Pokémon Talonflame

[lydian]

Talonflame

Types -

Base Stats - 78 HP / 81 Atk / 71 Def / 74 SpA / 69 SpD / 126 Spe
Abilities - Flame Body; Gale Wings

Moveset:

Level Up

— Flame Charge
— Flare Blitz
— Feint
— Peck
— Growl
— Quick Attack
— Ember
15 Fail
22 Acrobatics
29 Agility
38 Aerial Ace
47 Tailwind
56 Steel Wing
65 Roost
74 Fly
83 Brave Bird

Technical Machine

TM06 Fly
TM08 Hyper Beam
TM09 Giga Impact
TM11 Solar Beam
TM13 Fire Spin
TM21 Rest
TM23 Thief
TM24 Snore
TM25 Protect
TM30 Steel Wing
TM31 Attract
TM34 Sunny Day
TM38 Will-O-Wisp
TM39 Facade
TM40 Swift
TM56 U-turn
TM76 Round
TM78 Acrobatics

Technical Record

TR00 Swords Dance
TR02 Flamethrower
TR12 Agility
TR15 Fire Blast
TR20 Substitute
TR26 Endure
TR27 Sleep Talk
TR36 Heat Wave
TR37 Taunt
TR43 Overheat
TR48 Bulk Up
TR55 Flare Blitz
TR66 Brave Bird
TR85 Work Up
TR89 Hurricane

Egg Move

— Flame Charge
— Quick Guard
—Defog

Move Tutor

— Dual Wingbeat

Transfer Only

— Tackle
— Toxic
— Double Team
— Swagger
— Confide
— Hone Claws
— Incinerate

Newly Obtainable Moves: Hurricane, Brave Bird
Notable Moves: Brave Bird, Flare Blitz, Roost, Swords Dance, Dual Wingbeat, Bulk Up, Will-O-Wisp, Taunt, Hurricane, Fire Blast, U-turn, Toxic

Everyone's favorite Smogon bird returns, with Gale Wings, still nerfed, but with a new toy in Heavy-Duty Boots, so brush aside it's awful 4x weakness to Stealth Rock. While at a first glance Heavy-Duty Boots may seem like it doesn't solve Talonflame's problem, after all, using Brave Bird once already breaks your Gale Wing, and the newly added Dual Wingbeat is a tad too weak to be much useful, Talonflame still carves itself a niche, being able to tackle the frightening Volcarona as well as Liberace with ease, and threatening other faster threats like Alakazam and Starmie, should it get the chance to come in. It's very good at forcing out switch-ins, as well, so it can very easily Roost as a supposed check comes out, getting back its priority on Flying-type moves. Its coverage is also surprisingly effective, only really missing out on Rotom-Heat, Rhyperior, and the rare Tyranitar. If you do manage to keep it at full, it also can be a terrific asset against more offensive teams, saving you from a potential Hawlucha or Azumarill sweep.

That being said, Talonflame still has its shortcomings, taking a Knock Off could be game-changing, and its base 81 Attack still leaves quite a bit to be desired. But this Pokémon will very likely carve a niche for itself in the OU tier.

Talonflame @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- Roost
- Swords Dance

This will be the main Talonflame set, maximum Speed helps with Talonflame ties, while getting the jump on threats like Liberace, Alakazam, and Starmie, without having to rely on Gale Wings. Flare Blitz makes for a very good combo with Brave Bird, and leaves very little resisting both. Swords Dance helps increase its attack to get past physical walls that can't do much back, such as Hippowdon and Toxapex lacking Toxic. Last but not least, Roost helps regain HP against Pokémon that can't deal much back, such as Corviknight, Assault Vest Magearna, Volcarona, Defensive Clefable, and a handful others. While also being useful to regain Gale Wings on forced switches.

Honorable Mentions

Talonflame @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 48 HP / 252 Atk / 208 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Dual Wingbeat
- Roost
- Swords Dance

Talonflame @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 252 HP / 204 SpD / 52 Spe
Careful Nature
- Dual Wingbeat
- Will-O-Wisp / Taunt
- Bulk Up
- Roost

Talonflame @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 92 HP / 252 SpA / 164 Spe
Modest Nature
- Hurricane
- Fire Blast
- Roost
- Will-O-Wisp / U-turn

Talonflame @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Gale Wings / Flame Body
EVs: 252 HP / 48 SpD / 208 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dual Wingbeat
- Defog
- Roost
- Will-O-Wisp / Toxic

Dual Wingbeat variants could be an option, but the lack of power compared to Brave Bird leaves it unable to do much damage. Bulkier sets with perhaps Will-O-Wisp, Taunt, or Bulk Up, could be considered, but given these have even less immediate power compared to offensive sets make them very easy to capitalize on, and force out. Last but not least, Hurricane sets could be considered, perhaps in a Rain team, but the unreliability and the lack of a boosting move really hurts. Defensive / Utility with Defog could be useful, acting as a Liberace and Volcarona check that also excels at removing hazards. I haven't tried out any of these yet, so I encourage you, if you have tried them out, to share your sets here!

 

[Colonel M]

No Defog HDB set? Hate lyd.

Think Defensive / Utility Smogon Bird is a cool niche to have. Priority Flying move for Volcarona too.

 

[lydian]

No Defog HDB set? Hate lyd.

Think Defensive / Utility Smogon Bird is a cool niche to have. Priority Flying move for Volcarona too.

oh yeah didnt think about that, will add that one to the honorable mentions list oo

 

[SketchUp]

Talonflame won't be a metagame defining mon because of the Gale Wings nerf last gen, but I still think the bulky set definitely has a niche on teams that rely on residual damage + Taunt to break opposing balance. It has an amazing matchup against balanced staples such as Clef, Corviknight, Hippowdon, and Ferro and its defensive typing helps out in offensive matchups (Magearna, Volcarona, Excadrill, Jirachi etc.). It won't reach the same heights as ORAS SpD Talonflame because of the aforementioned Gale Wings nerf, the burn nerf (which was huge in the bulky water matchup) and the current popularity of Rotom-H (an even tougher matchup than Rotom-W and Heatran). Defog might be worth a try considering the great 1v1 matchup against most hazard setters (Seismitoad being the most notable exception but that's already dropping in popularity). I doubt combinations like Wisp + Bulk Up are worth it in the current metagame.

Talonflame @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 252 HP / 196 SpD / 60 Spe
Careful Nature
- Dual Wingbeat
- Will-O-Wisp / Defog / Toxic
- Taunt
- Roost

Speed for Jolly Excadrill

 

[UHX]

I think a defensive taunt + Wisp set has some merit as a great anti-lead and it has the ability to disrupt mons like wish Clef and Chansey.

Talonflame @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 132 HP / 8 Atk / 84 Def / 84 SpD / 200 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Taunt / Defog
- Roost
- Will-O-Wisp
- Brave Bird / Defog / U-turn / Dual Wingbeat

 

[Nauris]

Hurricane sets have access to boosting move in Work Up, so I would rather say that it lack access to a viable boosting move instead of just saying that it lacks access to boosting moves.

Hurricane sets main points for using it over Brave Bird or Dual Wingbeat is the ability to have fairly powerful Flying type move that doesn't damage the Talonflame, while dealing with Urshifu and Tangrowth slightly better compared to the physical variants, albeit at cost of being worse at checking Volcarona.

 

[Mocha]

One thing that sucks about Hurricane on Talonflame, aside from its meh base Special Attack, is that if you're relying on rain, you'll deal less damage with any fire move you considered running. I guess it won't matter in the long scheme of things when you're firing off priority Hurricane, but just something to remember.

Also:

"maximum Speed helps with Talonflame ties, while getting the jump on threats like Liberace, Alakazam, and Starmie, without having to rely on Gale Wings"

Particularly the part about not relying on Gale Wings, why would Talonflame not want to use Brave Bird instead of Flare Blitz on those Pokemon you mentioned anyway? Aside from situational switching scenarios when you want to heal or use a utility move. The reason I ask is why not opt for Adamant over Jolly? What speed ties would he would have to worry about outside of Gale Wings priority?

 

[DrPumpkinz]

"maximum Speed helps with Talonflame ties, while getting the jump on threats like Liberace, Alakazam, and Starmie, without having to rely on Gale Wings"

Particularly the part about not relying on Gale Wings, why would Talonflame not want to use Brave Bird instead of Flare Blitz on those Pokemon you mentioned anyway? Aside from situational switching scenarios when you want to heal or use a utility move. The reason I ask is why not opt for Adamant over Jolly? What speed ties would he would have to worry about outside of Gale Wings priority?

As the thing you quoted specifies, it's to outrun those things without having to rely on Gale Wings. As in, if your Talonflame isn't at 100% HP and thus doesn't have access to Gale Wings priority, it can still outrun those threats.

 

[Mocha]

As the thing you quoted specifies, it's to outrun those things without having to rely on Gale Wings. As in, if your Talonflame isn't at 100% HP and thus doesn't have access to Gale Wings priority, it can still outrun those threats.

I get that. But the OP mentioned Liberace, Alakazam, and Starmie as examples of speed threats, with the only other offensive move listed atm as Flare Blitz. My point being that why would you want to Flare Blitz those Pokemon anyway? Roost and Brave Bird will have priority, so the only useful thing I'm seeing here is being able to Swords Dance in their face, without relying on Gale Wings. Or other situational moments. So I'm trying to weigh down how useful the speed threats would be that you could trade with more power by going Adamant. Just trying to understand.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

I get that. But the OP mentioned Liberace, Alakazam, and Starmie as examples of speed threats, with the only other offensive move listed atm as Flare Blitz. My point being that why would you want to Flare Blitz those Pokemon anyway? Roost and Brave Bird will have priority, so the only useful thing I'm seeing here is being able to Swords Dance in their face, without relying on Gale Wings. Or other situational moments. So I'm trying to weigh down how useful the speed threats would be that you could trade with more power by going Adamant. Just trying to understand.

You wouldn't want to Flare Blitz them. You'd want to hit them with Brave Bird before they can U-turn out or destroy you with Psychic or Hydro Pump. Gale Wings gives you priority on your Flying moves if and only if Talonflame is at 100% HP. If Talonflame takes even a single point of damage (and may I remind you that its strongest STABs, Brave Bird and Flare Blitz, will deal recoil damage when used) it will no longer be able to hit things with priority (and similarly, it would never have priority on Roost, as if it's trying to heal itself, it means it has taken damage and thus Gale Wings is inactive). An adamant Talonflame would need to be played extremely cautiously, as any damage will mean it can't revenge kill a Nasty Plot Alakazam. A jolly Talonflame doesn't need to be at full health to revenge kill.

 

[Mocha]

You wouldn't want to Flare Blitz them. You'd want to hit them with Brave Bird before they can U-turn out or destroy you with Psychic or Hydro Pump. Gale Wings gives you priority on your Flying moves if and only if Talonflame is at 100% HP. If Talonflame takes even a single point of damage (and may I remind you that its strongest STABs, Brave Bird and Flare Blitz, will deal recoil damage when used) it will no longer be able to hit things with priority (and similarly, it would never have priority on Roost, as if it's trying to heal itself, it means it has taken damage and thus Gale Wings is inactive). An adamant Talonflame would need to be played extremely cautiously, as any damage will mean it can't revenge kill a Nasty Plot Alakazam. A jolly Talonflame doesn't need to be at full health to revenge kill.

I haven't seen how the extent of Gale Wings got nerfed, since I've been pretty inactive for 7th gen and assumed it was just a damage nerf. This makes more sense now, thank you for explaining.