Resource Other Metagames Index - Ask Questions Here!

In theory, yes that could be possible, but for now only a code for modifying HP and PP currently exist. And of course, that wouldn't work in LAN play, considering that changes to base stats (i.e. modifying a stat to anything above or below what should be possible based on the base stat) and type don't work with any multiplayer functionality period, but permanent battle-only forms, Ability changes, and movepool changes DO work, but only on LAN connection, which is what I assume Balanced Hackmons is based off of. Therefore the only thing this will help with is allowing permanent battle-only forms like sword doggo, shield doggo, Galar Darmanitan Zen/Regular Darmanitan Zen,and "POSSIBLY" (big quotes around this because of how powerful it is) Eternamax back into Balanced Hackmons and let them use whatever Ability, items, and moves they want.
That’s great to hear. So even though the Zen Modes are based on < 50% HP, where if they Heal they turn back to their non-Zen mode forms, they can maintain a form?

I guess this makes sense, similar to how we could choose to have Aegislash in Sword Form, even if the first turn it uses a Status move (since the BH functionality allows us to remove the form changing ability, and just select the Preferred form in the team builder, thus if we gave it King’s Shield, it will not revert back), but other factors like moves (Relic Song on Meloetta) work regardless of whatever form it startoff the battle in because that is species specific and doesn’t matter what item or ability it has.

Thanks!

This means we can have the Zen modes back!
I guess for the Crowned dogs, we are treating them like Primal-Groudon to Red Orb Groudon, mostly due to power for Zacian, but we could at least apply this to Zamenta and treat it like Primal Kyogre as the weaker of the two as it wouldn’t be banned due to power, or functionality, as it now; according to you can function as Crowned without the item.

Zen Mode is back in the BH game... literally!
 
Last edited:
That’s great to hear. So even though the Zen Modes are based on < 50% HP, where if they Heal they turn back to their non-Zen mode forms, they can maintain a form?

I guess this makes sense, similar to how we could choose to have Aegislash in Sword Form, even if the first turn it uses a Status move (since the BH functionality allows us to remove the form changing ability, and just select the Preferred form in the team builder, thus if we gave it King’s Shield, it will not revert back), but other factors like moves (Relic Song on Meloetta) work regardless of whatever form it startoff the battle in because that is species specific and doesn’t matter what item or ability it has.

Thanks!

This means we can have the Zen modes back!
I guess for the Crowned dogs, we are treating them like Primal-Groudon to Red Orb Groudon, mostly due to power for Zacian, but we could at least apply this to Zamenta and treat it like Primal Kyogre as the weaker of the two as it wouldn’t be banned due to power, or functionality, as it now; according to you can function as Crowned without the item.

Zen Mode is back in the BH game... literally!
Yep! I think we should revert back to old BH with battle-only forms allowed without their specific conditions knowing this, and if necessary just ban Zacian-Crowned and not the Rusted Sword so you can still use sword doggo, but with the Rusted Sword and Intrepid Sword, because people wanted that banned long before this whole no alternate form debacle started. Can someone tag The Immortal to reverse the battle-only form restriction change?
 

The Immortal

is a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Simulator Administratoris a Top Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Programmeris a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Other Metas Leader
Yep! I think we should revert back to old BH with battle-only forms allowed without their specific conditions knowing this, and if necessary just ban Zacian-Crowned and not the Rusted Sword so you can still use sword doggo, but with the Rusted Sword and Intrepid Sword, because people wanted that banned long before this whole no alternate form debacle started. Can someone tag The Immortal to reverse the battle-only form restriction change?
The mechanics of Balanced Hackmons will not be altered based on theory.
 
The mechanics of Balanced Hackmons will not be altered based on theory.
I thought the only theory part of his post was the stat change, (only HP and PP are allowed so we couldn’t alter the Speed, Attack, SpA, Defense, SpD), but he did say that Form changes “do” work for the LAN battles.

I think we were more focused on the form changes, and transitioned away from the base stat discussion:
In theory, yes that could be possible, but for now only a code for modifying HP and PP currently exist. And of course, that wouldn't work in LAN play, considering that changes to base stats (i.e. modifying a stat to anything above or below what should be possible based on the base stat) and type don't work with any multiplayer functionality period, but permanent battle-only forms, Ability changes, and movepool changes DO work, but only on LAN connection, which is what I assume Balanced Hackmons is based off of. Therefore the only thing this will help with is allowing permanent battle-only forms like sword doggo, shield doggo, Galar Darmanitan Zen/Regular Darmanitan Zen,and "POSSIBLY" (big quotes around this because of how powerful it is) Eternamax back into Balanced Hackmons and let them use whatever Ability, items, and moves they want.
Please confirm if the highlighted portion of your quote is not theory, and if the only theory portion of your post was just for base stat editing.
 
Okay, back with a bit of an update. After some testing, I've found out that the doggos are hard coded to be in the base formes outside of battle at all times, can confirm with both sword doggo and shield doggo, so rip that, however, Zen Mode Galarian Darmanitan / Zen Mode Unovian Darmanitan and Eternamax Eternatus work just fine outside of battle. I think because the doggos require a specific item and spawn in battle as the other form without the need for a transformation, they are immune to the rule that if you get the form in game without resetting your game, you can keep it. Also confirmed that Eternamax and Galar Zenmanitan work on LAN battles without problems, and you can Dynamax/Gigantamax with Eternamax in battle. Base stat / type editing, no matter what way you do it, will not work with any multiplayer functionality unless the other player has the exact same changes due to the way the game is programmed.
tl;dr, doggos can't get their battle-forms, every other mon can, and they work on LAN battles.
 
Okay, back with a bit of an update. After some testing, I've found out that the doggos are hard coded to be in the base formes outside of battle at all times, can confirm with both sword doggo and shield doggo, so rip that, however, Zen Mode Galarian Darmanitan / Zen Mode Unovian Darmanitan and Eternamax Eternatus work just fine outside of battle. I think because the doggos require a specific item and spawn in battle as the other form without the need for a transformation, they are immune to the rule that if you get the form in game without resetting your game, you can keep it. Also confirmed that Eternamax and Galar Zenmanitan work on LAN battles without problems, and you can Dynamax/Gigantamax with Eternamax in battle. Base stat / type editing, no matter what way you do it, will not work with any multiplayer functionality unless the other player has the exact same changes due to the way the game is programmed.
tl;dr, doggos can't get their battle-forms, every other mon can, and they work on LAN battles.
Thank you! You are great for being so helpful.

The Immortal so this is the confirmation you needed, correct? No theories on the Zen Mode, etc. forms. Please announce we can officially, legitimately, use Zen Mode in the team builder without Validation Check issues.

Thanks!

Wow, and to think I changed my Profile picture and Signature on this day of all days. The sun may have been setting in my Darm-Z photo, but it was not setting on Darm-Z’s use. The return of a king has arrived. #Gloat4TheGOAT
 
Me too! I know it’s all because 420LegitShucks did a great job researching the matter. You can view that here. I initially didn’t want to spoil the announcement but I feel like some people would want the context for the acknowledgement, in case The Immortal has wanted to be seen first.

Ultimately, I feel it will be they both will be the great check (offensively Galar), and counter (defensively Unova) to the doggos bc it can either KO, or single-handledly resist all of their STABs, while threatening with its own STAB.

I hope to put them to good use.

Lastly, I like your sets. For someone who recently joined us, I am glad you came up with helpful and very strong utility even against Imposter.

Externatus with RegenVest doesn’t just seem to work well, it makes very good sense, as the fall of Psychic attackers & attacks, weakening of Ground moves, and high Speed allow it to escape very well without coming in on a hit and being afraid of going last to tank 1 too many (like if the foe has a surprise coverage move).

For Solgaleo maybe a good set would be Prankster / Magic Bounce:
Spectral Thief, Roost, Anchor Shot, Entrainment / Poison Fang.

This allows you to Imposterproof your Zekrom, if it fell below 80% HP, as they Multi-Attack on your switch, which you resist. When they try and Boomburst, they get Entrained so you resist that too (and they lose STAB). Spectral Thief disarms their Shell Smash, and works off of Solgaleo’s workable Attack.

Otherwise I would consider for a Magic Bounce set - Poison Fang for accumulating damage while a foe are trapped. Roost keeps you safe, while Magic Bounce also blocks Hazards, Status attacks, etc. Magic Bounce still stops Entrainment.

This also works well if Imposter switches into it, (you can trap and wear down their PP until they struggle), and can play a major role on a team in general. Solgaleo doesn’t need to be offensive, it can take the offensive boosts away as a defensive check and then bring the power from Spectral Thief.

This also works well as a stop to Dragapult’s Normalize shenanigans. You Entrain first via Prankster as they try and Entrain, and if they try and set up you can Spectral for super effective damage. Since it is a Ghost, you cannot trap, so when they switch out you can Poison Fang their switch-in, only for them to have a 50% chance of being Toxic Poisoned. ;)

Once they see you have Spectral Thief, the will avoid sending in set uppers that are not the Normal-type, and if you have Magic Bounce they cannot try and use status moves or hazards. Be careful of Scald, though, still you handle most things while resisting SRocks, and being immune to Toxic Spikes.
Does this mean that Eternatus-Eternamax can be used in Pure Hackmons?
 

Ransei

Everyone has a story
is a Community Leaderis a Community Contributoris a Battle Simulator Moderator
Other Metas Leader
One big question I have in mind is if it's still able to take double from Dynamax Cannon, Behemoth Blade, and Behemoth Bash.

12/19 edit:
I have been informed with evidence. Behemoth Bash, Behemoth Blade, and Dynamax Cannon don't inflict twice as much damage to Eternatus-Eternamax.

This along with all the other information collected about this Pokémon confirms Eternatus-Eternamax will be treated entirely as a regular base Pokémon rather than a Dynamaxed Eternatus.
 
Last edited:
Are there any plans to implement Rusted Sword/Rusted Shield into MnM, similar to Red Orb/Blue Orb?

Rusted Sword: +40 Atk, +10 Spe, Steel Typing, Intrepid Sword

Rusted Shield: +30 Def, +30 SpD, -10 Spe, Steel Typing, Dauntless Shield

Rusted Shield would be mostly outclassed by Sablenite, but Rusted Sword would definitely be viable, +40 Atk and a free 50% boost would make it one of the best mega stones in terms of raw power.
 

GΔCT

once upon a time won't last forever
Are there any plans to implement Rusted Sword/Rusted Shield into MnM, similar to Red Orb/Blue Orb?

Rusted Sword: +40 Atk, +10 Spe, Steel Typing, Intrepid Sword

Rusted Shield: +30 Def, +30 SpD, -10 Spe, Steel Typing, Dauntless Shield

Rusted Shield would be mostly outclassed by Sablenite, but Rusted Sword would definitely be viable, +40 Atk and a free 50% boost would make it one of the best mega stones in terms of raw power.
Given that the orbs are no longer usable in MnM, this seems unlikely. For the same reason as those were removed (they are totally different mechanics), the Sword and Shield wouldn't be added.
 
While it passes the validation check in the Team Builder, should Primordial Sea be allowed in BH? It doesn’t exist in Generation 8. No Kyogre-Primal, who is the sole user of it, so like with the Type Gems not existing, maybe the ability should be banned, just like how Kyogre-Primal is. Afterall, if we cannot use the crowned forms due to the fact they are hard coded in, why can we use an ability from a banned Pokémon?
 
OM! Primordial Sea is allowed because it still exists in the game's code, same with all the other abilities of Pokemon that got cut. It's possible on cartridge to hack in a Pokemon with Primordial Sea and bring it to a LAN battle. The same is not true of the crowned dogs, which as far as we know are impossible to use in a battle against another person without having their signature item and ability.
 
OM! Primordial Sea is allowed because it still exists in the game's code, same with all the other abilities of Pokemon that got cut. It's possible on cartridge to hack in a Pokemon with Primordial Sea and bring it to a LAN battle. The same is not true of the crowned dogs, which as far as we know are impossible to use in a battle against another person without having their signature item and ability.
I appreciate your informative, kind, and validated post. Thank you.

I assumed as much, similar to how Zen Mode is allowed due to LAN battles, but abilities on banned Pokemon is interesting. It’s a shame their moves are banned via the MovesIt (Disabling of moves, like Pursuit, upon transfer).

In either case, it’s good to know it wasn’t a coding issue that was waiting to be nicked.
 
I try again: will there be strategic analyzes for the NFE mons on the Smogon dex (as is the case for the LC or the Monotype)?
 
I try again: will there be strategic analyzes for the NFE mons on the Smogon dex (as is the case for the LC or the Monotype)?
Yes. It might take some time, but this was recently announced by Alakazam here:

and the big one, the NFE QC team has been created as well! They will primarily be creating Gen 8 analyses for the on site dex, but they are also practicing with some Gen 7 NFE Pokemon that will be published.

NFE
BloodAce0107, Crystalites, SBPC, Marjane, vooper, and Quagg have all joined the newly created NFE QC!
Expect analyses to be published sometime soon!
 
What is the current policy on bringing back OMs from Generation 7/6, in the case of the previous leader no longer desiring to reprise their role? I've seen a good amount of suggested OMs in this Metagame Workshops of both this and the previous generation that have shared significant, if not exact premises with previous OMs. What would one do in this case, If they'd like to lead the tier? I've heard something about having to go to the previous leader and attain their approval. Is this the case? As a person with the desire to resubmit a previous metagame, I'd appreciate an answer.
 
What was OM leadership thinking when they made this years OM Circuit????

Like seriously, what’s the point in having STABmons and NFE in OMGS and have them count for Circuit points if they aren’t featured anywhere in the rest of the Circuit? They should at the very least be metagames in the finals with a Best of 5, if not have separate tours that count for circuit points as well. STABmons Seasonals were originally in the Circuit plans, and last I had checked they still were. What changed that they were removed?

2019’s circuit finals were made a Bo5 due to the large amount of users complaining about BH being too uncompetitive for a Bo3 (albeit I was not one of these users). This was a change most players were happy with, so why is it that the Circuit finals were changed back to a Bo3 this year?

The decisions made by leadership for the Circuit this year were very poor, in my opinion. Not only is the Circuit just inconsistent, it greatly discourages new players from trying for the trophy, and I know I won’t even think about participating in its current state.

Please consider changing this current Circuit setup.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 2, Guests: 3)

Top