To add onto the above post, both of these Pokemon were actually buffed in Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon, making it extremely unlikely they'd ever drop back to OU. Mega Lucario got a new and far more accurate secondary physical Steel-type STAB move in Meteor Mash, while Pheromosa got Drill Run and a couple of other new options iirc, making the likes of Toxapex and Gengar no longer decent switch-ins.
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Resource Simple Questions, Simple Answers Thread (read the op before posting a thread)
- Thread starter Celticpride
- Start date
I feel like next gen, pheromosa could be power creeped to our or something with a good typing to counter it will be added, but considering genesect is the exact same problem and has been stuck in Ubers for 3 gens, who knows. Also pheromosa struggles with 4 moveslot syndrome, so I'm not sure if drill run will be too much of a buff.
That’s a pretty big buff as it allows its physical variants I easily bypass toxapex, on one of its best checks (before Z-hyper Beam tech). I’m pretty sure HJK, U-Turn, Ice Beam and Drill run covers everything
They won't be implemented until the games are released
Not anytime in the near future.
-outl
Can we drop Dawn Wings Necrozma to OU?It seems weaker then hoopa-u and kyurem-b
I find this point to be highly debateable due to the bulk, typing, movepool, and even power differences regarding all three of these Pokémon when compared to each other. Regardless, Kyurem-Black started out in Ubers during BW and eventually got brought down. If we determine Dawn Wings Necrozma is similar, perhaps we will do the same, but for the time being, it will start in Ubers and remain there for the near future. It is hard to base these arguments solely off of theory, anyway.
Another thing about the new necrozmas,
SPOILER ALERT
SPOILER ALERT
As far as I can tell, the necrozma forms get a new z crystal to turn them into ultra necrozma, so even if they get into our, ultra necrozma will be too good for ou, so that z cystal(ultranecrozium z I think?) will likely need to be banned, similar to mega stones.
The Necrozma formes will start out in Ubers as they're cover legendaries so there's no need to ban any zcrystals
I heard in the upcoming game you'l be allowed 3 zmoves...does anyone know about this? I haven't seen it on the forums, did i hear wrong?
I believe that only works in-game with the rotom dex, so no
Sorry if this is the wrong place to ask, but where is the offensive Heatran set in the analysis? It was mentioned in the Other Options section and I know it's not the Choice Scarf set because OO also mentioned Z-Crystals.
move 1: Magma Storm
move 2: Earth Power
move 3: Solar Beam
move 4: Taunt / Stealth Rock
item: Grassium Z
ability: Flash Fire
nature: Timid
evs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
The offensive Heatran set is listed in the analysis, in fact it's the second set. The above posted set is a more niche Heatran that is mentioned in OO and can be used sometimes, though I would highly encourage you to use the Firium Z set listed there.
So OU council decided that Dawn Wings Necrozma won't be unbanned for now because policy is to always quickban 680 BST legendaries. I'm not questioning the decision here, but I'm wondering why they made an exception for Hoopa-Unbound when it was released, since it has 680 BST as well(and it did end up having to be banned in ORAS anyway to boot).
It wasnt a cover legendary (Hoopa-U)
Mewtwo is an exception to this I think, because it had the highest stats of all RBY, had the broken mono psychic typing, and a godlike movepool. I think it was pretty clear it was broken in those days.
Rayquaza and Giratina also didn't appear on a cover when they were first introduced. For the record, I'm not trying to claim that Hoopa was/is broken as those three, just that "it isn't on the cover lol" doesn't seem a very scientific criterion and it almost feels like AM was shitposting.
Well if we really wanna get specific, the criteria is that cover legendaries get quickbanned. Other obviously broken things may also get quickbanned. It’s not like an “if and only if” statement.
I was actually being serious. This has been "consistent" since at least Gen 2 with introduction of Ho-Oh and Lugia. Mewtwo was an exception because those games were based on a color scheme for Pokemon Red and Blue to start the franchise off, Pokemon Yellow putting emphasis on the Trainer Red and Pikachu relationship, at least in America. Rayquaza is an exception to this because Ruby and Sapphire represented Groudon and Kyogre for again color schemes, this also ends up with Rayquaza for the Emerald cover a couple of years later anyways. Same deal with Diamond and Pearl, Dialga and Palkia. The 680 BST philosophy is more of a coincidence when applying to bans because Gamefreak intentionally places a BST value to give importance or certain attributes to certain mons, with 680 being a standard for big legendaries, 600 BST for psuedo-legendaries like Tyranitar, and so forth.
To be fair the specific criteria is more or less what Selhido pointed out. There's no politically correct great term to phrase it other than that and it's easier to just ban from that angle in most cases. The confusion comes from the fact we're starting to hit generations with all sorts of weird shit such as mid battle evolutions, alternate forms of mons that exceed or break the usual philosophy of cover legend bans, and mons like Marshadow who don't have the highest of BSTs but other attributes push it beyond the scope of being healthy. Those are usually taken care of through the usual suspect process, in this case Hoopa-U was like this.
Tyranitar @ Assault Vest
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 248 HP / 60 Atk / 200 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Stone Edge
- Pursuit
- Earthquake
- Fire Blast
This is a spread Subject 18 passed me earlier and iirc a few people have been using it. I believe the bulk is to live +1 Z-Bug Buzz from Volcarona, which just shows how insanely bulky it is on the special side. It can also check things like Naganandel and Blacephalon, which are both very relevant in the early stages of this metagame. You can easily edit the set to use moves like Ice Beam or Crunch if you feel it fits your team best, but keep in mind that investing a bit into special attack could be ideal for using Ice Beam in order to assure a kill on offensive Landorus-T or defensive Landorus-T after Stealth Rock damage.
