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The Everything NHL Thread
- Thread starter Jackal
- Start date
"Islanders goalie Rick DiPietro left after two periods because of a groin injury,"
LOL
No offense to DiPietro because I actually like him but his sticking around is killing the Islanders. Montoya is a legitimate NHL goalie with tons of potential.
He is the future, not DiPietro. He should be starting everyday behind a young, developing but super talented young team and should be gaining their trust everyday.
You never want to seriously wish an injury on a player, but "I hope DiPietro is benched for a while" so Montoya can just be in there every night.
LOL
No offense to DiPietro because I actually like him but his sticking around is killing the Islanders. Montoya is a legitimate NHL goalie with tons of potential.
He is the future, not DiPietro. He should be starting everyday behind a young, developing but super talented young team and should be gaining their trust everyday.
You never want to seriously wish an injury on a player, but "I hope DiPietro is benched for a while" so Montoya can just be in there every night.
I'm not a sabres fan and I'm siding with miller. I sort of agree with what this guy said on a certain hockey site:
He shouldn't have moved toward miller - especially with his arms directly up to hit Miller in the face - even if there was a better chance to score simply to avoid injuries. Same reason you don't check someone from behind just because it makes it easier to hit. Same reason you don't get your stick up in someone's face even though that's their most vulnerable spot. Goalies getting concussions from players body checks is fucking dumb and not part of the game, same way checking from behind, high sticking, and boarding isn't.
I'm not saying it was fully Tootoo's fault (it definitely wasn't Miller's though), I'm saying it should be made an example of and coaches need to explain "how to not hit goalies" to their players or they will suffer suspensions. Simple as that.
I'm saying that what Tootoo did is a very common hockey play. The intent is never to run the goalie, but to get around the defender and pull up in front of the net for a point blank shot. You see it all the time, it's nothing new. It's different from Lucic (who I thought should have been suspended) because Miller was out of the crease, and Lucic wasn't pushed or anything. Almost none of the factors in the hit were the same, other than Miller being the person hit. There's not much you can do when you're pushed towards the goalie and given a fraction of a second to respond before hitting him.
And it's not like goalies don't get run into all the time by skaters who were pushed. This case is just more notable due to the speed of Tootoo (because of what he was attempting to do, which again is a common hockey play), and because Miller just recovered from a concussion. "Making an example" of this would not be justified. Shanahan should've done it for Lucic, but that's in the past and it shouldn't be taken out on Tootoo now.
And it's not like goalies don't get run into all the time by skaters who were pushed. This case is just more notable due to the speed of Tootoo (because of what he was attempting to do, which again is a common hockey play), and because Miller just recovered from a concussion. "Making an example" of this would not be justified. Shanahan should've done it for Lucic, but that's in the past and it shouldn't be taken out on Tootoo now.
What the fuck lol. Lucic does a dumbass play where he glides for a bit and throws his arms and body towards Miller pre contact.
Tootoo is straight up pushed into Miller by Ehrhoff and his arms don't even go up until contact was made.
He was driving hard towards the net, momentum carrying him forward, and then was pushed towards the net by Ehrhoff instead of going around the net as is normal.
This was simply an unfortunate hockey play. People, no matter who they are, drive hard to the net then swing around when the play breaks down. It happens multiple times a period. This is simply what happens when the rusher is pushed by the defenseman. Unlike Lucic, who wasn't pushed and had plenty of room to glide before contact, Tootoo was pushed directly into Miller.
It's obviously unfortunate that it had to be the notoriously dirty Tootoo and the just returned from concussion Miller but this isn't even close to a play that can be suspended for. It's so obvious that Tootoo is driving hard towards the net and then pushed into Miller (note how his arms don't come up till after contact).
And duh the announcers are homers lol...they're paid to be. Don't blame them for being homers, but it's unfortunate they decided to be blatantly wrong.
Sorry just have to comment here. Watch the video in slow motion one more time. His arms weren't up until contact was made...and contact was only made due to being pushed by the defenseman. The reason your check someone from behind and don't stick someone in the face analogies don't work is because he didn't choose to run Miller. Your analogies reference the illegal act; check from behind and stick to the face, not the instigating and legal motivations, checking someone more easily or softening them up. It is perfectly legal to position yourself to check someone more easily, just as it was perfectly legal for Tootoo to rush the net. Had there been no contact from Ehrhoff (or even two seconds to readjust himself after Ehrhoff's contact), then this would work with your analogy. As long as Tootoo was pushed into Miller by Ehrhoff, this remains excluded from your analogy due simply to the fact that his motivation was legal (drive the net) and he was pushed into Miller (illegal act caused by defensemen pushing).
Tootoo is straight up pushed into Miller by Ehrhoff and his arms don't even go up until contact was made.
He was driving hard towards the net, momentum carrying him forward, and then was pushed towards the net by Ehrhoff instead of going around the net as is normal.
This was simply an unfortunate hockey play. People, no matter who they are, drive hard to the net then swing around when the play breaks down. It happens multiple times a period. This is simply what happens when the rusher is pushed by the defenseman. Unlike Lucic, who wasn't pushed and had plenty of room to glide before contact, Tootoo was pushed directly into Miller.
It's obviously unfortunate that it had to be the notoriously dirty Tootoo and the just returned from concussion Miller but this isn't even close to a play that can be suspended for. It's so obvious that Tootoo is driving hard towards the net and then pushed into Miller (note how his arms don't come up till after contact).
And duh the announcers are homers lol...they're paid to be. Don't blame them for being homers, but it's unfortunate they decided to be blatantly wrong.
Sorry just have to comment here. Watch the video in slow motion one more time. His arms weren't up until contact was made...and contact was only made due to being pushed by the defenseman. The reason your check someone from behind and don't stick someone in the face analogies don't work is because he didn't choose to run Miller. Your analogies reference the illegal act; check from behind and stick to the face, not the instigating and legal motivations, checking someone more easily or softening them up. It is perfectly legal to position yourself to check someone more easily, just as it was perfectly legal for Tootoo to rush the net. Had there been no contact from Ehrhoff (or even two seconds to readjust himself after Ehrhoff's contact), then this would work with your analogy. As long as Tootoo was pushed into Miller by Ehrhoff, this remains excluded from your analogy due simply to the fact that his motivation was legal (drive the net) and he was pushed into Miller (illegal act caused by defensemen pushing).
I was kind of being sarcastic, but I seriously thought it was funny considering that they said things would be different (and that's what they come up with). Honestly I'm on the fence with the Tootoo 'incident'. On the one hand, you see these plays every so often with driving to the net, but the fact that Tootoo jumped at the end doesn't really help his cause. I think this is more of a sensitivity issue since nothing happened with Lucic (which was seriously stupid), and it's pretty much giving the go-ahead to making goalies fair game.
In other news, after watching this, I don't think I'll vote for Price (not that I'd ever vote for him in the first place, or for anyone but ya).
In other news, after watching this, I don't think I'll vote for Price (not that I'd ever vote for him in the first place, or for anyone but ya).
That's fucking awesome, I'll definitely take a minute to vote for him now.
Also, both that movie and Jean Dujardin are hilarious, not that you'll ever get the reference. Oh.. j't'ai cassé..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pc0tQGwTHH4
Go to ~2:17 you can clearly see him jump and raise his left arm and hit miller in the mask. If you look at before the hit, you can actually see Ehrhoff pushing Tootoo away from the net, towards the boards. Just to humor the notion that Ehrhoff gave Tootoo momentum, Tootoo was the one who picked the direction which is what I'm saying should be the reasoning for putting him at fault. You would blame a player for checking his opponent from behind (for example) even if the other ways to get to the puck were blocked.
I'm more saying it needs to be viewed with these things in mind and possibly even made more strict in the rulebook. Goalie concussions from body checks are simply absurd.
Also the jets just really aren't losing at home anymore.
B's v P's....F'in A
This is a great game so far, definitely worth the billing
Actually, Miller never got a concussion. Not saying they lied to try to get Lucic punished and give a slumping Miller some time off, but...wait actually yes I am saying that.
Neither hit should be considered worthy of a suspension, especially Tootoo's because it was so blatantly caused by Ehrhoff.
This is a great game so far, definitely worth the billing
Actually, Miller never got a concussion. Not saying they lied to try to get Lucic punished and give a slumping Miller some time off, but...wait actually yes I am saying that.
Neither hit should be considered worthy of a suspension, especially Tootoo's because it was so blatantly caused by Ehrhoff.
New conferences...
I will not complain about the Florida teams being with the ex North East teams but I will still believe whoever made that happen to be geographically confused.
Edit : Ah fuck... uneven divisions. Goddamn that makes it hit worst case scenario for me. Unless... that opens it up eventually for two expansion teams for the eastern conferences..
I will not complain about the Florida teams being with the ex North East teams but I will still believe whoever made that happen to be geographically confused.
Edit : Ah fuck... uneven divisions. Goddamn that makes it hit worst case scenario for me. Unless... that opens it up eventually for two expansion teams for the eastern conferences..
I just hate the new (or rather old) playoff setting.
I love me some rivalries
The expansion team theory conflicts with my thought that there is an obvious explanation for why we now have a division with two teams in Florida that would seem to be the right fit geographically for teams in Quebec City and Hamilton...
I still don't understand how a format with the 4 top teams in each conference getting playoff spots can be approved when each conference doesn't have an even number of teams. It's pretty obvious that the system is unfair. Barring the unlikely possibility the GMs are as unreasonable as most of their trades and free agent signings lead us to believe they are I can't imagine they plan to stick with it for long, so the expansion thing is probably a good bet. I really don't like Conference C as is: it sure doesn't look very competitive with the other Conference of formerly Eastern Conference teams and I'm a little sketchy on it getting equal representation in the playoffs automatically. It's a little funny with the "East Coast bias" the NHL's media is often accused of having that the two more eastern Conferences are the 7 team divisions though -- gotta imagine the NHL likes being guaranteed 4 of the Atlantic+DC/CAR teams in the playoffs with NJ and CAR both trending down right now.
I still don't understand how a format with the 4 top teams in each conference getting playoff spots can be approved when each conference doesn't have an even number of teams. It's pretty obvious that the system is unfair. Barring the unlikely possibility the GMs are as unreasonable as most of their trades and free agent signings lead us to believe they are I can't imagine they plan to stick with it for long, so the expansion thing is probably a good bet. I really don't like Conference C as is: it sure doesn't look very competitive with the other Conference of formerly Eastern Conference teams and I'm a little sketchy on it getting equal representation in the playoffs automatically. It's a little funny with the "East Coast bias" the NHL's media is often accused of having that the two more eastern Conferences are the 7 team divisions though -- gotta imagine the NHL likes being guaranteed 4 of the Atlantic+DC/CAR teams in the playoffs with NJ and CAR both trending down right now.
At first I loved these new divisions, but then I realized that the addition of Washington to this equation makes 5 teams that are better than the Islanders, making the possibility of making the playoffs even more remote.
Well, once they move to Kansas City maybe they'll get switched with Nashville/Columbus.
Well, once they move to Kansas City maybe they'll get switched with Nashville/Columbus.
NHL beware, the intangibles have just become..........tangible
Yea, as long as its not an important part of the body like the head. If its just a neck injury he should have definitely still been playing, he's just a pussy. I don't get why people don't understand that running the goalie is just a great hockey play as long as you aim for their neck and not their head.
sounds about right? Right.
New conferences...
I will not complain about the Florida teams being with the ex North East teams but I will still believe whoever made that happen to be geographically confused.
Edit : Ah fuck... uneven divisions. Goddamn that makes it hit worst case scenario for me. Unless... that opens it up eventually for two expansion teams for the eastern conferences..
I heard those were only the proposed conferences.
Anyway, I don't get why they adopted a half-assed AHL method without the full implementation - ways to deal with flaws within the numbers. It's basically missing the only important rule which is to allow crossovers for playoffs. What that means is basically the top 16 teams will play in the playoffs, and some divisions could have 5-6 teams in the playoffs while others have 2 or 3, for example.
I'm done with Shanahan. That guy is a complete joke. I felt like he had potential and got off to a decent start, but this year has been a complete joke. Lucic, a known dirty player, gets nothing for skating into Miller and causing him to miss multiple games due to injury. Tootoo, a known dirty player, gets PUSHED into the same goalie and receives a 2 game suspension? It is 1000000% obvious that Tootoo would've been able to change his direction to skate across the top of the crease if Ehrhoff was not pushing him towards the goalline. Come on man. Stuff like this makes me not even want to watch the NHL. How often do you see a game where a player gets pushed into the goalie and nothing happens? Answer: Every freaking game.
PS. This is coming from an avid Sabre hater that believes Lucic should have been suspended.
PPS or something: If you want to prevent this kind of stuff from happening, suspend the defensemen that are pushing the forwards into their own goalies. What's next? Forwards cannot skate past the faceoff circles anymore? Man this pisses me off.
More editing: How about puck-less Gionta elbowing Reimer in the head? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KW3L1jhvSik
a) Nobody pushed Gionta into Reimer
b) It was obviously unintentional (just like Tootoo)
c) Tootoo actually had the puck
d) It caused Reimer to miss over a month
PS. This is coming from an avid Sabre hater that believes Lucic should have been suspended.
PPS or something: If you want to prevent this kind of stuff from happening, suspend the defensemen that are pushing the forwards into their own goalies. What's next? Forwards cannot skate past the faceoff circles anymore? Man this pisses me off.
More editing: How about puck-less Gionta elbowing Reimer in the head? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KW3L1jhvSik
a) Nobody pushed Gionta into Reimer
b) It was obviously unintentional (just like Tootoo)
c) Tootoo actually had the puck
d) It caused Reimer to miss over a month
there has to be some kind of shanahan troll face jpg somewhere
Definitely don't think this is even close to what Lucic did (which should he have been suspended for), but the reverse angle in the video Shanahan released is interesting to me. While I thought Tootoo got pushed into Miller with the angle I'd seen before, it looks a lot more like Ehrhoff was just touching him and not applying any force when you look from in front of Tootoo, who seems to willingly slam into Miller and jump completely unnecessarily(don't give me that trying to jump over Miller shit. Like a basically immobile goon is going to jump five, six feet to clear a goalie while off balance. Give me a break.), which leads to the contact with the head, so I don't mind him getting a couple of games for a pretty stupid play after all. This one doesn't annoy me as much after seeing the video, but obviously it's amazingly ridiculous that Lucic didn't get at LEAST the same deal.
Speaking of which, I see Marchand slewfoot Niskanen last night. I imagine that won't net him anything, either.
Speaking of which, I see Marchand slewfoot Niskanen last night. I imagine that won't net him anything, either.
I agree that the Ehrhoff push wasn't a strong one, but he clearly angled Tootoo away from where he wanted to go. If you just pay attention to Tootoo, you can tell that he wants to make a move towards the top of the crease, but Ehrhoff removes that potential ice away from him.
If you start looking at around :35 on this link: http://video.nhl.com/videocenter/console?id=140163
You can see that Tootoo is angling his skates upwards, but when Ehrhoff makes contact, it prevents him from keeping that upward path.
If you start looking at around :35 on this link: http://video.nhl.com/videocenter/console?id=140163
You can see that Tootoo is angling his skates upwards, but when Ehrhoff makes contact, it prevents him from keeping that upward path.
I interpret it a little differently; it's fairly obvious he wants to cut in front of the net to get a shot which Ehrhoff's presence prevents him from doing, but I think he's perfectly capable of at least minimizing contact with Miller after he loses the puck by trying to go a bit toward the top of the crease(or behind the net, but it looks like if he tried that he'd probably wipe out with where his weight is), and in addition to making no effort to avoid Miller he actually jumps which causes the collision to be with his injured upper body(as well as sort of targeting his head, though Miller dodges pretty nicely). Shanahan's explanation of him not trying to avoid contact and hitting Miller hard/high seems pretty reasonable.
I think Shanahan got boxed into a corner here; obviously the GMs weren't very happy that goalies were "open season" as Ruff called it, and Shanahan answers to them, and the board of governors, not the fans. I would like to see some consistency, but Shanahan gets a pass from me this time (like Synre, I also feel that Tootoo could have done a much better job minimizing contact).
I don't even want to give some dickhead like Tootoo the benefit of the doubt.
If you're racing with a defenseman towards one end and suddenly try to abruptly turn in front of the net, it is hard for the defenseman rushing back with you not to push you in an attempt not to let you do it, especially considering you're carrying the puck. Sadly, this resulted in Tootoo hitting the goalie rather than being stopped from cutting inside. The dangerous play, which it was, was more Tootoo's than it was the defenseman's in my book and I'm perfectly fine with the suspension.
That said, it is indeed a joke that Tootoo gets two and Lucic didn't get anything.
If you're racing with a defenseman towards one end and suddenly try to abruptly turn in front of the net, it is hard for the defenseman rushing back with you not to push you in an attempt not to let you do it, especially considering you're carrying the puck. Sadly, this resulted in Tootoo hitting the goalie rather than being stopped from cutting inside. The dangerous play, which it was, was more Tootoo's than it was the defenseman's in my book and I'm perfectly fine with the suspension.
That said, it is indeed a joke that Tootoo gets two and Lucic didn't get anything.