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Pet Mod SS OU Theorymon (Completed)

:electivire: Dumb super effective coverage on steel types is not fun
:obstagoon: seems a lot stronger as now it hits a great speed tier to out speed common Pokémon, could be very strong though
:jolteon: pick raikou, only advantage I see is a better speed tier and electric immunity, doubt it'd be worth running over Raikou still 99% of the time
:Mudsdale: Seems really fun, stamina body press allows this Pokémon to have great offensive presence alongside its solid 110 attack. A good alternative to other ground types, probably outshining hippo unless you're running a sand team
:archeops: cool glass cannon rock type, also I find vital spirit to be very fitting
 
:ss/Electivire:: cool? balances steel types out (new thoughts after reading the the thread: if it wins remove fire punch from this and watch aegislash rise in viability)
:ss/Obstagoon:: Kinda underwhelming? idk 105 is a good speed tier but feels like it'd still lack a little:/
:ss/Archeops:: I was expecting an archeops buff anytime soon, that said, im not against it, its a cool mon
:ss/Jolteon:: HELL yeah, bro needs this (new thoughts after reading the thread: it really would be underwhelming, just give this ice beam and let it be a good sweeper, it still gets walled its not that strong lol)
:ss/Mudsdale:: the best sub fr, better hippowdon gang rise up (new thoughts after reading the thread: yeah a health buff would be better for this, but still cool)
 
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m

:electivire: Blacklist

:archeops: Least interesting sub here but if it works it works. Arch doesn't have an amazing movepool but its great offensive stats and ability to go mixed could help it carve out a niche, and STAB Head Smash is massively threatening against a large portion of the tier, even if it literally kills you for using it.

:obstagoon: I really don't want to crowd the 105 Speed tier and add another strong physical breaker at the same time.

:mudsdale: Doesn't need to be better than things to have a niche. Bulky Grounds are always good and Mudsdale has a strong defensive ability that doesn't restrict its teammates. If you're afraid of it being able to wall out Physical Attackers too easily, keep in mind 90% of Pokemon have Toxic.
 
Gonna give my two cents on this since why not, as it sounds quite fun and theorymonning is sick af
:electivire:
This is honestly...disgusting, is not like I think it will be broken or anything, it just feels like it restricts the building on a quite unhealthy way, since it traps every steel and is still genuinely disgusting to switch into, so won't be voting for this (cool concept but I think the fighting type was a little too much).

:Archeops:
Like others said, Vital Spirit is not useful at all since not many mons abuse of sleep moves (though I think it has some merit since it stops the random sheningans from Tangrowth or Amoonguss who could probably see an uptick in usage due to Zarude being dominant), it's definitely a great upgrade from Defeatist and now it can make use of it's arsenal of moves (it has Heat Wave like someone pointed up, which is rly good since u hit Steels). Voting for this 100%.

:Jolteon:
Honestly I don't think this buff is bad as a whole, but I think if we give it a more useful ability that separates it from Koko and Raikou it'd make more use of it (will use it since I think 3a Yawn has potential tho). Won't vote for it probably but I still would like to see this again in another slate, since I think it has other ways to be buffed (like you can do Surf but also add something that allows it to set apart from Raikou).

:mudsdale:
Sure, this mon will definitely have a place in OU metagame with these buffs, since Shore Up + Stamina sounds really cool and now you can wall most phsy attackers while you also hit stuff such as Zarude in the switch-in with Body Press, making it a quite good wall while also having good offensive prescense (hot take: I don't think this mon SHOULD run Stealth Rock 100% of the time, Shore Up / Roar / Body Press / EQ sounds fine in order to phaze setup-sweepers).

:Obstagoon:
Ok so ngl, I think it could make this mon kinda OP since...well let's see all the things it outspeeds:
:urshifu-rapid-strike::tapu-lele::hydreigon::victini::mew::zapdos-galar::zapdos::volcarona::thundurus-therian::garchomp::nihilego:(it's niche but it has gotten usage lately)
It also ties with Zarude (:zarude::zarude-dada:)
As we can see, this is a long list and I think it heavily buffs Obstagoon, like I still appreciate it since this mon has lots of potential (and there's a chance I vote for this over Mudsdale), but could be kinda busted, though yeah I like the buff I just think it could be a little restrictive, maybe 100 would be better? Like I know this is a rly crowded speed tier but it would give it a jump over Urshifu-RS, Lele and Drei while still tying with stuff such as Victini, making it easier to deal offensively while still getting a better niche in OU and if UU theorymon becomes a thing, it would be better down there.
TLDR; Voting for Archeops and I'm not sure if I should vote for Mudsdale (the most consistent buff imo), Obstagoon (another strong wallbreaker) or Jolteon (I still have hopes you all give it a better buff later on if it somehow gets voted on).

Have a nice day!
 
here i am spouting my Opinions again

:electivire:

No, absolutely not. It has the speed, coverage, and now the typing to pretty much trap any and all Steel-types in the game. Over at Megas For All we've already hashed this concept out during the Electivire slate and realized just how unhealthy and fundamentally constraining such an optimized trapper would be. Due to the effective range of its trapping abilities, it would be legitimately comparable to auto-trappers like Dugtrio, which can utilize a potent STAB to instantly invalidate and remove anything physically frail or weak to it. Considering this Electivire would have the typing and coverage to make what's, otherwise, a borderline ability that's standardly balanced by a user with limited options work to its best effect, and consequently invalidate an entire chunk of the metagame a la Dugtrio, I see absolutely nothing positive coming of this and I massively discourage exploring this concept further.

:obstagoon:

This would honestly be a pretty substantial change despite its simplicity since this new Speed tier would allow it to actually 1v1 a lot of the offensive metagame it couldn't originally, but considering it does genuinely address Obstagoon's core problem as a wallbreaker I think it would be certainly fine to have and is probably the change I like the most in this slate. It's not quite enough Speed to be difficult to revenge kill, but it's enough to give it more practical application against bulky offense builds. It would also most definitely still be balanced by its incredible proneness to residual damage via Burn, hazards, and contact effects. Furthermore, it boasts a U-turn weakness and is reliant on Facade to actually consistently sting. This is certainly fine, if anything I worry it won't do enough for it, but I think having another viable offensive Dark-type is always welcome in a metagame where viable Ghost-resists are brutally sparse.

:archeops:

Okay, I suppose. My main nitpick with this is more that you really missed out on the opportunity to use Early Bird, but this is certainly fine considering just how substantial power creep has become since its inception to where I think it'll probably be balanced. I believe it would be really debilitated by residual damage, especially if it wants to make use of Head Smash, and it looks like it would hate dealing with Ferrothorn-centric cores in general which are incredibly potent in the current SS OU metagame. I'm not particularly passionate about this because I don't think it necessarily adds a lot to the metagame, but it seems harmless enough.

:jolteon:

So this would essentially just make Jolteon a much faster Heliolisk? I suppose it would help since fast Electric-type pivots are so blanked by Ground-types, and giving one with an incredible Speed tier the option to pressure Ground-types directly seems like a pragmatic choice. This being said, I don't exactly feel this will be enough to make it worth using over Tapu Koko and Zeraora, the former of which has a secondary STAB to blast Garchomp, and the latter being probably the best natural late-game cleaner in the metagame next to Dragapult. In terms of the fast Electric-type pivot with an option to play around Ground-types directly, Jolteon is still heavily blanked by Grass-types and Ferrothorn to a point where I just do not see why you would use it over Tapu Koko in particular, even with Surf. Scald Raikou also exists, whose viability is already in question.

edit: lol nevermind raikou got buffed, raikou actually just overshadows this a million times over

:mudsdale:

Shore Up would probably make this thing an absolute juggernaut and probably the Ground-type of choice on bulkier structures. The comparisons to Hippowdon are fairly apt and would be ones I agree with for the most part, since on the Special side it roughly simulates Hippowdon's bulk (letting it check Dragapult and Heatran), and Stamina lets it accumulate bulk to a point where it could also start doing things like check Melmetal and Victini. Furthermore, Stamina could give it winning ability with Body Press and the ability to attain some comical feats, such as 1v1ing things like Weavile if it accumulates Stamina boosts beforehand. In fact, being a Ground-type with the ability to actually 1v1 Ferrothorn and Corviknight with Body Press feels incredibly fascinating and practical, and probably the most interesting reason to use it as a Ground-type. I'm not sure if it would be too worrisome of a change, but I can safely say Shore Up would propel this thing into top status considering how much it could consistently check with its incredible natural bulk and the potential to check with Stamina. I don't know if I directly support this per se, but I guess I'd be interested to see how it'd pan out. I will say, though, that I really don't see the point in +10 Defense; such a buff feels unnecessary and overtunes Mudsdale's defensive profile. If anything giving offenses a hole to exploit before it snowballs boosts feels like a much more dynamic balancing factor as a bulky Ground-type with longevity, so I feel I would support omitting the Defense boost if it gets Shore up.
 
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24 hour warning before voting starts
we'd also like to mention that due to the very large amount of opinions on electivire being too much, we decided to veto the Electivire sub entirely. so for this slate, you shall only vote two from the other four. anyone who votes for Electivire will be asked to change their vote or have their vote disregarded entirely.​
 
:electivire: Not sure on this Pokemon. I'd be fine if the Magnet Pull was swapped over with like Close Combat or Sheer Force, or if it was base Elec with MagPull. But yeah, I think it can tech to eliminate most existing Steels a bit too easy imo. You don't even need physical - Thunderbolt / Focus Blast / Flamethrower / Volt Switch or EQ does a very good job. Plus we just buffed an Electric type (more later).

:Obstagoon: This is probably one of the meh options of the slate if we are being real. I do not understand how this Pokemon is broken if it operates exactly how it plays in standard but it creeps Ursh and Lele too. It faces most of the same issues it does in standard - too easy to wear down, walled by top tier Steels and bad defensive typing since no uber oppresive Ghosts are around. Speed bump is mighty useful but I just do jot see this being an OU Pokemon. Not a very great buff imo.

:archeops: LMAO what a meme I love him.

:jolteon: this is bad, and Surf wouldnt make this OU anyway, but now it has to contend with buffed Raikou and consistently good Tapu Koko. Waste of a slot.

I will now go into detail about why you all are wrong.
My thoughts:


mudsdale.png

Just use Hippowdon. Or Quagsire. Or Swampert.

With the buffs in place, Mudsdale imo is roughly comparable to Hippowdon, if not superior in walling physical attackers thanks to Stamina. Muds has ever so slightly higher SpD bulk too (108/118/72 v 100/110/85) so mixed Hippo and SpD Hippo sets can be largely replaced by Muds. Reallynits tye support of Sand Offense that wouod keep up Hippo, which in and of itself is a strong niche so they can probably be interchangable. I will not explain why bringing up Swampert and Quagsire of all things is just....bad. None of these are OU so I doesnt matter.

:Mudsdale: :Metagame trends don't really help this guy a lot, Especially with how most A+ rank mons screw this fella over. Even then it would be unfair to say that this thing isn't helped by these buffs. I do see it having a niche at making switch in opportunities out of mons like Melmetal, Zeraora, Scizor, Victini and Gapdos. I guess you could also slap rocks into it but overall mudsdale will face harsh competition in its role from the likes of lando and Garchomp.

just bringing up the last slot, but I can see Muds slotting into Balance very easily, and comparing this to Garchomp is a very weird coparision since Chomp has been firmly an offensive Wallbreaker or Sweeper for quite some time now.

Luckily most other people realise that Mudsdale is clearly the best addition here, and would easily assimilate ito a A or A+ rank threat. Honestly I am glad itbwas +10 Def and not +20 HP I have seen being suggested, that would probaboy make it much too strong.
 
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