's extra special bulk, and the weak scalds aren't a big hindrence for Alo because scald is only really used to burn. Vaporeon has trouble walling most physical attackers when its physically bulky, and if it's specially bulky it doesn't wall anything important. With Alomomola being the premier physical wall water, and Suicune being the premier mixed-physical wall (which can also support teams with the roar set), there's no reason to use vaporeon. Any niche Vaporeon has over one, the other does much better.

Finally, Vap has 4mss. It has to choose between losing to Cune or losing to dragons, or being unable to support teams with heal bell.
 

Sam

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RE: Crobat

Crobat's rock weakness kind of undermines it as both a Fighting-type counter and a Defogger. It still performs its roles well but isn't really exceptional. Not to mention losing 100% of the time to the best mon in the tier (Mega Aero).
 

Thisbemyalt

Shiba sucks
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Can I ask why Mega amph is still A? I really question its ability to outclass the other megas I don't know if its been brought up but I honestly could see it moving down
 
I see Tyrantrum still isn't ranked. Tyrantrum for A- or B+. Head Smash hits so fucking hard (I think Darm's Flare Blitz and Mienshao's Reckless HJK are the only stronger attacks in UU) that it does silly stuff like 2HKO Suicune with a Life Orb and Jolly nature. Meanwhile, it pretty much invalidates Crobat's existence, and with Cleric support you pretty much invalidate Entei as well, as well as damn near every other Pokemon that would conceivably be locked into a Fire-type attack.

EDIT: Goddammit, Volbeat.
 

YABO

King Turt
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Can I ask why Mega amph is still A? I really question its ability to outclass the other megas I don't know if its been brought up but I honestly could see it moving down
2 words
Mega...Pidgeot
But forreal Amph is pretty underrated atm. Everyone is selling it short but it's still incredibly difficult to switch into and possesses crazy bulk.
 

Wanka

a suh
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The only thing I could say is that Mega Aggron and Mega amph could be switched or at least just put ggron up to reg A. Mega aggron is just a literal tank and can be supported with a cleric very nicely. Filter is an awesome ability for it and its a really good phazer and rocker while still having an offensive presence with a high natural attack and heavy slam. I honestly cant rlly say much about amph as I really dont see it much on the ladder. I could see it doing a good amount of work but im really just unsure about it if anything but that isnt as concerning as what I said about aggron. I firmly think it should be A but A- isnt aweful for it.
 

YABO

King Turt
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Also, why is Shedinja not included on this list? That thing is a savage that takes lives like no other. It quite literally has the ability to dismantle teams if played well and proper team support. Several people have used it to great ladder success (Hogg hit top 10 or something, DMT hit like #3 at one point, Bob the Bro peaked high on ladder, and I hit #1 with it). I understand it's a niche mon that doesn't work in every situation but neither does something like Golbat or Ditto.
 
Also, why is Shedinja not included on this list? That thing is a savage that takes lives like no other. It quite literally has the ability to dismantle teams if played well and proper team support. Several people have used it to great ladder success (Hogg hit top 10 or something, DMT hit like #3 at one point, Bob the Bro peaked high on ladder, and I hit #1 with it). I understand it's a niche mon that doesn't work in every situation but neither does something like Golbat or Ditto.
Golbat and Ditto don't faint because of switching in on a hazard not named Sticky Web or a status moves though
 
I don't mind having MAmph where it is because it can cause problems for three of the most popular mons in the tier, MPidg, Suicune and MAero, and I like that it can take a +1 Ice Punch from Gatr, so if it's healthy it will always force it out (and well, if Gatr is DD and not SD). But yeah, there's a lot of really popular momentum against it I think, and it comes at relatively big opportunity cost considering it means you aren't using MAero, MSnow, or MPidg all of whom I think are "better" just in a sense of how they relatively compete against what is currently popular on the ladder.

So A- might not be bad for it, but A isn't really bad either.
 

aim

pokeaimMD
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Also, why is Shedinja not included on this list? That thing is a savage that takes lives like no other. It quite literally has the ability to dismantle teams if played well and proper team support. Several people have used it to great ladder success (Hogg hit top 10 or something, DMT hit like #3 at one point, Bob the Bro peaked high on ladder, and I hit #1 with it). I understand it's a niche mon that doesn't work in every situation but neither does something like Golbat or Ditto.
It is waaaaay to dependent on hazards being gone and requires an incredible amount of support to even function properly plus it is incredibly weak and threatened by the most popular mons in the tier.
 
I know Blissey can be used as setup bait for a lot of things, but it covers far too much ground and provides far too much utility for stall to be B-. It's an easy B imo and fits in snuggly with the equally set-up bait alomomola.
 

Wanka

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Yeah that actually makes sense now I think about it, amph is good where it's at. I still stand my ground about aggron tho!!!!
 

aim

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I know Blissey can be used as setup bait for a lot of things, but it covers far too much ground and provides far too much utility for stall to be B-. It's an easy B imo and fits in snuggly with the equally set-up bait alomomola.
blissey is just not good atm fren. Reuniclus and Suicune, the former rising in popularity, just beat it entirely. Stall already has trouble with Reuniclus as it is. It can't switch into special attackers like Hydreigon as they can just take it out with Superpower after. Encore + Psyshock fodder for Alakazam. Refresh Work up Pidgeot and Sub CM Cress all smack it. It is just easily set up on and way too passive and right now stall isn't very good in UU as is and that's where you wanna use blissey. We feel UU has come to the point where Blissey is just not very good lol.
 
Was there any council discussion about Mega Pidgeot's placement? A+ certainly suits it, but a strong case can be made that its Hurricane/Work Up/Roost/Refresh set is S rank worthy. I'm too lazy (and outright bad) to make this case but it's a hot topic in the NP thread right now and I'm wondering if there was any discussion about it on the back end.
 
I would like to see Mega Pidgeot go from A+ --> S.



My reasoning behind Mega Pidgeot going to S rank is due to the tiers lack of viable flying resists. The only pokemon that stop Pidgeot in the tier are Empoleon, SpDef Rotom-H(weak to rocks),Ampharos (to an extend due to its lack of recovery), and fat mons such as Snorlax and Blissey. Pokemon like Umbreon can get torn apart by the Work Up set, especially with refresh. Pidgeot functions well against every play-style, especially offensive due to it out-speeding 95% of the tier. I am not going to go ahead and state what you already know, like the 100% hurricane with 30% chance to confuse, but I would like to point out that Pidgeot can be a great Defog user as well due to how Pidgeot forces so many switches. That option is very nice in a tier like UU which tend to struggle to find a hazard remover that is not dead-weight to the team. Pidgeot can be built around with very little team support and does its job, as a fast hard hitting special attacker, the most effective in the tier. I do not see any glaring flaw having it stay in A+.
 

IronBullet

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The main thing keeping Mega Pidgeot from going to S is the fact that it is utterly helpless against the best and most used Pokemon in the tier, Mega Aero. If Aero wasn't around then I have no doubts bird jesus would be S rank material, but just the mere presence of Aero is what pushes is down to A+.
 
Not really okay with having pert and toad in the same rank, toad's two niches that give it use over pert is knock off and an answer to crocune in water absorb. While cune can just PP stall it out. Swampert is a bit more superior because of the bulk and more of a offensive presence in band. I nom pert to go to A or Toad to go to B+. Also get sceptile outta B+, the meta is way too bulky offensive Oriented, things take hits then flat out ohko. (Entei, Nidoqueen, Crobat, etc) ps I typed this with my face.
 
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