SV UU Metagame Discussion

[Lily]

Today, we got our batch of Pokemon HOME drops, which led to an absolutely enormous amount of shifts! In terms of what rose to OU, we have:

Sandy Shocks moved from UU to OU

Womp womp.

Anyway, here's the real fun:

Hydreigon moved from OU to UUBL
Arcanine-Hisui moved from OU to UU
Articuno-Galar moved from OU to UU
Azelf moved from OU to UU
Basculegion moved from OU to UU
Basculegion-F moved from OU to UU
Braviary-Hisui moved from OU to UU
Breloom moved from OU to UU
Ceruledge moved from OU to UU
Cresselia moved from OU to UU
Decidueye-Hisui moved from OU to UU
Diancie moved from OU to UU
Electrode-Hisui moved from OU to UU
Enamorus-Therian moved from OU to UU
Glastrier moved from OU to UU
Goodra-Hisui moved from OU to UU
Kleavor moved from OU to UU
Lilligant-Hisui moved from OU to UU
Meloetta moved from OU to UU
Meowscarada moved from OU to UU
Mew moved from OU to UU
Moltres moved from OU to UU
Moltres-Galar moved from OU to UU
Muk-Alola moved from OU to UU
Overqwil moved from OU to UU
Regidrago moved from OU to UU
Rillaboom moved from OU to UU
Skeledirge moved from OU to UU
Slowbro-Galar moved from OU to UU
Slowking moved from OU to UU
Thundurus moved from OU to UU
Thundurus-Therian moved from OU to UU
Torkoal moved from OU to UU
Tornadus-Therian moved from OU to UU
Typhlosion-Hisui moved from OU to UU
Uxie moved from OU to UU
Zapdos-Galar moved from OU to UU
Zarude moved from OU to RU

So yea that's a lot of mons. Tell us what you're thinking! We'll also be unbanning Hydreigon, Iron Hands and Iron Leaves - tagging Kris so that this doesn't go unmissed when shifts are implemented. Thank you!!

 

[Monky25]

Hello everyone. While we are all excited for the tier changes from Pokémon Home, the UU forum moderation team has an extremely important announcement to make. We’re all excited, so we’re going to be a bit more lax in our posting rules for a while, so feel free to drop your memes and one-liners. However, in such confusing times, strong feelings arise in regards to the metagame, which may sometimes create intense dialogue that is not acceptable. In the OU metagame thread, numerous instances of hateful and rude attacks on the OU council and moderation team arose, which is something that is not tolerated at all across forums for every community. Even though this has not happened yet, the UU forum moderation team is establishing a zero-tolerance policy of attacks of any kind towards the council and moderators who are taking up a volunteer role in navigating such a strange time. Disagreements arise but from what has happened so far in other threads, some players will go too far into blatant insults and attacks that just create a bad time for everyone. This post is a clear warning to any poster to remain respectful and courteous to other posters as well as moderators and council members who are doing their best to guide the tier into a better state in such difficult times. THIS POST IS YOUR WARNING. VIOLATION OF THE RULES ESTABLISHED FROM THE POST RESULTS IN AN IMMEDIATE INFRACTION AT THE DISCRETION OF THE UU MODERATION TEAM.

 

[G-Luke]

Where's my Iron Treads?

 

[Estarossa]

Skeledirge back in UU is such bulky stonks cant lie, gonna be such a nice defensive glue and i'm all here for it. Glowbro back should be heat too and losing Scald should hopefully make counterplay feel a bit less annoying while its still gonna be a fantastic option.

Looking forward to seeing how good Torn-T ends up being here, losing Knock Off and Defog has downsides but in a lower power level vacuum Tornadus may have found itself fairly often wanting to leverage coverage or Nasty Plot anyway to make more immediate progress with less answers and we're not devoid of options to Knock its checks anyway. Taunt + 2 attacks u-turn / 3 attacks, Nasty Plot 3 attacks, and Nasty Plot U-turn 2 attacks all seem nice in theory, and a fast regen glue is always attractive.

 

[Cruzer108]

Frankly For UU this is horrifying, we joke about UU looking like Las gens OU But it seems Like UU is Turning Into this Gens OU With the constant Drops and Rises Its truly an experience and I'm eating popcorn in the corner Enjoying it

 

[MrE]

Rip Sandy Shocks UU, you were my fav mon down here.

Yay Garchomp surviving
Boo Treads surviving.

Going to be a few days until I can play but looking forwards to all the new toys. Torn-T, Muk, Loom, Meow, Dirge and Arcanine all look really good down here imo

 

[Lily]

for anyone who likes their drops summarised in meme format:

 

[HydreigonTheChild]

Rillaboom @ Choice Band
Ability: Grassy Surge
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Tera Type: Grass
Adamant Nature
- Wood Hammer
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- U-turn

HMMMM

252+ Atk Choice Band Rillaboom Wood Hammer vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Skeledirge in Grassy Terrain: 204-240 (49.6 - 58.3%) -- 68% chance to 2HKO after Grassy Terrain recovery

252+ Atk Choice Band Rillaboom Wood Hammer vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Scizor in Grassy Terrain: 102-120 (35.2 - 41.5%) -- 77% chance to 3HKO after Grassy Terrain recovery

-1 252+ Atk Choice Band Rillaboom Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Salamence: 135-159 (40.7 - 48%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

This mon is very interesting esp with things such as mence hating to take a knock off. Also another mon for chesnaught to eat alive! but yeah... between wood hammer and knock it can really go ham on the meta (so can meowscarada)

 

[Sylvi]

I don't care for every other Mon but Tornados Therian in UU is a victim and it deserves more voice

 

[BolTingBlazie]

Skeledirge back in UU is such bulky stonks cant lie, gonna be such a nice defensive glue and i'm all here for it. Glowbro back should be heat too and losing Scald should hopefully make counterplay feel a bit less annoying while its still gonna be a fantastic option.

Looking forward to seeing how good Torn-T ends up being here, losing Knock Off and Defog has downsides but in a lower power level vacuum Tornadus may have found itself fairly often wanting to leverage coverage or Nasty Plot anyway to make more immediate progress with less answers and we're not devoid of options to Knock its checks anyway. Taunt + 2 attacks u-turn / 3 attacks, Nasty Plot 3 attacks, and Nasty Plot U-turn 2 attacks all seem nice in theory, and a fast regen glue is always attractive.

Torn-t won't be here long most likely so use it while its here, whether it gets banned or OU takes it. Despite the nerfs I can verify its definitely good in OU, albeit a bit underexplored and underrated at the moment.

Also goltres is gonna slaughter uu, please council please get rid of it, we all know what double dance goltres is gonna do considering its even better than it was last gen. (Predicting goltres gets quickbanned for being dumb.)

 

[Slip]

I got about 10 minutes to kill SO

This is a very exciting time for me. I wasn't the biggest fan of the pre home meta, so I'm excited at how shaken up this tier will become. I have been playing a lot of 1v1 in the meantime, so I would like to go over the mons I'm excited to try out and see how well the mons carry over.

: always wanted to see this guy down here. Having an offensive spore user sounds extremely nice, and looking at the drops idt it will be OP right away or anything. Banded will be fun, SD will be fun. I'm sure it'll find a good place for now.

: We didn't get pelipper with it, but I have seen what this thing can do and it is very exciting. Even with scarf it can hit very hard, though phantom force is a lot less viable in the 6v6 metagame. Substitute sets will be very strong I think, but overall a good add imo.

: We have had Cresselia a lot before, but with the option of tera, I think it will really be able to strive more. Calm mind sets are extremely scary while also having lunar dance + trick room for the slow mons like glastrier and torkoal is very exciting for the archetype.

: though slow, enamorus is a great fairy edition to the tier. This thing can hit hard or can set up with ID, CM, Draining Kiss due to the amount of bulk it has. I'm interested to see if the encore meta sticks around, and if it doesn't I'm sure enamorus can find a path to be useful in more ways than 1.

: This thing gonna be busted LOOOOL. Victory dance + hustle even while running something like wide lens hits like a truck and its not very close. It has great natural coverage making it a lot less reliant on tera than its sister, so I have very high hopes for this thing.

: Meloetta hits hard and just does not die in a 1v1 sphere. 6v6 it can probably get worn down a lot more, but I think this will be an excellent revenge killer that can put a lot of pressure onto the opposing team.

: Hits hard enough and has great coverage to stop certain mons in their tracks. Going to be a nice staple to make sure certain sweeps don't happen or get good momentum imo. Probably scarf or band over the suicide leads we have seen in OU.

: Another broken ass mon. This mon does not die and kills everything. Tera gives it coverage it needs and with certain beserk sets, you can probably drop nasty plot for the coverage. I feel like its a matter of time till it gets banned but we will see.

: Overqwil is cool man. no auto rain unfortunately, but having a nice type, ability to poison enemies, and access to intimidate on top of being able to hit fairly hard makes me think it will be a nice edition. It will probably end up RU sooner or later, but I think it will constantly have viability.

: I like hard hitting fighting types, thats about it really. Excited to see what I can kill with this thing.

Busy today, but will get to play the meta tomorrow. These are all speculations so don't take anything too seriously. I will report back on this post when I get to play and test them all.

PS: shoutout the mod team and the UU council. thanks for always putting in the effort

 

[Bice]

Lifeismyth are you proud of yourself for making shocks rise

Anyway, here's my first impressions from the few games I've played:

Ban This Shit Immediately
- This thing is morbidly obese and super hard to kill, especially once it gets going. Fairy+Ground coverage is effectively unresisted (unless you're Heattom (lol)), and it can stay healthy with Draining Kiss. Only things that can really hurt it are also broken as shit, such as...
- Pretty much everyone knew that upon dropping this thing was gonna be crunk. Flare Blitz with zero drawbacks hurts under the sun, and Head Smash has even more nuking power at the cost of accuracy. It retains ESpeed from its Kantonian counterpart, letting it pluck off weakened targets and patching up its meh speed.
- I haven't experimented much with Hustle sets, instead opting for a Chlorophyll set to be used under the sun, but either way H-Lilligant hits fast and hard. As Slip mentioned above, Wide Lens + Hustle hits super hard even without Victory Dance, and it gets Sleep Powder as well. It's basically Iron Leaves that trades stats for a slightly better typing and the ability to put things to sleep.
- A nightmare from the SS UU days has returned with a vengeance, this time with actual coverage thanks to Tera. I'd imagine Double Dance sets are gonna be super powerful on Hyper Offense and it has pretty good bulk to boot.
- Haven't experimented much with it but seems busted, unresisted STABS + sig move with a 20% chance to paralyze = ouch owie.

Sus But Probably Not QB Worthy
- While Torkoal enables a lot of dangerous sweepers, on its own it kinda sucks. Unlike Pelipper, who had good longevity, a great typing, and reliable recovery, Torkoal is very easy to wear down and is forced to either get chunked by rocks or hamper its sun-setting capabilities. Drought might be banworthy, especially if Ninetales comes back with DLC, though it's tough to say ATM.
- Who thought Stone Axe was okay? This guy hits hard, has decent utility, and a good typing, though it's not the bulkiest and 85 speed sucks. Still, I'd imagine it'll be pretty good on offense.
- Surprise surprise, one of the biggest fat annoyances in OU is doing the exact same things it was doing before, just in UU. Its bulk and longevity puts it on my radar, though it might be an essential glue mon for the tier.
- Espathra... 2! In all seriousness, I'd imagine that it has the capability to be a pain with Stored Power sets, but having to manually set up + having less initial offensive presence than its brothers stings. I'm also mandating that everyone nickname their G-Articunos "playboi garti"
- I know people are kinda panicking with this guy in the tier, but losing valuable utility moves like Knock Off and Defog really hurts it and makes it a lot more manageable. I think it'll be a nice offensive AV pivot.

 

[BolTingBlazie]

Lifeismyth are you proud of yourself for making shocks rise

Anyway, here's my first impressions from the few games I've played:

Ban This Shit Immediately
- This thing is morbidly obese and super hard to kill, especially once it gets going. Fairy+Ground coverage is effectively unresisted (unless you're Heattom (lol)), and it can stay healthy with Draining Kiss. Only things that can really hurt it are also broken as shit, such as...
- Pretty much everyone knew that upon dropping this thing was gonna be crunk. Flare Blitz with zero drawbacks hurts under the sun, and Head Smash has even more nuking power at the cost of accuracy. It retains ESpeed from its Kantonian counterpart, letting it pluck off weakened targets and patching up its meh speed.
- I haven't experimented much with Hustle sets, instead opting for a Chlorophyll set to be used under the sun, but either way H-Lilligant hits fast and hard. As Slip mentioned above, Wide Lens + Hustle hits super hard even without Victory Dance, and it gets Sleep Powder as well. It's basically Iron Leaves that trades stats for a slightly better typing and the ability to put things to sleep.
- A nightmare from the SS UU days has returned with a vengeance, this time with actual coverage thanks to Tera. Losing Roost sucks, but I'd imagine Double Dance sets are gonna be super powerful on Hyper Offense and it has pretty good bulk to boot.
- Haven't experimented much with it but seems busted, unresisted STABS + sig move with a 20% chance to paralyze = ouch owie.

Sus But Probably Not QB Worthy
- While Torkoal enables a lot of dangerous sweepers, on its own it kinda sucks. Unlike Pelipper, who had good longevity, a great typing, and reliable recovery, Torkoal is very easy to wear down and is forced to either get chunked by rocks or hamper its sun-setting capabilities. Drought might be banworthy, especially if Ninetales comes back with DLC, though it's tough to say ATM.
- Who thought Stone Axe was okay? This guy hits hard, has decent utility, and a good typing, though it's not the bulkiest and 85 speed sucks. Still, I'd imagine it'll be pretty good on offense.
- Surprise surprise, one of the biggest fat annoyances in OU is doing the exact same things it was doing before, just in UU. Its bulk and longevity puts it on my radar, though it might be an essential glue mon for the tier.
- Espathra... 2! In all seriousness, I'd imagine that it has the capability to be a pain with Stored Power sets, but having to manually set up + having less initial offensive presence than its brothers stings.
- I know people are kinda panicking with this guy in the tier, but losing valuable utility moves like Knock Off and Defog really hurts it and makes it a lot more manageable. I think it'll be a nice offensive AV pivot.

To be honest even if torn-t does stay I expect it to go to OU at some point, so either way its the least of our worries.

Goltres needs to go day one though, no one wants the absolute goltres hell that was a few months of SS UU. (Also goltres never had roost)

 

[Vengeance417]

Can't wait to try a rendition of mono-claw down here in UU

- A nightmare from the SS UU days has returned with a vengeance, this time with actual coverage thanks to Tera. Losing Roost sucks, but I'd imagine Double Dance sets are gonna be super powerful on Hyper Offense and it has pretty good bulk to boot.

Pretty sure Moltres-G never had Roost to begin with.

 

[spidget]

Lifeismyth are you proud of yourself for making shocks rise

Honestly I am. Sorry UUers he was too good for you guys. Next time you get him maybe you'll appreciate him more

 

[Bice]

Can't wait to try a rendition of mono-claw down here in UU


Pretty sure Moltres-G never had Roost to begin with.

sure why not
went with espeon over grimmsnarl to give the team some semblance of hazard control. tera steel on ceruledge slightly helps with hisui arcanine. super half assed :skull:

 

[Melt Gibson]

alright, long post incoming, i'm gonna talk about a LOT of mons and give my mostly unfiltered thoughts on them, here we go

Okay, so all three of these are probably not healthy lol. Zapdos-G and Moltres-G have a track record, and not a whole lot has really changed? G-Molt's bulk is gonna be super obnoxious when it's suddenly a Fairy or a Water or some other stupid shit, and G-Zap suddenly has access to a whole new level of power while still doing all of the same shit it did last gen. G-Arti could end up being fine? Mostly depends on how difficult thrift shop Espathra shenanigans end up being and what counterplay we have available. I think it could end up not being a huge deal but I'm not convinced yet.

Losing Knock and Defog suuuuuucks :( Still really fast and has U-Turn and Regenerator though, so not bad by any means? I'm just not quite sure what this thing provides outside of being a raw statcheck, it gets no extra STABs like the other birds and doesn't have any sort of insane utility or coverage option to make up for it (Bleakwind sux lol). I think NP sets have a shot at making a mark, and Regenerator is probably going to be Really Fucking Annoying in combination with the newly returned Slowking, but man the state this mon is in is really sad.

NO. These fuckers are gonna be very very unfun to deal with, especially now that Sandy is gone and gives them 0 competition. Therian hits the same Speed threshold, has a better movepool (including Grass Knot!), and has an absolutely fucking nuclear SpAtk of 145. Still blocks Volt too thanks to Volt Absorb and can consistently deal with fat Grounds and Tyranitar in a way that Sandy couldn't. Incarnate is faster, still hits very hard, and has the lovely addition of Prankster bullshit. Prankster TWave, Nasty Plot, Substitute, etc etc. Do not wanna see them stick around in any capacity, at least for now.

This on the other hand is going to be very cool, kinda a sidegrade from Talonflame (No Defog and slower but actual bulk and power). Definitely see this becoming a staple as time passes like it did the last two gens, also functions as a Scizor check which is very very swag. Not a lot to say that hasn't been showcased by like seven years of performance in the tier.

I know sleestacks is jumping for joy right now. Going to be very good as a slow pivot with Regenerator (Regen cores are about to be absolutely fucking bonkers), as well as a nice special wall to deal with the plethora of shit that's going to be getting hurled around on the ladder early on this month. Very happy to see this one come back.

I don't fucking trust it for a minute, I'm not gonna say anything yet because it is Literally Day One but the MOMENT I see this motherfucker acting up with some Torch Song Tera Fairy Unaware bullshit I am going to scream from the mountains and the valleys for a ban or suspect. Do NOT take your eyes off of this bastard for a second.

You ready for Tera Poison Cress? No? Too bad! I'd like to personally have a chat with whoever decided to give this thing a move that restores 25% HP and cures status. Was it a joke? Because it's not funny! Genuine serious talk though, Cosmic Power Stored Power Lunar Blessing sets are gonna be really cheesy and everything else that this thing can do is probably still really annoying, Lunar Dance is still an option, standard CM fare is still an option, and the coverage is surprisingly well suited to the meta right now. Not looking forward to dealing with this.

Offensive Mew is still alive and well with its fifty billion setup moves, DD and IDP seem the most promising at first but I'm sure Stored Power shenanigans or some form of Double Dance could end up taking off, hazard lead doesn't seem terrible either. Loss of genuine, real utility Mew is sad, but also kind of a blessing in disguise because if this thing still got recovery moves it'd be UUBL in an instant.

Darmanitan 2, if you've ever seen me talk about this thing you know exactly how I feel about it (it's going to be good). Free rocks alongside actual good and reliable Rock and Bug STABs is amazing, plus you have plenty of options to fill in the flex slot. Good enough speed to run Scarf sets, although Boots is also very tempting since that 25% from rocks is really unfortunate. Weakness to Bullet Punch is also gonna be rough, but I have faith.

I've done some theorycrafting with this and I feel like Scarf sets have potential, it's got decent bulk alongside a very annoying typing to manage and U-Turn. Nothing to utilize Serene Grace, take that as you will, but this looks overall very solid. Maybe not enough to stay UU by usage, but definitely enough to have a niche. That's also what a lot of people said about Decidueye, and look at him now!

Turbo dookie. The worst possible typing to have in UU right now, bar none. They're slow and have barely any redeeming qualities to show for it. I've seen some people hype Hisui Decidueye as a Defog user that matches up well into setters, but I'm really not convinced.

However, this is something I can get behind. Physical Quiver Dance is very very cool, as well as perfect coverage with dual STABs + Ice Spinner. Having to choose Hustle's unreliability or not having an ability does kinda suck (unless you wanna run it with Torkoal, which like, might work tbh). Still, it's head and shoulders above the other two IMO.

more soon i have shit to do and teams to build, love y'all

 

[albabimam04]

Lifeismyth are you proud of yourself for making shocks rise

Anyway, here's my first impressions from the few games I've played:

Ban This Shit Immediately
- This thing is morbidly obese and super hard to kill, especially once it gets going. Fairy+Ground coverage is effectively unresisted (unless you're Heattom (lol)), and it can stay healthy with Draining Kiss. Only things that can really hurt it are also broken as shit, such as...

Is it just me or do I feel like enamorus-T is being hella overhyped? Sure it's strong but it's not that fat, it's bulk is comparable to Togekiss and it lacks reliable recovery. Set up sets get fairly dumpstered by Tinkaton after very little chip and it's too slow to make choiced sets work. Maybe I can see it being broken later but for now it's too easily threatened by a lot of things

 

[sleestacks]

I know sleestacks is jumping for joy right now.

Literally what I did when I woke up and checked my phone this morning

 

[SturdyShedinja]

Semi-informed first impressions:

BL drops

- Does hydreigon things. Has a solid defensive profile while still being threatening with choice or setup sets. Offensively checking the new ghosts and psychics is valuable, but meh speed holds it back
- AV checks some ridiculous things and setup variants seem super dangerous. The increased offensive power creep should hold it back but the lack of new grounds seems good for it.
- Has some valuable defensive traits for an offensive pokemon, but the typing really holds it back. SD booster energy sets should put in work though.

Drops from OU

- 252 Atk Choice Band Arcanine-Hisui Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Gastrodon: 229-270 (53.7 - 63.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery. Seems scary on paper, but it needs some prediction and is limited by its rock weakness. Grass Tera could be an ok 4th to be truly unwallable since you don’t really need more than three moves anyway, or you can just run STAB tera and click funny buttons
- I’m not entirely sure why you’d use this over other psychics. CM and future sight pivot sets could be decent enough, but it seems outclassed. At least Tera gives it actual coverage.
- Psychic fire coverage is good and nasty plot sets seem dangerous. Losing knock off hurts pivot sets but they could still be decent.
- Female seems better to have actual ghost stab imo. Either way, choice sets hit like a truck but aren’t anything too interesting
- SFLO hits like a truck if you predict right and tinted lens hurricanes hit hard for how spammable they are. Roost is nice to offset the rocks weakness, but defog doesn’t seem worth the moveslot.
-Loaded dice sets seem solid, but it has pretty steep competition for offensive grasses. Subseed seems like a bad gimmick, but I could be wrong.
- SD and band sets seem decent with fire ghost and fighting coverage. It might have a hard time setting up, but once it gets going it seems super hard to stop.
- Tera is nice for it, but it doesn’t seem that great. It’s a decent trick room setter, but outside of glastrier there aren’t many good abusers.
- Utility pivot sets could be decent. Band also seems pretty scary. Triple arrows is a stupidly good move
- Even though Tera helps it, it still has zero longevity. Probably not worth it.
- Tera ice seems funny, but it definitely lacks power if it’s not hitting super effectively.
- CM/ID/D Kiss/Filler seems super strong, and it has the bulk to check half the tier. Lack of recovery hurts, but it’s worth fitting a wish passer for something this absurd.
- Tera is nice for it, but it still seems to slow. Maybe Tera ground or fighting can work with the right support?
- It’s excellent coverage makes it unwallable on paper, but it still has to get a lot of turns right and gets worn down quickly. Steel typing gives it some nice resistances, but the common weaknesses don’t help and it’s too slow to force most things out.
- Stone axe is not enough to make this worth using imo
- 80% of the time it kills things 100% of the time. Hustle is a dumb ability, and after a boost, STABS + ice spinner seem unwallable. Sleep powder and healing wish could be interesting options
- It’s outclassed
- knockturn and spikes are great progress makers and flower trick is a great move. T Spikes and banded sets could be funny but are less consistent
- Can run any ho set under the sun, but no recover makes utility sets borderline unviable. Psychic is also a mediocre offensive type and base 100 offenses aren’t that impressive
- RIP Smogon bird. Flame body is nice to punish all of the new pivots and it’s STAB combo is nice. No defog is a bit disappointing though.
- Double dance sets seem as nutty as always and Tera gives it a ton of setup opportunities. Only time will tell if it’s broken or not.
- AV sets seem decent and poison touch knock off is very funny. No pursuit definitely hurts tho.
- Trades knock off for both spikes over muk. It seems decent, but it’s stats aren’t fantastic
- DD sets seem funny but not great
- Losing glide hurts, but it still has knockturn. CB sets should be solid, but SD is probably too slow.
- It’s a bit Tera reliant, but unaware is a great ability and torch song is a fantastic move.
- QCQD can outskill everything if it wants to. AV seems decent too especially with less knock off distribution.
- Futureport should be fantastic and it seems super splashable on more offensive teams. CM sets are probably outclassed by slowbro, but the surprise factor could make it worth running.
- NP sets seem absurdly strong and even without knock, pivot sets should be good. Tera flying seems great for it too.
- Unless you really need the volt immunity or hate stall, just run incarnate form.
- Sun doesn’t seem that great without shocks imo. It could maybe be ok on trick room
- Losing knock and defog hurts, but it still has plenty of longevity with regen and hits hard until hurricane misses. NP sets seem dangerous too.
- It seems pretty mediocre. Infernal parade is good but it’s nothing spectacular
- It’s probably not worth using outside of a secondary trick room setter
- CB sets are extremely strong and can wear down its checks with u-turn. Future sight and hazard support makes it even more absurd

Other drops

- Bulk up sets seem ok, and pivot sets always seem to find a way. I’m not sold on it yet, but this wouldn’t be the first time zarude was underrated at the start of a meta.
:raichu-alola- I think e terrain teams might have some potential. Leaves, jugulis, and hands are already great pokemon with just booster energy, and while raichu isn’t anything crazy without rising voltage, it still hits hard enough at +2 and can clean teams well enough. It’ll be interesting to see whether or not the quark drive abusers justify using pinchurchin, but there might be something there.
Other mons that I don’t have much to say about but could have a niche:

There’s a good chance I missed something, but I’m looking forward to seeing how this meta shapes up!

 

[memedose46]

Nah who let cresselia in

 

[Liz Angeles]

Think people are overhyping this, its stabs just aren't that spammable in the tier and it can't really fit tera blast, I can see it being really annoying with stuff to lure tyranitar and maybe zone to trap tink but nowhere near qb worthy.

Dirge dropping makes nasty plot far less threatening, I feel like hurri/bleakwind + taunt + u turn just makes infinite progress though.

I think it's great that we got a lot of new grass types, they have a really great defensive profile in the tier and open up the builder a lot. I can see breloom and meowscarada being a bit much to deal with long term though.

I'm not really convinced this is broken. Easily revenged and weak to rocks. Tera rock head smash is really hard to switch into but I just don't buy it.

This seems mid tbh, uu is pretty well equipped for its cheese.

Worth noting this mon lost any semblance of coverage, probably still a bit much.

I like using this mon a lot, losing knock sucks but it has great coverage and u turn, should be great.

I think male bascu kinda sucks, female is completely insane.

The damage output on this mon is crazy even if it has some drawbacks. 0 Atk Life Orb Braviary-Hisui Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 302-359 (88.5 - 105.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock don't sleep on this

This is just better armarouge I'm pretty sure, counterplay is way more minimal.

Psychic type with weather based healing in a tier with tyranitar, I don't buy it.

has some nice resistances and is good at keeping rocks up, should be a solid mon.

You can't really block volt from this thing so it's a good thing it's so weak.

This probably has a lot of good sets but nowhere near broken imo.

iron press rest is probably kinda dumb, the defense buff over regular goodra is massive. I think other sets could also have a place in the tier, just an all around good mon.

gets rocks and dies.

idk how you're meant to deal with this tbh, probably the most obvious quickban to me.

Really customisable mon, np sets are largely outclassed by azelf so I'd expect more dd or cheese sets. Taunt spikes or something could be ok.

I think this is much better than talonflame although it does require different teammates. Should be a great mon.

checks some annoying special attackers and spreads poison and knock off, just a cool mon that's pretty honest.

This is a great addition to the tier if it sticks around, really checks a lot of annoying stuff and provides a threat of it's own.

Another great defensive option we've gained, although I'm really not looking forward to qcqd spam.

Does the same stuff it's always done this gen, pretty comfortably the best defensive pivot in the tier and I'm glad to see it back.

I honestly don't know which of these scare me more. I think thund t still has a great speed tier for uu and the extra damage output is obviously great but thund i's speed tier is frankly ridiculous for how threatening it is.

Sun just seems really gimmicky tbh.

I can see this being decent at some point but it won't be good early, it's a cool mon but how are you using this over dirge in early chaos.

Cunoat. I'm convinced this mon is really good lol, freeze dry hurricane is really nice coverage and its typing isn't that bad post boots being invented.

I think this should be pretty good, specs or scarf both seem interesting, it's strong af if nothing else.

 

[Tree69420]

WHY DO WE STILL NOT HAVE TREADS

 

[Yoshikitty64]

it's a gen 9 starter reunion here

 

[BolTingBlazie]

Think people are overhyping this, its stabs just aren't that spammable in the tier and it can't really fit tera blast, I can see it being really annoying with stuff to lure tyranitar and maybe zone to trap tink but nowhere near qb worthy.

Dirge dropping makes nasty plot far less threatening, I feel like hurri/bleakwind + taunt + u turn just makes infinite progress though.

I think it's great that we got a lot of new grass types, they have a really great defensive profile in the tier and open up the builder a lot. I can see breloom and meowscarada being a bit much to deal with long term though.

I'm not really convinced this is broken. Easily revenged and weak to rocks. Tera rock head smash is really hard to switch into but I just don't buy it.

This seems mid tbh, uu is pretty well equipped for its cheese.

Worth noting this mon lost any semblance of coverage, probably still a bit much.

I like using this mon a lot, losing knock sucks but it has great coverage and u turn, should be great.

I think male bascu kinda sucks, female is completely insane.

The damage output on this mon is crazy even if it has some drawbacks. 0 Atk Life Orb Braviary-Hisui Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 302-359 (88.5 - 105.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock don't sleep on this

This is just better armarouge I'm pretty sure, counterplay is way more minimal.

Psychic type with weather based healing in a tier with tyranitar, I don't buy it.

has some nice resistances and is good at keeping rocks up, should be a solid mon.

You can't really block volt from this thing so it's a good thing it's so weak.

This probably has a lot of good sets but nowhere near broken imo.

iron press rest is probably kinda dumb, the defense buff over regular goodra is massive. I think other sets could also have a place in the tier, just an all around good mon.

gets rocks and dies.

idk how you're meant to deal with this tbh, probably the most obvious quickban to me.

Really customisable mon, np sets are largely outclassed by azelf so I'd expect more dd or cheese sets. Taunt spikes or something could be ok.

I think this is much better than talonflame although it does require different teammates. Should be a great mon.

checks some annoying special attackers and spreads poison and knock off, just a cool mon that's pretty honest.

This is a great addition to the tier if it sticks around, really checks a lot of annoying stuff and provides a threat of it's own.

Another great defensive option we've gained, although I'm really not looking forward to qcqd spam.

Does the same stuff it's always done this gen, pretty comfortably the best defensive pivot in the tier and I'm glad to see it back.

I honestly don't know which of these scare me more. I think thund t still has a great speed tier for uu and the extra damage output is obviously great but thund i's speed tier is frankly ridiculous for how threatening it is.

Sun just seems really gimmicky tbh.

I can see this being decent at some point but it won't be good early, it's a cool mon but how are you using this over dirge in early chaos.

Cunoat. I'm convinced this mon is really good lol, freeze dry hurricane is really nice coverage and its typing isn't that bad post boots being invented.

I think this should be pretty good, specs or scarf both seem interesting, it's strong af if nothing else.

Goltres is not being overhyped, its even more ridiculous than last gen mainly due to tera. Not only can it use tera to further bolster its already ridculous double dance sets by using it to trigger weakness policy, but it can also use it to boost its stab or break through things it should not be able to like tyranitar. Being obnoxiously bulky is just the icing on the broken cake here