Pokemon Scarlet & Violet - 18th Nov 2022! **OFFICIAL INFO ONLY**

Is it confirmed that they've changed ice to resist water? That's a neat change if so, and that terastal definitely looks like the ice one from the icon; not at all convinced it's the water crystal, and I suspect the Pokemon was explicitly chosen to show this off.

The new legends getting Shed Tail seems intimidating, but it really depends what else is in the format and how the sub works. You lose 50% for it by the looks of things, and for the initial meta, the most interesting things to swap to is gonna be... the other cover legend, which will share a ton of weaknesses. Of course, if the sub itself inherits all of that 50% HP, it could potentially make it tanky enough to often take more than one hit. Seems pretty busted still, but we've come to expect that from cover legends, and you'll need some form of healing if it's not just a once-per-fight deal. Unless the move is so strong that people run the pre-evo with 252 HP 252 Speed just to use it, which is very possible. One thing to consider is that if you have something that can outspeed the user and get them below 50% HP, they've just wasted a turn, and I don't think that will be especially difficult to pull off in Ubers when everything and its mum will be carrying an answer to dragon types; if the opponent *does* get their Shed Tail off, you can chunk the Substitute on that same turn and possibly have made the opponent lose 50% on their cover legendary just to get a check in safely; in most scenarios I'd call that a good trade.

I'm not convinced Terastalise will be especially broken, but I also thought Dynamax could be tame so I guess I'm not good at evaluating these things. It has similar unpredictability to Z-moves, but the power is probably gonna be worse than Max moves with no secondary effects, and locking yourself into a typing that can't as effectively use your *other* moves could be really debilitating. I strongly suspect the most common use case will be using it for temporary Adaptability on already very strong moves, or for a temporary way of covering crippling weaknesses like with the Tyranitar example; I'm not convinced that using it to change your STAB is gonna be terribly strong unless there's a way to manually deactivate it. It certainly seems more *interesting* than Z-moves or Dynamax, and I'm impressed they've managed to make a basic concept that is anything but basic in its actual applications.

I like Mirror Herb a lot as a way to punish getting greedy. A big bugbear in recent gens for me has been that it's often actively bad for me to faint an opposing mon, because something else coming in and getting a turn of setup is so crippling, so I can *only* get KOs with things that can deal with that switch in. Mirror Herb provides reactive counterplay to things like that (but in a way that also allows the setup user to play reactively in turn), and should help deal with things like Xerneas in VGC, as well as potentially dealing with some of the more degenerate strategies with Shed Tail. It also means you're losing an item slot instead of a Pokemon slot (Ditto) to punish setup, at the cost of requiring more skilled play.
 

churine

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looks like cetitan hits a base 140 hp minimum, as they showed coalossal in the same trailer with 215 hp, which is its hp nearly maxed out, so we can presume the same for cetitan. if this tells me one thing its that itll prob be slow and its a pure ice type so yeah, but you never know they can give it like base 60 speed which would be solid with slush rush.

the new moves and items look absurd tho lmfao. shed tail im almost certain will be stuck on cyclizard but its very much implied that mon is related to the box legends. cyclizard had 145 hp in the trailer which is 40 base hp minimum (max iv nearly max ev) or 85 maximum (0 iv and ev), so its safe to assume that cyclizard will probably be balanced around shed tail by having less then solid stats

mirror herb looks fun to just steal some dragon dances or what have you with a mon like salamence, like you know your opponent is going to set up so you switch into something that checks it, but it doesnt seem that consistent
loaded dice is great on technician mons for sure like they showed breloom off there
covert cloak is shield dust as an item and is honestly incredible. shield dust is prob one of the stronger abilities in the game that is only locked on bad bug type mons so having it as an item is nice. can see this be very strong in vgc
tera type i can almost see getting suspected considering that its an adaptability boost sometimes and theres a pseudo hidden power move that works with it, actually in some respects its even better. ferrothorn be damned
 
On the flip side, imagine something like Celebi going from having a 4x U-Turn weakness to resisting the move.
The best tera strategies will be the subtle ones that people don't expect, and THAT'S what I'm excited about.
Yes I'm in agreement with you. This is gonna really be the first time at least from my understanding that all teams will be truly unique (at least not as common I should say) because the possibilities feel almost endless!

You will have your common tera users of course but I think teams won't be as common as previous gens
 
guys im sorry but the coalossal was just using the water tera crown
1661111476886.png
1661111496670.png


This would be an extremely strange animation choice for Water and leaves me wondering how they would differentiate Ice from this, if you were correct. The animation whose icon is a snowflake and which involves the user being encased in ice blocks should probably be assumed to be Ice type until we see an even more Ice-like animation elsewhere, IMO.
 
Is it confirmed that they've changed ice to resist water? That's a neat change if so, and that terastal definitely looks like the ice one from the icon; not at all convinced it's the water crystal, and I suspect the Pokemon was explicitly chosen to show this off.

The new legends getting Shed Tail seems intimidating, but it really depends what else is in the format and how the sub works. You lose 50% for it by the looks of things, and for the initial meta, the most interesting things to swap to is gonna be... the other cover legend, which will share a ton of weaknesses. Of course, if the sub itself inherits all of that 50% HP, it could potentially make it tanky enough to often take more than one hit. Seems pretty busted still, but we've come to expect that from cover legends, and you'll need some form of healing if it's not just a once-per-fight deal. Unless the move is so strong that people run the pre-evo with 252 HP 252 Speed just to use it, which is very possible. One thing to consider is that if you have something that can outspeed the user and get them below 50% HP, they've just wasted a turn, and I don't think that will be especially difficult to pull off in Ubers; if the opponent *does* get their Shed Tail off, you can chunk the Substitute on that same turn and possibly have made the opponent lose 50% on their cover legendary just to get a check in safely; in most scenarios I'd call that a good trade.

I'm not convinced Terastalise will be especially broken, but I also thought Dynamax could be tame so I guess I'm not good at evaluating these things. It has similar unpredictability to Z-moves, but the power is probably gonna be worse than Max moves with no secondary effects, and locking yourself into a typing that can't as effectively use your *other* moves could be really debilitating. I strongly suspect the most common use case will be using it for temporary Adaptability on already very strong moves, or for a temporary way of covering crippling weaknesses like with the Tyranitar example; I'm not convinced that using it to change your STAB is gonna be terribly strong unless there's a way to manually deactivate it. It certainly seems more *interesting* than Z-moves or Dynamax, and I'm impressed they've managed to make a basic concept that is anything but basic in its actual applications.

I like Mirror Herb a lot as a way to punish getting greedy. A big bugbear in recent gens for me has been that it's often actively bad for me to faint an opposing mon, because something else coming in and getting a turn of setup is so crippling, so I can *only* get KOs with things that can deal with that switch in. Mirror Herb provides reactive counterplay to things like that (but in a way that also allows the setup user to play reactively in turn), and should help deal with things like Xerneas in VGC, as well as potentially dealing with some of the more degenerate strategies with Shed Tail. It also means you're losing an item slot instead of a Pokemon slot (Ditto) to punish setup, at the cost of requiring more skilled play.
I'd like to support you on this, I don't think Terastalizing will be broken either for three particular reasons.

#1 - Unlike Dynamax / Gmax; Tera changes typing and STAB, not stats or HP. In addition, it doesn't seem like Tera moves break through Protect / Detect / etc. Meaning it's not some insta-click win, or some minor one-turn annoyance like Z-moves.

#2 - Tera strategies entirely depend on the Pokemon you're using with. So some Tera strategies will be far better than others (as evidenced earlier in the thread with how Aggron probably wouldn't be good to Terastalize, but Celebi would).

#3 - It actually helps balance certain Pokemon (or push certain almost broken ones over the edge to ban-worthy territory), meaning that I feel that it will help keep the meta even more fresh compared to the last two gens.

Yes I'm in agreement with you. This is gonna really be the first time at least from my understanding that all teams will be truly unique (at least not as common I should say) because the possibilities feel almost endless!

You will have your common tera users of course but I think teams won't be as common as previous gens
The bolded sentence is exactly why I'm so excited. Teams will feel so much more fresh and unique because the possibilities are cranked up to 11. Meta trends will be far less stagnant because there will be millions of solutions to take them on. I'm so beyond excited that, frankly, I think this could be my favorite meta in singles comp Pokemon... ever.
 
Something like Aurorus or Aggron still won’t be great because you’re 1: basically locking yourself out of Terastallizing another Pokemon and 2: telegraphing from Team Preview that you’re Terastallizing your Aurorus/Aggron.
That former point applies to really everything and including Pokemon that otherwise wouldn’t need it as much, while the latter isn’t fully true.
Yeah, you probably know what Pokemon you’ll use if you’re using Aggron in OU, but what type is less predictable and when you Terastallize as well.
Will they become Ghost? Flying? Grass? Water? Fighting? Pure Steel?
You also have to factor in that many of these Pokemon suddenly because actually good with a new typing, so it wouldn’t matter as much if the opponent knew what Terastallizer you used. Like if you used Scizor in Gen 6/7, it would be obvious you were using Mega Scizor most of the time and would still be good.
Aggron might not be the best example for OU at least, as it lacks things like recovery or having anything set it apart from other OU walls, but Aggron could certainly see usage in the lower tiers and Physical Blissey definitely would be useful on teams.
 
Cyclizars jp name is Mototokage. Most obviously moto (motorcycle in spanish) + tokage (lizard in japanese), but a fun thing is that moto also means original in japanese, and koraidon and miraidon refer to something from the past and future. Past, original, future huh
Assuming you're aware of the leaks, now with the present bike-dragon confirmed it seems the box legends are actually the paradox versions of it, that's why they are legends tier and the present Dragon is a normal mon the leakers said the paradox mons are all Legend/UB tier and while they resemble the original mon they are treated like different mons

Also those item look kinda fun. I can see Breloom and Cincinno considering dropping skill link for tech for a stronger stab also that herb, lol.

Hawlucha used Swagger
Opponent got confused.
Opponent Attack raised Sharply
Hawlucha Mirror Herd activated
Halucha's attack increased sharply

Wonder if Swagger will get banned for good this time around.
 

Yung Dramps

awesome gaming
View attachment 448573View attachment 448574

This would be an extremely strange animation choice for Water and leaves me wondering how they would differentiate Ice from this, if you were correct. The animation whose icon is a snowflake and which involves the user being encased in ice blocks should probably be assumed to be Ice type until we see an even more Ice-like animation elsewhere, IMO.
this is the exact same animation as in the tera reveal, this "crystals jutting out" is the same for all types
 

RoiDadadou

Nothing less... from a king.
is a Pre-Contributor
I'd like to support you on this, I don't think Terastalizing will be broken either for three particular reasons.

#1 - Unlike Dynamax / Gmax; Tera changes typing and STAB, not stats or HP. In addition, it doesn't seem like Tera moves break through Protect / Detect / etc. Meaning it's not some insta-click win, or some minor one-turn annoyance like Z-moves.

#2 - Tera strategies entirely depend on the Pokemon you're using with. So some Tera strategies will be far better than others (as evidenced earlier in the thread with how Aggron probably wouldn't be good to Terastalize, but Celebi would).

#3 - It actually helps balance certain Pokemon (or push certain almost broken ones over the edge to ban-worthy territory), meaning that I feel that it will help keep the meta even more fresh compared to the last two gens.



The bolded sentence is exactly why I'm so excited. Teams will feel so much more fresh and unique because the possibilities are cranked up to 11. Meta trends will be far less stagnant because there will be millions of solutions to take them on. I'm so beyond excited that, frankly, I think this could be my favorite meta in singles comp Pokemon... ever.
I also join you on the 'not broken' line. I think it's also way more skilled, you have to balance between keeping your good type, or switching to get a kill with Tera Blast/Resisting a hit.
 
this is the exact same animation as in the tera reveal, this "crystals jutting out" is the same for all types
We can see the Ghost animation here:

1661111877020.png


Which again raises my unanswered question of "why on earth would you use a snowflake to represent Water?"

I would suggest the reason the other animation (the only full one we've seen) looks identical with the same colouring, when we can very clearly see different types are using different colours, is that the animation shown was also an Ice type transformation.
 

Dusk Mage Necrozma

formerly XenonHero126
We can see the Ghost animation here:

View attachment 448575

Which again raises my unanswered question of "why on earth would you use a snowflake to represent Water?"

I would suggest the reason the other animation (the only full one we've seen) looks identical with the same colouring, when we can very clearly see different types are using different colours, is that the animation shown was also an Ice type transformation.
The “snowflake” is the universal Tera icon. The ice is blue crystals. We know from previous trailers that’s the Water crown
 

RoiDadadou

Nothing less... from a king.
is a Pre-Contributor
View attachment 448573View attachment 448574

This would be an extremely strange animation choice for Water and leaves me wondering how they would differentiate Ice from this, if you were correct. The animation whose icon is a snowflake and which involves the user being encased in ice blocks should probably be assumed to be Ice type until we see an even more Ice-like animation elsewhere, IMO.
This is a crystal animation. 'cause it's crystaL, you know ?
 
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Have they confirmed whether or not Pokemon need to be holding an item to jump into their Tera forms?
I know that you have to have the Tera Orb or whatever, but I couldn't find anything specifying whether it's just a key item in the inventory or an item that a Pokemon has to hold in order to Terastalise.
 

Dusk Mage Necrozma

formerly XenonHero126
Have they confirmed whether or not Pokemon need to be holding an item to jump into their Tera forms?
I know that you have to have the Tera Orb or whatever, but I couldn't find anything specifying whether it's just a key item in the inventory or an item that a Pokemon has to hold in order to Terastalise.
I think if there was a held item they would have mentioned it by now. All evidence points towards the Tera Orb being a key item.
 
Something of note is that the tcg reveal shows a koraidon and miraidon card, and while a lot of info was obscured (type, retreat, weakness, resistance), its interesting to note that the layout of the names much more fits a basic than an evo. This is lower case ex, so if koraidon and miraidon were evos of cyclizar, korai and mirai ex would need to be stage 1 cards.
 
We have not seen the Ice one. We have seen the starter types and Ghost. And if you look at the previous trailers there’s a very clearly Water crown that’s the same as Coalossal’s.
1661112384871.png


This Persian is definitely not Ghost, it looks different from Water, and it looks different from the Grass Breloom we've seen. We also saw a Flying Drifblim.

True that this Persian isn't necessarily Ice (Rock would make more sense), but it's a massive stretch to suggest it's definitely Fire.

Have they confirmed whether or not Pokemon need to be holding an item to jump into their Tera forms?
I know that you have to have the Tera Orb or whatever, but I couldn't find anything specifying whether it's just a key item in the inventory or an item that a Pokemon has to hold in order to Terastalise.
The fact that Grass-Terastalise Breloom was used to show off the Loaded Dice strongly implies it doesn't require an item.
 

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This Persian is definitely not Ghost, it looks different from Water, and it looks different from the Grass Breloom we've seen. We also saw a Flying Drifblim.

True that this Persian isn't necessarily Ice (Rock would make more sense), but it's a massive stretch to suggest it's definitely Fire.



The fact that Grass-Terastalise Breloom was used to show off the Loaded Dice strongly implies it doesn't require an item.
Thats the normal tera crown my guy
 

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