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Sketchmons ORAS - Diggersby and Shell Smash Banned!

Hearing mixed opinions about Mega Pinsir/Espeed, so I'll let that go for another day or two then make a verdict.

Move Clause is implemented (no more than 1 pokemon can sketch a certain move per team)

King's rock and Razor Fang are banned, it's basically just uncompetitive wins, and i forgot to ban this last time so w/e

tagging The Immortal
 
Not many mons do multi shell smash as it leaves them weak to anything priority and there are many, many +1 moves as well as quick claw to give options. Geomancy telegraphs hard as each one takes two rounds (past the first anyway) which gives tons of room for forcing a swap. Gear shift can be nasty, but it's not as popular as contrary as it leaves the mon open and not doing damage. Contrary only appears on certain mons making it easy to spot.

Typically against multi-boosters I use heart shift + prankster, dragon tail/roar/ect or destiny bond + poison/burn/taunt. There's also unaware like you said and if you make the unaware guy also have transform then you end up just as nasty as the other guy as transform copies stat boosts but not abilities AND due to unaware still being there enemy stat boosts don't effect you anymore. You can also boost like mad to counter or rely on type/move immunities (ex: soundproof). There are many checks here!

Shift Gear is very popular actually. Most high Attack pokes with need for Speed carry Shift Gear. I've seen Shift Gear from Mega Metagross, Mega Scizor, Landorus-Therian, Jirachi (rare because Sacred Fire is more preffered) and Mega Garchomp (also rare but it CAN sweep). There are only two pokes with Contrary one doesn't care about Quagsire. And for Transform Unaware pokes, after you Transform, the opposing stats boost applies because your Ability isn't Unaware anymore (yes, I'm sure Transform also copies Ability).

Typically I find it's just one mon needed to stop one mon. I had a single garchomp wreck a team of boosters as he used stealth rock, sand storm and dragon tail over and over. Some people use toxic, light screen/reflect and roar to do the same thing. People panic when they see destiny bond and will spam non-damage moves to save themselves making them ripe for toxic. People forfeit when heart swap hits as you can make a single liepard or klefki wreck their team. Don't underestimate the power of disruption.


Bulbapedia may say that, but I keep having it stay the same on on Showdown. Might be a glitch, but it still happens. Showdown glitches a bunch such as Electrify sometimes being multi-turn and sometimes not even though bulbapedia says it's single turn and I have had mons with higher speed but low health be outsped by lower speed mons with no speed bosting anything before because the damage would have killed my mon if the slower mon went first. This isn't the regular game.

On quick claw: it's a gimmick but a gimmick is better than nothing.

I'm pretty sure most people won't forfeit right away after you Prankster Heart Swap their pokes with Klefki or Liepard. These two pokes are harmless, they almost never run any offensive sets, unless somehow you run offensive Klefki, which is a gimmick. Unless your poke is Thundurus (which has offensive presence), I'm pretty sure your opponent won't forfeit because of a single Heart Swap.

Also, I'm very sure that if Extremespeed got banned, people WILL start crying for Shell Smash/Geomancy/Quiver Dance/Shift Gear bans, despite it's number of checks, because they are forced to run Scarf Ditto and Prankster pokes on every team, mainly HO (Unaware pokes don't fit into HO). Set up will be very centralizing because every poke gets it.
 
Bulbapedia may say that, but I keep having it stay the same on on Showdown. Might be a glitch, but it still happens. Showdown glitches a bunch such as Electrify sometimes being multi-turn and sometimes not even though bulbapedia says it's single turn and I have had mons with higher speed but low health be outsped by lower speed mons with no speed bosting anything before because the damage would have killed my mon if the slower mon went first. This isn't the regular game.

On quick claw: it's a gimmick but a gimmick is better than nothing.
There are many ways transform can seem glitchy. When you copy a Pokemon with transform or imposter, you do copy their ability, but when you hover your cursor over your transformed 'mon it will say your ability is the same as before - even tho it isn't. I'm not sure about the electrify one tho...maybe you accidentally clicked it multiple times in a row? lel
 
Are ppl STILL discussing the monster called Mega Pinsir?
Anyways here is a set that once it sets up, is a monster

Latias @ Latiasite
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 Spe
Ability: Levitate
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute / Dragon Pulse
- Roost
- Stored Power
- Quiver Dance

The best abuser of Stored Power the game has ever created. Mega Latias is an underated Mega that 100% Dissmantles Stall teams and easily clean up offensive teams, provided all dark types are dead.
The spread allows it to survive an Adamant Choice Band Scizor's U-Turn at full health, while speed tieing with positiv3 natured base 139 at +1.
 
TT
Phasing
Heart Swap
Transform
Haze
Destiny Bond
Priority vs SS
Unaware

There are many options and these are the ones I thought of in a minute. Prankster is required on a lot of these options, but there are options if you don't want a prankster user.
Also, your stat boosts don't matter when you have unaware. Shell Smash, as said, leaves you weak to priority and Geomancy gives you a one-chance sweep. Plus, a move clause still leaves in pokemon such as Mega Pinsir and Diggersby in the meta. Plus, I don't want to run a ghost on every single team.
If you don't want to run a Ghost on any team, I also don't want to run any of these on any team I make and I already have to, no need to make matters worse right?
Also:
Phazing won't work if the opponent doesn't get greedy, as you have to take the boosted hit first. So this is only viable on very bulky builds.
I wouldn't use Heart Swap on anything that can't use it outside from status countering, for example, my Heart Swap Latios could pass the Draco Meteor drops to the foe.
Transform. Same as phazing.
Haze is a poor man's Topsy-Turvy.
Destinity Bond involves you sacking something and has no priority. Bad imo, more when the booster nets a kill for sure.
Priority vs SS. Extreme Speed.
Unaware pokes have pathetic stats and they can be easily overwhelmed or at least pressured.
Topsy-Turvy is left, and needs Prankster to work well. To put it flatly, I don't want to run Thundurus on every team I make (most of them offensive teams so no Klefki).
 
Shedinja @ Focus Sash / Safety Goggles
Ability: Wonder Guard
252 Atk
Brave Nature
-Baton Pass
-Endeavor
-Shadow Sneak
-Protect

lol I win

Entei @ Choice Band / Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Adamant Nature
-V-Create
-Mimic
-Dig
-Roar / Protect

Moveset adjusted so it can be used for an Assist V-Create team.

Banette @ Banettite
Ability: Insomnia -> Prankster
252 Atk / 252 HP / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
-Assist
-Phantom Force
-Protect
-Snatch

A possible partner for the above.
 
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Hearing mixed opinions about Mega Pinsir/Espeed, so I'll let that go for another day or two then make a verdict.

Move Clause is implemented (no more than 1 pokemon can sketch a certain move per team)

King's rock and Razor Fang are banned, it's basically just uncompetitive wins, and i forgot to ban this last time so w/e

tagging The Immortal
rip my 4 espeeders team

I made this team in about 5 minutes because I wanted to make a point about espeed spam being unskillful and overpowered. It's far from optimised but I did peak at #15 on the ladder and I don't play very often, so I'm sure someone else could've done better. You autolose to stall and struggle against a good opponent with 2-3 normal resists, but otherwise the pressure behind 4 espeeders is insane.

I originally made the team for AFTER a Pinsir ban, which is why it's not here. I decided to go with Diggersby and Ursaring for power - Ursaring has no speed investment because 90% of the time you click espeed/SD, and the extra bulk is very handy. Then I added Mega Lopunny as something which could beat ghosts as well as normal resists. The last moveslot is pretty free, I originally ran Drain Punch but Fire Punch is an option as a concession to Shedinja, and Healing Wish helps with another mon's longetivity since I don't run hazard removal. Porygon is standard scarf, with max speed to at least speed tie with opposing porys. I then realised I was very weak to fighting type attacks so I added a ghost in sableye, which also provides wow support. The sketch move could probably be something better since you don't really fear setup but I couldn't think of anything at the time (parting shot? defog? spore/dark void?). Lastly I wanted 1 more espeeders and terrak is one of the strongest while also bopping normal resists. I don't know why it's lum, to be honest, but it does help beat thundys.

Diggersby @ Life Orb
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 29 HP
- Swords Dance
- Extreme Speed
- Earthquake
- Knock Off

Lopunny @ Lopunnite
Ability: Limber
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Extreme Speed
- High Jump Kick
- Fire Punch /Drain Punch/Healing Wish

Porygon-Z @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Boomburst
- Dark Pulse
- Recover/Nasty Plot
- Trick

Sableye @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Topsy-Turvy
- Recover
- Will-O-Wisp
- Knock Off

Terrakion @ Lum Berry
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Extreme Speed
- Close Combat
- Stone Edge

Ursaring @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Extreme Speed
- Close Combat
- Crunch
 
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Sylveon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pixilate
252 Spe / 252 SpA / 4 HP
Modest Nature
-Boomburst
-Shadow Ball
-Psyshock
-Hidden Power Ground/Hidden Power Fire

#whydoessylveonalwaysgetboomburstinothermetas

Has an edge over M-Altaria and M-Gardevoir in freeing your mega slot and looking absolutely fabulous with those choice specs.
 
Sylveon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pixilate
252 Spe / 252 SpA / 4 HP
Modest Nature
-Boomburst
-Shadow Ball
-Psyshock
-Hidden Power Ground/Hidden Power Fire

#whydoessylveonalwaysgetboomburstinothermetas

Has an edge over M-Altaria and M-Gardevoir in freeing your mega slot and looking absolutely fabulous with those choice specs.
I've found a cleric set utilizing boomburst to work very well too. Boomburst still hits pokemon extremely hard, for example OHKOing tank chomp where Hyper Voice would do about 80% max, but also supporting the team very well. I find Heal Bell to be particularly useful given spore everywhere, and the fact that its typing counters sableye to be very useful as well.
 
Here is a set I thought of as a lure but actually works really well. I thought about what walled Keldeo and what it could use to beat them and Sludge Bomb Keldeo was born. Makes it pretty hard to switch into now that it toasts fairy.

Keldeo @ Scarf / Specs / Life Orb
Ability: Justified
Evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid / Modest Nature
- Secret Sword
- Scald
- Sludge Bomb
- Hydro Pump / Focus Blast / HP
 
Actually user Career Ended showed me a Keldeo set with water spout, doing 80% in one hit to my spdef Clefable and 2hkoing Mega Venusaur after rocks.

For the first days, I have been getting a lot of wins with just hazard stacking and ESpeed spam (MPinsir + Belly drum Snorlax with Gunk Shot and Seed Bomb to get by unaware mons).
But people are starting to realize how powerful hazard removers in this format are, and I can no longer rely on having my full, free stack of hazard. OU literally had no good hazard removers. (They lose to common rock setters and are weak to stealth rocks.)
 
I'm #2 on the ladder, and I really don't think Espeed or Mega Pinsir are overpowered per se - just that the combination of Mega Pinsir and another Espeed can very quickly become unmanageable to the kind of balance cores I've encountered on the ladder (since no one really wants to run pure offense because of Espeed's effect on that as well). I'd support a sketched move clause if possible.

I've been using Espeed Aurorus a lot and it's really amazing how good this mon is - quite a bit expect Boomburst (I assume) and leave things in that they really shouldn't - and it's not like 4x ice resists not named Heatran are common. Similarly, I think Gear Grind Megazor is an underrated threat - and between them they resist and beat 1 v 1 every Espeeder. I'm simplifying the ease I've had in dealing with Espeed, but I think individually it's not that serious of a threat but can quickly get out of hand if stacked well - I fought a particularly nasty Pinsir/Snorlax/SYLVEON Espeed core that I was just not prepared for at all, for example, and ended up adding Heatran to my team to hopefully deal with that in the future.

+2 252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mega Scizor: 289-342 (84 - 99.4%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Aurorus dies instantly if it switches in on a Close Combat, no ifs, ands, or buts.

This is not a reliable core for beating or even scaring out Mega Pinsir without losses.

Ugh... Diggersby. It's the "mega pinsir" for people who want a different mega on the team. Super abused with extreme speed! Diggersby is worse, IMHO, as the more powerful ghosts tend to be weak to ground with earthquake being destroyer of walls. Ghosts also can't hit Diggersby easily thanks to normal typing.

Almost every Ghost has innate access to Will O Wisp, Gengar has Focus Blast and is immune to Ground, Sableye can take any one attack from Diggersby on the switch-in, etc.

Bulbapedia may say that, but I keep having it stay the same on on Showdown. Might be a glitch, but it still happens. Showdown glitches a bunch such as Electrify sometimes being multi-turn and sometimes not even though bulbapedia says it's single turn and I have had mons with higher speed but low health be outsped by lower speed mons with no speed bosting anything before because the damage would have killed my mon if the slower mon went first. This isn't the regular game.

A display error isn't proof that the underlying behavior is incorrect. Electrify only lasts for the one turn, Electrify's message lasts multiple turns.

I've never seen a Speed result go awry that wasn't either explainable or a deliberate emulation of flawed behavior on the cartridges. (Insanely fast Pokemon breaking Trick Room for some reason)

---

On an unrelated note: I loathe Scarf Boomburst Sylveon and Serperior, generally.
 
Diggersby is definitely more threatening than pinsir vs defense, just because even unboosted almost every switchin is risky with its disgusting coverage and power. I think all-out attacking sets are probably the most viable, because with such a strong espeed it doesn't need setup to clean vs offense necessarily, and all it really needs to break stall is coverage. And about sableye:

252+ Atk Life Orb Huge Power Diggersby Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Sableye: 238-281 (78.2 - 92.4%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

That's definitely not something I'd want to switch in on :(
 
Actually user Career Ended showed me a Keldeo set with water spout, doing 80% in one hit to my spdef Clefable and 2hkoing Mega Venusaur after rocks.
You mean this set?
Lets bring up another monster.

Keldeo @ Choice Scarf
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Ability: Justified
Nature: Timid
- Hydro Pump
- Water Spout
- Secret Sword
- Filler honestly

After birds and lopp are gone, and a little Cleric support, you've got a monster in the making. Just realise that.

Edit: Its finally on Aqua!!!
Those BW players know how hard rain-boosted Hydro Pump hits, let alone Water Spout. Give this thing Specs and rain support, and destroy worlds. How about...
Keldeo @ Choice Specs
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Ability: Justified
Nature: Timid
- Hydro Pump
- Water Spout / Thunder / Hurricane
- Secret Sword
- HP Electric / HP Flying / Icy Wind
Specs Keldeo, for rain teams. The filler depends on the Sketched move. Calcs:
252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Skarmory in Rain: 493-582 (147.6 - 174.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune in Rain: 243-286 (60.1 - 70.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Venusaur in Rain: 234-276 (64.2 - 75.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Even Hydro Pump has a shot at 2HKOing the latter two.
Hurricane and Thunder are weaker than rain-boosted Hydro Pump even when supper-effective, but offer useful side effects and perfect accuracy. Thunder OHKOes or 2HKOes most bulky Water-types if not all of them and the paralysis chance is nice, while Hurricane has good coverage and its way stronger than Icy Wind / HP Flying for Grass-types, and has an infamous chance of confusing (aka hax to death its checks).
Water Spout is still good outside of rain, and there's Vacuum Wave too for non-rain teams.
 
Almost every Ghost has innate access to Will O Wisp, Gengar has Focus Blast and is immune to Ground, Sableye can take any one attack from Diggersby on the switch-in, etc.
Sorry, but Ghost types are only checks to Diggersby. They don't switch into it.
252+ Atk Life Orb Huge Power Diggersby Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Sableye: 169-200 (55.5 - 65.7%)
252+ Atk Life Orb Huge Power Diggersby Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Sableye: 238-281 (78.2 - 92.4%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Life Orb Huge Power Diggersby Fire Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 208-246 (80.3 - 94.9%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

There is also no Steel type that switches into Diggersby I'm afraid, as Bronzong either lacks Heatproof or Levitate.
252+ Atk Life Orb Huge Power Diggersby Fire Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 159-187 (47.6 - 55.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Life Orb Huge Power Diggersby Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Filter Mega Aggron: 160-189 (46.5 - 54.9%) -- 98.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Since Ghost and Steel as normal resists are out of the question, the only switch ins I can come up with are Mega Slowbro and Aerodactyl.
 
+2 252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mega Scizor: 289-342 (84 - 99.4%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Aurorus dies instantly if it switches in on a Close Combat, no ifs, ands, or buts.

This is not a reliable core for beating or even scaring out Mega Pinsir without losses.
This comes with the underlying assumption that it's getting to +2 when deterring set up of any kind is entirely mandatory on every mon you run in this meta.

Edit: In all fairness, I do think that Mega Pinsir might need to be banned but I don't think a Mega Pinsir ban would positively effect the meta without a complex ban on sketching the same move multiple times OR a wider Espeed ban. Mega Pinsir is only the most threatening Espeed mon by a very small margin.
 
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This comes with the underlying assumption that it's getting to +2 when deterring set up of any kind is entirely mandatory on every mon you run in this meta.

Mega Scizor is only coming in on Mega Pinsir in one of two ways.

-Manual switch, leading to the scenario I described as a possibility.

-Something died to let Mega Scizor in, presumably by threatening Mega Pinsir so badly Mega Pinsir couldn't risk the Swords Dance.

The latter is unacceptable. Even taking into account that Mega Pinsir is weak to Stealth Rock, it only ensures that Mega Scizor can stop an uncontrolled sweep, not that it acts as a reliable check or counter to Mega Pinsir.

The former is also unacceptable. It means Mega Pinsir can win a prediction or come in on something that can't do anything worth commentary to it, and your Mega Scizor is invalidated as a check/counter, instantly.

That core can't actually be counted on to check Mega Pinsir. Pressure it to make the right decisions -Swords Dance is wrong if you switch in Aurorus but Close Combat is wrong if you switch in Mega Scizor and either way it has to run right now- sure, but it, by itself, can use prediction to kill both of them if they try to do anything other than stop its rampage after a KO. That's shaky, even defining them as checks.

Sorry, but Ghost types are only checks to Diggersby. They don't switch into it.
252+ Atk Life Orb Huge Power Diggersby Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Sableye: 169-200 (55.5 - 65.7%)
252+ Atk Life Orb Huge Power Diggersby Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Sableye: 238-281 (78.2 - 92.4%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Life Orb Huge Power Diggersby Fire Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 208-246 (80.3 - 94.9%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

There is also no Steel type that switches into Diggersby I'm afraid, as Bronzong either lacks Heatproof or Levitate.
252+ Atk Life Orb Huge Power Diggersby Fire Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 159-187 (47.6 - 55.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Life Orb Huge Power Diggersby Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Filter Mega Aggron: 160-189 (46.5 - 54.9%) -- 98.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Since Ghost and Steel as normal resists are out of the question, the only switch ins I can come up with are Mega Slowbro and Aerodactyl.

I never said Ghosts were counters, my point was simply that Diggersby is easier to check than Mega Pinsir. You've got options that just aren't available against Mega Pinsir. Zapdos is the only thing off the top of my head that is the reverse: a workable check/counter to Mega Pinsir that Diggersby laughs at.

I wouldn't cry if Diggersby was kicked out the meta by any stretch of the imagination, but if it's broken it's still less broken than Mega Pinsir.

Though I don't see why you're mentioning Fire Punch. I can't imagine a Diggersby build that would bother, and Knock Off kills Bronzong regardless of Ability, while Skarmory dies much more reliably to Wild Charge -no need for Stealth Rock to ensure the kill.

Also Aerodactyl dies instantly to Wild Charge. And Banded Diggersby has a 99.6% chance of 2HKOing Mega Slowbro with Wild Charge, too. (I hate Banded Diggersby) Assuming it was Mega Evolved for both hits and there were no hazards, by the way.

If Diggersby isn't Banded and doesn't Swords Dance, Cofagrigus is an amusing check. Even if it's either of those, it has to use Knock Off, not Earthquake, to get the KO before being Will O Wisped, so Cofagrigus is a pretty reliable way to force Diggersby out one time, and you can give Cofagrigus reliable recovery!
 
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Hoo boy. Been lurking OM's for years now, but I feel compelled to use my first post to share with you all something that's given me surprisingly great results in this meta: Mega Garchomp with Shift Gear. In Sketchmons, regular Garchomp mainly sees use as a bulky Rocky Helmet rock-setter, with a Mega Evolution that is powerful but has an unfortunate drop in speed, which has seemingly killed any hope of it becoming a standout. Mega Garchomp cannot utilize its natural access to DDance with a Sketched coverage/priority move, as numerous Scarf users and faster mons simply outpace him. As much as he would appreciate the extra Attack boost, Shell Smash is an inferior option in a speed/priority-focused metagame. Shift Gear takes the best of both worlds and combines them into one potentially-terrifying threat.

With proper support, Mega Garchomp can find ample opportunities to severely dent some premier Sketchmons tanks and walls, as well as sweep underprepared/weakened teams. Using a Sand Streamer with a Smooth Rock as a bulky pivot or a suicide hazard-setter will give Mega Garchomp ~5-7 turns of Sandstorm, which Sand Force uses to increase the damage of his Earthquakes and Stone Edges by an impressive 30%. Sand is a vital partner for any competent Megachomp set, as it nullifies Leftovers as well as breaking Sashes and Multiscales that could be troublesome. Many kills +1 Megachomp would miss are patched up by this power boost. Pink blobs CANNOT switch into a Sand Force-boosted EQ, and players risk being swept if they lose the Transform speed-tie. Your gameplan should usually be to sacrifice/slowly pivot out of your Sand Streamer, then Shift Gear on the switch/neutral hit. Opposing players will be forced to send in their bulkiest mons to take a hit and shave off a chunk of Megachomp's HP before being 2HKO'd by EQ, as they will be preserving their own win-condition. If not outright swept, opposing players will likely be out 2-3 'mons by the time Sandstorm runs out.

Recommended spread is a 252 Atk/252 Spd/4 Def fast sweeper with a Jolly nature. Mega Garchomp does not want to take repeated hits, so outspeeding as much as you can is pivotal. Moves are Shift Gear, Earthquake, Stone Edge, and Dragon Claw. Self explanatory; boost, then spam EQ on everything you can, Stone Edge on the things you can't. Dragon Claw gives a good neutral STAB move to use when Sand runs out, and hits Breloom, Chesnaught, and Virizion better than the other two moves. Is a safe move for when Fairies are dead and you don't want to risk a Stone Miss on any EQ-immune mons.

Mega Garchomp does NOT like to go against Levitating/Flying Steel-type Pokemon, and they should be eliminated or heavily weakened before attempting to set up. Be wary of Encore users, as well as hard switching into a Taunt or Torment.

  • 252 Atk Sand Force Mega Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Landorus-T in Sand: 188-222 (49.2 - 58.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
  • 252 Atk Sand Force Mega Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Gyarados in Sand: 290-342 (73.7 - 87%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
  • 252 Atk Sand Force Mega Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Unaware Quagsire in Sand: 208-246 (52.7 - 62.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
  • 252 Atk Sand Force Mega Garchomp Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Unaware Clefable in Sand: 229-270 (58.2 - 68.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • +1 252 Atk Sand Force Mega Garchomp Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Clefable in Sand: 342-403 (87 - 102.5%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
  • +1 252 Atk Sand Force Mega Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Serperior in Sand: 271-319 (93.1 - 109.6%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
  • +1 252 Atk Mega Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 164+ Def Garchomp: 386-456 (91.9 - 108.5%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
  • +1 252 Atk Sand Force Mega Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tyranitar in Sand: 524-620 (129.7 - 153.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
  • +1 252 Atk Sand Force Mega Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Sableye in Sand: 240-283 (78.9 - 93%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
  • +1 252 Atk Sand Force Mega Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Filter Mega Aggron in Sand: 226-267 (65.6 - 77.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • +1 252 Atk Sand Force Mega Garchomp Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 252 Def Blissey in Sand: 771-907 (118.4 - 139.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
  • +1 252 Atk Sand Force Mega Garchomp Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey in Sand: 516-607 (80.3 - 94.5%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
I'm not foolish enough to say that Megachomp is meta-defining at this point, as he still has some disconcerting flaws. Between having no item and needing to use his Sketch for a setup move, the bane of Megachomp's existence will always be priority. Prankster-sleep will stop your sweep short, and most relevant Espeed users 2HKO Megachomp, making intelligent teambuilding vital. Hazard-removal for Spikes or Sticky Webs will keep chomp as healthy as possible when coming in, all the while using your own to help Megachomp get kills it could not without rocks. Spore-immune mons, such as Ferrothorn or Goodra, can take on a Whimsicott, Thundurus, or Mega-Banette attempting to interrupt your sweep, and bulky Steels or Ghosts can take on Espeed users who prevent Megachomp from setting up safely (though Mega-Pinsir can get around different Steel types, depending on whether it runs CC or EQ). Rocky Helmet Ferrothorn has been an invaluable partner for a Ttar/Megachomp core, absorbing Spores and non-Pinsir Espeeds alike.
  • 252 SpA Adaptability Porygon-Z Boomburst vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Garchomp: 328-388 (91.8 - 108.6%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
  • 252+ SpA Serperior Leaf Storm vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Garchomp: 169-199 (47.3 - 55.7%) -- 77.3% chance to 2HKO
  • 252 Atk Mega Heracross Pin Missile (5 hits) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Garchomp: 240-285 (67.2 - 79.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • 252+ SpA Keldeo Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Garchomp: 280-330 (78.4 - 92.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • 252 SpA Mega Pidgeot Hurricane vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Garchomp: 193-228 (54 - 63.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • 68 SpA Zapdos Hidden Power Ice vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Garchomp: 232-276 (64.9 - 77.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • 4 SpA Suicune Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Garchomp: 248-296 (69.4 - 82.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • 4 SpA Latias Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Garchomp: 320-378 (89.6 - 105.8%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO
  • 252+ Atk Life Orb Excadrill Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Garchomp: 212-251 (59.3 - 70.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • 252 Atk Tyranitar Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Garchomp: 118-141 (33 - 39.4%) -- 99.9% chance to 3HKO
  • 252+ Atk Choice Band Huge Power Azumarill Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Garchomp: 106-126 (29.6 - 35.2%) -- 18.1% chance to 3HKO
  • 252+ Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Garchomp: 294-348 (82.3 - 97.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • 252+ Atk Guts Ursaring Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Garchomp: 190-225 (53.2 - 63%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • 252+ Atk Choice Band Huge Power Diggersby Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Garchomp: 225-265 (63 - 74.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • 252+ Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Garchomp: 187-222 (52.3 - 62.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
tl;dr: On the correct team, Mega Garchomp has the potential to become a top-level Mega in Sketchmons. Takes neutral and weaker SE hits with ease and reliably 2HKOs back, with many being OHKO'd with Rock/Spike support. Sets up on many things that could revenge/outmuscle it. Only notable flaw being lack of priority and being revenged by said priority. Great sweeping/wallbreaking potential now, can improve even more if a Mega-Pinsir nerf/ban is approved.
Any feedback on teammates, set details, and counters would be greatly appreciated. Thank you all in advance!
 
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Try suspecting jirachi as well with sacred fire
Have you tried running a Fire-type? Jirachi has seriously bad 4MSS and its coverage options aren't good for much other than picking on 4x weaknesses, in any case, so it's not terribly difficult to handle in teambuilding. Definitely good at spreading burns though, could be quite nice with the right support.
 
Welcome to the official Sketchmons Viability Rankings topic. You should know the drill by now; In this thread, we as a community will rank every single usable Pokemon into "tiers." In this thread, you're encouraged to post your thoughts and opinions on the various Pokemon that are usable in Sketchmons and what tier they should fall under. Posts in this thread will be taken into account when deciding rank changes.
The general idea of the topic is to rank each Sketchmons pokemon under "rankings" that go in descending order. Since this is a general tier list, everything is lumped together. There won't be any segregation between offense & defense threats.
  • EX: Garchomp can be ranked in A tier as an offensive threat, Ferrothorn can be ranked under A as supportive threat and Skarmory can be can also be ranked in B tier as a defensive threat. These are just examples not representative of their future or current ranks.
Sketchmons Ranking Tier List
(In alphabetical order)
S Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are at the top of the Sketchmons metagame
S+ Rank


642.png
Thundurus-I

S- rank


660MS.png
Diggersby
646-b.png
Kyurem-Black

A Rank:
Reserved for Pokemon that are fantastic in the Sketchmons metagame.

A+ Rank


036.png
Clefable
elvqhTa.png
Mega Altaria
485MS.png
Heatran
006-mega-x.png
Charizard (Mega - X)
212-mega.png
Scizor (Mega)
647MS.png
Keldeo
094MS.png Gengar
428MS.png
Lopunny (Mega)
445MS.png
Garchomp
720UMS.png
Hoopa-U
0vrs5qm.png
Mega Sableye
641-s.png
Tornadus-Therian
p4uPcqX.png
Mega Metagross

A Rank


474MS.png
Porygon-Z
461MS.png
Weavile
462MS.png Magnezone
184MS.png
Azumarill
254-mega.png
Sceptile (Mega)
707.png
Klefki
282-mega.png
Gardevoir (Mega)
248MS.png Tyranitar
080-mega.png
Slowbro (Mega)
450MS.png
Hippowdon
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Diancie (Mega)
497MS.png
Serperior
663MS.png
Talonflame
113MS.png Chansey
445-m.png

065-mega.png
Alakazam (Mega)
Fj9Ab0G.png
Mega Latias
490MS.png
Manaphy

A- Rank


003-m.png

645-therian.png Landorus-T
308-mega.png
Medicham (Mega)
145MS.png Zapdos
530MS.png
Excadrill
639.png Terrakion
006-mega-y.png Charizard (Mega-Y)
130-mega.png
Gyarados (Mega)
598.png
Ferrothorn

B Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that are great in the Sketchmons metagame.

B+ Rank


121MS.png
Starmie
245MS.png
Suicune
385MS.png
Jirachi
700MS.png
Sylveon
625MS.png
Bisharp
380MS.png
Latias
381MS.png
Latios
142.png
Aerodactyl
227.png Skarmory
132.png
Ditto

B Rank


091MS.png Cloyster
637MS.png
Volcarona
306-mega.png
Aggron (Mega)
479-wash.png Rotom-W
018-mega.png Pidgeot (Mega)
472MS.png
Gliscor
130MS.pngGyarados
195MS.png Quagsire
701.png


B- Rank


635MS.png
Hydreigon
149MS.png Dragonite
302MS.png
Sableye

C Rank:
Reserved for Pokemon that have notable niches in the Sketchmons metagame.

C+ Rank


706MS.png
Goodra
638MS.png
Cobalion
563MS.png Cofagrigus
464MS.png
Rhyperior
687.pngMalamar
494.pngVictini
437.png
Bronzong

C Rank


292MS.png
Shedinja
342MS.png Crawdaunt
082MS.png
Magneton
626MS.png
Bouffelant

C- Rank


699.png
Aurorus
289MS.png
Slaking

D Rank:
Reserved for Pokemon that are mediocre in the Sketchmons metagame.

486.png Regigigas

Rules

  • Post intelligently. Posts like "I think pokemon X should be in this tier" will be deleted.
  • Usage statistics may be used to support an argument or a claim, but don't base your ENTIRE argument around them. For example, you can't just say "Pokemon X shouldn't be this tier because they aren't used that often!"
  • Suspect talk, unrelated stuff, one liners that ask questions that provide no substance, something that doesn't really pertain to rankings or petty arguments about semantics and definitions, such as the definition of a counter as one example, will be deleted.
Happy posting ♪♪
 

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Viability rankings!

Regigigas, Archeops, and Slaking should all be D Rank imo. They're all the same shitty gimmick, although Archeops can function with its ability if it needs to.

Magneton should be ranked at least as high as Magnezone. It's frailer, but can afford to run a Modest nature (hitting 239 speed) compared to Magnezone's Timid (which hits 240), and with those natures 'ton actually hits harder. 372/239 (ton) vs 359/240 (zone)

Mega Sableye is gud, idk about where it should go but it's bloody annoying. Regular sableye is pretty good too thanks to prankster, it gets reliable recovery, wisp, AND a sketch move giving it a niche over the keys and thundy.

Aerodactyl hits like a freight train and is ridiculously fast, it 2HKOs Skarmory with banded Head Smash and has decent enough coverage. Weakness to rocks, bullet punch and water shuriken is irritating but there are few safe switchins once it gets in. I think B is a decent place for it.

Darminitan can be ranked next to Victini, they have similar roles but it's stronger and frailer.

Ferrothorn has a small niche, sketching recovery, rapid spin, or wisp. Probably C or C+, it's not amazing but it's pretty bulky - it can just about tank uninvested Serperior's V-Create and Twave it back.

I've been really unimpressed with Metagross so far (and in fact all 3 of the S- ranked mons), what do they tend to sketch? I've seen Heavy Slam/SS/SG megagross, boomburst/SG altaria, and quiver dance clef (but I'm sure there are better options). Speaking of, I think it'd be a good idea to put standard sketch moves next to each pokemon, in brackets. I'd be happy to help with that and with VR in general.

edit: Swoobat should be in probably C, it's incredible once set up but you need a lot of team support - priority removed and some resists dented.

I don't know where to tank the following:
-Mega Bee
-Ditto
-Blissey (outclassed by chansey except in scarf transform)
-Ursaring (probably outclassed by diggersby but it does get bellyspeed)
-Togekiss

I'm going to go and see if there's anything else I can't find and I'll edit this post accordingly.
 
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