Project SS OU - Victim of the Week - Not hosted anymore

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Ty to everyone who voted. The winners this time are

Counter: Unaware Calm Mind :Clefable: by Smashburn
Check: Choice Band Smart Strike :Kartana: by Bluecliqse


Now for the next Victim of the Week we have... Swords Dance Crawdaunt

:ss/crawdaunt:

Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Crabhammer
- Knock Off
- Aqua Jet​

A fan favorite wallbreaker. After a Swords Dance this pokemon is able to OHKO Toxapex, Corviknight, Magic Guard Clefable, and has a very strong chance to also OHKO Ferrothorn and Mandibuzz. Even Colbur Berry Slowbro, a popular way of dealing with weavile, gets OHKO after an SD most of the time. Being able to set up in front of slow Landorus-Therian, Heatran, Slowking-Galar, while also being able to take a Shadow Ball or a Knock Off, gives Crawdaunt enough room to shake up the opposing team. What do we do against this pokemon?

Deadline for submissions is Friday May 27th at 11:59 EST​
 
reserving lele

:ss/tapu-lele:
Tapu Lele @ Choice Specs / Choice Scarf
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Psyshock
- Moonblast
- Focus Blast
- Psychic

Lele is a check to crawduant, not being able to switch in but being able to OHKO with moonblast. Additionally, psychic terrain blocks aqua jet. Both scarf and specs work.

Calcs:
252 SpA Tapu Lele Moonblast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Crawdaunt: 498-588 (186.5 - 220.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Lele: 374-442 (133 - 157.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Lele: 361-426 (128.4 - 151.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
 
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reserving defensive kommo-o
:ss/kommo-o:
Kommo-o @ Leftovers
Ability: Bulletproof
EVs: 252 HP / 148 Def / 40 SpD / 68 Spe
Impish Nature
- Body Press
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Earthquake
If they SD on the switch:
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 148+ Def Kommo-o: 196-231 (55.3 - 65.2%)
If they hard Crabhammer or Knock Off:
252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 148+ Def Kommo-o: 99-117 (27.9 - 33%)
252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 148+ Def Kommo-o: 95-113 (26.8 - 31.9%)
Live easily and OHKO with Body Press:
148+ Def Kommo-o Body Press vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Crawdaunt: 296-350 (110.8 - 131%)

EVs are just the regular defensive Kommo-o set.

Kommo-o is a CHECK to crawdaunt because it doesn't have reliable recovery and can be worn down by repeated hits throughout a game.
 
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reserving hydreigon

:bw/hydreigon:
Hydreigon @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 204 HP / 12 Def / 140 SpA / 152 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Earth Power
- Dark Pulse
- Roost
- Defog

Hydreigon is a decent check to Crawdaunt, thanks in no short part to its resistance to Aqua Jet and ability to outspeed and 2HKO Crawdaunt. However, if they Swords Dance on the switch, any other move into Aqua Jet can kill it, making this just a check.

With SD
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Aqua Jet vs. 204 HP / 12 Def Hydreigon: 127-151 (33.7 - 40.1%) -- 35.3% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 204 HP / 12 Def Hydreigon: 316-373 (84 - 99.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Without SD
252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 204 HP / 12 Def Hydreigon: 155-182 (41.2 - 48.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 204 HP / 12 Def Hydreigon: 159-187 (42.2 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Hydreigon
140 SpA Hydreigon Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Crawdaunt: 142-168 (53.1 - 62.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
 
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Reserving Fini

:swsh/tapu_fini:
Tapu Fini @ Leftovers
Ability: Misty Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 116 Def / 140 Spe
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Taunt
- Scald
- Draining Kiss

Fini's typing means it resists both of Crawdaunt's STAB's and can then proceed to outspeed and 2HKO with Draining Kiss, which allows it to heal back most of the damage from a +2 Crabhammer. Therefore, Fini is a Counter

252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 116+ Def Tapu Fini: 108-127 (31.3 - 36.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 116+ Def Tapu Fini: 104-123 (30.2 - 35.7%) -- 41.3% chance to 3HKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 116+ Def Tapu Fini: 213-252 (61.9 - 73.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Tapu Fini Draining Kiss vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Crawdaunt: 168-200 (62.9 - 74.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (36.6 - 43.6% recovered)
 
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Zarude @ Leftovers
Ability: Leaf Guard
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Bulk Up
- Jungle Healing
- Power Whip
- Darkest Lariat

MONKE

it can hard switch in always vs crawdaunt and either jungle healing to recover back up or KO it with power whip. If it sd's on the switch it just drops to power whip, and if it attacks it has to guess a 50/50 if it should stay in or switch out. You can also bulk up on it and make it so it will do much less to you and you can potentially clean the opposing team utilizing the free turns you get

252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Zarude: 142-168 (40.3 - 47.7%) -- 3.1% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Zarude Power Whip vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Crawdaunt: 422-500 (158 - 187.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
 
First time here:
:swsh/magnezone:
Magnezone @ Leftovers
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Flash Cannon
- Body Press
- Toxic
A defensive pivot Magnezone. It outspeeds Crawdaunt and OHKOs it with Volt Switch, and can take a +2 Aqua Jet. It can switch in on an unboosted Aqua Jet but not a Knock Off or Crabhammer: It falls to an Aqua Jet if it is weakened by one of those. Therefore, it is a check.
 
:sm/volcanion:


Volcanion @ Choice Specs
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Steam Eruption
- Flamethrower
- Earth Power
- Sludge Wave


252+ SpA Choice Specs Volcanion Sludge Wave vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Crawdaunt: 273-322 (102.2 - 120.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO


While it can’t switch into a knock off. It can come in on a free switch or a water move and ohko with sludge wave. It also is an amazing revenge killer for crawdaunt do to it being unable to click 3 of its move safely and can stop a boosted crawdaunt from sweeping. Due to the fact it can’t switch in but can 1v1 crawdaunt it is a Check.
 
:SS/Avalugg:

CHECK

Avalugg @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Icicle Spear / Avalanche
- Body Press
- Rapid Spin
- Recover​

Sturdy Avalugg is one of the best checks to SD Crawdaunt on stall, as the combination of sturdy + body press allows it to tank any hit at 100% health and KO back, effectively 'trading' with Crawdaunt. This is, of course, favorable for the stall player, as one of the primary reasons to use Sword dance Crawdaunt is to abuse stall.

It is also a cleaner check than Skarmory, for example, as you do not have to play mind games with Counter v Sword Dance PP, or play around Magnezone with shed shell thus losing boots and losing sturdy if hazards are up, while Avalugg is free to always run Heavy Duty Boots.

I am noming this as a check and not a counter as there is one scenario in which Crawdaunt comes out ahead: when Avalugg is below 100% and switches in under rain.

+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg in Rain: 406-478 (103 - 121.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
VS​
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 270-320 (68.5 - 81.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
 
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:ss/rillaboom:

Rillaboom @ Grassy Seed
Ability: Grassy Surge
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Acrobatics
- Grassy Glide
- High Horsepower
- Swords Dance

252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. +1 0 HP / 0 Def Rillaboom in Rain: 161-191 (47.2 - 56%)
252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off vs. +1 0 HP / 0 Def Rillaboom: 140-166 (41 - 48.6%)
252+ Atk Rillaboom Grassy Glide vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Crawdaunt in Grassy Terrain: 362-428 (135.5 - 160.2%)


Grassy Seed SD Rillaboom is a great check to Crawdaunt, as it is able to freely switch into any of Crawdaunts attacks, whether or not rain is up. Once Rillaboom switches in, it will use up its Grassy Seed, raising its defense and weakening Crawdaunts Knock Off. Because of this, a full-health Rillaboom can live both a Crabhammer or Knock Off + an Aqua Jet. One thing to keep in mind is that Rillaboom will die to a crit Knock Off or a crit Crabhammer in rain. Once Rillaboom is in, it can force out or KO Crawdaunt with Grassy Glide. Grassy Glide is great because it prevents extra chip done to Rillaboom with an Aqua Jet, due to its priority. However, because Rillaboom doesn't have any reliable recovery, and can only heal itself through Grassy Terrain, Rillaboom is a check.
 
suwa said:
Ty to everyone who voted. The winners this time are

Counter: Unaware Calm Mind :Clefable: by Smashburn
Check: Choice Band Smart Strike :Kartana: by Bluecliqse


Now for the next Victim of the Week we have... Swords Dance Crawdaunt

:ss/crawdaunt:

Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Crabhammer
- Knock Off
- Aqua Jet​

A fan favorite wallbreaker. After a Swords Dance this pokemon is able to OHKO Toxapex, Corviknight, Magic Guard Clefable, and has a very strong chance to also OHKO Ferrothorn and Mandibuzz. Even Colbur Berry Slowbro, a popular way of dealing with weavile, gets OHKO after an SD most of the time. Being able to set up in front of slow Landorus-Therian, Heatran, Slowking-Galar, while also being able to take a Shadow Ball or a Knock Off, gives Crawdaunt enough room to shake up the opposing team. What do we do against this pokemon?

Deadline for submissions is Friday May 27th at 11:59 EST​
Click to expand...
 
:SS/Tapu Bulu:
Tapu Bulu @ Life Orb / Leftovers
Ability: Grassy Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 196 Def / 60 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Horn Leech
- Close Combat
- Synthesis

Tapu Bulu is a COUNTER to SD Crawdaunt since it can switch into any of its moves and OHKO back (while having recovery). Grassy Surge and Synthesis provide a very reliable recovery while Life Orb & SD give it more firepower to be generally more threatening

Calcs:
If it attacks on switch in:
252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 196 Def Tapu Bulu: 110-131 (31.9 - 38%) -- 81.9% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 196 Def Tapu Bulu: 108-127 (31.3 - 36.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Grassy Terrain recovery

252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 196 Def Tapu Bulu in Rain: 166-196 (48.2 - 56.9%) -- 3.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery (IN RAIN)

If it tries to Aqua Jet:
252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Aqua Jet vs. 252 HP / 196 Def Tapu Bulu in Rain: 66-79 (19.1 - 22.9%) -- possible 9HKO after Leftovers recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

If it SD's, you can just OHKO it back with Horn Leech:
0 Atk Tapu Bulu Horn Leech vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Crawdaunt in Grassy Terrain: 302-356 (113.1 - 133.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO


(PS: The Speed EVs were put to outspeed Heatran although I don't think it matters here)
 
Hi everyone, before voting begins I just thought of letting you know my opinion.

  • I was thinking of considering as counters just the mons that get reliable recovery. In this case :zarude: and :Tapu bulu:
  • The :Hydreigon: posted does die to +2 Crabhammer + Aqua Jet while not being able to OHKO. So I was considering not listing it as check, but let me know what ya'll think.
  • Even though :Avalugg: dies to +2 Crabhammer in Rain, I was considering listing it as check cause not everyone accounted for rain, but let me know what ya'll think.
  • Finally I am not sure what to do about :Kommo-O:. Even though it's listed as a check for the lack of recovery, it can still effectively switch in 2 or (even 3 times) and outspeed and OHKO back. Let me know if you think we should list it as Counter or Check.

Please let me know your opinion throughout the day so we can start the voting process.​
 
IMO Avalugg is a counter, as is the Kommo-o set (although this is more arguable). If we limit counters to mons that only have reliable recovery, that's kind of a slippery slope - why not limit it to mons that have recovery AND outspeed the threat (otherwise if they swap in already chipped they can lose).

Counters can be worn down, and eventually fail to beat what they're supposed to beat. That doesn't mean they aren't a counter to the threat in most cases - good teams will try to wear down or surprise that counter when trying to break it, and will try to keep it healthy if they're using it.

Sure, that Kommo-o set can be worn down but even after 1 round it can still beat Mr. Krabs in the 1v1 again, which IMO makes it a counter as per the definition that's usually been used in past gen versions of this thread.
 
TURBODERP said:
IMO Avalugg is a counter, as is the Kommo-o set (although this is more arguable). If we limit counters to mons that only have reliable recovery, that's kind of a slippery slope - why not limit it to mons that have recovery AND outspeed the threat (otherwise if they swap in already chipped they can lose).

Counters can be worn down, and eventually fail to beat what they're supposed to beat. That doesn't mean they aren't a counter to the threat in most cases - good teams will try to wear down or surprise that counter when trying to break it, and will try to keep it healthy if they're using it.

Sure, that Kommo-o set can be worn down but even after 1 round it can still beat Mr. Krabs in the 1v1 again, which IMO makes it a counter as per the definition that's usually been used in past gen versions of this thread.
Click to expand...

Avalugg is not a counter cause it just gets 1HKO in rain... how is that a counter in any way? It's barely a check.

Yeah exactly by why you are saying I am considering Kommo a counter instead of a check, trying to be flexible with the definition.

Maybe the way I expressed this was a bit poorly, I just meant to consider as counters "for this specific case". In any case I am just tryna get opinions if everyone would be fine by considering the :Zarude: :Tapu Bulu: :Kommo-O: as counters, and the rest of the mons as checks. If anyone wants to up or down a mon, let me know.
 
suwa said:
Maybe the way I expressed this was a bit poorly, I just meant to consider as counters "for this specific case". In any case I am just tryna get opinions if everyone would be fine by considering the :Zarude: :Tapu Bulu: :Kommo-O: as counters, and the rest of the mons as checks. If anyone wants to up or down a mon, let me know.
Click to expand...
i think that makes sense.
They can switch in multiple times and KO. That makes them a counter. They may not live FOREVER but they can take enough hits to where they are good enough in a normal - length game.
 
Can't believe nobody listed the original goat, so I'm dropping it here before voting starts (yes i know im late soz).

:ss/Tangrowth:
Tangrowth @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpDef
Relaxed Nature
- Knock Off
- Giga Drain
- Sleep Powder
- Focus Blast
​

You know who he is, you know what he does. Obviously not amazing in Weavile meta but that’s not to say he can't do anything. He can check SD Crawdaunt until ‘Daunt gets to +2, at which point it's a roll for Knock to kill.

252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tangrowth: 91-108 (22.5 - 26.7%) -- 26.6% chance to 4HKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tangrowth: 177-211 (43.8 - 52.2%) -- 12.5% chance to 2HKO

0 SpA Tangrowth Giga Drain vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Crawdaunt: 284-336 (106.3 - 125.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
 
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