Tentacruel

[Kindrindra]

The point is that there's no reason to use Black Sludge when Leftovers exists since there's a chance that Black Sludge will end up hurting something on your team. It's not going to happen often, but giving your opponent that option just isn't practical at all.

If someone tricks your Black Sludge away from you, they'll pretty much have to use Trick again. Yes, you're giving the opponent the option to trick it onto another of your team members but, before that, you'll be hurting your opponent. The benefits and defects balance each other out.

Oh, and if you're using Item Clause, the benefits FAR outweigh the defects.

 

[PokéMontage]

Do you guys seriously think that the topic of Black Sludge hasn't been brought up before? It's existed for quite some time now. There are reasons why you rarely ever see it used.

 

[alphatron]

So why are people using rain dish as their ability when they aren't running a rain team? I'm certain that the popularity of rain makes this seem like a neat option, but every time I get away with nasty plot celebi or virizion using boosted gigs drains for free against non rain team users, I have to wonder.

So I think I'm using tentacruel wrong. And by using him wrong, I keep getting the feeling that he isn't to be used on any team that isn't a rain team or a stall team. If your team needs a rapid spinner, you don't really benefit by just tossing a tentacruel on it, especially with scarf landorus and rotom-w running everywhere. He isn't tremendously bulky (if drapion could learn rapid spin...) and only seems capable of safely rapid spinning vs. slower Pokemon who set up Sr such as burned ferrothorn and forretress. Against offensive teams, I've found him to be a bit of a hindrance.

 

[tehy]

And that is why i stopped using tentacruel. He's supposed to wall bulky waters and spin on them, but what with scald, he no longer can do that as easily. he's also supposed to set up t-spikes, but i can never find time to do that like i did in 4th gen.

 

[v]

every time I get away with nasty plot celebi or virizion using boosted gigs drains for free against non rain team users, I have to wonder.

If you hit a Tentacruel on a non-Rain team with a boosted Giga Drain, it seems to me like you're taking an awfully big risk. They're bluffing because nothing says "Tentacruel's Liquid Ooze!" when it comes in. Unless you have nothing better to hit it with, why risk losing any hitpoints at all? It is similar to running Expert Belt on something to bluff a choice item. They are attempting to get an advantage when they can while still discouraging their opponents from trying to use draining moves on Tentacruel.

 

[Princess Bubblegum]

Yeah with the popularity of drizzle teams, especially rain stall teams which Tentacruel faces against, rain dish can not be ignored on a stall team. I used liquid ooze for the longest time and it literally saved me once, in the super extra late game.

But I have not come to simply bump on that, oh no. I am here to persuade my fellow sand stallers to use rest on Tentacruel. I like to bring up the point that tehy made:

And that is why i stopped using tentacruel. He's supposed to wall bulky waters and spin on them, but what with scald, he no longer can do that as easily

Outside of Jellicent of course, this is no longer a problem with rest. Look at Tentacruel's movepool, scald / rapid spin / toxic spikes / ice beam, it is filler, complete and utter filler. I often found Tentacruel dieing to stacked up damage + entry hazards or status, it often rarely set up or spun. Wish rarely helped to alleviate this either. One day I was just like "fuck this shit" and tossed rest on Tentacruel, never looked back. With a little cleric support, (which with Blissey is on every sand stall team) Tentacruel can stay around forever, and it needs not worry about burns because it can just sleep it away. I do realize that this means the opponent must let me do this, but against stall teams, it is going to happen, and against offensive teams, my last worry is Tentacruel slowly dieing to entry hazards. The point of a surprise ice beam on dragon types is mute, considering it’s a stall team, you should be able to deal with Dragonite, and I also have scald which burns them.

I’m also doubting the effectiveness of the current standard physically bulky spread, sure it's great against infernape, but I often wished I had more special bulk when facing heatran which is much more common. I’m currently running calm - 252 HP / 168 Def / 76 SDef / 12 Spd to take earth powers easily, which is good, but I am thinking about dumping it all into special defense, to deal with more offensive ones that run stealth rocks for some reason.

 

[aurora]

...but I am thinking about dumping it all into special defense, to deal with more offensive ones that run stealth rocks for some reason.

Don't dump EVERYTHING into special defense; you'd want at least some HP and speed (as well as Special Attack even) to make Tenta work properly.

 

[Princess Bubblegum]

Playing around with the evs, I think only 96 defense evs are needed to prevent a 2HKO with rocks from Infernape's close combat, so Im probably going to play around with that.

If your really considered about Infernape, 252 HP / 184 Def / 60 SDef / 12 Spd prevents a 2HKO with stone edge with rocks.

 

[tehy]

Yeah with the popularity of drizzle teams, especially rain stall teams which Tentacruel faces against, rain dish can not be ignored on a stall team. I used liquid ooze for the longest time and it literally saved me once, in the super extra late game.

But I have not come to simply bump on that, oh no. I am here to persuade my fellow sand stallers to use rest on Tentacruel. I like to bring up the point that tehy made:



Outside of Jellicent of course, this is no longer a problem with rest. Look at Tentacruel's movepool, scald / rapid spin / toxic spikes / ice beam, it is filler, complete and utter filler. I often found Tentacruel dieing to stacked up damage + entry hazards or status, it often rarely set up or spun. Wish rarely helped to alleviate this either. One day I was just like "fuck this shit" and tossed rest on Tentacruel, never looked back. With a little cleric support, (which with Blissey is on every sand stall team) Tentacruel can stay around forever, and it needs not worry about burns because it can just sleep it away. I do realize that this means the opponent must let me do this, but against stall teams, it is going to happen, and against offensive teams, my last worry is Tentacruel slowly dieing to entry hazards. The point of a surprise ice beam on dragon types is mute, considering it’s a stall team, you should be able to deal with Dragonite, and I also have scald which burns them.

I’m also doubting the effectiveness of the current standard physically bulky spread, sure it's great against infernape, but I often wished I had more special bulk when facing heatran which is much more common. I’m currently running calm - 252 HP / 168 Def / 76 SDef / 12 Spd to take earth powers easily, which is good, but I am thinking about dumping it all into special defense, to deal with more offensive ones that run stealth rocks for some reason.

Here's the thing-unless you have sleep talk as well-at which point you either have no attacks, no t-spikes, or no rapid spin-then i can just bring in anything that forces out tentacruel and not really care. That's the problem with rest-it just puts death off.

 

[lmitchell0012]

Playing around with the evs, I think only 96 defense evs are needed to prevent a 2HKO with rocks from Infernape's close combat, so Im probably going to play around with that.

If your really considered about Infernape, 252 HP / 184 Def / 60 SDef / 12 Spd prevents a 2HKO with stone edge with rocks.

What about thunderpunch (which I think is currently illegal with iron fist)?? Is that capable of a 2HKO??

 

[DDRMaster]

What about thunderpunch (which I think is currently illegal with iron fist)?? Is that capable of a 2HKO??

252 Atk Life Orb Infernape ThunderPunch vs 252 HP/252 Def Tentacruel: 47.8% - 56.04%

The only way to completely prevent the 2HKO while SR is up is if you have Rain up and use Protect after you come in. Otherwise, Blaze Infernape has a chance to 2HKO you and Iron Fist Infernape (assuming Iron Fist+Thunder Punch is ever legal) will almost always 2HKO Tentacruel, even with that Protect trick.