God I was oblivious that day, thank you for reminding me with your beautiful meme
(Edited Dragapult into my post)
Has anyone else been noticing a slow rise in weird "hybrid" teams of HO and Stall that have double cores?
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
-
Congrats to the winners of the 2023 Smog Awards!
Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion
- Thread starter TPP
- Start date
- Status
(Edited Dragapult into my post)
Has anyone else been noticing a slow rise in weird "hybrid" teams of HO and Stall that have double cores?
That's called balance
I don't mean balance teams specifically (ask Finch about my Gen 8 Lunatone obsession as a balance team option), I mean like specifically double cores that almost have no synergy
me vs freezai: https://play.pokemonshowdown.com/battle-gen9ou-1759874802
Hey, aren't tier shifts happening today? It's on the first of every month, right? Or am I wrong?
alephgalactus
Banned deucer.
Oh yeah, does RU exist now? Is that how it works? UU’s already gone through the traditional hazing ritual of “OU-viable mon drops month 1 before being discovered”.
Thank you for everything you do Marty! Excited for the drop!
Before that happens, any predictions on drops & rises?
Espathra's obviously rising.
Pawmot might rise, but I haven't seen it around much
Hat might too
Other than that Tauros, Scream Tail & Hydreigon/Jugulus have a chance at rising
Maushold will absolutely drop
Charizard is also going down
I think Orthworm also drops
Other than that, I think Lokix, Tyranitar and Pex also have a chance at dropping.
Espathra's obviously rising.
Pawmot might rise, but I haven't seen it around much
Hat might too
Other than that Tauros, Scream Tail & Hydreigon/Jugulus have a chance at rising
Maushold will absolutely drop
Charizard is also going down
I think Orthworm also drops
Other than that, I think Lokix, Tyranitar and Pex also have a chance at dropping.
Personally I think the 2 guaranteed rises from UU ---> OU will definitely be Espathra and Hattrene, since both hold strong places within the OU metagame but were unfortunately not entirely discovered before the first shift. I could also see Azumarill and Pawmot rising for the same reason (though I'm not as sold on either). All 4 of theseare key members of the UU tier, so seeing them go is kind of sad (aside from Espa, nobody likes the dumb ostrich).
I think the only free drops from OU ---> UU will be Charizard, Orthworm and Tyranitar, with Pex being almost guaranteed to drop aswell but I'm still not 100% sold on it dropping yet. Maushold and Lokix are the ideal Poketuber mons so I could see low ladder spamming the ever loving daylight out of them despite both being extremely subpar in OU.
alephgalactus
Banned deucer.
- Dachsbun might rise
because it’s dough. In all seriousness, enough people are desperate enough for Chi-Yu answers that Dachsbun, one of the only things that sorta-kinda answers the damn fish, may see some time in OU. - In the same vein, Azumarill might rise for its astounding ability to almost check Chi-Yu sometimes, which is more impressive than it sounds.
- Pelipper and Floatzel stand a chance of rising as people start discovering that rain teams exist.
- Hatterene’s a guaranteed rise. Magic Bounce is invaluable in a meta ruled by hazards.
- Rotom-Wash barely missed the cutoff last month and I’d be shocked if it doesn’t get back into OU.
- Cinderace is going down because I don’t think there was even mathematically a way to get it past the usage threshold within 2 days. UU quickban will follow within hours.
- Ditto is likely dropping. I don’t even know how it stayed OU for this long when Shed Tail exists; all the setup sweepers it wants to copy spend most of their lives behind a Substitute now.
- I haven’t really heard much about Ceruledge, so maybe that will drop.
So, here's what my thoughts are:
Guaranteed Drops
Maushold
Charizard
Orthworm
Cinderace (I mean, on a technicality)
Probable Drops
Toxapex
Tyranitar
Ditto
Maybe?
Iron Moth
Lokix
Ceruledge
----------------------
Guaranteed Rises
Hatterene (Cinderace dropping may give this a bit of a shorter lifespan since hazard stack is less valuable now)
Espathra
Probable Rises
Azumarill
Pelipper / Floatzel
Maybe?
Dachsbun
Arboliva
Paldean Tauros (Mainly Fire, maybe Water)
Hydreigon
Iron Jugulis
I'll add more stuff when others discuss other 'mons that could make it on here.
POST-DROP EDIT:
Jesus, how the heck did Baxcalibur drop to UU?
Guaranteed Drops
Maushold
Charizard
Orthworm
Cinderace (I mean, on a technicality)
Probable Drops
Toxapex
Tyranitar
Ditto
Maybe?
Iron Moth
Lokix
Ceruledge
----------------------
Guaranteed Rises
Hatterene (Cinderace dropping may give this a bit of a shorter lifespan since hazard stack is less valuable now)
Espathra
Probable Rises
Azumarill
Pelipper / Floatzel
Maybe?
Dachsbun
Arboliva
Paldean Tauros (Mainly Fire, maybe Water)
Hydreigon
Iron Jugulis
I'll add more stuff when others discuss other 'mons that could make it on here.
POST-DROP EDIT:
Jesus, how the heck did Baxcalibur drop to UU?
Last edited:
Iron Valiant @ Booster Energy
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast
- Aura Sphere
- Thunderbolt / Energy Ball / Shadow Ball
Simply pass into this thing with Shed Tail Cyclizar, use Calm Mind, and sweep. This Pokemon is so unbelievably stupid; I love it. STAB Moonblast and Aura Sphere are what you'll be clicking most of the time. The last slot is really dependent on your team's individual needs; personally, I prefer Thunderbolt, but Energy Ball and Tera-boosted Shadow Ball have their uses (Ghost Tera is my preferred Tera type on Iron Valiant at the current moment, but I haven't really felt the need to Terastylize Iron Valiant compared to other Pokemon).
Another thing I might see dropping is amoongus. initially it had the ability to resist Palafin, which was invaluable, but right now the meta obliterates it. The only thing it does decently is spread spore and counter tusk, and is generally outclassed by breloom.
Like... What does this counter? Dodonzo? Kinda Garg & Tusk?
Its a free switch once sleep clause is activated for Chi yu, ceruledge, ape, corv, bax, chien pao, clod, pult, chomp the list goes on.
It has the worst possible matchup against tier king gholdengo too.
Like... What does this counter? Dodonzo? Kinda Garg & Tusk?
Its a free switch once sleep clause is activated for Chi yu, ceruledge, ape, corv, bax, chien pao, clod, pult, chomp the list goes on.
It has the worst possible matchup against tier king gholdengo too.
Amoongus is still a very valuable check and pivot and it isnt dropping any time soon, its one of the main defensive options in balance teams.
While it's debatable if it is as useful as it was during the earlier days, Amoonguss still has nice defensive value. Spore of course is amazing on its own, Can help pivot around variants of Great Tusk, Dragonite, Iron Valiant (lacking psychic coverage), can help with dealing with Dondozo and Garganacl, not too bothered by RotomWash and is itself great against many Breloom variants (though I've caught a few of those running aerial ace which 2HKOs Amoonguss with rocks). Useful against stuff like Azumarill too.
Also Ceruledge is pretty mid (not horrible but mid) so I don't think it is relevant to mention here.
Fair enough. I was just listing pokemon currently in OU when I mentioned ceruledge.
Overall, I think it has a decent role in OU, but I don't think it should be OU proper until Chi-Yu is gone. Inviting that thing in for free is not good.
Usage stats are out lads. Some of them are freakin wild. Baxcalibur dropped to UU, and that's not the craziest thing on that list.
Also, technically, Cinderace is now in RU lol.
Also, technically, Cinderace is now in RU lol.
Bax and Ace aren't lasting long, but unsurprising mostly. Bax really struggles to break unaware cores, especially with tera fairy as common as it is. Also without ice shard it gets rolled by every other dragon
Cinderace is not in RU. If you check out Marty's post, Cinderace was not considered for a drop due to having a single day of data. Hilariously, within that single day, it still managed to get ~3% usage for the whole month lmao
After a DD Bax outruns all other dragons. The unaware core is a bit more fair though CB sets break through these if they lack fairy dondozo. Bax also is a great check to RotomW which is a very nice trait to have. It's a good pokemon and considering other good mons like Iron Handa almost dropped and Ceruledge having more use than both prior mentioned mons... OU ladder is wack.
alephgalactus
Banned deucer.
What the actual shit, how did Espathra not rise? I genuinely feel like there was a data error of some kind.
Also, a part of me is really hoping Tier Shift gets approved again before Blissey, Slowbro, and Weavile rise out of RU.
Ngl, in my time on the ladder (around 300+ games over the last 2 weeks) I haven't actually seen thaaaat many Espathra. I think it has fallen off now that people have learned how to respond to it. In all those games played I've maybe been swept by it like once, and even then it was probably just cause I was playing like a dum dum.
Oh yeah, I agree it should be OU. It's just a bit hard to wield when it gets countered by a fair few key pokemon. When I was talking about getting owned by other dragons I was referring to situations where it didn't have opportunities to get off a dragon dance.
- Status