Pokémon Pinsir

[SmashBrosBrawl]

He asked for a pros and cons list. I've played this game before, and used mega pinsir, I can assure you. I tried to put it in terms that someone who's new to the game. Pinsir needs +2 to even touch stuff like skarmory, aegislash, etc. Earthquake hits aegislash, but makes skarmory a counter, and vice versa. His movepool is small, and lacks coverage. That's bad, but can be worked around.

252+ Atk Mega Pinsir Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Aegislash-Shield: 192-228 (59.2 - 70.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Well then, i sure dont know what kind of aegislash are you facing. Flying+Ground is excellent coverage, specially when it can burst through resists with a swords dance boost. Even rotom-w is taking 61% minimum from a boosted return. The only thing that can switch in consistently in it is skarmory, and thats only because it has stab brave bird.

 

[Strykeypoo]

I don't think I saw many posts mentioning it, but regarding the Earthquake/Close Combat argument, there is a kinda mediocre inbetween. You want to hit both Skarmory and Aegislash? Knock Off. Tyranitar? Not so much.


252 Atk Mega Pinsir Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Aegislash-Shield: 170-202 (52.4 - 62.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Mega Pinsir Knock Off vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Aegislash-Shield: 114-136 (35.1 - 41.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

That's 93% - 110% with SR. Over a 50% 2HKO, which isn't terrible, especially considering a +2 EQ is still a 2HKO.

252 Atk Mega Pinsir Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 69-82 (20.6 - 24.5%) -- guaranteed 5HKO
252 Atk Mega Pinsir Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 85-101 (25.4 - 30.2%) -- guaranteed 4HKO


That's pretty awful, but it has the benefit of getting rid of Skarm's Leftover's or Rocky Helmet. Close Combat is far from a 2HKO as well, though, and no competent player will let you set up to +2 without sending in their Skarmory the same turn. I think the most constructive thing to do is to just acknowledge that Skarmory counters Pinsir. Also:

0 Atk Skarmory Brave Bird vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Pinsir: 186-218 (68.3 - 80.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 Atk Skarmory Brave Bird vs. -1 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Pinsir: 276-326 (101.4 - 119.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Knock Off at least lets you survive a hit, giving Skarmory 60-70 recoil damage in return.


0 Atk Skarmory Brave Bird vs. -1 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Pinsir: 276-326 (101.4 - 119.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO

 

[SmashBrosBrawl]

You DONT want to hit skarmory. Its useless because you will always lose every single time. Earthquake should always be used because you can actually beat aegislash.

 

[Sucker Lunch]

But here's the thing, Pinsir can't reliably boost at any time he wants. With a Stealth Rock Weakness, Bad Typing, and low sp.def he could lose over 70% of his HP (or die) before doing anything. But great mon nonetheless if you build a team around him. However, this meta seems to be loving dual screens so Pinsir's wallbreaking prowess could be kept in constant check. Klefki is becoming a staple and Pinsir hates that guy, but not because he can't beat him. Klefki can help sweepers maul through teams early on or allow stall to wall all day.

 

[Strykeypoo]

You DONT want to hit skarmory. Its useless because you will always lose every single time. Earthquake should always be used because you can actually beat aegislash.

Getting a Knock Off on Skarmory is always useful. You also ignored half my calcs posted, Knock Off is a 2HKO on Aegislash without even boosting up. You need to be +2 on Aegislash to 2HKO with EQ, meaning Aegislash will always get a hit in on you.

 

[SmashBrosBrawl]

Getting a Knock Off on Skarmory is always useful. You also ignored half my calcs posted, Knock Off is a 2HKO on Aegislash without even boosting up. You need to be +2 on Aegislash to 2HKO with EQ, meaning Aegislash will always get a hit in on you.

Uh no, an unboosted earthquake from adamant nature is a guaranted 2hko on any aegislash. Earthquake also ohko heatran which is another huge threat. Pinsir doesnt have enough move slots to spare on something that does little to help coverage wise.

 

[MagicMissingno]

Uh no, an unboosted earthquake from adamant nature is a guaranted 2hko on any aegislash. Earthquake also ohko heatran which is another huge threat. Pinsir doesnt have enough move slots to spare on something that does little to help coverage wise.

You could get rid of Quick Attack.

 

[Orga777]

You could get rid of Quick Attack.

Eh. A priority move that is STAB may be too much to give up, though. Especially with priority running the format like it is right now.

 

[Sucker Lunch]

Uh no, an unboosted earthquake from adamant nature is a guaranted 2hko on any aegislash. Earthquake also ohko heatran which is another huge threat. Pinsir doesnt have enough move slots to spare on something that does little to help coverage wise.

But remember, Earthquake only hits heatran if he's not flying on an Air Balloon.

MagicMissingno

Hey ^__^! Anyway, I think Pinsir sort of depends on Quick Attack for priority. Many Special Sweepers are faster than him and can easily hit him very hard.
Also, without Quick Attack, he loses to Infernape.

 

[Tesung]

Yeah but if you want rotoms dead use mold breaker eq, and ohkoing aegislash at plus 2 and heatran no matter what is too important. And max max rotom takes like 60% from a plus 2 return, so cc seems very situational, and the drops are annoying for priority, especially because it takes all priority pretty well besides brave bird. Think about it this way, neutral closecombat has 120 bp, and factoring stab plus aerilate resisted return is about 100. Aegislash is everywhere, and it can't afford to be walled. Also, while thundurus isn't a great switchin, it switches into anything once, takes a quick attack and ohkos (this May be iffy with rocks, but it's still a solid revenge killer at least).

This was a response to haunter and them two more people posted firstlol

 

[TrophyHunterallday]

Ok so just to be clear. Pinsir is a viable option for a mega HOWEVER he will need a solid team that can support him. So what kind of team would you suggest? i big wall and support team or 1 wall 1 hazard and 1 support/bouncer. Thats usually how i set up my teams with sweepers the rest of the places. Right now i;m just using mega Scizor cause i have nothing else. So any advice or tips or even a team that would work with a Mega Pin?

 

[Sucker Lunch]

Ok so just to be clear. Pinsir is a viable option for a mega HOWEVER he will need a solid team that can support him. So what kind of team would you suggest? i big wall and support team or 1 wall 1 hazard and 1 support/bouncer. Thats usually how i set up my teams with sweepers the rest of the places. Right now i;m just using mega Scizor cause i have nothing else. So any advice or tips or even a team that would work with a Mega Pin?

I think Pinsir needs the following things

- Rotom-W

Why? Rotom is an amazing partner for Pinsir because he is resistant to 3 of Mega Pinsir's weaknesses (Flying, Ice, Fire) and neutral to Rock and Electricity. On top this fact, Rotom-W's Electric/Water typing is super-effective against many targets aimed at Pinsir. He can also act as Scald Bait. Also Rotom serves as one of the best offensive talonflame counters out right now.

- Rapid Spinner.

Why? Pinsir loves having entry hazards on the other person's side of the field. It makes his clean-up job nearly impossible to stop during the endgame. I feel as if Defog can actually hurt pinsir in the long run. Also, Rapid Spin removes hazards n' stuff.

- Hazard Setter

 

[farranpoison]

In the same vein as Rotom-W, here's another great partner that I find to be totally underrated.

Gastrodon.

Immune to Electricity, resists Rock and Fire, and is pretty bulky. Also has Storm Drain to absorb all the Scalds running around nowadays. In return, Pinsir resists Grass, Gastrodon's only weakness, and can take them out. Gastrodon is also a great Rotom-W counter, which can threaten Pinsir if not set up. It also carries Toxic to threaten enemy walls, and has reliable recovery with Recover.

 

[Sucker Lunch]

In the same vein as Rotom-W, here's another great partner that I find to be totally underrated.

Gastrodon.

Immune to Electricity, resists Rock and Fire, and is pretty bulky. Also has Storm Drain to absorb all the Scalds running around nowadays. In return, Pinsir resists Grass, Gastrodon's only weakness, and can take them out. Gastrodon is also a great Rotom-W counter, which can threaten Pinsir if not set up. It also carries Toxic to threaten enemy walls, and has reliable recovery with Recover.

Holy crap I totally forgot about Gastrodon. I should breed a Storm Drain one.
Ahh I wish I could have both Gastro and Rotom on the same team but that's only asking to be beaten by Zard Y

 

[TorchicBlaziken]

What exactly does Pinsir lose out on if it runs Facade over Return?

 

[Sucker Lunch]

What exactly does Pinsir lose out on if it runs Facade over Return?

You lose out on damage every time you don't have status. Also, Pinsir doesn't want a burn among other things because it lowers the BP of STAB Aerialate Quick Attack, the move that makes Pinsir a threat to everything. However, on the extreme end, Paralysis makes him dependent on Quick Attack which doesn't deal nearly as much damage as return. Walls won't be KO'ed by Quick Attack alone. Finally, poison makes Pinsir already frailer than he already is, and once Pinsir is in with a SD boost, he doesn't want to switch out.

 

[CrymsonEchidna]

What exactly does Pinsir lose out on if it runs Facade over Return?

Return has a guaranteed 102 Power plus STAB while Facade is really reliant on status aliments to get the most out of it.

 

[sparktrain]

Holy crap I totally forgot about Gastrodon. I should breed a Storm Drain one.
Ahh I wish I could have both Gastro and Rotom on the same team but that's only asking to be beaten by Zard Y

Gastrodon and Heatran together synergize pretty well with Pinsir. Gastrodon does a pretty nice job taking special hits as well as walling the omnipresent Rotom-W. Heatran can tank Grass attacks aimed at Gastro and Fire/Flying moves aimed at Pinsir. Heatran does a pretty nice job of walling Talonflame to hell and back, not to mention Zard-Y can't do much to it unless it carries Focus Blast. Heatran also poses a threat to Steel-types like Skarmory which would normally give Pinsir trouble.

This defensive core can easily tank hits from Pinsir's biggest threats, as well as threatening pokemon that Pinsir can't break through. They can also set up rocks, which Pinsir loves.

 

[Sucker Lunch]

How are you guys dealing with Zard Y, who unlike Pinsir, doesn't mind coming out early and wrecking havoc? Pinsir obviously loses to Zard if not already Mega Evolved, what teammates can counter the not-dragon sun dragon?

 

[Jaroda]

I don't think Pinsir should be concerned with beating Rotom when Excadrill makes a natural partner. Mold Breaker EQ is Rotom's bane (Bronzong too) and he also is immune to Electric and 4x resists Rock for Pinsir, and has the Rapid Spin support Pinsir needs too. Alternatively Natural Cure Starmie can absorb burns and either spin or even through up screens too. EQ is superior to CC in most situations it seems.

 

[TrophyHunterallday]

After reading a lot of this thread it would seem that the common consensus is that EQ is a better overall move for pinsir while CC is more situational. In my mind that seems very accurate. With CC you have no ability to take out common walls that are heavy hitters in Gen 6 ie Mawhile and Aegislash. The Better option to me is EQ. While Rotoms levitate eliminates EQs ability against it there are plent of other pokemon that can handle it. ie. Trevenant Gourgheist. CC is more situational and as it stands Pinsir can't afford the stat drop since he is most likely going to be a switch in that stays in. A late game sweeper that can hopefully take out 3 pokemon to end the game. Which is really my ideal method of Mega Evolving pokemon

How are you guys dealing with Zard Y, who unlike Pinsir, doesn't mind coming out early and wrecking havoc? Pinsir obviously loses to Zard if not already Mega Evolved, what teammates can counter the not-dragon sun dragon?

I would say the obvious Rotom is a complete counter to Zard Y but i think Azumarill could also do some massive damage. WIth a priority Aqua jet he can do some massive damage. and of course Azu can take a shot with some decently bulky defense stats and HP

 

[TheMohZone]

After reading a lot of this thread it would seem that the common consensus is that EQ is a better overall move for pinsir while CC is more situational. In my mind that seems very accurate. With CC you have no ability to take out common walls that are heavy hitters in Gen 6 ie Mawhile and Aegislash. The Better option to me is EQ. While Rotoms levitate eliminates EQs ability against it there are plent of other pokemon that can handle it. ie. Trevenant Gourgheist. CC is more situational and as it stands Pinsir can't afford the stat drop since he is most likely going to be a switch in that stays in. A late game sweeper that can hopefully take out 3 pokemon to end the game. Which is really my ideal method of Mega Evolving pokemon


I would say the obvious Rotom is a complete counter to Zard Y but i think Azumarill could also do some massive damage. WIth a priority Aqua jet he can do some massive damage. and of course Azu can take a shot with some decently bulky defense stats and HP

the only complete counters to Zard Y are other weather seters, except Abomasnow and Hippo. Basically TTar and Politoad along with bulky dragons. Solarbeam murders Rotom and Azu, and thanks to Drought Aqua Jet isn't a kill.

 

[Hidious]

How are you guys dealing with Zard Y, who unlike Pinsir, doesn't mind coming out early and wrecking havoc? Pinsir obviously loses to Zard if not already Mega Evolved, what teammates can counter the not-dragon sun dragon?

Garchomp with stone edge checks talonflame, both charizard mega forms (but only checks x with scarf), aegislash, and pretty much all other fire and electric types

 

[Tesung]

Goodra counters Zard y, but idk why we are talking about this when mega pinsir shits on Zard y. It should be noted that goodra is a good partner, as it forces out skarm, switches into rotom, switches into scarf genesect, and switches into thundurus. This duo is very weak to TAlomflame though

 

[Sucker Lunch]

Goodra counters Zard y, but idk why we are talking about this when mega pinsir shits on Zard y. It should be noted that goodra is a good partner, as it forces out skarm, switches into rotom, switches into scarf genesect, and switches into thundurus. This duo is very weak to TAlomflame though

Pinsir can't switch in Zard Y and he has to be in Mega Form to outspeed Zard Y. So whenever normal Pinsir comes in against Y he is basically locked into Quick Attack to do any sort of damage. The thing about Y is that he doesn't care whether it's early game or late game he can sweep whenever he feels like as long as stealth rock isn't up (because unlike X, Y doesn't require any boosting). I'm seeing more and more people lead with Y because he forces a switch if your name isn't Tyranitar or Politoed. You can't counter him with Blissey because Zard Y often runs flare blitz as a physical move so he can speed boost in Blissey's face (guaranteed 2HKO) with uninvested attack.

Pinsir is strong but he needs momentum. Zard Y is quickly becoming the Vanilla MVC3 Wolverine of the meta. Slam people so hard in the beginning that they have a very slim chance of coming back.