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Super Smash Bros. Brawl: Character and Tier Discussion
- Thread starter Firestorm
- Start date
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There is no such thing in america as a soft ban because everyone would break it.
In japan, nobody's going to break it under any conditions.
In japan, nobody's going to break it under any conditions.
Everyone interested in the MK debate of whether he should be banned or not should tune in tonight at 8pm EST to listen to the SBR debate. We have our very own Smogon resident in the debate, Mia who will be arguing for the Anti-Ban side as Umbreon Mow. Everyone should show their support for Mia, whether you agree or not. Best of luck; I will definitely be listening :D
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=201664
This is the main thread where you can listen to the live stream.
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=202504
This is the Tactical Discussion thread about it, to see who is debating.
At the moment, they are talking about cake :P
So tune in at 8!
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=201664
This is the main thread where you can listen to the live stream.
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=202504
This is the Tactical Discussion thread about it, to see who is debating.
At the moment, they are talking about cake :P
So tune in at 8!
thank you for posting this, hopefully will be interesting
Mia just raped lol
Umbreon Mow, yeah.
Great job Mia :)
Edit: lol, 11,000 characters.
Edit: lol, 11,000 characters.
oh cool, i'd always wondered who mia was on smashboards.
a lot of people have said that the pro-ban side 'won' the debate. i only listened to the closing arguments, so we'll see.
i also heard that someone mentioned wichita's bi-weeklies and the one week mk ban (first tourney in the nation to ban mk, iirc), and my placement in it.
a lot of people have said that the pro-ban side 'won' the debate. i only listened to the closing arguments, so we'll see.
i also heard that someone mentioned wichita's bi-weeklies and the one week mk ban (first tourney in the nation to ban mk, iirc), and my placement in it.
yeah :D
when they mentioned you everyone in #smash was like "did he just say steeler???"
Anyway, to contribute my thoughts, i was abit miffed that i listened for three hours only to hear pretty much the same stuff thats already been circulating and no real conclusion at the end, especially since im in GMT meaning i was up from 1:00 AM - 4:00 AM :<
To be honest, im leaning more towards the pro-ban side for completely selfish reasons in that meta is a bitch and i dont want to play AS him, so I'd rather not have to learn to beat him x)
Of course i understand the real reasons why hes being considered for banning too, but since im not really a tourney goer and im not at the same level as these guys, it's not such a big deal to me.
I really liked overswarms statement "If your patient has a disease, you dont wait until hes dead to do something about it" or something along those lines, and i was pleased when panda was won over by it.
All in all, i just think it's pretty interesting. It's obviously a big controversial issue but since i cant really contribute to it im quite content to just spectate and deal with the results.
when they mentioned you everyone in #smash was like "did he just say steeler???"
Anyway, to contribute my thoughts, i was abit miffed that i listened for three hours only to hear pretty much the same stuff thats already been circulating and no real conclusion at the end, especially since im in GMT meaning i was up from 1:00 AM - 4:00 AM :<
To be honest, im leaning more towards the pro-ban side for completely selfish reasons in that meta is a bitch and i dont want to play AS him, so I'd rather not have to learn to beat him x)
Of course i understand the real reasons why hes being considered for banning too, but since im not really a tourney goer and im not at the same level as these guys, it's not such a big deal to me.
I really liked overswarms statement "If your patient has a disease, you dont wait until hes dead to do something about it" or something along those lines, and i was pleased when panda was won over by it.
All in all, i just think it's pretty interesting. It's obviously a big controversial issue but since i cant really contribute to it im quite content to just spectate and deal with the results.
I wasn't. If we found something broken with Meta Knight in a few months or whatever, it's not like we'd be put into some kind of instant, community-crippling jeopardy. We'd just ban Meta Knight. If there isn't a reason to ban it now, then... there isn't a reason to ban it now. That's... that's it >_>
if he isn't broken right now, we shouldn't ban him right now. I really don't see any reason for that not to be considered the case here.
Theres no problem with one character being superior to the rest, that's just natural.
With about as much justification as Adv pokemon players that wanted SkarmBliss out.
While there's little doubt that Meta Knight is currently the best character in the game, "far superior" is a pretty massive exaggeration.
Okay....? I don't agree that he is far superior. I play G&W, and I dont think MK is a vastly better character than him, not in the least.
stoo that's awesome...haha. wish i'd been there.
gw is really freaking good...but definitely not bannable good.
mk is really freaking amazing...and perhaps bannable good.
what i want to talk about is how the game would develop sans-MK. i really think it'd revolve around the current top tier with marth jumping a few spots, and perhaps wario joining them if wario-fever spreads outside of the west coast...
i think all of the characters would dominate at fairly equal levels, with gw being just half a head above the rest.
from my knowledge...
gw has some issues with marth, snake, and wario to a certain extent. really skilled toon links gives gw a headache. tlinks would go up in usage, but i don't think it'd be drastic since marth and snake do just as well. the reason why i place gw as head honcho is because he dominates more of the cast than any other character...that isn't mk. however, i don't think there would be an outcry for a ban here because marth and snake will be common in tourneys and can eliminate gw, so there is a counterbalance there...tlink would probably be most commonly used as a cp secondary if the opponent loses a match to gw.
marth becomes a solid character for high level players, due to most of his matchups being player skill dependent. snake, ddd, rob, dk all serve as a counterbalance so marth doesn't dominate. plus, marth has the most similar playstyle to mk. this is the character i see the most mks flocking to, although not in droves.
ddd beats lots of characters, like gw, but has the disadvantaged matchups that gw lacks. falco and olimar are probably ddd's biggest buzz kills. ddd has a tough matchup with gw but it's only a slight disadvantage. more uncommon characters, like pikachu, also bother ddd. i don't think ddd would change much without mk...most players will still have a secondary for ddd if their main is really bothered by the chain grab.
snake is probably bothered the most by mk's absence, and loses his top spot to gw due to having more difficult matchups. falco, dk, and rob stand out. pikachu is again an option.
rob is fairly popular due to matching up well with snake, ddd, and marth. the biggest knock for rob is that gw is one of his toughest matchups. i think rob will be more common than he is now because gw is about as bad for rob as mk is, but gw will be easier to cp for and less common in tourneys. rob/snake or rob/marth players would be pretty effective, i'd think.
falco counters snake and ddd as well as anyone does, which is why he stays in top tier. gw is difficult though, falco players will need a secondary...probably marth or snake. tl for the lulz.
imo it revolves mainly around gw, and marth/snake as a result, due to having the best matchup with him. ddd, rob, and falco all hang around at an equal or nearly equal level due to having a good matchup against either marth or snake, as well as being the best of the rest. if toon link does well against a good portion of the rest of the top tier (i think ddd and maybe rob are the likeliest), then tlink could very well become a solid counterpick for players. the biggest boost would be if tlink did well against marth, but i think it's a 6:4 disadvantage. not bad though.
just theorycraft, feel free to add in and share your thoughts.
gw is really freaking good...but definitely not bannable good.
mk is really freaking amazing...and perhaps bannable good.
what i want to talk about is how the game would develop sans-MK. i really think it'd revolve around the current top tier with marth jumping a few spots, and perhaps wario joining them if wario-fever spreads outside of the west coast...
i think all of the characters would dominate at fairly equal levels, with gw being just half a head above the rest.
from my knowledge...
gw has some issues with marth, snake, and wario to a certain extent. really skilled toon links gives gw a headache. tlinks would go up in usage, but i don't think it'd be drastic since marth and snake do just as well. the reason why i place gw as head honcho is because he dominates more of the cast than any other character...that isn't mk. however, i don't think there would be an outcry for a ban here because marth and snake will be common in tourneys and can eliminate gw, so there is a counterbalance there...tlink would probably be most commonly used as a cp secondary if the opponent loses a match to gw.
marth becomes a solid character for high level players, due to most of his matchups being player skill dependent. snake, ddd, rob, dk all serve as a counterbalance so marth doesn't dominate. plus, marth has the most similar playstyle to mk. this is the character i see the most mks flocking to, although not in droves.
ddd beats lots of characters, like gw, but has the disadvantaged matchups that gw lacks. falco and olimar are probably ddd's biggest buzz kills. ddd has a tough matchup with gw but it's only a slight disadvantage. more uncommon characters, like pikachu, also bother ddd. i don't think ddd would change much without mk...most players will still have a secondary for ddd if their main is really bothered by the chain grab.
snake is probably bothered the most by mk's absence, and loses his top spot to gw due to having more difficult matchups. falco, dk, and rob stand out. pikachu is again an option.
rob is fairly popular due to matching up well with snake, ddd, and marth. the biggest knock for rob is that gw is one of his toughest matchups. i think rob will be more common than he is now because gw is about as bad for rob as mk is, but gw will be easier to cp for and less common in tourneys. rob/snake or rob/marth players would be pretty effective, i'd think.
falco counters snake and ddd as well as anyone does, which is why he stays in top tier. gw is difficult though, falco players will need a secondary...probably marth or snake. tl for the lulz.
imo it revolves mainly around gw, and marth/snake as a result, due to having the best matchup with him. ddd, rob, and falco all hang around at an equal or nearly equal level due to having a good matchup against either marth or snake, as well as being the best of the rest. if toon link does well against a good portion of the rest of the top tier (i think ddd and maybe rob are the likeliest), then tlink could very well become a solid counterpick for players. the biggest boost would be if tlink did well against marth, but i think it's a 6:4 disadvantage. not bad though.
just theorycraft, feel free to add in and share your thoughts.
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