I second this. Imo, Magearna is so goddamn broken it's not even funny anymore
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Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v2 [Update on Post #5186]
- Thread starter TPP
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I second this. Imo, Magearna is so goddamn broken it's not even funny anymore
Quelle surprise, the mon that had coverage issues now has coverage and is absolutely fucking borked.
gholdengo just got the perfect answer to it in the form of decidueye. even without that, it still struggles against:
basculegion
ceruledge
cien pao
cinderace
sometimes clodsire
garchomp
other gholdengo
glimora if it has earth power
great tusk
heatran
hoopa
hydreigon
iron moth
iron treads
kingambit
landorus
meowscarada
roaring moon
samorot
skelidirge
sometimes ting lu
torkoal
ursaluna
volcarona
walking wake
zoruark
and every single mon with ground coverage, which is every single mon
How the hell are you labeling us as incompetent in the same post as saying you understand and that you were way-off in your pre-home assessment? That is quite literally a contradiction between one sentence and the next. Like seriously do you people read your posts before complaining about thankless volunteers?
Any drop can be banned quickly enough to where it’s not like it’s actually a problem that it got a chance and Regieleki was never Uber before, so this at worst just sets precedence for the future with Regielki in Tera metagames rather than wasting weeks each generation like we had to with Genesect and Landorus-I.
Because this post was written in a moment of salt. Y'all ain't incompetent and I get you're doing your best.
Some random thoughts playing/watching games.
I think Sneasler is bad and not as good as people are making it out to be but it has a very RNG based move that creates some funny interactions at best, not very balanced interactions at worst. Unfortunately something will have to give in terms of tiering I suppose.
Tier is fun and playable despite the crying going on but very chaotic and not balanced for many reasons. As much as I dont want to see things like Mag (“Midgearna” -Goat Vert) I’m going to accept having to redo my builder for the inevitable bans coming.
Ctann I read all your posts in full despite you thinking otherwise. And my opinion is what matters to me first so
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Petition to stop the H-Arc propaganda. That mon is bad and these ranking lists putting it in the “good” sections are bad and should be reported.
Offensive tusk sets are borked af too. Hate that mon lol.
I think Sneasler is bad and not as good as people are making it out to be but it has a very RNG based move that creates some funny interactions at best, not very balanced interactions at worst. Unfortunately something will have to give in terms of tiering I suppose.
Tier is fun and playable despite the crying going on but very chaotic and not balanced for many reasons. As much as I dont want to see things like Mag (“Midgearna” -Goat Vert) I’m going to accept having to redo my builder for the inevitable bans coming.
Ctann I read all your posts in full despite you thinking otherwise. And my opinion is what matters to me first so
.Petition to stop the H-Arc propaganda. That mon is bad and these ranking lists putting it in the “good” sections are bad and should be reported.
Offensive tusk sets are borked af too. Hate that mon lol.
I thought it was over rated too, but it really does have a role no other Pokémon has now that lando T lost defog.
Earthquake
Rapid spin
Stealth Rock
Volt Switch/Knockoff
Is something no other Pokémon can do, hell the only other Pokémon that can do 3 of those 4 things is the other two wheelie boys. It’s real value in that
I found Treads very fun to use on Electric Terrain teams pre Home. Obviously this has changed a lot but offensive treads with steel stab and ET boosted Wild Charge is a really fun and useful mon to have in your pocket, considering how common tera fairy is. Even now I don't see its utility being bad, just maybe a bit outclassed at the moment, and I think once bans are put out and the meta settles it'll still be a really solid mon. That kind of role compression is really hard to match.
you just admited your shortcomings. that makes you better than 98% of everyone here.
I just wanna make a post to call Finch incompetent tbh.
On a real note tho, I think just like pretty much everyone has said, gear is a huge issue rn. This mon has been a problem forever and the addition of tera into its option set is just insane. I think I've only come across tera water and tera fairy so far, but accounting for its typing alongside its actual set might just be too much brain gymnastics for one mon.
Elecki on the other hand is undoubtedly A very strong mon but I don't think I've come away from any game thinking that this is ruining the game for me. its strong but it has answers, its incredibly frail and revenging it is fairly manageable. its most sinister set IMO is actually the screens set, bc it functionally is very similar to grimsnarl being able to get them up fast, and pivot out with volt. the only difference being that it can actually create some offensive pressure where as grim just sits there at the end of the bench mid/late game.
I might be in the minority but I think elecki can stay, at least for the time being. Gear and luna are more pressing issues imo
On a real note tho, I think just like pretty much everyone has said, gear is a huge issue rn. This mon has been a problem forever and the addition of tera into its option set is just insane. I think I've only come across tera water and tera fairy so far, but accounting for its typing alongside its actual set might just be too much brain gymnastics for one mon.
Elecki on the other hand is undoubtedly A very strong mon but I don't think I've come away from any game thinking that this is ruining the game for me. its strong but it has answers, its incredibly frail and revenging it is fairly manageable. its most sinister set IMO is actually the screens set, bc it functionally is very similar to grimsnarl being able to get them up fast, and pivot out with volt. the only difference being that it can actually create some offensive pressure where as grim just sits there at the end of the bench mid/late game.
I might be in the minority but I think elecki can stay, at least for the time being. Gear and luna are more pressing issues imo
I’ve been playing the metagame a decent bit recently and I’m currently around the 1600s and I’ve got a few thoughts!
https://pokepast.es/abdc830ceb4f8e11
I’ve been using this team recently and it’s given me a really interesting perspective on a lot of these Pokémon!
First, Enamorus-Therian
this mon is really underrated in the meta! The special attack and bulk are absolutely fantastic, the coverage and set up options are great, and the typing is really nice! Here’s how I’ve been using it:
Turt (Enamorus-Therian) @ Leftovers
Ability: Overcoat
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 72 Def / 148 SpA / 36 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Iron Defense
- Calm Mind
- Draining Kiss
- Tera Blast
Basically, I’ve modeled this set to kill a lot of Ursaluna variants. Once it gets an iron defense off, it can pretty effectively drain and set up calm mind while outspeeding the base speed variant by just a bit! The flying type means that it will never use headlong rush/eq while it’s out, which allows for a pretty solid read to tera ghost in order to be immune to facade and get set up for a sweep!
Other fun facts:
easily takes care of pao after just one ID
Takes care of eleki after a CM
2HKO’s Glowking after a CM with tera Ghost
Sets up pretty well on Zam-C with tera Ghost
That being said, set up isn’t the only thing it can do! With its really high special attacking stat and great coverage, bulky specs/other boosting item sets are totally viable!
what enables Enamorus so well, however, is Corviknight and Clodsire! These two mons, being holdovers as a core from pre-home, work really well- and I’m not seeing many people utilize them! I’m also using Urshifu-R, and with all 3 of these mons most checks to Enamorus are taken care of!
i know what you’re thinking though, why use Enamorus as the set-up sweeper instead of Magearna?
Well, due to the current impact of trick room and Ursaluna in the metagame, Mag’s Steel typing works against it- whether it be fire punch or eq or even tera normal facade, mag has a lot of trouble getting completely set up against this really common threat currently, which is why this tera ghost set on Enamorus uniquely works here.
There’s more I could talk about, but that’s all I really have for now! I know a lot of what I’m using is flawed but I’m having a blast watching the meta be re-shaped once again!
https://pokepast.es/abdc830ceb4f8e11
I’ve been using this team recently and it’s given me a really interesting perspective on a lot of these Pokémon!
First, Enamorus-Therian
this mon is really underrated in the meta! The special attack and bulk are absolutely fantastic, the coverage and set up options are great, and the typing is really nice! Here’s how I’ve been using it:
Turt (Enamorus-Therian) @ Leftovers
Ability: Overcoat
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 72 Def / 148 SpA / 36 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Iron Defense
- Calm Mind
- Draining Kiss
- Tera Blast
Basically, I’ve modeled this set to kill a lot of Ursaluna variants. Once it gets an iron defense off, it can pretty effectively drain and set up calm mind while outspeeding the base speed variant by just a bit! The flying type means that it will never use headlong rush/eq while it’s out, which allows for a pretty solid read to tera ghost in order to be immune to facade and get set up for a sweep!
Other fun facts:
easily takes care of pao after just one ID
Takes care of eleki after a CM
2HKO’s Glowking after a CM with tera Ghost
Sets up pretty well on Zam-C with tera Ghost
That being said, set up isn’t the only thing it can do! With its really high special attacking stat and great coverage, bulky specs/other boosting item sets are totally viable!
what enables Enamorus so well, however, is Corviknight and Clodsire! These two mons, being holdovers as a core from pre-home, work really well- and I’m not seeing many people utilize them! I’m also using Urshifu-R, and with all 3 of these mons most checks to Enamorus are taken care of!
i know what you’re thinking though, why use Enamorus as the set-up sweeper instead of Magearna?
Well, due to the current impact of trick room and Ursaluna in the metagame, Mag’s Steel typing works against it- whether it be fire punch or eq or even tera normal facade, mag has a lot of trouble getting completely set up against this really common threat currently, which is why this tera ghost set on Enamorus uniquely works here.
There’s more I could talk about, but that’s all I really have for now! I know a lot of what I’m using is flawed but I’m having a blast watching the meta be re-shaped once again!
ursaluna isnt even close to banworthy.
Once Eleki is banned, he's next:
Electrode-Hisui @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Aftermath
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Energy Ball
- Tera Blast
- Volt Switch
Electrode-Hisui @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Aftermath
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Energy Ball
- Tera Blast
- Volt Switch
I like that Urshifu-RS set. Drain Punch seems like it could be a legit option now since Urshifu's typing is pretty good vs Chien-Pao / Samurott-H & the additional recovery will help it stave off those threats better over a longer battle. Maybe Thunder Punch is a worthwhile option too, does a lot to Pex (which you can run with Tera Electric to potentially OHKO after an SD boost.
As a big Sneasler defender, this thing is literally only on anyone's radar for potential Suspect or Ban is because of Dire Claw. Remember Triple Axel Weavile? Now you're dealing with a mon that trades Ice's Coverage for that power on two STABs that are harder to resist in its OU, abilites that actually... do something for it, and much less reliance on contact hits for Physical damage.
The thing is, Sneasler is a glass cannon if I ever saw one, with its weaknesses being EVERYWHERE on OU's bigwigs right now and requiring incredibly careful positioning in order to put its potentially large amount of work in. It needs team Support to put things in range, get on the field safely, and time its Unburden activation right if that is the set you elected for. Theoretically, a high-risk/high-reward mon that'll fare better once we get rid of the Tera-Eleki meta that our Hubris has yielded.
Dire Claw meanwhile just says that 65% of the time you make progress with Poison Point, 33% of the time that progress is on-the-spot crippling, and 17% of the time it'll just win you the match-up. You know the reason GF never lets something fast have Spore (and why Smeargle is a terrible thing to be legal in VGC don't @ me)? Well you're witnessing it in miniature right here. I am aware that this move is inevitably not getting suspected because it's a Signature without distribution to test (now I know how the LR people on the Facebook posts feel), but let's be real, how is a move that amounts to a Taunt-free Status Slot Machine ever going to be fair on anything besides the most absolutely knee-capped Pokemon ever? I'm talking "Base 38 Speed with Flinch Signature move" knee-capped (which I'm not sure is even achievable with these statuses by comparison).
The thing is, Sneasler is a glass cannon if I ever saw one, with its weaknesses being EVERYWHERE on OU's bigwigs right now and requiring incredibly careful positioning in order to put its potentially large amount of work in. It needs team Support to put things in range, get on the field safely, and time its Unburden activation right if that is the set you elected for. Theoretically, a high-risk/high-reward mon that'll fare better once we get rid of the Tera-Eleki meta that our Hubris has yielded.
Dire Claw meanwhile just says that 65% of the time you make progress with Poison Point, 33% of the time that progress is on-the-spot crippling, and 17% of the time it'll just win you the match-up. You know the reason GF never lets something fast have Spore (and why Smeargle is a terrible thing to be legal in VGC don't @ me)? Well you're witnessing it in miniature right here. I am aware that this move is inevitably not getting suspected because it's a Signature without distribution to test (now I know how the LR people on the Facebook posts feel), but let's be real, how is a move that amounts to a Taunt-free Status Slot Machine ever going to be fair on anything besides the most absolutely knee-capped Pokemon ever? I'm talking "Base 38 Speed with Flinch Signature move" knee-capped (which I'm not sure is even achievable with these statuses by comparison).
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I have Clodsire for Pex, I do really like Thunder Punch Tera Electric but I think Ice Punch works a lot better just because of how common Clod is right now! I guess it’s kind of a give and take because it disallows it to hit Pelipper which is really common right now, but I guess it really just depends on what you want to be hitting it the metagame rn!
dire claw isnt even 20% of my argument.
ive been having a lot of luck with air balloon sneasler on a screens team. sure its easy to pop but that just gives you free unburden
At least its not Glaceon this time...
I've found that tera ground Magnezone is a surprisingly decent partner for Regieleki. It stops Iron Treads from pivoting out with volt switch, and also does decent against non-tera Heatran and Magearna, who can annoy boots Regieleki. Also usable against Kingambit, although sucker punch is a bitch for supreme overlord boosted ones. Not amazing, but certainly not bad.
Of course, this is all redundant with the imminent quickban of Regieleki. Just thought it was a fun lil niche for it in this crazy meta.
Of course, this is all redundant with the imminent quickban of Regieleki. Just thought it was a fun lil niche for it in this crazy meta.
If I'm being honest about Sneasler, it feels very similar to old Hawlucha, depending on what you're running its either completely overwhelming, or completely pathetic. Back then it was Slowbro who could walk into Hawlucha and just slap it across the face, killing it instantly, but in Hawlucha's case its typing at least provided an immunity to ground. With Lando, Tusk, and Ursa all running rampant you can't afford to be weak to ground and this frail. Priority from things like Dragonite and the assortment of Aqua Jetters cripple Sneasler at best.
252 Atk Adaptability Basculegion Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Sneasler: 120-142 (39.8 - 47.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Barraskewda Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Sneasler: 157-186 (52.1 - 61.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (Not even in Rain)
252 Atk Choice Band Urshifu-Rapid-Strike Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Sneasler: 148-175 (49.1 - 58.1%) -- 97.7% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Tera Normal Dragonite Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Sneasler: 222-262 (73.7 - 87%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
This ones the biggest one to me. Losing 87% from a +0 Dnite is bad. In a hazard heavy meta, this means you only require rocks and 1 spike layer to be in OHKO range. At least it doesn't have to worry about Kingambit's Sucker Punch, but then you can start running GhostGambit to sit on Sneasler while dealing HUGE damage in return with Iron Head.
I think after all the bans are done Sneasler is gonna be a solid A rank mon for sure, but it doesn't feel banworthy to me rn.
252 Atk Adaptability Basculegion Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Sneasler: 120-142 (39.8 - 47.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Barraskewda Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Sneasler: 157-186 (52.1 - 61.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (Not even in Rain)
252 Atk Choice Band Urshifu-Rapid-Strike Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Sneasler: 148-175 (49.1 - 58.1%) -- 97.7% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Tera Normal Dragonite Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Sneasler: 222-262 (73.7 - 87%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
This ones the biggest one to me. Losing 87% from a +0 Dnite is bad. In a hazard heavy meta, this means you only require rocks and 1 spike layer to be in OHKO range. At least it doesn't have to worry about Kingambit's Sucker Punch, but then you can start running GhostGambit to sit on Sneasler while dealing HUGE damage in return with Iron Head.
I think after all the bans are done Sneasler is gonna be a solid A rank mon for sure, but it doesn't feel banworthy to me rn.
Not going to lie, I think people on this thread have to be respectful to the council, they work their assess of in terms of being transparent and always updating us on what's on the table for the OU meta. I feel using ill words directed at the council is inappropriate and I don't think I should say this but watch what you say before you post it, shouldn't be that difficult to read something and see "oh shit this might be taken the wrong way". I feel like the OU mods are pretty forgiving for a lot of inappropriate posts on this thread as well as the original discussion thread but you shouldn't push your luck to be honest.
side note: did tococot discover the reaction button?
Also I think the mons that would be in the emergency quick ban pool right now (and this is an assumption based on conversation and just playing): Magearna, Regieleki, and Ursaluna.
side note: did tococot discover the reaction button?
Also I think the mons that would be in the emergency quick ban pool right now (and this is an assumption based on conversation and just playing): Magearna, Regieleki, and Ursaluna.
Kinda surprised it was regi.
Screens megarna lives to terrorize the meta another day
Screens megarna lives to terrorize the meta another day
Gotta go fast.
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