[RMT] Team Hydro

[Rane]

This is the 3rd incarnation of this team, and I've constantly been making changes & substitutions. I had another thread going but it had a lot of old data and I wanted to focus on what I'm running now. Thanks to everyone who contributed!

TEAM HYDRO

Team Overview: This is a mono-water team is for use in OU Standard competition with all standard clauses, and the battleground is Nintendo WiFi. My previous teams have included Floatzel, Tentacruel, and Empoleon, but I've found a really good synergy with this group. One of the MAJOR problems I've faced has been with fast special sweepers with Electric & Grass attacks, since I really didn't have a counter for them. Not anymore, and never again. Most OU teams will run with Blissey, I'll run with another pinkish pokemon, Milotic. Swampert has been a great physical wall, but he was Skarmbliss weak. Hes now the Mixpert variety. When I had Floatzel he ran with Taunt and I've fallen in LOVE with that move. Gyarados had her movepool & IVs shuffled a bit and she now has Taunt. Qwilfish has become the little darling of this team, and he has undergone a single change this time around. Starmie also is unchanged as a Choice Scarf sweeper, outpacing almost the entire board and suprising most other Choice scarfers who think they've got a OHKO. Kingdra has undergone one change, and it focuses on 3 threats that I had very little answer to across the board: Celebi, Ludicolo, and Starmie.

I have a list of questions about the team after Kingdra, please reference them in your post if you are giving an answer, thanks!

Milotic @ Leftovers
Marvel Scale
252 HP / 6 SpAtt / 252 SpDef
Calm
- Surf
- Toxic
- Hypnosis
- Recover

With the Team Hydro, one of the major things that I've had problems with was Special Sweepers. Milotic comes in with 394 HP & 383 Special Defense, and is not afraid to take any special attack. As an extreem example, Max SpAtt Jolteon hits for 56% with Thunderbolt. Surf is standard STAB and with her high SpA she can wear down a lot of pokemon that take neutral damage. Recover to keep her in the fight. I added Toxic for two reasons. First, it can handle those trying to stall on her, and the second reason is almost too embarassing... I had NO moves that were effective against Shedinja. So that covers the Ghost/Bug.

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Intimidate
212 HP / 16 Atk / 180 Def / 100 Spe
Adamant
- Dragon Dance
- Taunt
- Waterfall
- Frustration

Where Milotic was the beautiful protector of the team, her sister Gyrados comes in as a bringer of death and destruction. I have NO problem switching Gyarados into any physical grass attack, with the neutral damage + Intimidate just barely doing enough damage to not be fully recovered by lefties. As I said above, I love Taunt and it would have been missed if I didn't give it to someone. Who better than Gyarados! I love coming in on spikers, Taunting them, and then watching them squirm or run, and in the rare case, explode! With this IV spread & Intimidate, she can survive 90 base attack explosions, which is AWESOME. If she can get 2-3 Dragon Dances off its pretty much over. A few do resist both Frustration & Waterfall, but even Empoleon doesn't stand a chance after 3 DDs. Did I say I loved Taunt?

Swampert @ Leftovers
Torrent
240 HP / 216 Def / 52 SpA
Relaxed
- Earthquake
- Surf (Hydro Pump?)
- Ice Beam
- Roar

Its really amazing how many people resort to using SkarmBliss. Swampert's prior life had him as a total Physical powerhouse, taking Bulk Ups from Floatzel and sweeping, but Skarmory always blew that strategy out of the water with Whirlwind and an inability to get through that tough Defense & Roosting. Swampy is back but Mixed up. I kept Roar because I'll never ever let another team set up a subbing/Swordsdancing Ninjask. It just won't happen! The major question with this set is Surf or Hydro Pump? Is it worth the risk of missing to be able to 2HKO Skarm? Any thoughts on this would be helpful.

Starmie @ Choice Scarf
Natural Cure
102 HP / 252 SpA / 156 Spe
Modest
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Rapid Spin

With 457 speed while wearing the scarf, this Star has 2 roles.
1) Spin after all spikers have been cleared out
2) Outpace everything and lay waste to the field.
You may question having Rapid Spin on this set, or not having Surf, but I have so much Water on this team it was amazingly redundant. Also, Gengar usually accompanies SkarmBliss, so the HOPE is to come in with Starmie and predict the switch in to Gengar and blast him instead of spinning.

Quilfish @ Damp Rock
Swift Swim
252 HP / 252 Def / 6 Speed
Jolly
- Rain Dance
- Explosion
- Destiny Bond (Poison Jab)
- Substitute

I have grown to love this little guy. His sole role is to come in (absorbing Toxic spikes if possible!), Rain Dancing, outspeeding the opponent, and either Explode or Substitute to scout for Weather spoilers. The sub gives him a free turn to Dance, then Blow up (being faster than the opponent again now that its raining). I also love it when I get the question "What is that?!?!" I replaced Poison Jab with Destiny Bond. The frequency that I've run into Gengar is astounding, and he walls this set otherwise. Destiny Bond & Explosion provide extreme take down ability, especially as I sub down to almost nothing.

Kingdra @ Life Orb
Swift Swim
252 SpA / 136 Speed / 122 HP
Modest
- Surf
- Draco Meteor
- Ice Beam
- Signal Beam

Before, Kingdra used to run with Rain Dance in his move roster. I took it out and replaced it with a nitche move: Signal Beam. Someone told me I was Celebi weak... Yeah, not anymore. Also it is used for Starmie & Ludicolo (who resist or take neutral damage to Surf & Ice Beam, and I don't want to ruin my SpAttack by tossing meteors around if I can help it). The main reason I took Rain Dance out of the moveset was because I have had a fantastic success rate with Qwilfish in at least getting it raining.

QUESTIONS

1) Milotic now has Toxic, besides the generic Ice Beam answer, are there any other moves I could consider that would be helpful to the overall party?

2) Qwilfish has taken on Poison Jab to help cover Grass & Ludicolo. Should I move a few EVs over to Attack to help with the attack side, or should i just keep the EVs where they are at for survivability?

3) Starmie is sporting a fancy Scarf, should I keep Rapid spin in the set just to clean up after the spikers have been dealt with, or should I forgo the support move for his other STAB move, Surf, knowing that I will have to switch out after

4) Another Starmie Question: The starfish is Modest and has EVs split between HP & Speed. Should I move the HP EVs to speed so I don't get outrun by the odd Choice Scarf Gengar who has max EVs in speed? (happened before...)

5) Swamper is Mixpert, and I currently have Surf. Should I go for Hydro Pump for power or keep Surf for reliable damage?

6) Kingdra has EVs in both HP & Speed, and the same question is posed here like the Starmie question... should I move them all to speed or keep them? This is a little different, since Kingdra is using Life Orb and is getting 10% sapped with each attack.

More questions will be added, and those that are answered will be edited to show what the responses are.

Thanks everyone!

 

[blasphemy1]

Taunt should have stopped Skarmory from Whirlwinding you before you were able to KO it. I say get Floatzel back and lets see the team because if you bulk up 6 times, Swampert with Adamant and Max attack will OHKO Skarmory with Waterfall, just barely but every time, 87.5% min to it. Of course this is rovided Stealth Rock is set up which isn't hard when you have(or used to) Empoleon, who can take Outrages and set up Stealth Rock. I say lets see your old team.

 

[BrazilianDragonite]

Lol Ludicolo still give you problems(not like before,though)
Raikou now is the real problem(Sub/Calm Mind with hp grass=bye)
Why not Ludicolo?It's always a welcomed poke in water teams,and grass moves really helps you against some shit(like Specs/Scarf Sceptile who's gonna revenge kill your entire team with Leaf Storm,or even worse,the SD version)

 

[Rane]

Taunt should have stopped Skarmory from Whirlwinding you before you were able to KO it. I say get Floatzel back and lets see the team because if you bulk up 6 times, Swampert with Adamant and Max attack will OHKO Skarmory with Waterfall, just barely but every time, 87.5% min to it. Of course this is rovided Stealth Rock is set up which isn't hard when you have(or used to) Empoleon, who can take Outrages and set up Stealth Rock. I say lets see your old team.

OK, if I'm lucky and Skarmory is lead-off, yes, the very first thing would have been Taunt (though he usually isn't). And then they switch, and I Bulk Up. They know I have Taunt and will directly attack, if they're smart they'll focus on its paper thin Special Defense. If i'm stupid and stay in and somehow survive a t-bolt, energy ball, or stabbed special attack, thats only two Bulk ups. At this point I need to Baton Pass or face extinction.

Also, Empoleon was a Sleep Talker, and he was just dead weight on the team.

 

[Rane]

Lol Ludicolo still give you problems(not like before,though)
Raikou now is the real problem(Sub/Calm Mind with hp grass=bye)
Why not Ludicolo?It's always a welcomed poke in water teams,and grass moves really helps you against some shit(like Specs/Scarf Sceptile who's gonna revenge kill your entire team with Leaf Storm,or even worse,the SD version)

Ludicolo isn't going to be a problem, especially with Milotic, Qwilfish, taunting Gyarados, and Signal Beam on Kingdra.

Yes, Raikou is a problem. I'm playing on WiFi though and have yet to see one. Honestly, what are the odds of a HP Grass Raikou?!?! =D

And the pineapple is a good pokemon, no doubt about it. Give me a suggestion on who to replace him with and why.

Sceptile is a threat, yes. Leaf Storm is situational, but if he is using Choice Scarf, Milotic can survice the attack. Choice Specs and Starmie comes in for revenge, and if he doesnt OHKO they don't konw I'm running with Scarf myself unless its been scouted accurately.

 

[BrazilianDragonite]

Ludicolo isn't going to be a problem, especially with Milotic, Qwilfish, taunting Gyarados, and Signal Beam on Kingdra.

Yes, Raikou is a problem. I'm playing on WiFi though and have yet to see one. Honestly, what are the odds of a HP Grass Raikou?!?! =D

And the pineapple is a good pokemon, no doubt about it. Give me a suggestion on who to replace him with and why.

Sceptile is a threat, yes. Leaf Storm is situational, but if he is using Choice Scarf, Milotic can survice the attack. Choice Specs and Starmie comes in for revenge, and if he doesnt OHKO they don't konw I'm running with Scarf myself unless its been scouted accurately.

Well,for Ludicolo,there's still the Swords Dance version(yes,right,who uses it?)
But i don't know what to replace.Your team looks great already
Another poke that can give you problems is Toxicroak(Starmie isn't a real counter thanks to Sucker Punch,and Swampert will not like being hit by Focus Punches,but it still can counter Croak,though).

 

[Rane]

I have made a few changes, and here they are:

1) I have removed Mirror Coat from Milotic and changed it with Toxic, for two reasons. One, Mirror Coat/Hypnosis is an illegial moveset. (It kinda pissed off a sensitive WiFier last night who then thought that my entire team was HAXORZ. Yes, I'm using Pokesave, No, I'm not maxing out 31 IVs across the board or haxing insane EVs. Its just sooo much easier to make adjustments without having to go through the entire breeding process, and once I DO get this team finalized I will then start the breeding programs to get 100% legits.) Two, I had ZERO answers to Shedinja. Toxic handles the little bugger.

2) I added a Questions list to the bottom of the thread, and if anyone would be so kind to provide an answer or two I will add their comment to the main thread.

3) I am going to start working on a Treat List, and I am going to scout around the RMT board to see how others are doing it.

4) Fixed some typos and made some formatting changes.

Thanks to everyone who has contributed in my previous thread (please don't post there, and if a mod stumbles into this thread you can link and lock!), and thanks to the continued criticism.

 

[Rane]

Changed out Poison Jab for Destiny Bond to evade being walled by Gengar. Destiny Bond/Explosion take care of the few pokemon that were handled by Poison Jab.

I'm still looking for answers to the questions in the original post, and any other suggestions. Thanks,

 

[DarkSuicune]

Why Frustration on Gyrados? Use return. It's easier to keep em happy.

 

[Rane]

Why Frustration on Gyrados? Use return. It's easier to keep em happy.

Thats your only criticism? Shes angry, she's at max unhappiness, Frustration is good. =D

 

[blasphemy1]

LOL. Okay you need to understand that Ludicolo rapes this team. HP Electric is very common because it is a great Gyarados counter, and Grass Knot rapes Milotic. Swampert and Starmie are both walled/killed by it since it has ground resistance and high Sp Def. Quilfish is a joke and Kingdra can be walled by Blissey, especially since you don't have physical moves(LAME!)

 

[DarkSuicune]

Thats your only criticism? Shes angry, she's at max unhappiness, Frustration is good. =D

No, thats not my only criticism, but i'm just saying Frustration = Return. So, since its easier to keep happiness up, (Berries, battles, etc) Return is a more used option. But if she's at max unhappiness, then its fine. Although, frsutration sounds cooler. :D

 

[Perfection]

Suicune provides as a better Roarer than Swampert.

252 HP/252 Def/4 Sp. Def.
Bold

Roar
Rest
Calm Mind/Surf
Ice Beam

She can phaze and boost her potential. Rest heals, and with that Rain Dance, Surf seems quite powerful. She may not use EQ, but she can still use Calm Mind.

 

[Rane]

LOL. Okay you need to understand that Ludicolo rapes this team. HP Electric is very common because it is a great Gyarados counter, and Grass Knot rapes Milotic. Swampert and Starmie are both walled/killed by it since it has ground resistance and high Sp Def. Quilfish is a joke and Kingdra can be walled by Blissey, especially since you don't have physical moves(LAME!)

HP electric may be common in Shoddy, but I have only seen HP on ANYTHING once in any of my WiFi battles. Is it possible? yeah. And so is a legit HP Grass Raikou, which also rapes this team, however unlikely I will ever actually see one. Lets assume Ludicolo does not have HP Electric, mmmkay? Qwilfish can switch into any of the common attacks, Ice, Grass, Water, Seismic, and respond by setting up both rain dance & subs if it stays in. Then its fielders choice with explosion & destiny bond. Kingdra mops ludi up with signal beam. While I like Mixdra a lot its hard to give up the little extra speed & power by switching to a Att/SpA EV spread. As it is right now he is slower than a Jolly max speed TTar w/o the Rain. And who are you trying to convince about Blissey, the absolute most overused poke there is? I know how hard it is to deal with her with even an all OU team (lucky if it doesn't have counter...) so I know that when blissey comes in I have to clear it out first. EVERYONE has to deal with it. Qwilfish likes fighting Blissey, and if they're dumb enough to keep it in they get burned.Don't get me wrong or take any of my comments the wrong way, I appreciate ANY feedback, but instead of just pointing out the obvious weaknesses, how about something to counter them and make the team better, eh?

 

[Rane]

Suicune provides as a better Roarer than Swampert.

252 HP/252 Def/4 Sp. Def.
Bold

Roar
Rest
Calm Mind/Surf
Ice Beam

She can phaze and boost her potential. Rest heals, and with that Rain Dance, Surf seems quite powerful. She may not use EQ, but she can still use Calm Mind.

I'd like to use suicune instead of Milotic in all honesty, but I am NOT going to go play Colosseum again and grind and attempt to get a decent suicune. I don't have that much free time! Thanks for the suggestion though!

 

[Rane]

I need to stress that this is a WiFi team, something that I left out of the OP but had in my previous threads, I apologize for that and will add it asap