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Project OU Theorymon [Voting: Check Post #3272]

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Okay.

Hydreigon + Protean
I don't find this that interesting. Yeah at face value it is and no doubt it's a stupidly good buff, but my problem is we've already had a Pseudo-Legendary Dragon with Protean win a previous slate. I know that generally for voting we assume that these are the only things entering OU rather than all at the same time; but to me a submission and definitely a winner has to offer something interesting and unique we haven't seen before, and to me this is way too similar to a previous submission to be interesting. I know, I know; it's a more offensively inclined version while Goodra is more defensive, but their function and concept is still way too similar to me. Also yeah as people have been saying this would probably be fuckin broke :U

Aromatisse + Fairy/Poison
... meh? I mean... alright, I guess? I would like to see the reasoning behind this submission but honestly I can't see anything particularly interesting beyond fairy that resists fairy. At first I was attracted to this because it is a unique typing we've never seen before, but at the same time I'm questioning what it really does for it - hell, at face value Fairy/Steel seems to outclass it completely. I'm not sure what the submitter was going for here.

Poliwrath + No Guard
I'm... really not liking this one either, sorry. I know my post right now seems to just be completely whiny - and I swear there's a light at the end of the tunnel - but I've gotta be honest on what I feel about these. This submission just seems more annoying than anything; mirroring the lower-ladder trend of No Guard Machamp Dynamicpunch. A 100% guaranteed sleep and confusion on something which can afford to invest in decent defences with a good defensive typing is not something I want to see, sorry. Also, ah... to me this is completely ignoring the one possible niche Poliwrath could actually have in OU in general; that being it's utilizing of Water Absorb. I'd prefer to see something that builds upon that rather than something that just makes it irritating to fight.

Granbull + Fur Coat
I promised a light at the end of the tunnel and here it is. I fucking adore this one. I had a brief little stint in NU using a balance team with Granbull and it was such a fun team player with Intimidate; this'll just make it better. Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think we really have a physical tank Fairy in OU so again, this is an interesting submission - it complements it's already good traits of a nice support movepool in Heal Bell and Thunder Wave, some lovely offensive presence with Play Rough and a typing which has time and again proven it's worth. This would be a brilliant addition to balance IMO and is definitely what I'll be voting for.
 
Hey guys, I'm interrupting discussion briefly to let you know about something cool that's going to happen soon. We're getting a challenge ladder on Pokemon Showdown. I will be posting a thread in Other Metagames later tonight where we will have a ladder discussion. After 5 months, we're finally going to get a chance to see our hard work in action!

I'm very excited about this next step forward for our project, and I want to thank every one of you because without you, it wouldn't be possible at all.

Thanks guys :D

Sun King
 
TheBraveGallade said:
Sooo. The only high ranking ou poke that can counter hydrygon is a bulky manaphy. That proceeds to either kill you or tail glow.
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Not really a counter, as it stands a solid chance of being 2HKO'd... But it might survive.

Also, basically everything faster than Hydreigon is OHKO'd. Pretty much all of the 2HKOs are things that are outsped. AV Raikou/Torn-T are the only things that both outspeed and reliably avoid an OHKO. So yeah - nothing switches into this.
 
Thanks guys :D

spoderman
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corrected, thank me by liking this n_n
also, i liked this slate as well, balanced with 2 offensive and 2 defensive buffs, nothins trollish/annoying/murder-worthy like poison heal gastro(apologies to whover proposed it, it's just my dislike in general). looking forward to the ladder and other awesome slates, i'll prolly just spectate tho. Recreant ima watch you play n_n

ps: who the fk posted before me ima kill you!!

e: oh it's Hogg, sorry bro i wont harm you :]
 
SparksBlade said:
i'll prolly just spectate tho. Recreant ima watch you lose n_n
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Fixed

I know i'm not an important member of council or anything, but this is honestly really, really exciting to me. Thank you all for the massive amount of participation. I remember the day this thread was first posted, and me, and even Mysteria, thought it would just be something that got buried in the depths of nothingness. Thank you for everybody who submits theorymons and thank you for being so amazing.

Related to the slate: Hydregion wrecks. As people have said, there are literally 0 switch ins to this thing. Not to mention that, upon changing type, it loses its quad weakness to Fairy. I know this is a very small detail but it's something I thought I'd say .^.
 
So many hydregion sets! He's definitely gonna get my vote this slate, if only from personal bias.
Aromatise doesnt really get anything useful IMO,
Poliwrath sounds pretty cool, but I dont know whether it makes him OU worthy.
Last but not least, granbul. Scary good physical wall, but too passive for my tastes. Also, mixed attackers hurt him badly.
 
ksr15 said:
So many hydregion sets! He's definitely gonna get my vote this slate, if only from personal bias.
Aromatise doesnt really get anything useful IMO,
Poliwrath sounds pretty cool, but I dont know whether it makes him OU worthy.
Last but not least, granbul. Scary good physical wall, but too passive for my tastes. Also, mixed attackers hurt him badly.
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I wouldn't exactly call Granbull passive. Base 125 Attack with Play Rough and access to crippling moves like Thunder Wave is active enough to scare off a shit ton of things even if they can get around Fur Coat (either by SE move, Mold Breaker, or special attack).
 
Guess I'll post my thoughts!

Fairy-Poison Aromatisse:

Those additional sexy 4x fighting and bug resistance (u-turn) allows it to be a really handy Mega Hera check (not so relevant now I guess):

252 Atk Mega Heracross Pin Missile (5 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Aromatisse: 60-70 (14.7 - 17.2%) -- possible 8HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

252 Atk Mega Heracross Rock Blast (5 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Aromatisse: 160-190 (39.4 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

The added grass resistance makes it a solid switch into Breloom:

252 Atk Technician Breloom Bullet Seed (3 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Aromatisse: 81-96 (19.9 - 23.6%) -- possible 5HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Technician Breloom Rock Tomb vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Aromatisse: 87-103 (21.4 - 25.3%) -- possible 5HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

While a Sp Def set now avoids a 2HKO from Gengar (although it can't do much back)

252 SpA Life Orb Gengar Sludge Wave vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Aromatisse: 173-204 (42.6 - 50.2%) -- 35.5% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

The problem is that for all the benefits that it adds, the added ground weakness does really counter balance it, as Earthquake is a common coverage move.

No Guard Poliwrath:

God this would be annoying. A great defensive typing and solid status moves in scald, hypnosis, and dynamic punch, this would be a nightmare. As an added bonus, and something that I don't think has been mentioned, is that hypnosis AFFECTS GRASS TYPES, unlike spore. so 100% acc sleep is 100% acc sleep :) Great just for putting Breloom, Ferro, Celebi and Amoongus switch-ins to sleep.

Fur Coat Granbull:

THAT BULK.

I think people are underestimating the power of this. No reliable recovery sucks, but:

252 SpA Life Orb Latios Psyshock vs. 248 HP / 232+ Def Fur Coat Granbull: 76-90 (19.8 - 23.4%) -- possible 5HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Yes please.

252 SpA Keldeo Scald vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Granbull: 127-151 (33.1 - 39.4%) -- 100% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

A bulk up set would be lush, or just use it as a physical wall; it has great synergy with a number of wish passers. That ChanBull core :)

Protean "Who needs Hidden Power?" Hydreigon

YES PLEASE.

As an offensive player, this is such a dream come true. As proven by numerous previous posters, there are almost no switch-ins to this beast. What hasn't been emphasized though, it how much Hydreigon would benefit from losing it's dual typing. It makes it so difficult to check, either as a mono Dragon, Steel, or Fire type, and almost forces the opponent to revenge. We always complain about mono-typing offensively, but protean just blows that out of the water; Hydreigon can viably use moves of the best offensive and defensive typings in the game (apart from Fairy). Hydreigon differs from Greninja in that even though it is a lot slower, Hydreigon can use more typings with higher BP moves (Dragon, Water, Fire, Steel, Ground, Dark, Rock, Fighting, Bug, Steel, Normal, and Psychic are all covered by U-turn or at least 80BP moves).

While a Special/Mixed set will be the most popular, it can now run a viable Band Set, with high powered-moves like Head Smash, Outrage, Earthquake, Superpower, Aqua Tail, and Return complemented by elemental fang coverage.

It can also run a sexy support set, using T-wave, Taunt, and other moves.

The possibilities are just endless (when you ignore opportunity cost), but stall will be forced to run a 'mon to revenge it/threaten it with Toxic/T-wave.


P.S. Congrats Sun King!!
 
I really don't get Iron Miss on Hydra. What makes it better than a max 252 Timid Flash Cannon? If I need to kill a fairy, and have already become resistant to what was once a 4x weakness, why do I need so much power unless it has fire coverage?

You don't even need Atk investment. Chansey and Heatran are both 2Hkoed by neg nature, 0 Atk Super Power anyway. Even if Heatran doesn't lose enough health to be 2HKOd, its Balloon is now popped, meaning Earth Power kills it regardless. If I'm not mistaken, birdspam is in decline, meaning less things to fly over a potential Earth Power.


It's funny how I'm advertising so much for a mon I don't even plan to vote for.
 
Iron Tail OHKOs Specs Sylveon and can help you muscle past a boosted Clefable, but Flash Cannon is probably better overall.

0 Atk Life Orb Protean Hydreigon Iron Tail vs. 244 HP / 0 Def Sylveon: 416-491 (106.1 - 125.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
 
Iron Tail doesn't have its strength reduced after a Draco, and it helps against specially defensive Pokémon that resist superpower such as Mew.

EDIT: Also, AV Azumarill can tank two Flash Cannons, and two rounds of LO damage + Waterfall + Aqua Jet KOs in return.
 
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Yeah, gratz, Sun King! btw, sorry for the unfounded statement earlier. hard to research on my tiny cell phone screen
upload_2015-3-18_20-4-1.png

yeah, it's tinier than it looks too.
 
Guys, please vote for Fur Coat Granbull, I want to use it on the ladder damn it!

I feel the ladder is going to be cool since there is now a reason for you to argue what mon you like the most, the ability to use it on ladder, which is cool.
 
Being my first true discussion on this thread, I think this slate is interesting and find it rather funny that there are 2 fairies, a Dragon, and a fightng type. Fairy pls Nerf.

Protean Hydreigon
I guess it's cool, but I just feel that since Hydreigon doesn't have too good of a speed stat due to our almost typical 115, it just seems not beneficial to the ability without a scarf. And even then, you have to predict correctly. STAB on every move is pretty good, especially with Life Orb, but this just seems like a slower, worse typing, bulkier Greninja. Not my cup of tea to be completely honest. (Also Scar Keld utterly destroys this thing.)

No Guard + Poliwrath

I actually quite like this idea, even better if Poliwrath had a bit better typing and move pool. It's slow, guaranteed Sleep status on your foes is still rather risky though since you don't know if you'll survive the incoming attack. As Kurona said, it's pretty much mimicking Machamp, but less heavy hitting and sleep. Cool idea, but no dice.

Poison / Fairy Aromatisse

This gives Aromatisse some of the most powerful, and popular weaknesses in the current meta. Yes, it is immune to Toxic, but it already has Aromatherapy. I don't like this one at all.

Fur Coat Granbull

Underdog, Runt of the Pack. What ever you want to call it, this ability literally and figuratively makes Granbull FABULOUS. With access to moves like Heal Bell, Thunder Wave, and being able to hold Leftovers, it makes this thing an utter tank. It gets base 125 attack with STAB Play Rough to hit like a truck, yet still bing rather bulky. This is kinda like Chansey, yet not in need of an Eviolite. I keep coming back to this item... Definitely getting my vote.
 
Alright I'll give it a go because seems like a cool thread :)

Protean Hydreigon

As an offense player, this sounds really appealing. Hydreigon has a wide movepool (sadly it lacks BoltBeam) to abuse Protean, so definitely a buff for it. It'll be extremely hard for balanced and even stall to switch-in, although thanks to its low speed offense just has to sac something to revenge kill it. I don't really have much else to say here, just that Hydreigon is already pretty viable in OU so it doesn't really NEED this.

Fairy/Poison Aromatisse

It gets a Toxic immunity as well as being a Fairy that's not utterly destroyed by Gengar...that's pretty decent. It gains a resistance to Fairy and Grass attacks, while having 4x resistance to Fighting a Bug type attacks, which is nice. Sadly, that's as far as it goes as with the Poison typing comes a nasty weakness to Psychic and Ground type moves, and I don't think being weak to either is a good thing.

No Guard Poliwrath

I don't think this is as annoying as some people make it out to be. At least, not against offense. It has low speed and decent bulk which is why its match-up vs offense is pretty poor. However, it'll be hard for balance and stall to switch-in. It seems like it'll be playing Hypnosis vs Dynamic Punch mind games. You put one thing to sleep, make them switch out unless it's something that can take a Dynamic Punch, and if they do switch out, the next thing gets confused. Not exactly a fun thing to play against. I don't think this will get my vote as it doesn't get a whole lot better. Why the hell doesn't it get Stone Edge :(

Fur Coat Granbull

Ahhhh my favourite one in this slate. It has a good defensive typing along with a nice movepool consisting of support options like Heal Bell, Thunder Wave, and Roar, and offensive options like Play Rough, elemental punches, and Earthquake. It tanks physical hits like a champ. I don't know if anyone's mentioned this but it checks almost the entire physically offensive meta. It's only 3HKO'd by Banded Scizor's Bullet Punch, which is insane for a Fairy type. It does have flaws like lack of recovery outside of Leftovers and using RestTalk wastes moveslots that could be used for something else. Also Fairy is really good offensively and there isn't much that would be able to set-up on Granbull, and anything that can doesn't appreciate Thunder Wave and/or being phazed out by Roar. This is almost guaranteed to get my vote.
 
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nigggggaazzzzzzzzzz

it is time to start voting!

why am i so excited! a theorymon tournament is about to be started by recreant! you guys better start preparing!

oh why else am i excited?

spoiler: huge power 'mon to be in next slate gg ou

you may vote for:

fur coat granbull (ye ye)
no guard poliwrath {0.0)
fairy/poison aromatisse (lol this is bullshit)
protean hydreigon (aids)

edit: this post's tone goes against my nature rofl
 
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