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The Abortion Thread (use this!)

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Even if you assume that organized religion is NOT essentially an extension of the State (which it is), I'd have to assume that well, the State is the most infectious, devastating and vile plague heh.

States are (arguably) necessary evils, but evils nonetheless.

ls said:
You really hate sex, but sex needn't have to lead to babies, even if it leads to pregnancy. You didn't even bother to make an argument, you just spewed venom about sex and "be a man" bullshit.
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Well, apparently you think that there is nothing morally wrong with killing post-term babies (I'm making a moral argument so if you're a nihilist don't even respond).

I don't hate sex - I hate the fact that people think they have the right to have sex without accepting the fact that a baby might result from it, and thinking they have the right to kill that baby to avoid the responsibility of parenthood.

And a fetus is not "potential" life, it's life.
 
Ancien Régime said:
Well, apparently you think that there is nothing morally wrong with killing post-term babies (I'm making a moral argument so if you're a nihilist don't even respond).

I don't hate sex - I hate the fact that people think they have the right to have sex without accepting the fact that a baby might result from it, and thinking they have the right to kill that baby to avoid the responsibility of parenthood.

And a fetus is not "potential" life, it's life.
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If you'd like to actually make a moral argument against anything I said I'll be happy to engage you, but so far you're saying nothing in the way of arguments, so it's incredibly hard to say anything to you.
 
Ancien Régime said:
And a fetus is not "potential" life, it's life.
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Then put down that germ-killing soup, you soulless fuckbag.

For one, "potential life" is so broad. Every individual sperm is potential for life, if I were to store it and donate in large quantities to a sperm-bank. A cluster of 100-or-so cells isn't "life", and "potentiality" for it is no argument that it has more rights than the mother.

And stop referring to it as baby-killing for Christ's sake. To terminate the existence of cells that have yet to germinate isn't fucking going in there with a knife and stabbing a live baby.
 
any woman who would rather have an abortion than go through with the pregnancy, is obviously not the type of person or not in the time of their lives to be the kind of mother a child needs.
 
Ambitions said:
Just because a woman fucks up her life ( I'm leaving the rape factor out of this one ) doesn't mean her child should be fucked over.
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what a ridiculous talking point. yes a child born to an ill-prepared, perhaps impoverished, mother who doesnt want them is not fucking over the child at all.
 
Your assuming the worst just so you can see if from your point of view. I'm used to seeing rich ass spoiled sluts get knocked up and then sticking an Oric XL up there pussy to suck it out.
 
Ambitions said:
Your assuming the worst just so you can see if from your point of view. I'm used to seeing rich ass spoiled sluts get knocked up and then sticking an Oric XL up there pussy to suck it out.
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Abortion isn't immoral regardless of the class of the one who aborts.
 
Okay that could be the dumbest thing I have ever read while on Smogon except for some one saying "vegetarians are only live longer because they eat healthy".

Abortion is completely immoral. It takes something that is about to be life and fucking eliminates it.
 
I don't think of an undeveloped fetus as a human being, and I think that the human life starts to mean something when they first experience some form of consciousness.
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My whole effing point in the whole topic of abortion.I should idolatrize you.

I don't have much else to say, but I really dislike arguing with soft-hearted people that get all cute and fuzzy when they think of babies(or fetuses, for that matter.)
 
Ambitions said:
Okay that could be the dumbest thing I have ever read while on Smogon except for some one saying "vegetarians are only live longer because they eat healthy".

Abortion is completely immoral. It takes something that is about to be life and fucking eliminates it.
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"About to be life" isn't a valid category with rights against elimination, you'll have to be a lot more specific.
 
We have like 5 abortion threads every year on smogon. Nobody is going to change anybody's view on abortion. That is a fact. Why is it even discussed? It only leads to mindless arguments. There is no middle ground. There is no trying to prove somebody right or wrong. These threads should be banned.
 
Dude its a freaking human get it. What you think just because its leeching off its mother its any less of a life for its any less of a living thing. It eats shits needs oxygen its alive. And killing it isn't fucking moral. Period there is no debate. The debate is weather it should be legal or not.


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Justin8649 said:
We have like 5 abortion threads every year on smogon. Nobody is going to change anybody's view on abortion. That is a fact. Why is it even discussed? It only leads to mindless arguments. There is no middle ground. There is no trying to prove somebody right or wrong. These threads should be banned.
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And smogon has new members every day and this is there chance to voice there opinion.
 
Ambitions said:
Dude its a freaking human get it. What you think just because its leeching off its mother its any less of a life for its any less of a living thing. It eats shits needs oxygen its alive. And killing it isn't fucking moral. Period there is no debate. The debate is weather it should be legal or not.
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Yeah guys. Everyone should shut the fuck up and listen to him cement his opinion with much, much profanity. Then you fucking accept it as fact like the pro-choice piece of shit that you all are. Jesus, don't you get it?
 
Justin8649 said:
We have like 5 abortion threads every year on smogon. Nobody is going to change anybody's view on abortion. That is a fact. Why is it even discussed? It only leads to mindless arguments. There is no middle ground. There is no trying to prove somebody right or wrong. These threads should be banned.
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None of those are preconditions for threads, nor should they be. Besides, people posting in them demonstrates the demand.
 
Dude its a freaking human get it. What you think just because its leeching off its mother its any less of a life for its any less of a living thing. It eats shits needs oxygen its alive. And killing it isn't fucking moral. Period there is no debate. The debate is weather it should be legal or not.
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There is a long list of other "living beings" that do the same time, yet we eat it.I hope you are vegetarian.

Oh wait, they are also living being that IN FACT eat "shit"(not really, minerals and such" and need oxygen.

Now, do you find something they all have in relation?Fetuses, animals, and plants?They don't have consciousness.

For me, an human NEEDS to have consciousness.
 
Ancien Régime said:
You do not have an inalienable right to fuck.
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I can't find any reason to think such a thing as an 'inalienable' right exists in human society. There are rights that shouldn't ever be violated, but no rights that can't be violated with sufficient force. Your denial of the 'inalienable' right to fuck is based solely on the belief that a fetus has sufficient self awareness to desire its own existence. I do not believe that, hence I support the right of any woman to have an abortion. CFickle already did a suitable job explaining why this position is logical. Because there is no moral reason to oppose the termination of a pregnancy, inconvenience is as good a reason as any. I am also not convinced that the rhetoric of anti-abortion activists is genuine, since many of them oppose access to contraception that would reduce the number of unplanned pregancies. That attitude is consistent with Christian condemnation of sex for pleasure and the desire to punish 'sluts', which seems to be the heart of the anti-abortion movement.

Ancien Régime said:
Everything > Death. Basic principle of the universe.
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Calling any moral judgment, or anything other than physical laws by which matter interacts, a 'basic principle of the universe' is rather presumptuous. I am glad to be alive and have no desire to die, but it's hypothetically possible that anyone could be put under horrible tortures that would make them wish they were dead. The important point is that the value of my life derives from my self consciousness rather than being inherent in my existence.

Ancien Régime said:
Even if you assume that organized religion is NOT essentially an extension of the State (which it is), I'd have to assume that well, the State is the most infectious, devastating and vile plague heh.
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I'm confused by this. You seem to have identified yourself as a Christian in other posts, so are you saying that if the United States adopted anarcho-capitalism you would tell Jesus goodbye and become a fellow atheist? Religion exists regardless of government, and a secular government can in fact be a good antidote to it. I don't want to derail this thread and start an even bigger argument, but just so everyone know where I stand, I hope to see all religious beliefs gradually die off some day, with extreme fundamentalism going sooner than later.
 
No I'm vegan, because I refuse to support an industry that consumes more natural resources than any other and is rapidly leading our earth toward and impending doom, under pays employees, ruins the economy, burns our rain forests, and makes the US full of white trash fat sacks of shit.

Basically I have morals and I try to educate my self to better our species, something that some one as selfish as you can't even begin to understand and grasp.

A fetus is going to be a person. Thats like saying hey lets go kill some boys because they makes girls lives suck. But lets not kill men because they are to old.
 
I like, Ambitions, how all of your arguments are either straw man or ad hominem (and both, when we're lucky!).
 
My stance right now is pro-choice. I haven't heard a single argument yet that has convinced me to be for the other side.
 
Agreeing with Iraff.Geez, I can't believe such a nice guy like Ambitions just seems to focus on insulting, and not looking farther than were his nose is at.

Ambitions said:
No I'm vegan, because I refuse to support an industry that consumes more natural resources than any other and is rapidly leading our earth toward and impending doom, under pays employees, ruins the economy, burns our rain forests, and makes the US full of white trash fat sacks of shit.

Basically I have morals and I try to educate my self to better our species, something that some one as selfish as you can't even begin to understand and grasp.

A fetus is going to be a person. Thats like saying hey lets go kill some boys because they makes girls lives suck. But lets not kill men because they are to old.
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OH GOD YOU ARE STILL KILLING PLANTS, AND THEY ARE LIVING BEINGS!!!They are living beings, because as you said, they eat "shit" and need oxygen.You heartless fiend, how dare you!

Also, what the hell? @ the last paragraph?How can you make such a retarded comparison was that.That's like saying "Hey, let's not jail that man that killed his whole family and some witnesses because he might make the cure to Cancer AND AIDS in the time he is NOT jailed!

Or if you are a follower of something like killing high-crime persons(executions), same thing, just changed "jail(ed)" for "kill(ed)".
 
Tchomi Temocho said:
OH GOD YOU ARE STILL KILLING PLANTS, AND THEY ARE LIVING BEINGS!!!They are living beings, because as you said, they eat "shit" and need oxygen.You heartless fiend, how dare you!
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Making fun of some one is not a valid form of argument just as abortion is not a valid answer to some 16 year old sluts pregnancy problem.
 
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