Reflecting on BW and Looking Ahead to Gen VI - SEE POST #508

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@Choice Specs
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Like the idea previously mentioned of a special version of Intimidate. It would seriously help in this ridiculously offensive metagame. I also want to see more types of priority. A special fire type priority or an electric priority would be really cool. More entry hazards would also be cool; I REALLY like the idea of ice type Stealth Rock (say goodbye to dragon types lol). Also, sandstorm gives rock types a special defense boost, why doesn't hail give ice types a defense boost? That would help make it viable (and push Kyurem(-B) over the edge, IMO).

I like the idea above for a Gravity auto-inducer.
I think at least one new tier is called for next gen, and that'll probably be necessary anyway when you take all the new Pokémon on their way into account. I think that OU is significantly stronger than what it used to be, with ultra-powerful Pokémon with crazy stats and OP abilities happily roaming free. Instead of banning them all to ubers, I feel like a tier between OU and UU would be nice, where the top 15-20 OU pokes are banned so people can enjoy an environment that's not quite so daunting, something more closely resembling Gen IV OU. Or, perhaps a new tier right at the bottom end of the scale is called for. NU used to be the place for unusable schlock, but now you've got to really go digging elbow-deep right into the bottom of the usage stats before you can find stuff that's outright bad.

As for personal hopes for next gen, well, top of my list is some unique new typings, or ones that have been previously neglected. Ground / Bug and Water / Bug, I'm looking at you. Ghost / Steel and Dragon / Fighting would also be entertaining to see, especially if they could offset how crazy good those typings are with some sensible drawbacks.

Also, ice types do need buffing. It's the only typing where having it is categorically a drawback almost all of the time, even when opposed to stuff like Grass, Poison or Flying. but I really have no idea how to go about fixing it without tinkering with type matchups, something I'm extremely cautious of.

Also, give me a rock type move with perfect accuracy, around 80-90 base power and no added effects. Make it a TM that every rock type can learn. FREE US FROM THE TYRANNY OF STONE EDGE, GAME FREAK.

Also I'd like a move that works like Defog only not dumb, ie; removes hazards from YOUR side of the field and not your foes. In fact, just fix Defog so that's what it does. It would make flying types a lot better and brings in a whole bunch of good new hazard-clearers who aren't restricted by rapid spin's shit distribution. Still I don't think it would entirely put Starmie, Forretress et. al. out of business, because you could theoretically block the new-and-improved Defog with Taunt, something you can't do with Rapid Spin.
I want a non-attacking move that removes weather and hazards. Suddenly there's a reason to run weatherless, since that gives you another way to Rapid Spin. Cloud Nine also needs better distribution, and needs to be fixed to that it deactivates weather rather than suppresses it.
Oddly, I also want buffs to Sun and Hail. Sun needs a better starter and more boosted moves, Hail needs a 50% attack drop for non-ice types, and more abilities that it boosts.
Scald needs a nerf. Any move that's far more popular than Surf with the same typing clearly has a problem.

More unique type combos, a few nerfs to offensive threats. A Choice-equivalent item for defensive mons would be a godsend, but there's no good way to do that that I can think of. A speed-boost item similar to Life Orb would be cool, too. It would give the base-90s something to do.

Non-meta, I want character customization. Lose the stupid boy/girl question at the beginning and just let me build my character from the ground up. Suddenly every fight wouldn't be against one of the same few sprites.
Wish list of gen VI GO!

1. New auto inducers of things besides weather. For example what if a pokemon had an auto trick room "weather" when it enters the battle? A gravity auto inducer would be great as well.
As much as I love Trick Room, that Pokemon would be so broken. The question I would have with that is, how long would Trick Room last? Would it only last for as long as the Pokemon is on the field? And then how will people stop Trick Room once it's on the field? All those are questions that would make that Pokemon broken. But if GameFreak did that they should give to the king Slowking.

The Gravity user should be Dusknoir or Metagross.
Trick Room is actually more powerful of an effect than weather for most part, no way they are releasing an autoinducer with that -althought I suppose at least it wouldn't give us permanent TR-.

I'd like to see if they could pull a new ability like a pokemon that can use the same move twice in a row during one single turn, or another oddball like that.


I actually like the trend of bringing in more and more offensive threats.However,I do hope for more defensive mons though.As the offensive nature of the meta has given speed and priorities an unhealthy importance.When people start running scarfstarmie and multi scarfers you know just how desperate they are.

Like almost everyone,I would like to see weathers disappear or get nerfed.Air Lock/Cloud Nine pokemons would be terrific imo(aka a bulky rayquaza to shit on chloro abusers,scarfKeldeo and torn-T).And some new abilities and some influential items(lol@air balloon,rocky helmet).

Also,good spinners,good spin blockers,and all that stuff(plz no fight-rock resist though).

Auto TR inducer:LMAO,ever faced a Conkeldurr under TR?


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Team Preview has honestly saved our asses lol, the metagame would be in much worse shape without it. The ability to see threats before the game has started has allowed us to keep strong Pokemon such as Dragonite and Volcarona in the metagame. Weather wars would be even worse and a struggle to keep hazards up would increase. The only real detriment I think preview has brought is nerfing the incredibly awesome Zoroark.

By the way, preview has had a huge positive impact on VGC so I seriously doubt you'll be seeing it removed any time soon.

I haven't read through the entire thread but I'm sure the usual things like new Rapid Spin are going to come up. Ground type Spin would be awesome imo, Dragonite the spinblock!
-Dream World abilities incompatible with Gen 6

-No Permanent sleep mechanics

-No Scald

-Influx of Rotom-W counters

-Less people blaming GameFreak for an unbalanced metagame and more on not just banning Drizzle / Drought so we could uncover SOME of the problem mons

Edit-Fundamental change of competitive pokemon like Team Preview / Physical + Special split (not one just ruining it like Weather), Ground-Type spin as I just saw from TFC would be interesting.
I want this metagame to be a lot more defined in comparison to the previous. This metagame really just feels like a mush of gigantic threats that can kick you out the door.
A Grass/Dragon type. The possibilities are endless, chlorophyll, natural cure. The powerrrrr!

Also a buff to hail would be very nice since it got nothing much (other than Kyurem) this gen, maybe another inducer?
A ghost/steel that could spin/set up hazards would be cool.
A couple more magic bouncers is cool.
Whirlwind phases hazards along with the Pokemon may be cool.
Scald burn chance nerf to 10% seems balanced.

Also, Cool typings.

Ice types getting defensive buff in hail/ ice type moves getting boosted in hail seems fair.


Ride on Shooting Star
BW without team preview would be much worse imo. Revealing sweepers after counters are weakened/dead would make many pokemon impossible to deal with.
BW without team preview could be horrible, but by other hand, it's not a good answer... "hey, I'm a horrible metagame, let's do something that broke part of what Pokémon is for fixing it at some degree", so, I could love to see team preview out from the game, and balance somewhat more the metagame.


- Every Pokémon should have the same quanty of IV's... In that way, you should play more with the distribution of those IV's, making things more inclined to preparation, and also; I always feeled injust that some Pokémon are just worse... because yes and because random, all Pokémon should have the same number of IV's with just different distribution. When Breeding, the IV's should be a sort of random "mix" between the two partners, for example if the mother had 30 of speed and the father 20, then the baby can have between 20-30 +/- 1-2.

- Taking in account the impact that can make the previous point, a limit of 150 EV's or something like that on each stat, making more important the classic bulky attacking of Gen 1/2 if you're playing on offensive on place of just put 252 EV's of attack/special attack and speed and sweep right away.

- Generation 4 inserted a lot of broken moves being distribuited to Pokémon who could just abuse of it right away, at difference of Generation 3 and previous, and sadly, because you can just interchange with Generation 5, you can pass them! So... A good solution to this problem (for example, Stealth Rock being a TM on generation 4 is one of worst things ever that Generation 5 was unnable to help) could be that you can pass Pokémon from previous generation, but only eggs, and those eggs just doesn't carry any TM/HM/Tutor move when it hatchs, it also could be combined with the previous points to doesn't make any problem of compatibility and stuff. In other words, a rebuild of the movesets of each Pokémon.

To the last point, the unique users who can learn it via level up are all Pokémon on buttom tiers like Golem, the unique exception is Ferrothorn, but I think if he makes the unique OP user of Stealth Rock, he should just be banned from OU, and problem fixed if the games doesn't balance very well at all.

- A debuff of weather induced abilities: That is, on place of make them forever, they should only be of limited turns like Sunny Day move and stuff, in that way you can just buy time to shout down the weather, and at the same time, give space and time for the weathers teams to work, too.

- Some minimal change to the type chart: Rock Type should resist Dragon. Ground Type should be weak to Flying (in that way, your Flying Type friends can finally switch with a reason to those Earthquakes). Bug-Type should resist Psychic Type or Dark Type, whatever of both. Steel-Type should not resist Psychic or Ghost, making them neutral. Ice Type should resist Water. Poison Type should be super effective against Dragon or Figthing. Optionally, Flying Type attacks could be inmune against Ghosts, too.

That is, with those suggestions (and with natural reasons behind it, apart from balance) almost any type should have a similar advantage on any tier. Also, less Water Type Pokémon should be able to learn Ice Beam, that just make Grass Type innefective against them, when they should be able to destroy them. Fire Type Pokémon should have better movesets, too. Fire Walls should learn a move like... a heal move of 1/2 HP that can give them an extra resistance or something like that, and Fire attackers should just have better coverage and optional moves... apart from Will-o-Wisp, derp.

I could rather buff a bit the Normal Type moves, too, because they can't do Super Effective with it's stab, then should have some of extra punch on their attacks, at least, like Double-Edge with 140 of BP and things of that sort, while Dragon Type moves should have a minimal debuff on it's BP, like they were before Generation 4, with Outrage having 90 or 100 of BP, and Draco Meteor with 110 or 120 of BP. A more balanced special Flying and Normal Type attack should be done and had better distribution, Porygon is ok with Tri Attack, but there're other sad Normal Type Pokémon with high special that can't use it at all, like Pidgeot or Noctowl.

Rain Dance, Hail, Sunny Day, and Sandstorm (and Trick Room) should be on the field for 6 turns without need of an item, and with the item, should be 10 turns (not item for Trick Room, please), I think, That could make more variety with the thing of weather inducers if the debuff to it's abilities is applied.


Innovative new design!
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  • Give Ice-types more resistances. Grass and Water would be the obvious ones, you're not going to melt Ice with Water unless it's scalding hot (Scald could deal more damage to Ice types if they want :p)
  • Improve Rapid Spin distribution. Scolipede (from Whirlipede), Meloetta (justified by Pirouette Form), and Tornadus would make sense from a flavour standpoint. Rapid Spin Tornadus-T would certainly have some interesting implications... if not exactly balanced ones. Cloyster would also become more viable as a spinner with a 4x resistance to Water and neutrality to Grass.
  • Improve Recover/Slack Off distribution. As stated before, many Pokemon in the lower tiers would be able to do much better if they had reliable recovery.
  • Make it so that auto-weather abilities just induce Rain Dance or Drizzle automatically upon entry, with the weather rocks boosting their duration. If this is bad for Kyogre/Groudon flavour wise, then just replace Ninetales/Politoed's abilities with lesser versions. This would make weather playstyles a little more balanced at least.
That's probably good enough for me. Maybe a new type that does well against Fighting types but falls to Psychics would also be cool, but idk.


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I think Gen. VI, like all the generations before, will add exactly what we expect it to: Lots of Pokémon which would break/fix the Gen. V Metagame. What we want is for the current errors to be smoothed over, new Pokémon given time in the limelight, new types being buffed or nerfed so they aren't as screwed over as they are currently. And yes, we get those corrections, but the outcome of that is a totally changed metagame in which the "fixes" barely help the receivers from being total fodder.

For instance, Magic Guard Alakazam in RSE would be a top-tier threat. Dusknoir would run rampant in RSE OU, smashing 'mons left and right.
"Technician Breloom would be overpowered!", we cried. Technician Breloom came, but the metagame shifted around it, and suddenly it performed decently, but it was hardly broken.

At the same time, did any of us anticipate the changes BW gave us? Could we, with all our experience from DPPt, predict what would be the top threats of the BW metagame before the games were out? Not at all. Suddenly, lots of new Pokémon, lots of new moves, a few new mechanics and items we would never have expected before.

We can look at the current metagame, see what's broken and what's not, but all that is going to be changed when XY comes. Half of what we want to fix won't even be applicable any more. Perhaps fire-type priority will send Scizor to UU. A new entry hazard could render Dragonite unusable. New items or moves could make Beedrill OU material. Perhaps we'll see a new Moody, and a period of Delibird sweeping Uber teams before getting banned. Perhaps the metagame will implode completely, requiring severe modifications to be remotely balanced in the first place. We will not know before it's here. What we want fixed belongs to this generation. What will come, belongs to the next.
Pokemon X and Y? Damn, Pokemon has really outdone itself this time. However, there are some stuff I'd like to see as well ;)

1.) We need more weather abusers...but anything but rain. We need Pokemon that can take advantage of other weathers than just Rain. One big reason that this generation kinda felt boring was simply the fact, IMO, that rain dominance and the rain abusers were simply too abundant compared to others.

2.) Do bring in a OU Viable Cloud 9 or AirLock Pokemon. I don't think GameFreak understands just how desperate I was to sneak in a ALtaria, Golduck, or Lickilicki for the sake of a non-weather team....

3.) Pkn X and Pkn Y need to introduce more defensive Pokemon. This metagame needs a hell of a balancing. The amount of offense that I see (even though it's one of my favorites kinds) really gets boring. I'd like to see a resurgence of Balanced+Bulky offense and some stall just like the good ol' days of BW1.

4.) I'd like to see more offensive Rapid Spinners and maybe one more Magic Bouncer.

5.) Buff Lucario. Buff Lucario. Buff Lucario.
If gen 6 is like recent gens they will probably add a whole lot more offensive pokemon. Honestly I dont mind if they add more offensive threats as long as they are not too fast. I dont think the meta-game can afford to get any faster as it would mean pokemon with base 100 speed thats arn't running a scarf set might not even be a viable option anymore. Remember in gen 4 when Garchomp's base 102 speed was considered really fast. Well in the current meta-game it's 'fast' but not fast enough anymore.


Sacred Sword
i want a fucking GOOD spinner. Something actually designed to be the perfect spinner in the game, i dont ask much, i would just say a ferrothorn with recover and rapid spin, it really really sucks that it doesnt learn these moves. So if gf could gives us a better spinner it would be good, and if they dont at least i wish they put rapid spin as a tutor move. Also i think recover/roost should be a tutor moves as well (dont know if it already is) but i think that things like bronzong would very appreciate it, as well a shitload of other things that i actually dont remember. Also, i want to see more defensive ghosts in the mg, jellicent was ok but i think that a grass/ghost pokemon with nice defenses would be a nice addiction, i dont ask that perfect typing ghost/steel with levitate anyway because i know trollfreak will never gives us this. I want stealth rock to be available on way more things (like, wtf gastrodon cant learn stealth rock...?) as well as more spikes users and why not, toxic spikes. What im dreaming about the most is an item with the same effect of eviolite but for fully evolved pokemon. This would really be a great thing for defensive team and it could balance the matchup against offensive teams. As you can imagine i want the metagame to be more and more defensive.
I think one of the most obvious nerfs that need to happen is to actually affect one of the most prominent and dangerous types that is only resisted by one type namely dragons... Rather than the nth suggestion of a steel type, whose main purpose is to help against dragons, I think it would be better if they just toned down the dragons overall I mean lets face it this gen was incredibly generous to them, either giving them DW buffs (e.g. Dragonite & Salamence) or expanded movepools to bypass would be counters or walls (e.g. Hydregion/Haxorus). Dragons just need to be nerfed that in itself would already be a nod towards toning down offense.

Another thing I'd love to see them work with in the next gen is... Permanent weather not being permanent. I really wouldn't mind the weather abilities if they weren't something that lasted for the whole game. I think it would bring a lot of balance back and help the metagame if it didn't have to last the entire match, I dunno let it last 5 or 8 turns.

As a praise though to this gen I do like that they did try to increase the viability of odder teams like Trick Room, as one notices a bunch of good TR mons this gen. I hope they continue this trend and next gen other than continually looking to improve trick room perhaps improve the mechanics of the other rooms they created and gravity. Just please do not make any permanent or auto-inducers for TR or gravity because these are VERY POWERFUL terrain effects and buffing them by giving them something akin to drizzle or drought is just a recipe for disaster. At best I could live with these moves acquiring an item to boost duration or something but an auto-inducer would just ruin the nice balance these teams are built on.

Scald toned down big time... Or remove it :D Its such a mindlessly easy move to abuse with very little consequence, who cares if you're using scald on something that resists water because the burn status is what will really hurt them and at a 30% chance its very easy to fish for.

Oh and last but not the least a very obvious buff to ice types by simply giving Jynx a much needed evolution, she has the moves and ability (dry skin) to be an incredible offensive ice mon she just needs a buff on stats (particularly speed) that really would come from the fact she is the only humanoid type in the numeric sequence that has yet to receive an evolution.

Dark Fallen Angel

2. New weathers. Something like Sorawing's acid rain idea.
I like the new weather idea. I was thinking of something like "night" to buff Dark/Ghost-type attacks. This would give people another reason to use them, other than combating Psychic-types.

I also would like more things:

  1. A new type. It would be interesting to balance the metagame. I was thinking of a type that could hit Water super-effectively, as well as Ghost (most teams don't have super-effective attacks against Ghosts these days, although they are either too frail or have a secondary, common weakness anyway), but to nerf Water-types would be a good idea to remove Rain dominance from the metagame. I was thinking of a Light-type. C'mon, guys, there's a Dark-type. It's interesting to note that the new deer legendary looks like it had light on its body.
  2. More exotic type combinations. Ghost/Steel is the combination that I wish more, preferably with Levitate. This Pokémon could be the best counter to top-threats like Terrakion and Sheer Force Landorus. It could even be a staple on this metagame. However, combinations like Dragon/Grass (anti-Water-type Pokémon?), Grass/Fire (A NEW CHLOROPHYLL SWEEPER WITH STAB ON FIRE ATTACKS!!!), Water/Fire (with Cloud Nine, it could be an excellent anti-weather Pokémon), Ice/Steel (the best counter to Dragon-types on the game), Ice/Fighting (One of the few Ice-types neutral to Stealth Rock, with a STAB combination with excellent type coverage, if it had Ice Shard and Mach Punch, it would just kick asses), Dragon/Fighting (A Dragon that could just Close Combat those Steel-types away), Fighting/Flying (Imagine Staraptor with STAB on Close Combat)
  3. Decent Flying-type attacks. Most Flying-types those days don't use Flying-type attacks, just because there aren't any decent Flying-type attacks that aren't poorly distributed, most of them either have a drawback that doesn't make them appealing (Hurricane's being only accurate on rain, Acrobatics requeriment of not using an item, Fly's 2 turn duration), or are too weak to be useful (Wing Attack, Aerial Ace). The only two decent Flying-type attacks are poorly distributed (Brave Bird and Aeroblast - the latter is a signature move, in fact). The fact that Tornadus-T is about to be banned just show how a Flying-type attack can be very destructive on the metagame. In fact, there are more Pokémon that resist Dragon than Pokémon that resist Flying on the meta! This would force people to be cautious with their teams.
  4. Decent Ghost-type Pokémon. There are only two Ghost-type Pokémon on OU. Jellicent and Gengar. The former lacks offensive presence, and the latter is too frail. Also, both can be defeated by the most common spinner on the metagame, Starmie, if the former lacks the right EV spread, and the latter lacks Choice Scarf. The spinblockers these days have very few reasons to be used other than spinblocking. Jellicent is only being used more now, because it's a counter to Keldeo.
  5. More sandstorm abusers. There are only three real Pokémon that exceed on sandstorm, not counting Terrakion and Tyranitar, which only abuse the fact that they are getting a boost to their Special Defense on sandstorm. These three Pokémon in question are Stoutland, Sandslash and Landorus. The former two have their speed doubled, and the latter becomes stronger. Apart from those, there aren't good sandstorm abusers, like Excadrill, which was broken for the metagame and was banned.
  6. An accurate Rock-type attack. Seriously, I am tired to use Stone Edge, which misses more often than not, when I need that it hits. The only three accurate Rock-type attacks are special, or too weak.
  7. More decent options, for Fire-types, to combat Water-types. Most of them only have Solarbeam or Hidden Power Grass/Electric. The former is too risky, and the latter is very weak, seriously, I want that Fire-types can have a way to combat Water-types, just as Water-types have a way to combat Grass-types (Ice Beam).
  8. More ways to get rid of entry hazards. Preferably, more spinners, more that can easily fit on teams, like Starmie or Forretress. Preferably, spinners that can also lay down hazards, like the aforementioned Forretress, or like Excadrill. Or more Magic Bounce users, preferably one with decent stats (not like Xatu) or that is not frail, that have reliable recovery, and a good typing (not like Espeon). Or, invent new ways to get rid of hazards (lol Defog).
  9. A new entry hazard that did damage like Stealth Rock. One that could cripple an dominant type, like Water-, Steel-, or Dragon-types. For Water, a Grass-type hazard could be very useful, and would also cripple Terrakion, as well as the two sand inducers, Tyranitar and Hippowdon. It would also be a knife on Gastrodon's heart. It would not be a big deal, as there are many things that resist Grass attacks, anyway. For Steel, a Fire-type entry hazard could be very useful, but unfortunately, it could also be broken, as while Water-types would not bother with that hazard because of their resistance, there are many top threats that are 4x weak to Fire, like Scizor and Ferrothorn. Not to mention that Abomasnow would be heavily crippled. It would probably be banned from the metagame. A Ground-type entry hazard would not be very useful because of the abundance of Ground-type immune Pokémon on this metagame. For Dragon, an Ice-type entry hazard would be very good, but again, it could also be arguably broken, as like Fire, there are many top threats 4x weak to Ice, and thus, an Ice-type hazard could be broken.
  10. More, different setup moves. For example, a Dragon Dance that boosted Special Attack instead of Attack, or a physical Quiver Dance (boosting Attack, Defense and Speed).


ne craint personne
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If I had one wish for this new GEN, it would be to not increase too much the size of the metagame already. At the moment the 5th GEN is horribly instable, bringing more pokemons to it would result in a big chaos that we would have to deal with for some years at least.

To that, I see some possibilities :
- Ban faster, harder. I rather start from a narrowly sized metagame (but not so unbalanced) to a bigger one, than the opposite process.
- Work from the pokemons we already have. Chimecho is not so cool right ? find a way to improve it instead of creating a brand new pokemon. This would also help to strenghten the universe of the game in itself. I don't know for you, but in my opinion, I totally stopped looking at all those crappy looking dolls after the second GEN. For god sake, there is no comparison possible between the new GENs and the first ones in terms of graphism. And we all know, graphism works for a large part of the credibility we'll give to the game.

For the metagame in itself, I would, instead of increased big defensive house, try to look for balanced pokemons.
Watch Terrakion, it's either a pure attacker, or a Focus Sash lead. It's like, you can have a defensive pokemon, or an offensive one and that's it. Or you can give your offensive pokemon a Sash.
The building options are damn poor. This comes from the fact that many of those pokemons lack an access to recovery. In today's metagame you can come on the field and lose 75% of your life just by stepping in. What the fuck is that madness for real ?
A strong enough pokemon can cleanly sweep a whole team with some hazards support. He doesn't even need to be versatile or something. He comes, hit a move, lock himself in with a choice whatever and that's it.
This totally kills any kind of strategy.

More versatile pokemons please, less stupidly powerful one please. No need to put big defensive house against big offensive ones. To me it's like putting sugar over salt.
Imagine a soupe with too much salt in it, will you put sugar in ? I don't think so.
In the end, creating big defensive house will result in some random polarization, in some shifumi game.
I don't really want a war between brainless choiced pokemons and big meaty walls, this is boring as fuck. I rather have a way between versatile and unpredictable pokemons that can often go for an offensive path of a more defensive one, but for that, we need to say bye to all those powerhouse focused on one single side of the board.

Whatever, if I ruled the competitive world, each time a new game comes out, I would keep the old GEN and implement slowly (even one-by-one sometimes), cleverly, each pokemon of the new game after a debate; instead of just adding everything to create a gigantic mess that will be a pain to clean after.


formerly Mashfinch
Am i the only one hoping for a Poison/Dragon Arbok evolution? Since y'know this is 6th gen and everyones anticipating evolutions

I feel like it fits with Arboks design, movepool and egg group(dragon)

Poison/Dragon is a pretty decent defensive typing in competitive pokemon, with resistances to Fighting, poison, bug, grass, electric, water & fire, in addition to being immune to poison and absorbing toxic spikes. It also relatively balanced, having weaknesses to common attacking types in ice, dragon, ground and psychic.

Arbok already has 2 great defensive abilities the evolution could utilize in intimidate and shed skin, one making it more physically bulky, the other dealing with status and making rest somewhat reliable recovery.

It would also have a great support movepool from Arbok, and coil + good physical coverage in moves like aqua tail, EQ etc.

Arbok also currently gets access to both rain dance and sunny day, so the evo could function as a weather counter to either, resisting water and electric for anti-rain, and grass, fire and poison(sludge bomb Venusaur and the like) for anti-sun

The question is though, if arbok gets an evolution, does sandslash deserve one, and how competitively viable would that be? my guess is it would be an excadrill clone
What I would like to be fixed in the next generation are Dragons in general. Personally, I believe there is to little risk in using them, and every Dragon gets perfect type coverage in three moves. Not too mention how powerful they are as well, few Dragons do not have a high BST.

Ways of fixing it could be, like mentioned, nerfing the base power of Dragon moves, pushing them down too 100 for Outrage and 120 for Draco. Another would be too introduce ''Stealth Icicles''. This would instantly make Dragons more risky to play, and arguably would be a deserved nerf to them. Unlike before, Dragons would now need some extra support to work at maximum potential.

However, I would not wish Stealth Icicles to stack with Stealth Rock. having both of these up at the same time would be insane, so I would want these hazards too destroy each other if either is already on the field. This would make it so you either have too choose which you want on your team, or have both so you can choose which too set up.

Also, lessening the pressure on Steel types to wall Dragons by adding new Dragon resists, like a new typing or giving it Ice types, who sorely need more reasons too be used (Regice would be a really good counter too Dragons, especially if hail were to be buffed to give 50 % defense boost), would also help out. Also limiting most users of Stealth Icicles too Ice types would also boost their usage.

Other than Dragons, weather probably needs some balancing, but I have nothing too really add to that discussion.

PK Gaming

Persona 5
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oh and pk i agree with you about BW1 stall, but let's be frank - if you banned weather, offense would just be fighting spam + dragon spam and stall would still suck. there aren't enough gliscors and skarmories in this game to hold up in a weatherless metagame; you still have to contend with terrakion and a crapton of dragons
Hmm, I don't think there's a way of estimating that without testing a clear skies metagame. (we did but nobody played...) Though the funny thing about DragSpam is, I don't think banning weather would actually significantly buff it; rather, without weather abilities, people would be more inclined to use it that sort of team style since there aren't as many options.

and is Fighting spam even a thing in OU???

Hopefully by the end of BW testing we can achieve a balanced metagame. Or at least something similar to what we had in at the end of BW1 >_>

Dark Fallen Angel

What I would like to be fixed in the next generation are Dragons in general. Personally, I believe there is to little risk in using them, and every Dragon gets perfect type coverage in three moves. Not too mention how powerful they are as well, few Dragons do not have a high BST.

Ways of fixing it could be, like mentioned, nerfing the base power of Dragon moves, pushing them down too 100 for Outrage and 120 for Draco. Another would be too introduce ''Stealth Icicles''. This would instantly make Dragons more risky to play, and arguably would be a deserved nerf to them. Unlike before, Dragons would now need some extra support to work at maximum potential.

However, I would not wish Stealth Icicles to stack with Stealth Rock. having both of these up at the same time would be insane, so I would want these hazards too destroy each other if either is already on the field. This would make it so you either have too choose which you want on your team, or have both so you can choose which too set up.

Also, lessening the pressure on Steel types to wall Dragons by adding new Dragon resists, like a new typing or giving it Ice types, who sorely need more reasons too be used (Regice would be a really good counter too Dragons, especially if hail were to be buffed to give 50 % defense boost), would also help out. Also limiting most users of Stealth Icicles too Ice types would also boost their usage.

Other than Dragons, weather probably needs some balancing, but I have nothing too really add to that discussion.
I don't like the idea of Stealth "Icicles" (Ice-type Stealth Rock). Yes, it would cripple Dragon-types, but would also nerf Grass- and Ground-types, such as Celebi, Landorus, Gliscor, and Torterra Hippowdon. Not to mention that it would put more pressure on Flying-types, which already have to deal with Stealth Rock. Speaking of the aforementioned Celebi and Gliscor, they are counters to Keldeo and Terrakion, respectively, and would take 25% and 50% damage from Stealth Icicles, respectively. This would make them much more easy to deal with, possibly make them defeatable by what they were supposed to counter, thus making Keldeo and Terrakion even more dominant than they already are. Unless Generation VI also introduces a more plausible counter for the aforementioned Keldeo and Terrakion, I think that there are other, better ways to nerf Dragon-types. Maybe introducing a new type, or modifying the current type chart to make an already existent type, resistant to Dragon, and/or giving more weakness to Dragon-types (for example, it was been discussed on the making sense of type chart thread on the off-topic forum, that if Dragon-types are cold-blooded creatures, and for this reason they are weak to Ice, then they should also be weak to Fire).
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