BROloom
What you said, is what I actually said, except you said it negatively. But my point is, you actually said what I'm saying.
You also are contradicting yourself in your argument...
And hey, are you trying to make me laugh? Since when did Choice Scarf pokémon switch in? Aren't they supposed to be revenge killers or late game cleaners?
Most of your sample revenge killers even said, it needs to take "these damage", but they're ubiqitous so Rapid Spin is mandatory.
Sample scenario: You send in Serperior, assuming a hazard is up, takes damage, then proceeds to leaf storm, but the opponent is surprisingly bulky, survies the hit and strikes back with a weak attack, you finsih it off, and the scarfed mon comes in.
Now, you might say, that "They have to sacrifice a pokémon!" But you must remember that Serperior wont be killing a thing unless it's se or already low on health.
And what makes you think it'll be ubers? That's the best joke I've ever heard today! :)
Sorry for such an attitude but we aren't talking about ubers here.
Celebi is still much better because it has more offensive presnece and unpredictable.
And you just made Serperior look good like he's unstoppable, that's true but it needs massive team support to be unstoppable. It's like Agility Chinchou of LC. "Looks unstoppable but needs massive team support to be unstoppable."
EDIT: The only Unrelased DW pokémons you will use at ubers are Feraligtr and Chandelure.
PS If Celebi isn't your cup of tea, Breloom is also a setup sweeper that competes with Serperior, the irony I am the one telling the guy with Breloom's namesake.
I feel like you missed everything I said. First of all, I ran calculations on EVERYTHING I stated, I was pointing out how none of those scarfers are clean counters (countering under pretty much any condition), and yes, can come in a finish up (their job as a scarfer, hurrdurr) but that does NOT make it a reliable counter, since they can't reliably take that hit and KO. Hell, in your "simple scenario", Serperior has K.O'd one pokemon, in your "scenario" it has done its job, and your only counter is a revenger killer that Serperior can now switch out from. You mentioned how I'd say "they have to sacrifice a pokemon", but your disclaimer is that it won't kill a thing unless it's SE or already low on health... Sorry, what? How does your precious set-up Celebi kill anything? Oh that's right, it either forces a switch to get a free Nasty Plot, or the pokemon does little damage to Celebi while it sets up. Guess what, the EXACT same thing applies in getting Serperior to set up, except, as you kindly pointed out, Serperior can come in and revenge kill something slower AND get a free +2 boost! Making it even EASIER to set up with Serperior.
Oh by the way, the reason I mentioned the scarfers "switching in", is because for a pokemon to be an effective counter, a pokemon has to be able to switch in, otherwise it's not a counter, it's a revenger killer, two completely different things, and we we're talking about what can counter Serpierior, not what can revenge kill it.
Secondly, I said that he WON'T be uber, go read what I said, I said "Serperior
ISN'T going to be an unmatched threat going instantly into ubers" and that "nobody will claim" that he would be uber, because he won't be, and it's stupid to think he would be. You see that word "isn't" there? It specifically points out how I don't think he'll be uber, ever, so either read more carefully, or don't try and imply I said something I didn't.
Thirdly, I've posted about how with leaf storm, most pokemon are afraid to switch in and take that, while they wouldn't care less about switching into a nasty plot, and Celebi's base speed problems, but if you just want to keep saying "Celebi is still better" with no backing up to that claim, then go ahead, but it doesn't look good on your behalf.
The same problems exists with Breloom, I love him, but as a set-up sweeper he has 2 moves taken up with Spore and Sword Dance, with the 3rd being Mach Punch. If anything outspeeds Breloom (not difficult) and resists fighting attacks, he can be easy to stop, all that said pokemon has to do is switch in on a SD, outspeed base 70 speed, and resist a Mach Punch and kill it with its paper thin defences, where as in Serperiors case, if you switch in, you're still taking a leaf storm at the minimum, and have more to worry about another 3 moves that could completely ruin your day, all while having decent defences to back it up.
Here's the deal, you listed pokemon that "wall" Serperior in your first post, I did calcs to show how they don't "wall" him, they only wall him if they he doesn't take HP fire, which I'll remind you, you said was pointless to take because he's meant to take on water pokemon, which is moronic, why take coverage moves at all on your pokemon? Oh right, so they don't get walled. You also said that "it's outclassed by Celebi as a (naturally) bulky boosting Grass-type", which isn't true because of Celebi's naturally lower speed, making it easy to take out, especially when with Celebi, all a pokemon only has to do is switch in to a nasty plot and out speed a base 100, where as with Serperior, it has to come in on a base 140 STAB attack to begin with, and then outspeed a base 113. You said "Celebi boasts more immediate offensive presence, a wider movepool", I'm pretty sure being able to hit off a 140 base attack and boost at the same time is more of an immediate offensive presence, and that while Celebi has more options to choose from, it has to have nasty plot+giga drain, then two moves to help it, Serperior can have Leaf storm + 3 moves to help it. The only place Celebi shines over Serperior as a set up is the choice of sets it can run, thus being more unpredictable, where as Serperiors will always be a contrary set.
As I said, I don't think Serperior will be unstoppable, that is not what I'm saying, I'm saying that a contrary Serperior is frickin scary, and that it isn't just "outclassed" by celebi, not by a long shot.