I don't see how people "over-adapted" to hail. By simply using Gallade, you completely screw over hail. Add in the fact that specially defensive Entei can just Roar you through the entire battle, I just don't see how you can say that we have too many counters for it in each team. As I've said, it only requires one or two Pokemon to completely shut down an entire team. This isn't like countering a Pokemon. In that case it would be a one to one ratio. Here, if you use two Pokemon to shut down an entire team, I don't see how you can possibly compare the two. However, I still stand by the fact that you can just use one Pokemon to counter hail completely, and don't really need the excess, unless you wanted to use them for the core of your team.
CB Tomb traps Gallade, certain slowking sets can handle it, specs glaceon can nuke it, you can stall it out with toxic spikes, a competent hail team can cover its general weaknesses. Specially defensive entei is shit outside of beating hail, that's the type of overcentralization i was talking about. That someone would actually use SpD entei to me is a testament to hail's power.
And no, one to two pokemon are not capable of shutting down a well played hail team. The hail team gives you awesome weapons to use and then it's in the players hands to compensate for its weaknesses, and then it becomes a game of pokemon. And if you can eliminate the other team's 1-2 hail checks (which is not as difficult as you've made it seem) you can pretty much get a clean sweep.
I don't see how having a Choice Scarf user is a disadvantage against hail teams. Life Orb users sure, but not Choice Scarf. If the Choice Scarf user is faster than Rotom-F, then in most cases, that Pokemon will wreck havoc.
Depends who you get it in on and who the scarfer is. If the team has a check to the scarf they're just going to be taking extra damage without a power boost. They can be tricky to play around, sure, but a hail team should have at least 2-3 protects spread around on various members. Scarves are predictable.
I didn't know hail could have this many things incorporated into it... You talk as if when you stick all these things in a team you aren't getting screwed in other aspects. Hail has fragile team building. And with all the "things" you're talking about, any rest/talk user would take a shit on it. Gallade with Lum Berry also takes a shit on it. We're talking putting one Pokemon on a team and shitting on your idea. I don't understand how we're overcompensating and still getting fucked over.
Choice Specs Glaceon and a toxic spikes user isn't exactly a stretch to include on a hail team. Glaceon can power through any rest talker that I know of, and lum Gallade gets covered by your gallade check. Yes, hail has fragile team building. But not carrying a fighting type check on a hail team is stupid, especially one as important as gallade. And yes, it is possible to cover gallade.
It does not beat 95% of the tier. If anyone thinks that the metagame that we just played was broken, then they failed to team build correctly. I do not deny that a future metagame with hail could be broken, but no one has presented a team that overcomes some of the most common RU Pokemon. Again, we are voting on this suspect test, not a future one in which you imagine possible scenarios. If you want to vote on a metagame in which we have not played, then just do away with the entire suspect test process and just vote on what you envision.
Given a free sub, which is not a huge stretch given it can force out a ton of pokemon with the threat of blizzards, yeah, sub/protect/blizzard/[toxic/hp ground] Glaceon can beat 95% of the tier. You need to be bulky enough to take two blizzards or faster than it and able to take one blizzard, carry leftovers so you don't get hail stalled, and if you're slower than it you need to have some way to deal with toxic (so no slowkings or lanturns, that loses to glaceon 1v1). I wouldn't use a 95% of the tier claim lightly, but i do think 95% of the tier loses to it.
Or you can never give it a chance to set up a free sub, which results in glaceon blasting you away with its 130 SpA. The Glaceon user will happily comply and take a free ko whenever he switches in Glaceon. This is not an effective method of dealing with Glaceon, however.
And just so we're clear, even if hail is proven to be overpowered in the next suspect test, I stand by my decision in this suspect test. I voted on what I saw, not what I envisioned.
Fair enough. I felt like I've seen enough this test. And at the end of the day all we're left with is arguments and opinions.
