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Metagame Pure Hackmons [Leader's Choice]
- Thread starter Mbouchon
- Start date
It's actually one of the few abilities that does not get shut down by Neutralizing Gas, so it's become part of a big threat to the metagame and teams are virtually required to either run a Magic Bouncer or several Magic Coat users.
The Isle of Armor DLC has arrived. We have some new Pokemon and some returning old Pokemon to play with!
This post is to introduce some of the Pokemon we can either see as highlights or being theoretically highlights. It'll contain my thoughts on each of them.
New Pokemon:
Zarude
In the Eternamax meta, Zarude is a Pokemon whose statspread doesn't look very bad, especially when combined with a Dark-typing. It looks great on paper as it seems to have the potential to successfully wall Stored Power sweepers. Because it's also a Grass-type, it innately carries Safety Goggles without having to use its item slot. The Dark/Grass type combination it has seems good but there are three issues with it:
Urshifu
This mon is a joke
Its Water-type forme is worse
Scrafty is better
R8 my haiku
. In all seriousness, Urshifu doesn't really have a place in the metagame. Its Dark-type forme is outclassed by the viable Dark-types in the meta. Even Scrafty outclasses it for having the better defensive stats to manage sweepers, but Scrafty isn't viable because the other Dark-types have more useful typings. The Water-type forme is pretty pointless. In Pure Hackmons you are either trying to beat the Pokemon in A rank+, or defending them. Urshifu Rapid-Strike forme would have a hard time doing either in most cases. My best advice is to not use Urshifu.
Slowbro-Galar
Don't even think about it.
Returning Pokemon
Chansey
The queen of Hackmons is back and she's ready to shift the meta! Chansey is by far the best addition coming from the DLC and while it's not as good as it was in the previous gens, it'll no doubt still be great in the current generation. The thing about Chansey is, it carries base 250 HP and 105 Special Defense, is able to carry eviolite, and most importantly, does not carry a weakness to Psychic-type attacks! This puts it at nearly the same line of bulk as Eternamax but unlike the gigantic 1125 BST beast, Chansey does not have to worry about getting pulverized by most sweepers! Take a look at these calcs:
+4 252+ SpA Eternatus-Eternamax Stored Power (260 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 461-543 (65.4 - 77.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+4 252+ SpA Indeedee Stored Power (260 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 513-604 (72.8 - 85.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
These are coming from the hardest hitting most prominent sweepers in the entire metagame! Indeedee, White Kyurem, Dawn Wings, and Mewtwo are now forced to run Secret Sword if they want to OHKO this Pokemon! Eternamax is going to have to run Bolt Beak! They stand little to no chance against it otherwise!!! They can Taunt but Chansey can carry Spectral. Otherwise it can just use Haze!
+4 252 Atk Eternatus-Eternamax Bolt Beak (170 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 674-793 (95.7 - 112.6%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
Bolt Beak doesn't even carry a 100% OHKO chance, and this is assuming Eternamax has to sacrifice its best sweeping nature for another nature!
The only downside to running Chansey is the fact that unlike all the other Stored Power walls, this one kinda has to run Comatose in order to work. Otherwise, Blissey is better. With Comatose you avoid being put to sleep while still being able to carry Eviolite. This can be a small issue as the other sweepers take their freedom from holding specific abilities and use it as an opportunity to carry Magic Bounce for other Comatose users. That means with Chansey on board replacing more Stored Power walls, another Pokemon is going to have to take the role of a Magic Bouncer on a team.
Blissey
While not as successful as Chansey is going to be, Blissey at least carries more variety. It has the option to run Magic Bounce or Neutralizing Gas or carry other items such as Safety Goggles or Leftovers (if you're still running Comatose). Since you're not going to be walling as much as Chansey in the special department and still get OHKOed by all the same physical moves, but at an even higher rate, you might be better off running Blissey with a +SpD nature, which is a nice first!
These are all the Pokemon I believed to have been the main highlight additions to this format. I don't think many more would be notable or recognizable as this format is centralized around six Pokemon and how you're able to stop them. Chansey and Blissey will do great. I predict physical moves and spectral will be more common among the special sweepers and I think those sweepers would be nerfed a bit because of how much Chansey and Blissey compress their moveslots. I don't see physical sweepers taking a rise because despite Chansey and Blissey coming to life, physical sweepers still aren't very good at taking down Eternamax and will struggle just as much as they've already. Defensive roles may be able to take a better turn over the metagame and perhaps spice games up another notch. We'll see how everything goes! If you have your own opinions about how these Pokemon would shape up the meta or if you have more Pokemon in mind, you are all free to post below!
This post is to introduce some of the Pokemon we can either see as highlights or being theoretically highlights. It'll contain my thoughts on each of them.
New Pokemon:
Zarude
In the Eternamax meta, Zarude is a Pokemon whose statspread doesn't look very bad, especially when combined with a Dark-typing. It looks great on paper as it seems to have the potential to successfully wall Stored Power sweepers. Because it's also a Grass-type, it innately carries Safety Goggles without having to use its item slot. The Dark/Grass type combination it has seems good but there are three issues with it:
- Dark/Grass leaves it being weak to the majority of coverage moves from Stored Power sweepers (Flamethrower, Secret Sword, Moonblast)
- It's left to only resist rarer coverage moves used by Eternamax more than anything (Bolt Beak/Earthquake), while still getting hit neutrally by Boomburst.
- Innate Safety Goggles while good isn't really necessary and the Dark-types who don't have this feat have no problem carrying the item.
- Umbreon carries a few of the same weaknesses but carries much less while also packing in higher defensive stats.
- Mandibuzz, while carrying more weaknesses than Umbreon, is able to completely avoid Ground-type moves rather than just resisting them. This is a bigger feat due to the popularity of the move Fissure. While Zarude resists Ground-type attacks, Earthquake is incredibly rare and Fissure is much more common, so this resistance would be made ineffective in most cases.
- Tyranitar has a lot of weaknesses but it's at least able to resist the more common Boomburst coming from the hardest hitting sweeper alongside being slightly more bulky.
- Grimmsnarl is immune to Dragon-type moves, which are often carried by Eternamax with set up moves for some reason.
Urshifu
This mon is a joke
Its Water-type forme is worse
Scrafty is better
R8 my haiku
. In all seriousness, Urshifu doesn't really have a place in the metagame. Its Dark-type forme is outclassed by the viable Dark-types in the meta. Even Scrafty outclasses it for having the better defensive stats to manage sweepers, but Scrafty isn't viable because the other Dark-types have more useful typings. The Water-type forme is pretty pointless. In Pure Hackmons you are either trying to beat the Pokemon in A rank+, or defending them. Urshifu Rapid-Strike forme would have a hard time doing either in most cases. My best advice is to not use Urshifu.
Slowbro-Galar
Don't even think about it.
Returning Pokemon
Chansey
The queen of Hackmons is back and she's ready to shift the meta! Chansey is by far the best addition coming from the DLC and while it's not as good as it was in the previous gens, it'll no doubt still be great in the current generation. The thing about Chansey is, it carries base 250 HP and 105 Special Defense, is able to carry eviolite, and most importantly, does not carry a weakness to Psychic-type attacks! This puts it at nearly the same line of bulk as Eternamax but unlike the gigantic 1125 BST beast, Chansey does not have to worry about getting pulverized by most sweepers! Take a look at these calcs:
+4 252+ SpA Eternatus-Eternamax Stored Power (260 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 461-543 (65.4 - 77.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+4 252+ SpA Indeedee Stored Power (260 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 513-604 (72.8 - 85.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
These are coming from the hardest hitting most prominent sweepers in the entire metagame! Indeedee, White Kyurem, Dawn Wings, and Mewtwo are now forced to run Secret Sword if they want to OHKO this Pokemon! Eternamax is going to have to run Bolt Beak! They stand little to no chance against it otherwise!!! They can Taunt but Chansey can carry Spectral. Otherwise it can just use Haze!
+4 252 Atk Eternatus-Eternamax Bolt Beak (170 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 674-793 (95.7 - 112.6%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
Bolt Beak doesn't even carry a 100% OHKO chance, and this is assuming Eternamax has to sacrifice its best sweeping nature for another nature!
The only downside to running Chansey is the fact that unlike all the other Stored Power walls, this one kinda has to run Comatose in order to work. Otherwise, Blissey is better. With Comatose you avoid being put to sleep while still being able to carry Eviolite. This can be a small issue as the other sweepers take their freedom from holding specific abilities and use it as an opportunity to carry Magic Bounce for other Comatose users. That means with Chansey on board replacing more Stored Power walls, another Pokemon is going to have to take the role of a Magic Bouncer on a team.
Blissey
While not as successful as Chansey is going to be, Blissey at least carries more variety. It has the option to run Magic Bounce or Neutralizing Gas or carry other items such as Safety Goggles or Leftovers (if you're still running Comatose). Since you're not going to be walling as much as Chansey in the special department and still get OHKOed by all the same physical moves, but at an even higher rate, you might be better off running Blissey with a +SpD nature, which is a nice first!
These are all the Pokemon I believed to have been the main highlight additions to this format. I don't think many more would be notable or recognizable as this format is centralized around six Pokemon and how you're able to stop them. Chansey and Blissey will do great. I predict physical moves and spectral will be more common among the special sweepers and I think those sweepers would be nerfed a bit because of how much Chansey and Blissey compress their moveslots. I don't see physical sweepers taking a rise because despite Chansey and Blissey coming to life, physical sweepers still aren't very good at taking down Eternamax and will struggle just as much as they've already. Defensive roles may be able to take a better turn over the metagame and perhaps spice games up another notch. We'll see how everything goes! If you have your own opinions about how these Pokemon would shape up the meta or if you have more Pokemon in mind, you are all free to post below!
I've built a few Gen 8 Hackmons teams since the Island of Armor DLC began and figured I could share my latest one to show how the returning Pokemon have affected this metagame.
Pokepast: https://pokepast.es/2a5646f6367287e2
Swords are the theme of this team. Ignore the name.
Generally how it works is, you lead with Stealth Rock Zacian-Crowned to set up rocks, Taunt the opponent out if you predict they're setting up their own hazards or some stat boosts, rapid spin to clear hazards if the opponent has already set them up, and Double Iron Bash to beat the majority of Pokemon otherwise.
Zacian-Crowned @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Double Iron Bash
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock
- Rapid Spin
This Eternamax can be sent in whenever you feel the need to recover another Pokemon or itself. Its biggest role is to pressure most non OHKO Zacian-Crowned out and prevent outside sweepers (sweepers who aren't currently in A) from sweeping as easily. This is most of what what Eternamax is required to be used in teams for. Otherwise you risk letting yourself become prone to an overwhelmingly larger portion of Pokemon, especially opposing Zacian-Crowned to a bigger extent. I usually run a Stored Power sweeper Eternamax set but Chansey has greatly nerfed it. The delegated sweepers on this team are Pokemon who're better suited to handle Chansey. I figured since it wasn't attacking, it could just mostly serve a passive role where it helps heal the attackers of this team, of which done have any method of recovery on their own. Fissure was given for its efficiency as an attack move in this generation. Eternamax doesn't get harshly punished for missing but the entire team can reap great rewards off opposing targets getting one-shotted. Last but not least it was given Comatose + Black Sludge to absorb Double Iron Bash attacks more easily and while not having to worry about targets using Nuzzle or Spore back. Eternamax is never a Pokemon you want to have put asleep on your team.
Eternatus-Eternamax @ Black Sludge
Ability: Comatose
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Wish
- Rapid Spin
- Fissure
- Teleport
With Chansey's introduction I'd arguably believe Indeedee could be the most proficient sweeper now as it is the Pokemon able to deal the most damage and the best chance against Chansey after completely setting up. Chansey can eat x2 sweepers a lot more easily and punish back harder with Spectral Thief since Dawn Wings/Mewtwo/White Kyurem don't carry an immunity to it. Eternamax has massive 4MSS so it already risks getting walled by more immunities, but it also doesn't land KOs as easily as Indeedee. Indeedee's stronger Stored Power attack in combination of being able to run move coverage options leaves this Pokemon having a bigger advantage than it has in the past.
The specific Indeedee set below specifically targets Chansey and can be used to sweep most opposing Pokemon, who are less likely to wall x3 attacks from Indeedee than x2 from White Kyurem/Mewtwo/Dawn Wings. Taunt stops Chansey from using Haze or Whirlwind, while Normal-typing already blocks Spectral Thief. It can set up once and already threaten the Pokemon with Secret Sword. Under the right circumstances it should also be given the opportunity to set up a second time.
Indeedee (M) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Taunt
- Shell Smash
- Stored Power
- Secret Sword
Sweepers are more restricted to moves that target Chansey, meaning they'll now become easier to wall overall. Part of this is why this team's Eternamax carries the specific moves that it does (Fissure to attack potential sweeper walls, Wish heal Zacian-Crowned or other sweepers if they are low health), but this is also why we have a second Zacian-Crowned.
The Zacian-Crowned set below should be able to help defeat most walls for sweepers, and most Pokemon in general with the combination of Double Iron Bash and Fissure. It carries Substitute to protect itself from opposing attacks, Taunt to block opposing set up sweepers, Double Iron Bash and Fissure to destroy their offenses as usual. Chansey can already handle most prominent sweepers very well but just in case it isn't enough, Zacian-Crowned can find a way to fight back. Safety Goggles was given in case the target has already set up once (mostly if they set up in front of Eternamax or don't get flinched by Double Iron Bash. The last thing you want is to give the opponent an extra free turn to set up. I will admit however that there could be a potential problem with overly relying on this set, seeing how both Double Iron Bash and Fissure have 16 PP total and only Fissure can properly take care of Eternamax and specific Steel-type Stored Power walls such as Aegislash and Dusk Mane.
Zacian-Crowned @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Double Iron Bash
- Taunt
- Substitute
- Fissure
I've already explained Chansey enough, it's there to hardstop sweepers. They are forced to run Secret Sword coverage in order to beat it, automatically giving Zacian-Crowned and most type immunity walls a greater chance to defeat them. It runs Comatose because being put to sleep could turn Chansey's chance of beating sweepers from 100 to 0%. Chansey clears stats and wastes the sweeper's time. Chansey blocks sweepers at x3 unless they run powerful physical moves whereas most Pokemon who aim just to go x2 are unable to break it unless they run Fighting-type attacks. If a sweeper ends up with x3 stats it's likely for Chansey to have an opportunity to shut them down with Haze, force them to start setting up from scratch again, and then Teleport to a Zacian-Crowned, since they also tend to survive x2 attacks against most moves and they take advantage of Secret Sword being a forced coverage option. Magic Coat is given to stop Taunt from blocking its attacks, since this set carries all status moves. Haze is given for it to serve a higher chance against Eternamax among the other sweepers (Spectral Thief would be blocked by Imprison), and Teleport is to be able to revenge more easily with a Zac-C switchin at the right moment.
Chansey (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Comatose
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Soft-Boiled
- Magic Coat
- Haze
- Teleport
I never like having just one sweeper in a team due to how well they carry an entire game. It's just more difficult to win if all of your sweepers are down since you'd have to rely on OHKO moves more frequently. Because of this I've entered my favorite sweeper, Dawn Wings! Dawn Wings is not much different from the rest and has to run Secret Sword unless it wants to get walled by Chansey, although this might not be entirely effective since Chansey can stand in the way of its Dynamax. I like Dawn Wings because it blocks Rapid Spin and is overall able to set up more safely and more easily than every other sweeper bar Eternamax. Since it's slow you can always count on it setting up last so its stats don't get stolen, but it's just fast enough to outspeed all nonscarved Pokemon at +2. Choice Scarf Zac-C's popularity has been declining a bit, the Eternamax set is better at punishing it, Ghost-type is immune to any STAG gimmicks, and it is able to OHKO opposing Eternamax after a Shell Smash using Max Mindstorm Prismatic Laser. It tends to be underrated but these features are too much to look behind, especially for how much it's contributed to my past success in this format overall.
+2 252+ SpA Life Orb Necrozma-Dawn-Wings Max Mindstorm vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Eternatus-Eternamax: 634-749 (88.9 - 105%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock.
(It has 164 Speed EVs to make Dawn Wings the slowest it could possibly be while outspeeding Ninjask at +2)
Necrozma-Dawn-Wings @ Life Orb
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 164 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Prismatic Laser
- Shell Smash
- Stored Power
- Secret Sword
This is one of the new teams I have for now. It's not perfect, of course. I personally believe a Scarf Zacian-Crowned can fit in for example to take full advantage of Chansey forcing x2 sweepers to run Secret Sword. It would sound good to see Zacian-Crowned outspeed before even having to worry about the target attacking. (Although I still believe Safety Goggles is more vital in case the target survives Double Iron Bash without flinching)
Necrozma-Dawn-Wings @ Life Orb
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 164 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Prismatic Laser
- Shell Smash
- Stored Power
- Secret Sword
Chansey (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Comatose
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Soft-Boiled
- Magic Coat
- Haze
- Teleport
Zacian-Crowned @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Double Iron Bash
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock
- Rapid Spin
Zacian-Crowned @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Double Iron Bash
- Taunt
- Substitute
- Fissure
Eternatus-Eternamax @ Black Sludge
Ability: Comatose
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Wish
- Rapid Spin
- Fissure
- Teleport
Indeedee (M) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Taunt
- Shell Smash
- Stored Power
- Secret Sword
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 164 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Prismatic Laser
- Shell Smash
- Stored Power
- Secret Sword
Chansey (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Comatose
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Soft-Boiled
- Magic Coat
- Haze
- Teleport
Zacian-Crowned @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Double Iron Bash
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock
- Rapid Spin
Zacian-Crowned @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Double Iron Bash
- Taunt
- Substitute
- Fissure
Eternatus-Eternamax @ Black Sludge
Ability: Comatose
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Wish
- Rapid Spin
- Fissure
- Teleport
Indeedee (M) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Taunt
- Shell Smash
- Stored Power
- Secret Sword
Swords are the theme of this team. Ignore the name.
Generally how it works is, you lead with Stealth Rock Zacian-Crowned to set up rocks, Taunt the opponent out if you predict they're setting up their own hazards or some stat boosts, rapid spin to clear hazards if the opponent has already set them up, and Double Iron Bash to beat the majority of Pokemon otherwise.
Zacian-Crowned @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Double Iron Bash
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock
- Rapid Spin
This Eternamax can be sent in whenever you feel the need to recover another Pokemon or itself. Its biggest role is to pressure most non OHKO Zacian-Crowned out and prevent outside sweepers (sweepers who aren't currently in A) from sweeping as easily. This is most of what what Eternamax is required to be used in teams for. Otherwise you risk letting yourself become prone to an overwhelmingly larger portion of Pokemon, especially opposing Zacian-Crowned to a bigger extent. I usually run a Stored Power sweeper Eternamax set but Chansey has greatly nerfed it. The delegated sweepers on this team are Pokemon who're better suited to handle Chansey. I figured since it wasn't attacking, it could just mostly serve a passive role where it helps heal the attackers of this team, of which done have any method of recovery on their own. Fissure was given for its efficiency as an attack move in this generation. Eternamax doesn't get harshly punished for missing but the entire team can reap great rewards off opposing targets getting one-shotted. Last but not least it was given Comatose + Black Sludge to absorb Double Iron Bash attacks more easily and while not having to worry about targets using Nuzzle or Spore back. Eternamax is never a Pokemon you want to have put asleep on your team.
Eternatus-Eternamax @ Black Sludge
Ability: Comatose
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Wish
- Rapid Spin
- Fissure
- Teleport
With Chansey's introduction I'd arguably believe Indeedee could be the most proficient sweeper now as it is the Pokemon able to deal the most damage and the best chance against Chansey after completely setting up. Chansey can eat x2 sweepers a lot more easily and punish back harder with Spectral Thief since Dawn Wings/Mewtwo/White Kyurem don't carry an immunity to it. Eternamax has massive 4MSS so it already risks getting walled by more immunities, but it also doesn't land KOs as easily as Indeedee. Indeedee's stronger Stored Power attack in combination of being able to run move coverage options leaves this Pokemon having a bigger advantage than it has in the past.
The specific Indeedee set below specifically targets Chansey and can be used to sweep most opposing Pokemon, who are less likely to wall x3 attacks from Indeedee than x2 from White Kyurem/Mewtwo/Dawn Wings. Taunt stops Chansey from using Haze or Whirlwind, while Normal-typing already blocks Spectral Thief. It can set up once and already threaten the Pokemon with Secret Sword. Under the right circumstances it should also be given the opportunity to set up a second time.
Indeedee (M) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Taunt
- Shell Smash
- Stored Power
- Secret Sword
Sweepers are more restricted to moves that target Chansey, meaning they'll now become easier to wall overall. Part of this is why this team's Eternamax carries the specific moves that it does (Fissure to attack potential sweeper walls, Wish heal Zacian-Crowned or other sweepers if they are low health), but this is also why we have a second Zacian-Crowned.
The Zacian-Crowned set below should be able to help defeat most walls for sweepers, and most Pokemon in general with the combination of Double Iron Bash and Fissure. It carries Substitute to protect itself from opposing attacks, Taunt to block opposing set up sweepers, Double Iron Bash and Fissure to destroy their offenses as usual. Chansey can already handle most prominent sweepers very well but just in case it isn't enough, Zacian-Crowned can find a way to fight back. Safety Goggles was given in case the target has already set up once (mostly if they set up in front of Eternamax or don't get flinched by Double Iron Bash. The last thing you want is to give the opponent an extra free turn to set up. I will admit however that there could be a potential problem with overly relying on this set, seeing how both Double Iron Bash and Fissure have 16 PP total and only Fissure can properly take care of Eternamax and specific Steel-type Stored Power walls such as Aegislash and Dusk Mane.
Zacian-Crowned @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Double Iron Bash
- Taunt
- Substitute
- Fissure
I've already explained Chansey enough, it's there to hardstop sweepers. They are forced to run Secret Sword coverage in order to beat it, automatically giving Zacian-Crowned and most type immunity walls a greater chance to defeat them. It runs Comatose because being put to sleep could turn Chansey's chance of beating sweepers from 100 to 0%. Chansey clears stats and wastes the sweeper's time. Chansey blocks sweepers at x3 unless they run powerful physical moves whereas most Pokemon who aim just to go x2 are unable to break it unless they run Fighting-type attacks. If a sweeper ends up with x3 stats it's likely for Chansey to have an opportunity to shut them down with Haze, force them to start setting up from scratch again, and then Teleport to a Zacian-Crowned, since they also tend to survive x2 attacks against most moves and they take advantage of Secret Sword being a forced coverage option. Magic Coat is given to stop Taunt from blocking its attacks, since this set carries all status moves. Haze is given for it to serve a higher chance against Eternamax among the other sweepers (Spectral Thief would be blocked by Imprison), and Teleport is to be able to revenge more easily with a Zac-C switchin at the right moment.
Chansey (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Comatose
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Soft-Boiled
- Magic Coat
- Haze
- Teleport
I never like having just one sweeper in a team due to how well they carry an entire game. It's just more difficult to win if all of your sweepers are down since you'd have to rely on OHKO moves more frequently. Because of this I've entered my favorite sweeper, Dawn Wings! Dawn Wings is not much different from the rest and has to run Secret Sword unless it wants to get walled by Chansey, although this might not be entirely effective since Chansey can stand in the way of its Dynamax. I like Dawn Wings because it blocks Rapid Spin and is overall able to set up more safely and more easily than every other sweeper bar Eternamax. Since it's slow you can always count on it setting up last so its stats don't get stolen, but it's just fast enough to outspeed all nonscarved Pokemon at +2. Choice Scarf Zac-C's popularity has been declining a bit, the Eternamax set is better at punishing it, Ghost-type is immune to any STAG gimmicks, and it is able to OHKO opposing Eternamax after a Shell Smash using Max Mindstorm Prismatic Laser. It tends to be underrated but these features are too much to look behind, especially for how much it's contributed to my past success in this format overall.
+2 252+ SpA Life Orb Necrozma-Dawn-Wings Max Mindstorm vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Eternatus-Eternamax: 634-749 (88.9 - 105%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock.
(It has 164 Speed EVs to make Dawn Wings the slowest it could possibly be while outspeeding Ninjask at +2)
Necrozma-Dawn-Wings @ Life Orb
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 164 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk
- Prismatic Laser
- Shell Smash
- Stored Power
- Secret Sword
This is one of the new teams I have for now. It's not perfect, of course. I personally believe a Scarf Zacian-Crowned can fit in for example to take full advantage of Chansey forcing x2 sweepers to run Secret Sword. It would sound good to see Zacian-Crowned outspeed before even having to worry about the target attacking. (Although I still believe Safety Goggles is more vital in case the target survives Double Iron Bash without flinching)
change the name to corn on the cobs it'll be way better trust me
30 HP IVs (or 248 HP EVs) helps them take less damage from hazards, status effects, and Substitute, which tend to be more crucial factors in Hackmons than in most other formats.
how does this work?
residual damage is rounded down
when you have true maximum hp you have a number that is divisible, meaning no rounding down
when you have 248 hp evs, you have a number that isnt divisible, meaning it rounds down
in practice this saves like 1 hp per rock, but this lets you have 1 more switch when you are switching a lot
Generally you should avoid asking simple one line questions in a thread. For any further questions about Pure Hackmons ask https://play.pokemonshowdown.com/oldshark or shoot me a message on my smogon profile.
To answer your question pokemon rounds down. This applys for poison, life orb, burn hazards, but for this example let me explain using hazard damage. Pokemon 4x weak to Stealth Rocks such as Charizard would take 50% from Stealth Rocks. If Charizard has 200 HP it would take 50% or 10 0 damage. If Charizard has 199 HP it would take 50% which is 99.5, but that is not the case. Remember when I said pokemon rounds down. Charizard would actually only lose 99HP if it has 199 total HP due to the 5 being rounded down. 99 is less than half of Charizards total HP (199) which would allow it to switch into Stealth Rocks twice and live on 1 HP since 199-99-99=1, compared to if it had 200 total HP it would take 100 each time which is 50%, meaning if it switched in twice it would die since 200-100-100=0. Pokemon only 4x weak to rocks should not have their HP divisible by 2. Pokemon 2x weak to rocks should not have their HP divisible by 4. Pokemon neutral against rock should not have their HP divisble by 8, pokemon that resist rock should not have their HP divisible by 16, and pokemon 4x resistant to rock should not have their HP divisible by 32 (although if you 4x resist rock generally it doesnt really matter). Since pure hackmons allows 252 evs in every stat (in all generations besides 6) you can afford to run 30 ivs with 252 evs because it is the same as 248 evs with 31 ivs, however do not do this in formats like OU or others that limit evs because you lose an ev by lowering ivs and investing evs into that stat. Always use 248 hp 31 ivs instead of 252 hp and 30 ivs outside of hackmons, if you want to invest fully into HP. Beware that not all pokemon need 248 evs in HP if running as much hp as possible however. For example Primarina can run 252 HP evs because that gives it a stat of 364. Since Primarina is neutral against rocks, lets divide that number by 8. 364/8 is 45.5. Since 45.5 is not a whole number and pokemon rounds down, this means that the pokemon already takes less damage from stealth rocks than normal.
Pokemon with an ability such as poison heal would want their HP to be evenly divisible by 12, because that means that its recovery wont round down. Sometimes you want to take less damage from something like Toxic or Burn so you dont want your HP to be divisible by 6. If you ever see a pokemon run less than 31 IVs with a Life Orb, they are probably trying to take less Life Orb damage, since for Lifeorb you dont want your HP to be divisible by 10. You want your HP to be as close to N-1. In this example 10-1. So something with 9 in the last digit of the HP slot would take the least damage from Life Orb, something with 0 as the last digit would take the most.
If you dont fully understand what I said feel free to ask me on my smogon account or in https://play.pokemonshowdown.com/oldshark
Bulbapedia only says that NG can't suppress NG,Stance Change or Schooling
No pokemon in gen 8 have Comatose (or other unneutralizable abilities). Coma and other abilities can be hacked in
Time to go over the new mons! And while I am not Ransei, I tier lead Gen 3 so close enough.
Also, I'm doing a different style. While Ransei just goes over like three mons in a lot of detail, I'm doing every mon that's fully evolved or otherwise viable, with less detail but still detail, and I'll put some information on how they could be used. Let's go!
#031 Nidoqueen
Possible Moves: Stealth Rock, Soft-Boiled, Flamethrower, Taunt, Spectral Thief, U-turn, Whirlwind
Predicted Rank: UR
Nidoqueen's pretty much a worse Comatose Eternamax. Just use that instead.
#034 Nidoking
Possible Moves: Stealth Rock, Soft-Boiled, Flamethrower, Taunt, Spectral Thief, U-turn, Whirlwind
Predicted Rank: UR
Nidoking is even worse than Nidoqueen since the one useful function of that mon, which is a Nuzzle absorber, is made worse because Nidoqueen already struggles against the most common Nuzzle user, Zacian-Crowned. Nidoking's lower bulk cements it as useless.
#144 Articuno
Possible Moves: Spiky Shield, Recover, Parting Shot, Teleport, Stealth Rock, Haze, Defog
Predicted Rank: UR
Articuno's niche is being immune to both Sheer Cold and Fissure and doing it better than Delibird. The issue is that Sheer Cold isn't used, there are way better Fissure immunities, and Articuno loses to the most common Fissure user, once again Zacian-Crowned.
#144 Articuno-Galar
Possible Moves: Soft-Boiled, Spectral Thief, Knock Off, Haze, Rapid Spin, Stealth Rock
Predicted Rank: UR
Worse Lugia. Next.
#145 Zapdos
Possible Moves: Recover, Volt Switch, Defog, Flamethrower, Teleport, Whirlwind, U-turn
Predicted Rank: UR
Zapdos does actually do something. It's the single best Zacian-Crowned counter in the game, barring G-Max Fireball Comatose Eternamax who can still fall to a Fissure out of nowhere, though it's unlikely. It can still run Neutralizing Gas, unlike some checks which want Comatose to avoid paralysis from Nuzzle. It absorbs Double Iron Bash and Nuzzle easily, while still being immune to Fissure. Paired with Heavy-Duty Boots, it can land a Defog on Zacian-Crowned well. Unfortunately it will probably still be UR because it's mostly outclassed by Eternamax, and it will likely not enough of a standout to get ranked.
#145 Zapdos-Galar
Possible Moves: Secret Sword, Substitute, Whirlwind, Recover, Shell Smash, Taunt, Flamethrower, Stored Power
Predicted Rank: UR
It's a cool mon, but what exactly does it do over Eternamax? That's right, nothing.
#146 Moltres
Possible Moves: G-Max Fireball, U-turn, Soft-Boiled, Defog, Rapid Spin, Knock Off, Taunt
Predicted Rank: UR
Outclassed by Ho-Oh and Zapdos. Nothing special.
#146 Moltres-Galar
Possible Moves: Knock Off, Defog, Roost, U-turn, Will-O-Wisp, Haze, Foul Play, Parting Shot
Predicted Rank: UR
Completely outclassed by Yveltal. Next.
#149 Dragonite
Possible Moves: Roost, U-turn, Knock Off, Spectral Thief, Baton Pass, Imprison, Dynamax Cannon, Whirlwind
Predicted Rank: UR
It's a worse Eternamax. Need I say more?
#169 Crobat
Possible Moves: U-turn, Recover, Spectral Thief, Will-O-Wisp, Rapid Spin, Knock Off, G-Max Fireball, Spore
Predicted Rank: UR
It's a fast pivot, which is always nice, but you could use Zacian-Crowned or maybe Ninjask to the same extent. The difference here is that Crobat is the second fastest Fissure immunity, and Ninjask has the obvious flaws of being Ninjask, but that doesn't make Crobat any good. Also Fissure immunities are overrated.
#243 Raikou
Possible Moves: Baton Pass, Volt Switch, Roost, Spectral Thief, Magic Coat, Will-O-Wisp, Whirlwind, Imprison
Predicted Rank: UR
It's...a nothing mon. The most it could possibly do is embody the poor role Zeraora already does poorly. Just use Eternamax, trust me.
#244 Entei
Possible Moves: V-create, Knock Off, Roost, U-turn, Spectral Thief, Teleport, Rapid Spin
Predicted Rank: UR
Another nothing mon. Again, Eternamax or Reshiram is an infinitely better option.
#245 Suicune
Possible Moves: Defog, Will-O-Wisp, Soft-Boiled, Spectral Thief, Knock Off, Flamethrower, Spikes
Predicted Rank: UR
I don't really have to say it a third time.
#249 Lugia
Possible Moves: Knock Off, Roost, Whirlwind, Substitute, Baton Pass, Magic Coat, Spectral Thief, Stealth Rock, Sleep Talk
Predicted Rank: C2
Right before this post, I went off about it in the Old Shark room:
[18:17:36] AV Cosmoem: lugia doesnt work because a 2x resist in stored power is just weaker than what you need
[18:18:18] AV Cosmoem: hdb means spore weakness and when it gets on the field it doesnt do anything to smashers
[18:18:26] Zy / Nt: yveltal might replace mandibuzz
[18:18:44] AV Cosmoem: kyuw destroys it and it has a tough time against indeedee because i imagine spectral is the only real form of damage
Yes, it has a Spore weakness because HDB is its best item unless you have a lot of hazard removal. Yes, KyuW ignores it. Yes, a 2x Psychic resist isn't exactly the most appealing thing in the world. But Lugia still puts in work as a Shell Smash check. Lugia's advantage over the other Smash checks are mainly a good matchup against Moonblast, Flamethrower and Earth Power, its decent Zacian-Crowned matchup, and the ability to outspeed most Smashers pre-Smash and cripple them before they can threaten Lugia. Of course it still has its problems, like choosing between a sleep weakness and a Stealth Rock weakness and being completely useless against Kyurem White, but it's solid and better than the no-niche mons in C3.
#250 Ho-Oh
Possible Moves: G-Max Fireball, U-turn, Soft-Boiled, Defog, Rapid Spin, Knock Off, Taunt
Predicted Rank: UR
This set that I made can pivot on Zacian, Dark-types and smashers for free. Ho-Oh doesn't have a fear of Knock Off since it outspeeds most relevant Darks and just U-turns on them. The problem is that Zapdos also does this but better, and Eternamax does this but better. At least Ho-Oh can use G-Max Fireball comfortably.
#306 Aggron
Possible Moves: Flip Turn, Magic Coat, Stealth Rock, Thousand Arrows, Soft-Boiled, Knock Off, Defog, Whirlwind
Predicted Rank: UR
Aggron is an interesting mon, it's like a physical wall but it's really slow so it benefits from slow pivot and stuff. It's not good or anything (not even a Steel resist?) and Ferrothorn does its job way better in every way.
#334 Altaria
Possible Moves: Stealth Rock, Nuzzle, Spectral Thief, Roost, Knock Off, Whirlwind, Spikes, Court Change
Predicted Rank: UR
It's just a worse Eternamax.
#346 Cradily
Possible Moves: Spikes, Whirlwind, Parting Shot, Baton Pass, Stealth Rock, Will-O-Wisp, G-Max Drum Solo
Predicted Rank: UR
Cradily is the same thing as Aggron, but has a Spore immunity in exchange for being even more awful in every other way.
#359 Absol
Possible Moves: Knock Off, Rapid Spin, Taunt, Soft-Boiled, U-turn, Stealth Rock, Nuzzle, Whirlwind
Predicted Rank: UR
Completely outclassed by Yveltal. Any possible niche Absol could have over Yveltal is also done by Umbreon. So Absol is useless.
#365 Walrein
Possible Moves: Flip Turn, Recover, Defog, Magic Coat, Knock Off, Spikes, Nuzzle, Haze, Will-O-Wisp, Ice Shard
Predicted Rank: UR
What does this even do? I couldn't tell you what to replace Walrein with because it doesn't check anything of significance.
#369 Relicanth
Possible Moves: Stealth Rock, Flip Turn, Taunt, Roost, Haze, Will-O-Wisp, Whirlwind
Predicted Rank: UR
lol
#376 Metagross
Possible Moves: Shell Smash, Sunsteel Strike, Stored Power, Milk Drink, Haze, Spectral Thief, Baton Pass
Predicted Rank: UR
On paper, Metagross is a neat mixed Shell Smash user, so it's not afraid of Chansey, and a solid wall as well due to it having an edge in the Moonblast matchup against other Shell Smashers. In practice, Necrozma-Dusk-Mane is better.
#377 Regirock
Possible Moves: who cares
Predicted Rank: UR
Come on. This is worse Eternamax and you know it.
#378 Regice
Possible Moves: Recover, Volt Switch, Court Change, Whirlwind, Parting Shot, Freeze-Dry, Dynamax Cannon
Predicted Rank: UR
An interesting mon that can maybe try to wall Kyurem White, or try to wall...actually, that's it. Therefore, Dynamax Cannon so that it can damage Kyurem White, the only thing it beats. Freeze-Dry because it works. Obviously it's trash but at least it's funny trash.
#379 Registeel
Possible Moves: Spectral Thief, Recover, U-turn, Baton Pass, Spikes, Nuzzle, Will-O-Wisp, Defog
Predicted Rank: UR
Just use Necrozma-Dusk-Mane. It's better.
#380 Latias
Possible Moves: Stored Power, Eternabeam, Shell Smash, Spore, Flamethrower, Dynamax Cannon, Moonblast, Earth Power, Secret Sword
Predicted Rank: UR
Grouped them together because they're the same thing. Latias and Latios have absolutely nothing over other Smashers. The only thing is that they have Dragon STAB and Psychic STAB at the same time, which is redundant. Just use Mewtwo.
#382 Kyogre
Possible Moves: Water Spout, Soft-Boiled, Fissure, Will-O-Wisp, Substitute, Anchor Shot, Volt Switch
Predicted Rank: UR
An interesting mon that can use Water Spout to trash anything that doesn't resist, and Fissure to trash anything that does resist. Anchor Shot to trap stuff like Eternamax, so you can Fissure them, and Volt Switch because it reaches Gyarados. The problem is that Zacian-Crowned is just Kyogre but better. At least it resists Double Iron Bash.
#383 Groudon
Possible Moves: Thousand Arrows, Shell Smash, Dragon Dance, Recover, Spore, Will-O-Wisp, Substitute, Spectral Thief
Predicted Rank: UR
Another interesting mon, that can use a mono-attacking set with Thousand Arrows and Shell Smash or Dragon Dance, and has some other utility options as well. Since Thousand Arrows is such a great attack, how come this is UR? It's because it doesn't do its job good enough. It takes like 40 from Double Iron Bash, way too much for an offensive check to Zacian-Crowned, since it just flinches everything. It does on average 70% to Bold Eternamax at +6, if you even get to +6 since Eternamax usually just uses Will-O-Wisp, Spectral Thief, Whirlwind, or Haze. Seismitoad does a better job since it can tank Zacian-Crowned well. I mean Seimsitoad's not good either, but whatever, I'm saying Groudon's not good.
#384 Rayquaza
Possible Moves: U-turn, Roost, Nuzzle, Knock Off, Rapid Spin, Spectral Thief, Jungle Healing, Thousand Arrows, Dragon Darts
Predicted Rank: UR
Yeah I put a bunch of ridiculous stuff in the Possible Moves section but not like you're using Rayquaza anyway.
#445 Garchomp
Possible Moves: Thousand Arrows, Parting Shot, Stealth Rock, Rapid Knock, Spectral Thief, Roost, U-turn, G-Max Fireball
Predicted Rank: UR
It's pretty much a worse Eternamax, again. Thousand Arrows STAB is the most it has and it's still not that much.
#466 Electivire
Possible Moves: Baton Pass, Volt Switch, Roost, Spectral Thief, Magic Coat, Will-O-Wisp, Whirlwind, Imprison
Predicted Rank: UR
Electivire, like every Electric-type, is outclassed by Eternamax. Next!
#467 Magmortar
Possible Moves: V-create, Knock Off, Roost, U-turn, Spectral Thief, Teleport, Rapid Spin
Predicted Rank: UR
Magmortar, like every Fire-type, is outclassed by Eternamax and Reshiram. Next!
#480 Uxie
Possible Moves: Spectral Thief, Haze, Soft-Boiled, Defog, Parting Shot, Knock Off, Stealth Rock, Sleep Talk
Predicted Rank: UR
Once again I grouped them together because they're the same thing. We just covered Lugia like 3 minutes ago. Do I really have to explain why Uxie and Mesprit are bad?
#482 Azelf
Possible Moves: Shell Smash, Stored Power, Moonblast, Flamethrower, Spore, Taunt, Secret Sword, Earth Power
Predicted Rank: UR
Azelf is apart from his sisters because he is bad for a completely different reason. Instead of getting outclassed by every Dark in the game like Uxie and Mesprit, Azelf is outclassed by every Smasher in the game. He just has no niche over them.
#483 Dialga
Possible Moves: Shell Smash, Eternabeam, Flamethrower, Spore, Moonblast, Earth Power, Secret Sword, Stored Power, Taunt, Dynamax Cannon, Double Iron Bash
Predicted Rank: B3
Finally, a good Shell Smasher! Dialga's niche over other smashers is to not be weak to Spectral Thief, while resisting Double Iron Bash at the same time. It doesn't sound big, but it actually is, considering every other smasher except Necrozma-Dusk-Mane has a really hard time dealing with Zacian-Crowned, and Necrozma-Dusk-Mane dies to Spectral/Knock Off. Dialga doesn't have a difficult time setting up two Shell Smashes because of its typing, which is when it really becomes comfortable as a sweeper. Seismitoad also does this, but Dialga is way stronger. Of course it has problems, like how it has to set up two smashes before it can start dealing real damage to Eternamax, but we've already seen in Indeedee that's not the worst thing ever. I might be overselling it, but it really should go around this rank. I feel like it's definitely above everything in C1 and B3.
#484 Palkia
Possible Moves: Flip Turn, Soft-Boiled, Defog, Scald, Dynamax Cannon, Water Shuriken
Predicted Rank: UR
It's a cool mon, but it doesn't really have enough to stand out. I would totally use Dynamax Cannon + Water Shuriken to game Smashers though.
#485 Heatran
Possible Moves: Lava Plume, Volt Switch, Milk Drink, Fissure, Whirlwind, Substitute, Defog
Predicted Rank: C3
Fire/Steel is a great type, and it lets Heatran accomplish a few things. Notably it 4x resists Double Iron Bash, making it the perfect switch-in to Zacian-Crowned. It also has a 4x resist to Fairy and a 2x resist to Psychic, meaning that it can also serve as a decent Shell Smash check. The issue is that Earth Power and Secret Sword have been rising, Heatran is really vulnerable to status despite being immune to two of them, and it has the same problem as Lugia where it's only a 2x Psychic resist. I might be proven wrong, but I imagine most people will opt for Necrozma-Dusk-Mane, though Heatran has a stronger Zac matchup in exchange for the Smash matchup. That's a real niche, so I think it deserves C3.
#487 Giratina
Possible Moves: Knock Off, Taunt, Soft-Boiled, Parting Shot, Spectral Thief, Stealth Rock, Rapid Spin
Predicted Rank: B2
Giratina is an incredibly strong wall that can spinblock at the same time. It has three niches over Aegislash. One, it has a good speed tier, so it can pivot around stuff and set Stealth Rocks or Taunts easier. Two, it's a lot fatter. Three, Griseous Orb makes it immune to Trick, making it one of the better Zacian-Crowned answers. Aegislash does have Steel/Ghost, which of course is a huge benefit compared to Ghost/Dragon, but Giratina I believe is around the level of Aegislash and so should share its rank, B2.
#487 Giratina-Origin
Possible Moves: Knock Off, Taunt, Soft-Boiled, Parting Shot, Spectral Thief, Stealth Rock, Rapid Spin, Dragon Darts
Predicted Rank: UR
It's pretty much Giratina, but less fat. It's not even any faster, so there's no reason to use Giratina-Origin.
#488 Cresselia
Possible Moves: Knock Off, Roost, Whirlwind, Substitute, Baton Pass, Magic Coat, Spectral Thief, Stealth Rock, Spiky Shield, Wish
Predicted Rank: C1
It's Lugia, but it trades a worse typing against Psychic Shell Smash users for a Stealth Rock neutrality and higher bulk. I honestly think Cresselia is better since it fixes things that Lugia struggles with like the Kyurem-White matchup, and I think it should be a rank above as it feels a level above Tyranitar and Dusclops as well.
#531 Audino
Possible Moves: Shell Smash, Baton Pass, Substitute, Milk Drink, Whirlwind, Mashup Motive
Predicted Rank: UR
It's outclassed by Snorlax, and Snorlax is C3. That says a lot about how good Audino is.
#615 Cryogonal
Possible Moves: Freeze-Dry, Recover, Defog, Magic Coat, U-turn, Knock Off, Spikes, Nuzzle, Haze, Will-O-Wisp
Predicted Rank: UR
Yeah, no.
#641 Tornadus
Possible Moves: Defog, Roost, U-turn, Whirlwind, Knock Off, Spiky Shield, Taunt
Predicted Rank: UR
Pure Flying is a cool type, but Tornadus doesn't really have anything over Eternamax.
#642 Thundurus
Possible Moves: Recover, Volt Switch, Defog, Flamethrower, Teleport, Whirlwind, U-turn
Predicted Rank: UR
Outclassed by Zapdos, who is outclassed by Eternamax. Next!
#643 Landorus
Possible Moves: Soft-Boiled, U-turn, Earth Power, Thousand Arrows, Defog, Stealth Rock, Sleep Talk
Predicted Rank: UR
Ground/Flying was good in Gen 5, but in Gen 8 I don't think it really accomplishes that much, so UR it is.
#697 Tyrantrum
Possible Moves: Stealth Rock, Defog, Destiny Bond, Taunt, Parting Shot, Endure, Haze, Defog
Predicted Rank: UR
Tyrantrum was famous in the last two gens for being one of the worst Wonder Guards in the entire game, sporting a weakness to Ice, Ground, Fairy, and Steel, making it useless. In Gen 8, Wonder Guards don't exist, leaving Tyrantrum with nothing that makes it memorable. Next.
#699 Aurorus
Possible Moves: Rapid Spin, Freeze-Dry, Volt Switch, Milk Drink, Parting Shot, Spectral Thief, Spikes
Predicted Rank: UR
lol ok
#703 Carbink
Possible Moves: Trick Room, Explosion, Toxic, Magic Coat, Guard Split, Skill Swap
Predicted Rank: UR
Carbink has bolstered full FEAR teams greatly, as it is the only Pokemon with a combination of Trick Room and Sturdy. It is able to utilitze Mental Herb and Explosion to further increase its viability as a Trick Room suicide lead, clearing the way for powerful offensive Pokemon such as Solosis and Togedemaru.
Oh this isn't standard? Well RIP Carbink.
#716 Xerneas
Possible Moves: Moonblast, Recover, Parting Shot, Defog, Volt Switch, Will-O-Wisp, Spore, Spikes
Predicted Rank: UR
What does this do? Dark check? It's just too vulnerable to the meta options to do anything that matters, and there are better Kyurem-White checks.
#717 Yveltal
Possible Moves: Knock Off, Roost, Haze, Will-O-Wisp, Nuzzle, Parting Shot, Defog, Whirlwind, Spectral Thief
Predicted Rank: B1
It's Mandibuzz with better stats, of course it's going to be B1. This time it might actually not be the worst one in that rank! Yay, passing the title to Umbreon!
#718 Zygarde-Complete
Possible Moves: Thousand Arrows, Recover, Whirlwind, Stealth Rock, Haze, Parting Shot, Trick, Substitute, Dragon Dance
Predicted Rank: UR
Zygarde-Complete is a big fat physical Ground-type wall. What more could you ask for? Its ability to easily clean support with its Dragon Dance Substitute set while also serving as a strong check to Zacian-Crowned would deserve a spot in C3. However, it probably won't get ranked, since I'm pretty sure Reshiram also does this but better. At least it has Thousand Arrows STAB.
#785 Tapu Koko
Possible Moves: Volt Switch, Recover, Stealth Rock, Rapid Spin, Moonblast, Nuzzle
Predicted Rank: UR
It's an effective spinner with Moonblast to threaten things and its Speed, but it's just not really strong enough and it doesn't stnad out.
#786 Tapu Lele
Possible Moves: Shell Smash, Stored Power, Moonblast, Spore, Substitute, Secret Sword, Flamethrower
Predicted Rank: UR
Maybe there's something ridiculous I missed like "Tapu Lele outspeeds this at +1 after a Shell Smash" but if this kind of smasher worked, we would have used Gardevoir. But it doesn't. Also Moonblast is required which probably takes a toll on Lele.
#787 Tapu Bulu
Possible Moves: Spectral Thief, Play Rough, Knock Off, Dual Wingbeat, Soft-Boiled, U-turn
Predicted Rank: UR
AV Bulu with Spectral/PR/Knock/DW sounds absolutely hilarious but Bulu's just not really up to par.
#788 Tapu Fini
Possible Moves: Moonblast, Soft-Boiled, Parting Shot, Haze, Defog, Scald, Earth Power
Predicted Rank: C3
Fini's actually decent. It counters Kyurem-White, checks Reshiram, has a really safe Defog, is a strong pivot, and can Scald burn most stuff in its path. It also does good against Dark-types, for obvious reasons. I mean I don't see it getting ranked simply because the council probably doesn't agree with me on this one, and I was a little on the fence for whether or not it deserves UR or C3, but this is my decision, and I stand by it.
That's everything! I hope you had a good read!
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As an aside, Lovely Kiss is (likely) coming back due to the arrival of Jynx.
This means goggles are no longer enough to stop sleepers, and prob will increase viability smashers, especially Mewtwo and DGZ
An increase of comatose might also mean an increase of Stag (a free ko in the right circumstances), No Guard, Simple, etc. in order to beat them
also gmax fireball is unusable
prob gonna be echo
definitely has a niche
both reshiram and dialga can ko at +2 with good hazards, life orb, and dynamaxed eternabeam
reshi better bc it threatens ohko on zac
also clanging scales > dyna cannon
ig sr resist is better but barely any1 used reshi so diag gonan be simialr
This means goggles are no longer enough to stop sleepers, and prob will increase viability smashers, especially Mewtwo and DGZ
An increase of comatose might also mean an increase of Stag (a free ko in the right circumstances), No Guard, Simple, etc. in order to beat them
no111111 ground stab and preventing no guard mons#031 Nidoqueen
Possible Moves: Stealth Rock, Soft-Boiled, Flamethrower, Taunt, Spectral Thief, U-turn, Whirlwind
Predicted Rank: UR
Nidoqueen's pretty much a worse Comatose Eternamax. Just use that instead.
Gyarados and the fan are equally good at countering#145 Zapdos
Possible Moves: Recover, Volt Switch, Defog, Flamethrower, Teleport, Whirlwind, U-turn
Predicted Rank: UR
Zapdos does actually do something. It's the single best Zacian-Crowned counter in the game, barring G-Max Fireball Comatose Eternamax who can still fall to a Fissure out of nowhere, though it's unlikely. It can still run Neutralizing Gas, unlike some checks which want Comatose to avoid paralysis from Nuzzle. It absorbs Double Iron Bash and Nuzzle easily, while still being immune to Fissure. Paired with Heavy-Duty Boots, it can land a Defog on Zacian-Crowned well. Unfortunately it will probably still be UR because it's mostly outclassed by Eternamax, and it will likely not enough of a standout to get ranked.
also gmax fireball is unusable
prob gonna be echo
you are just as fast as eternamax, ie slow#169 Crobat
Possible Moves: U-turn, Recover, Spectral Thief, Will-O-Wisp, Rapid Spin, Knock Off, G-Max Fireball, Spore
Predicted Rank: UR
It's a fast pivot, which is always nice, but you could use Zacian-Crowned or maybe Ninjask to the same extent. The difference here is that Crobat is the second fastest Fissure immunity, and Ninjask has the obvious flaws of being Ninjask, but that doesn't make Crobat any good. Also Fissure immunities are overrated.
no spectral weak means you can stay in on eternamax#379 Registeel
Possible Moves: Spectral Thief, Recover, U-turn, Baton Pass, Spikes, Nuzzle, Will-O-Wisp, Defog
Predicted Rank: UR
Just use Necrozma-Dusk-Mane. It's better.
definitely has a niche
higher than c2, beats just about every current coverage move from *not kyu-b* and 99% sure you live a stray tbolt#249 Lugia
Possible Moves: Knock Off, Roost, Whirlwind, Substitute, Baton Pass, Magic Coat, Spectral Thief, Stealth Rock, Sleep Talk
Predicted Rank: C2
reshiram has the same spa and steel resistance#483 Dialga
Possible Moves: Shell Smash, Eternabeam, Flamethrower, Spore, Moonblast, Earth Power, Secret Sword, Stored Power, Taunt, Dynamax Cannon, Double Iron Bash
Predicted Rank: B3
Finally, a good Shell Smasher! Dialga's niche over other smashers is to not be weak to Spectral Thief, while resisting Double Iron Bash at the same time. It doesn't sound big, but it actually is, considering every other smasher except Necrozma-Dusk-Mane has a really hard time dealing with Zacian-Crowned, and Necrozma-Dusk-Mane dies to Spectral/Knock Off. Dialga doesn't have a difficult time setting up two Shell Smashes because of its typing, which is when it really becomes comfortable as a sweeper. Seismitoad also does this, but Dialga is way stronger. Of course it has problems, like how it has to set up two smashes before it can start dealing real damage to Eternamax, but we've already seen in Indeedee that's not the worst thing ever. I might be overselling it, but it really should go around this rank. I feel like it's definitely above everything in C1, and feels on the level of Gourgeist-Super and Zamazenta-Crowned.
both reshiram and dialga can ko at +2 with good hazards, life orb, and dynamaxed eternabeam
reshi better bc it threatens ohko on zac
also clanging scales > dyna cannon
ig sr resist is better but barely any1 used reshi so diag gonan be simialr
disrespect
#642 Thundurusand #642 Thundurus-Therian
Possible Moves: Recover, Volt Switch, Defog, Flamethrower, Teleport, Whirlwind, U-turn
Predicted Rank: UR
Outclassed by Zapdos, who is outclassed by Eternamax. Next!
It can... chip etern and threaten zacian in the same slot?#718 Zygarde-Complete
Possible Moves: Thousand Arrows, Recover, Whirlwind, Stealth Rock, Haze, Parting Shot, Trick, Substitute, Dragon Dance
Predicted Rank: UR
Zygarde-Complete is a big fat physical Ground-type wall. What more could you ask for? Its ability to easily clean support with its Dragon Dance Substitute set while also serving as a strong check to Zacian-Crowned would deserve a spot in C3. However, it probably won't get ranked, since I'm pretty sure Reshiram also does this but better. At least it has Thousand Arrows STAB.
yes im disrespecting thundy its not good also i said zyg wasnt good enough to get ranked what do you want from me, also ig registeel has something, also nidoqueen is ass and crobat is ass and i said zapdos was bad too, and dialga is not reshiram reshiram runs like scarf or something
tmi im gonna remove you
I can just smell the Poison/Dark & Electric types running Air Balloon & Wonder Guard.
All I can say is that if there was a National Dex version of this format, I would see the Huge Power Mega Mewtwo X from a billion miles away.
All I can say is that if there was a National Dex version of this format, I would see the Huge Power Mega Mewtwo X from a billion miles away.
Don't worry, everyone is just running neutralizing gas on all 6 of their eternamax's anyway
Yep.Don't worry, everyone is just running neutralizing gas on all 6 of their eternamax's anyway
we sure do live in a society
remember when imposter existed? that was fun
remember when imposter existed? that was fun
Some of the best times of our lives.
It's possible that whether this actually gets implemented on Pokemon Showdown depends on its coders, not our ability to push them. But according to this, you can make Eternamax have effectively exactly 0 Defense or Special Defense, and then it takes 2 damage at most from physical or special attacks before factoring in considerations like STAB, type effectiveness, or possibly item boosts or stat boosts...so yeah, good luck 2HKOing those Eternamaxes:
Is PH going to implement this?
This is probably off topic, but I still don't really understand how 252x5 eternamax can be used in PH/BH. I always thought the premise is anything without rom hack, or at least something that you can bring to local battles. But FWIK eternamax can be only obtained by rom hacking den raids, and while you can capture it and bring it to local battles, it always reverts back to orginal form after reloading the save. Without reloading saves for pkhex, wouldn't the total ev be limited to 510 in-game? Or is this a special case allowed by the community?
This is how true ph is, but it depends on if/when developers can actually implement this into PS.
Eternamax can be hacked in. (Crowned Dogs can be too; cant find a good post)
Also maxed out EVs can be hacked and used in local battles, too.
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