Smogon Doubles UU

[KyleCole]

if this post gets 10 likes I'll do a full RMT (teambuilding, variations, observations on the tier etc) on my rank 1 team (10 likes just so that I know the effort will actually be worth it and people will look at the RMT because it will take a couple of hours at least). In the meantime, here's a video of the first variation of the team that was made after the first day of the tier UU Doubles Rank #1 team.

Basically the only things that have changed since this video are a couple of EV spreads have been slightly altered and I've swapped Shaymin for Parasect to have a better matchup vs Trick Room. Since the video I've also tried a different mon for pretty much every member (Aerodactyl and Tornadus in Crobat's slot for example) so if you guys are interested in the full RMT clicking like is a great way to let me know :)

Edit: the rmt would actually be p good because it has literally been rank 1 since the tier started

Edit2: thats 10, as soon as my two weeks from Stepping on Shadows have passed I will post the RMT

 

[Roxer]

Rain is so underrated omg, with Ninetales running around with mega houndoom, having Rain really helps hindering them, as in Rain, Kingdra can OHKO both.
the rain setter that I've been using is Tornadus, Prankster Rain Dance and Taunt with STAB Hurricane that doesn't miss is too good to let go.

Tornadus (M) @ Damp Rock
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 88 HP / 252 SpA / 168 Spe
Timid Nature
- Rain Dance
- Hurricane
- Taunt
- Protect
This set is really great for setting up Rain. It gets prankster which only helps and stuff. Hurricane is super strong and hits hard everything that doesn't resist it, and the confuse chance is really nifty. Taunt is there to stop Trick Room, Tailwind etc, really great move overall. Protect disrupts offensive strategies, double targetting etc, really good move overall. EVs outspeed Jolly Mega Medicham and that's really all you need, the rest is dumped into HP.

Kingdra @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Muddy Water
- Draco Meteor
- Ice Beam
- Protect
This is what I've been using alongside Tornadus. Rain Boosted LO 252 SpAtk Modest Muddy Water is nothing to play around with and hits everything super hard unless resisted. Draco Meteor is a great nuke and DESTROYS Latias. Ice Beam is used vs Shaymin etc. Ice is an overall really great offensive typing in this meta. Protect is protect, already explained it on Torn explanation. Running max speed because TWind is really common in this meta imo, you need as much speed as possible.

 

[qwerts]

What are some nice rain counters in this tier? My teams are having trouble playing against it. Trick Room is almost shut down with fakeout + taunt but rain is annoying as hell.

 

[AuraRayquaza]

What are some nice rain counters in this tier? My teams are having trouble playing against it. Trick Room is almost shut down with fakeout + taunt but rain is annoying as hell.

Any of the grass types in the meta help with kindra and other rain sweepers, but be careful with ice beams. Goodra is also a big rain killer. A cool counter to kindra/tornadus is empoleon, but it loses to raikou.

Usually i run a steel type (for torn) and a water type/goodra for other sweeper

 

[Qazoo306]

Just had a god battle vs. xzern on the ladder. It shows two major things: Mega Pinsir is incredible, and I suck at using Staraptor. I also want to point out that Mega-Medicham is very easy to play around and cripple due to will-o-wisp and the plethora of good flying types. Overall this is a fun tier and I may RMT my team soon because it seems to work well but not perfectly :)
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogondoublesuu-167553950

 

[Audiosurfer]

What are some nice rain counters in this tier? My teams are having trouble playing against it. Trick Room is almost shut down with fakeout + taunt but rain is annoying as hell.

Latias is a great Pokemon to consider. It's got great typing and bulk as well as good offensive presence and access to weather moves and tailwind, so it makes a pretty solid answer to opposing weather.

 

[qwerts]

Just had a god battle vs. xzern on the ladder. It shows two major things: Mega Pinsir is incredible, and I suck at using Staraptor. I also want to point out that Mega-Medicham is very easy to play around and cripple due to will-o-wisp and the plethora of good flying types. Overall this is a fun tier and I may RMT my team soon because it seems to work well but not perfectly :)
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogondoublesuu-167553950

Unless used right mega medicham is a liability, flying moves are some of the best in the meta and flying types are all over. Pinsir is amazing with priority protect break and a nuke of a return.

 

[AuraRayquaza]

Ive played with mega aerodactyl on a rain team and it is also really good. A super fast sky drop is like a fake out and is a clutch way to stop tr for a turn. Tough claws makes its attacks hit hard (rock slide not included) so he can dish oit damage

 

[Pastelle]

One thing that I love about this metagame is that it gives me the opportunity to use mons that are outclassed in the regular doubles metagame. One of these mons is Roserade, and this set I've been using has been a great asset to my dUUbs team.

Toxica (Roserade) @ Black Sludge
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Sludge Bomb
- Giga Drain
- Leech Seed
- Protect

The bulk on this thing is really useful, and with a solid 125 Special Attack it can recover an insane amount of HP with Giga Drain, as well as take out virtually Fairy with Sludge Bomb. Natural Cure also comes in handy for things like burn or paralysis. However, it doesn't have the greatest Defense, so threats like Staraptor can cause it a bit of trouble.

Just something I've enjoyed using in this tier and something that others would enjoy using as well.

 

[qwerts]

One thing that I love about this metagame is that it gives me the opportunity to use mons that are outclassed in the regular doubles metagame. One of these mons is Roserade, and this set I've been using has been a great asset to my dUUbs team.

Toxica (Roserade) @ Black Sludge
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Sludge Bomb
- Giga Drain
- Leech Seed
- Protect

The bulk on this thing is really useful, and with a solid 125 Special Attack it can recover an insane amount of HP with Giga Drain, as well as take out virtually Fairy with Sludge Bomb. Natural Cure also comes in handy for things like burn or paralysis. However, it doesn't have the greatest Defense, so threats like Staraptor can cause it a bit of trouble.

Just something I've enjoyed using in this tier and something that others would enjoy using as well.

Interesting mon, but fire and flying are two of the most defining pokes in this metagame, with theats like tornadus, staraptor, briavary, murkrow, typhlosion, infernape, arcanine, and quite a bit more. A stallish mon does not fit unless it is quite bulky, seeing as tailwind is the most dominate force atm.

 

[Pastelle]

Interesting mon, but fire and flying are two of the most defining pokes in this metagame, with theats like tornadus, staraptor, briavary, murkrow, typhlosion, infernape, arcanine, and quite a bit more. A stallish mon does not fit unless it is quite bulky, seeing as tailwind is the most dominate force atm.

That's true, but I usually use Roserade towards the middle and end of a match to clean up. Plus I have plenty of options to eliminate the common fire and flying threats early on like the Mega Aerodactyl I use (just thank god Talonflame isn't legal in this tier...)

 

[Skore]

So when is the best time to find people playing? I can never find anyone on when I am.

 

[Qazoo306]

Go into the PS doubles room and ask someone to either go onto the ladder or just to challenge you. Either way works just fine if your looking for a battle.

 

[Aerogon]

I think its time we update the banlist as even Mega Metagross is allowed on the ladder.

 

[Qazoo306]

It's been 3 months since the ban list was updated anyway, so we need to change the ban list for usage first. Maybe Metagross will be banned for that anyway. If I'll go compile a list for an updated ban list and edit this post for it. Anyone else have another mega stone that you think we should ban?

Edit: see my profile picture for the second one IMO.

 

[finally]

official post: http://www.smogon.com/forums/thread...ier-update-january-2015.3525882/#post-5956274

UU Banlist:
Aegislash, Amoonguss, Azumarill, Bisharp, Breloom, Camerupt, Chandelure, Charizard, Conkeldurr, Cresselia, Deoxys-Attack, Diancie, Dragonite, Excadrill, Ferrothorn, Garchomp, Gardevoir, Gengar, Greninja, Gyarados, Heatran, Hitmontop, Hydreigon, Kangaskhan, Keldeo, Kyurem-Black, Landorus-Therian, Latios, Ludicolo, Mamoswine, Mawile, Meowstic, Metagross, Mew, Politoed, Porygon2, Rotom-Wash, Sableye, Salamence, Sceptile, Scizor, Scrafty, Shaymin-Sky,Slowbro, Suicune, Swampert, Sylveon, Talonflame, Terrakion, Thundurus, Togekiss, Tyranitar, Venusaur, Zapdos

Drops:
Abomasnow, Aromatisse, Dusclops, Jellicent, Manectric, Rhyperior, Rotom-Heat, Thundurus-Therian, Weavile, Whimsicott

 

[finally]

Audiosurfer
will latiasite be banned from doUUbles
latias is legal, but i believe mega latias is too strong for doUUbles

 

[Qazoo306]

What's the major speed tier to hit in this? In doubles OU it's 240 speed, but what is it in doubles UU?

 

[Laga]

I normal Doubles, the speed to hit is 351+, in Duubs I reckon it would be the exact same haha

Latias is probably the most notable one, but generally just build off of base: 70 / 80 / 100 / 110 because they are generally common in all tiers.

 

[KyleCole]

Here are some of the speed tiers that I use

• 0 Spd M Blastoise hits 192 (base 78)
• 0 Spd Rotom-H hits 208 (base 86)
• 252+ Speed Medicham, Glalie, and M Altaria hit 284 (base 80)
• 252 Spd Krookodile hits 283, Jolly hits 311 (base 92)
• 252 Spd Arcanine hits 289 and Jolly/Timid hits 317 (base 95)
• 252 Spd Haxorus hits 293, Jolly hits 322 (base 97)
• 252+ Spd M Medicham, M Glalie, and Shaymin hits 328 (base 100)
• 252+ Spd Mienshao and Lopunny hit 339 (base 105)
• 252+ Spd Latias and M Gallade hit 350 (base 110)
• 252+ Crobat and Aerodactyl hit 394 (base 130)
• 252+ M Manectric and M Lopunny hit 405 (base 135)
• 252 Spd M Aerodactyl hits 399 and Jolly hits 438 (base 150)

 

[Qazoo306]

Audiosurfer
will latiasite be banned from doUUbles
latias is legal, but i believe mega latias is too strong for doUUbles

I'm more concerned about Darkrai TBH. It's one of the fastest notable non-mega pokemon in the tier and it hits hard with STAB Dark Pulse and it has great coverage. Mega Gallade could be trouble too, but I think that one could wait for us to see if it really will be broken or not. Latias is strong and bulky, but I don't have any experience with it being good or bad (never faced it).

 

[Audiosurfer]

Audiosurfer
will latiasite be banned from doUUbles
latias is legal, but i believe mega latias is too strong for doUUbles

As of right now I'm probably not banning it from the tier without some evidence that it's broken. Latias + a mega is for a majority of teams better than Mega Latias, and it doesn't have some killer offensive pool either that's letting it rampage through teams or anything. There's only like one set I could see being a legitimate problem and it's not something easy to use or that you could slap on a bunch of teams either. There's plenty of things in the meta that let you handle Latias and it's not warping the meta or anything so I'd rather just leave it free than ban it.

 

[Thwack!]

Are there any useful offensive/defensive benchmarks when it comes to deciding ona stat spread in DoUUbles? I currently have a few Pokemon I want in the tier I would like to use, but I have a hard time deciding on what EV spread to go for.

 

[Dragsol]

I know it's not Landorus-T, but I like using Nidoking as my ground type. It can be either a physical or special sweeper, with movepools for both. It's attack is a bit higher than it Sp. Atk, but it's special movepool work better with Sheer Force.
Special Nidoking
Nidoking W/Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Speed, Modest Nature (+Sp Att, -Att)

- Sludge Wave
- Earth Power
- Blizzard
- Protect
This Nidoking is set up to be a special sweeper. EVs and nature are set up to boost Sp. Attack and make it more deadly. Sludge Wave hits everybody, so make sure you use with with someone using protect or a steel type. Earthpower adds great coverage, and gets the Sheer Force boost unlike Earthquake. Blizzard hits both opponents and gets the boost as well as hitting other ground types and Flying types. Protect keeps you safe from everything like surf and earthquake from your fellow teammates and is just a wise choice in doubles. Life Orb and Sheer force make a great combination. Sheer Force ignore Life Orb damage but still gives the user the Life Orb boost.
Other options: Flamethrower, Fire Blast, Sludge bomb, Ice beam, Thunderbolt, Thunder, Shadowball, Focus Blast, and Surf. I once saw a Nidoking nicknamed "The Avatar" because of it's versatility. Once Nidoking learns Hurricane of Air Slash this will be more true, but you can see how versatile this pokemon is.

Physical Nidoking
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Speed, Adamant Nature (+Att, -Sp Att)
-Poison Jab
-Drill Run
-Rockslide
-Protect
This is a physical version of the above Nidoking, just switched around to punch hard. Poison Jab and Drill Run are STAB moves that get the Sheer Force/Life Orb boosts, and Rockslide gets both but no STAB. Instead it just hits both targets which is very useful in doubles. Protect is there again for safety.
Other Options: Fire/Ice/Thunder punch, Superpower, Earthquake, Stone Edge, Megahorn, Aquatail, Iron Tail.

Nidoking can also be a mixed sweeper, with many option to choose from. A mixed sweeper can keep your opponent in the dark as to what you're planning and what tricks you have up your sleeve.
Honorable mention goes to Toxic Spikes and Stealth Rock, both which are good moves to have. I find them more useful in singles, and Nidoking's ability is better suited for a offensive Pokémon anyway. It's poison typing can absorb toxic spikes too, which helps when your opponent sets them.

 

[Dragsol]

Are there any useful offensive/defensive benchmarks when it comes to deciding ona stat spread in DoUUbles? I currently have a few Pokemon I want in the tier I would like to use, but I have a hard time deciding on what EV spread to go for.

Can you maybe clarify a bit?