Thundurus-T [GP 0/2]

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Overview
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With the highest Special Attack of any Electric-type in the game, Thundurus-T can be daunting to face. It has a good Speed stat as well, although it's not as good as it used to be. Thundurus-T's offensive prowess is augmented by its access to powerful boosting moves in Nasty Plot and Agility, as well as the defensive typing to set these up on certain threats. It also has several good coverage options that make it difficult to counter without knowing its moves. Although it is relatively frail, its typing makes it resistant to most priority moves, so teams cannot fall back on them as an answer. However, Thundurus-T faces a lot of competition from its Incarnate forme. While Volt Absorb is a useful ability, it's quite inferior to Prankster. Thundurus has a higher Speed as well, which can be crucial. Outside of the competition, Thundurus-T's switch-in opportunities are limited by Stealth Rock, and its poor bulk can make it difficult to set up if the opponent keeps up the pressure. Finally, you run the risk of being walled even if you can set up if you don't have the right coverage move. Overall, though, despite its flaws, Thundurus-T can be a very powerful sweeper.

Nasty Plot
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name: Nasty Plot
move 1: Nasty Plot
move 2: Thunderbolt
move 3: Hidden Power Flying
move 4: Focus Blast
ability: Volt Absorb
item: Leftovers / Lum Berry
evs: 20 HP / 252 SpA / 236 Spe
ivs: 30 SpA / 30 SpD / 30 Spe
nature: Modest

Moves
========

Nasty Plot makes Thundurus-T nearly impossible to wall, helping it be an extremely powerful stallbreaker. Thunderbolt is your strong bread-and-butter STAB attack. Hidden Power Flying is a secondary STAB attack that can wreck Mega Venusaur, something that would counter Thundurus-T otherwise. In conjunction with Thundurus-T's STAB moves, Focus Blast gets nearly unresisted coverage except for itself, Rotom, and the extremely relevant Dedenne. It also hits would-be-checks like Tyranitar, Excadrill, Kyurem-B, Chansey, and Heatran super effectively. Grass Knot can be used instead to hurt Hippowdon, Quagsire, and Gastrodon, but Focus Blast hits them hard enough, especially with Nasty Plot.

Set Details
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The Speed EVs outspeed Jolly Pinsir, while Special Attack is maximized to hit as hard as possible. The remainder goes into HP, which also gives you a number divisible by 16. If using Leftovers, this is best as it gives Thundurus-T more recovery each turn. If Lum Berry is used instead, then move 4 EVs from HP to Defense to reduce Stealth Rock damage. The IVs give the most efficient spread for Hidden Power Flying. Leftovers is generally the better item to sustain the stallbreaking, but Lum Berry is also very good to get a free pass from status. Life Orb could be used, but at that point this set is better used by Thundurus.

Usage Tips
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Nasty Plot Thundurus-T is used as an early- or mid-game wallbreaker that can break many defensive cores. It excels against stall, but can struggle against offensive teams and will not be as helpful as against them. This set is rather prediction-reliant in order to set up, as it often does it on predicted switches. Because it does not use Agility, this Thundurus-T is much easier to check as well, so predicting switches may be necessary. It's best to come in for free on a double switch, after a KO, or from a slow U-Turn or Volt Switch, so that you can set up on as healthily as possible. If your opponent has something like Latios that is an easy switch-in and outspeeds, there is no reason to use Nasty Plot and you should instead just attack and switch out.

Team Options
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Like any offensive Pokemon, Thundurus-T appreciates entry hazards, and Deoxys-D is a great setter. Nasty Plot Thundurus-T is primarily a wallbreaker, so sweepers that can take advantage like Belly Drum Azumarill and Dragon Dance Mega Charizard X are good teammates. Keldeo has good defensive synergy, resisting Rock- and Ice-type attacks, while Thundurus-T resists Grass-, Flying-, and Electric-type moves. Keldeo can also break through Chansey easily or sweep after Thundurus-T wallbreaks. Aegislash, Tyranitar, and Scizor can easily switch into Latios and Latias. Aegislash and Tyranitar can Pursuit trap them, while Scizor has a slow U-Turn to get Thundurus-T in for free.

Agility
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name: Agility
move 1: Agility
move 2: Thunderbolt
move 3: Hidden Power Flying / Hidden Power Ice
move 4: Focus Blast / Psychic
ability: Volt Absorb
item: Life Orb
evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Modest

Moves
========

This Thundurus-T boosts its Speed with Agility to be nearly impossible to revenge kill. Thunderbolt is its strongest reliable STAB attack. Hidden Power Flying is a secondary STAB that hits Grass-types hard, especially Mega Venusaur. Hidden Power Ice can also be used to hit Dragon-types. Focus Blast gets the best coverage with Hidden Power Flying and hits Tyranitar, Excadrill, Kyurem-B, and Heatran super effectively. If not using Hidden Power Flying, Psychic is needed to get past Mega Venusaur. Grass Knot is also an option in the last slot to hit Hippowdon, Quagsire, and Gastrodon harder.

Set Details
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Speed and Special Attack are maximized to be as fast as possible before using Agility and to hit hard. Life Orb is the best item to get a great boost in power. A Modest nature is best since Thundurus-T is boosting its speed, but Timid could be used if you want to outspeed base 100 Speed Pokemon before you boost.

Usage Tips
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Thundurus-T should come in for free on something that it can definitely beat, like Talonflame locked into Brave Bird. It should be used as a late-game cleaner, not in the middle. If its checks are still healthy, then it shouldn't bother setting up, as it will just be forced out. Although it resists Flying-type moves, Choice Band Talonflame can revenge kill it once it drops below 50%.

Team Options
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Thundurus-T really appreciates hazards to weaken its checks so that it can sweep, and to this end, Deoxys-D is very helpful. Belly Drum Azumarill can often clean up after Thundurus-T comes through, as the two share similar checks in Latias and Mega Venusuar. Latios is a good Defogger to increase Thundurus-T's set up opportunities and can also wallbreak. Keldeo has good defensive synergy, resisting Rock- and Ice-type attacks while Thundurus-T resists Grass-, Electric-, and Flying-type moves. They also share common counters that they can weaken for each other. Scizor checks Latios and Latias well, and can supply a slow U-Turn while threats like Talonflame come in to help Thundurus-T.

Double Booster
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name: Double Booster
move 1: Agility
move 2: Nasty Plot
move 3: Thunderbolt
move 4: Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Flying
ability: Volt Absorb
item: Leftovers / Life Orb
evs: 156 HP / 252 SpA / 100 Spe
nature: Modest

Moves
========

Thundurus-T can set up two different boosts with this set. Agility allows it to outspeed almost anything your opponent could have, while Nasty Plot boosts its Special Attack up to terrifying levels. Thunderbolt is a strong STAB move, while you have a choice of two Hidden Powers for coverage. Hidden Power Ice gets almost perfect neutral coverage, but Hidden Power Flying is stronger against a neutral target and beats Mega Venusaur.

Set Details
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The Speed EVs allow Thundurus-T to outspeed Scarf Latios at +2, generally the fastest Pokemon you will come across. After that, Special Attack is maximized with a Modest nature to hit as hard as possible. The rest goes into HP to increase set up opportunities. Leftovers is the better item to set up boosts, but Life Orb could be used for more power.

Usage Tips
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Double Booster Thundurus-T works like a middle ground between a Nasty Plot or Agility set. Usually, it won't get to do both, so you should pick depending on the team you're facing. If you are facing a more defensive team, set up Nasty Plot mid-game to break walls. If you are facing a more offensive team, set up Agility late game to clean up and sweep. Most of the time, only one will be necessary, although if both are set up it can be very difficult for the opponent to recover. When it comes to setting up, the HP EVs are nice to make it easier, but it is still better to do it on predicted switches so your bulk is preserved for sweeping.

Team Options
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Deoxys-D is a great teammate to set up entry hazards that wear down Thundurus-T's checks. Mega Pinsir is an effective wallbreaker or sweeper that can pair with Thundurus-T, although it stacks weaknesses. Belly Drum Azumarill can clean up after Thundurus-T goes through the opposing team. Keldeo has great defensive synergy, resisting Rock- and Ice-type attacks while Thundurus-T resists Grass-, Electric-, and Flying-type moves. They also share common counters, so they can sweep after each other. Scizor can offer a slow U-Turn to get Thundurus-T in for free as something like Talonflame comes in. Tyranitar, Aegislash, and Bisharp can Pursuit trap Latios and Latias, two of Thundurus-T's biggest checks.

Other Options
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Thundurus-T has a nice Speed tier and access to Volt Switch for a Choice Scarf set, but Choice-locked Electric-type attacks are easy to exploit. U-turn can also be used to grab momentum and weaken Latios and Latias. To this end, Knock Off can be used as Chansey is one of the best counters, and it also hits Latios and Latias. An All-Out Attacker without boosting moves could be used, as well as other moves like Substitute or Taunt. However, in general, Thundurus outclasses Thundurus-T at these other options.

Checks & Counters
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**Extremely Specially Bulky Pokemon**: Tyranitar can take Thunderbolts with ease, but it will lose to Focus Blast. Blissey and Chansey can wall Agility sets with ease, but Nasty Plot sets will break through. Heatran can beat any set without Focus Blast with Roar.

** Bulky Dragon-types without a 4x weakness to Ice**: Latios and Latias are two of Thundurus-T's best checks, but Hidden Power Ice can do good damage as they switch in. Kyurem-B can beat it as long as it doesn't have Focus Blast. Assault Vest Goodra is very bulky, but it can't OHKO, and a +2 Hidden Power Ice will 2HKO, so it cannot switch in and win.

**Ground-types**: Excadrill can beat Thundurus-T if it does not have Focus Blast. Specially Defensive Hippowdon beats sets without Grass Knot or Nasty Plot. Mamoswine can't switch in but nearly OHKOs with Ice Shard.

**Grass-types**: Mega Venusaur beats sets without Hidden Power Flying or Psychic. Celebi also beats sets that don't have Hidden Power Flying or Nasty Plot.

**Offensive Pressure**: Thundurus-T can be difficult to revenge kill when it often uses Agility and resists most priority. The best way to keep it from setting up and destroying your team is by keeping up pressure.
 
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Definitely emphaize the needs of removing a lot of threats and it being used as a late game sweeper or cleaner. In particular - many bulky Ground-types laugh at the set and Mega Venusaur is only phased by +2 HP Flying.
 
Is there not a chance that a Choice Scarf set could be viable? It has enough Speed to out speed Dragonite, Salamence, and the Charizard forms (although it can't do too much to Charizard X), and it's one of the reasons why you might want to use it over say Thundurus-I (which can't run a Choice Scarf set very well). I'm not necessary requesting it's there, but it's something that maybe other QC members want to discuss. I also think a mix wall breaker set is certainly viable too, with something like Super Power, Thunderbolt, HP Ice, and U-turn, but again, it's something that I think other QC members could discuss. Personally, I'd like to see both sets.

Now, onto your actual analysis. I don't have too much to comment on until the Team Options section for the first set. I'd mention Specs Keldeo being a really nice partner, as it can blast through Tyranitar, Heatran, Chansey, and Kyurem-B, and they overall have decent synergy together. Scizor is also a great team option for it's ability to check Kyurem-B, Tyranitar, Celebi, and for it's ability to provide Defog support.

Other than that though, this seems pretty good.
 
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It's not that difficult to break past Bulky Grounds, really, except for Hippowdon, with the Agility set. Quagsire and Gastrodon are both easily 2HKO'd by Focus Blast, as well as of course Excadrill and Mamoswine, and Garchomp, Gliscor, and Landorus-T will lose if you have HP Ice. I will emphasize that while Thundurus-T has the potential to beat most of the metagame, it can't run all of its coverage moves, so you have to pick your counters.

A Choice Scarf set has been brought up before, and while I'm not against adding it if that's what is wanted, the general consensus was that it wasn't worth it because of how easy it is to take advantage of choice-locked Electric attacks. As for a mixed wallbreaker, I think Thundurus would generally do that better because of higher attack and speed.

I'll add Keldeo and Scizor. Thanks for the suggestions.
 
ShootingStarmie said:
Is there not a chance that a Choice Scarf set could be viable? It has enough Speed to out speed Dragonite, Salamence, and the Charizard forms (although it can't do too much to Charizard X), and it's one of the reasons why you might want to use it over say Thundurus-I (which can't run a Choice Scarf set very well). I'm not necessary requesting it's there, but it's something that maybe other QC members want to discuss. I also think a mix wall breaker set is certainly viable too, with something like Super Power, Thunderbolt, HP Ice, and U-turn, but again, it's something that I think other QC members could discuss. Personally, I'd like to see both sets.
Click to expand...

The problem with a Choice Scarf set is that none of Thundy-Ts moves are very desireable to be locked into. HP ice is weak, Thunderbolt/Voltswitch have too many Pokemon immune to them and Focus Blast is Focus Blast. U-Turn is nice to catch some potential counters like the Latis, but with a SR weakness spamming an unstabbed U-Turn from an OK but uninvested Atk stat isn't the greatest strategy. Also even without these flaws there are a lot other Pokemon who can revengekill the same threats and usually they can do it even better/more reliable.
Honestly i wouldn't even say that the Scarf set is bad on paper Thundurus-T has everything a good scarfer needs with a good speed stats, phenomenal offense, good coverage in just a few moves and even U-Turn, but there are just so many better Pokemon that can do virtually the same that you have to ask yourself the question why would i use Thundurs-T over something like Scarf Chomp/Exca/Rotom-W/Priority Pokemon XY.
 
This gen most of the stuff Thundurus T does is done better by Thundurus I, but there is one set that I have used extensively, and imo is the best set Thundurus T can run: NP + 3 attacks. The main niche Thundurus T has is that it hits almost as hard as LO Thundurus without any boosting item, which allows it to run Leftovers or Lum Berry, and thus be a huge pain for stall. Most stalls lose to Thundurus T if it gets one Nasty Plot up and its Lum Berry intact. Especially this generation, with the speed tiers having slowed down a bit, I don't see why Double Dance, and especially Agility, are placed higher than NP + 3 attacks, a more effective set in this meta.

I use two different movesets for this, either NP + Thunderbolt + HP Flying + Grass Knot, or NP + Thunderbolt + HP Ice + Focus Blast. Both sets are effective, it simply depends on the coverage you need. I also tend to run a bulkier EV spread when using the former moveset, where I only aim to speed creep Pinsir before it mega evolves, while on the latter moveset I run max Speed to outspeed the 100 benchmark.

Notable KOs include Chansey being 2hkoed at +4 with Thunderbolt, something Thundurus I can't do without getting to +6, as well as a guaranteed OHKO on Mega Venusaur with HP Flying at +2, which Thundurus misses by 10%.

imo NP 3 attacks is the Thundurus T set of this generation, and it's quite ridiculous that it isn't on the analysis yet. (imo this should be the first set)

Oh yea and Scarf is terrible this generation, it is not worth a place on this analysis at all.
 
I'm okay with adding a pure NP set too, I had initially dismissed it because I figured that Thundurus' higher Speed was more important than the higher Special Attack, but if the Special Attack actually makes a difference, I'd be glad to play with it and include it. I'd like to hear other QC members' opinion on it, though, because I feel like it could be a bit too niche to be generally effective. There's not really a lack of stallbreakers anyway, and it seems like it fares somewhat poorly against non-stall teams. But if you've used it effectively and others think it's fine, I'll definitely include it.

Edit @ below: That log is so faked I don't even use an underscore in my IRC nick
 
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Just a minor nitpick but your current spread on the Nasty Plot set isn't optimal, if you use 31/0/31/30/30/30 for Hidden Power Flying and use 20 HP / 252 SpA / 236 Spe you come out with an extra point in defense.
 
legs said:
Just a minor nitpick but your current spread on the Nasty Plot set isn't optimal, if you use 31/0/31/30/30/30 for Hidden Power Flying and use 20 HP / 252 SpA / 236 Spe you come out with an extra point in defense.
Click to expand...
That's a nice catch, thanks. I'll change the set and add an IVs part since people usually use 30/30/30/30/30/31 with HP Flying, but in this case since you don't run max speed, it's fine to use 31/31/31/30/30/30.
 
Just a heads up when you list IVs you don't need to list the ones that remain as 31

Actually you don't even need to list IVs at all if you are just doing it for Hidden Power IVs, so you can remove those.
 
I have come to save the day with a custom thundurus-t!

Thundurus-Therian (M) @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 156 HP / 252 SAtk / 100 Spd
Modest Nature
- Agility
- Thunderbolt
- Dark Pulse / Psychic / Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Thundy can take ice beams from plenty of pokes surprisingly , I usually use this set without screen support but it helps if your goal is to take a STAB ice beam. Defog support is also needed as it needs every single point of its HP. The speed EVs are just enough to outspeed a scarf latios at +2 with the rest thrown into HP to take them Super Effective moves. As for showcases of this set in action. I can link them if Requested.
 
Thundy-T is too frail and lacks weaknesses to take advantage of Weakness Policy, friend. Here are some examples

0 Atk Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 156 HP / 0 Def Thundurus-T: 372-440 (110 - 130.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 156 HP / 0 SpD Thundurus-T: 393-463 (116.2 - 136.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 Atk Terrakion Stone Edge vs. 156 HP / 0 Def Thundurus-T: 438-516 (129.5 - 152.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

You can set up on weak ice beam users (unboosted manaphy), weak rock type move users (defensive landorus-therian), but that's really it. Even some weak rock type move users like Excadrill wont give a shit about your +2 if you dont have focus blast, or Hippowdon if you dont have Grass Knot..

With such a small profile of pokemon you can actually set up on WP becomes very match up reliant, unlike other than sets such as WP dragonite where it has multiscale to set up on any super effective move meaning that there will always being an opponent to try and use it against, or WP tyranitar (Popular in SPL doubles) who has about common 100 weakensses and the bulk to take most of them. If the opponent doesnt have one of these pokes or you cant get in on them then youre wasting your item where Life Orb or sometihng could always be useful.
 
Ash Borer said:
Thundy-T is too frail and lacks weaknesses to take advantage of Weakness Policy, friend. Here are some examples

0 Atk Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 156 HP / 0 Def Thundurus-T: 372-440 (110 - 130.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 156 HP / 0 SpD Thundurus-T: 393-463 (116.2 - 136.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 Atk Terrakion Stone Edge vs. 156 HP / 0 Def Thundurus-T: 438-516 (129.5 - 152.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

You can set up on weak ice beam users (unboosted manaphy), weak rock type move users (defensive landorus-therian), but that's really it. Even some weak rock type move users like Excadrill wont give a shit about your +2 if you dont have focus blast, or Hippowdon if you dont have Grass Knot..

With such a small profile of pokemon you can actually set up on WP becomes very match up reliant, unlike other than sets such as WP dragonite where it has multiscale to set up on any super effective move meaning that there will always being an opponent to try and use it against, or WP tyranitar (Popular in SPL doubles) who has about common 100 weakensses and the bulk to take most of them. If the opponent doesnt have one of these pokes or you cant get in on them then youre wasting your item where Life Orb or sometihng could always be useful.
Click to expand...

I usually end up using it late game when opponent's team is weakened or things that can soak hits are down. As i mentioned I wouldn't use it to take STAB ice beams. As for t-tar, while unrelated I carry two intimidate users. I have dealt with quite a few t-tars and they don't really last long in the game. however if there is a poke on the other team that can either take the hit and phaze or kill thundy I usually avoid sending it out. I find myself usually playing with the core of my other 5 pokes sometimes taking advantage of its immunity and boosting on the hp ice. Hp Ice or pokes that don't hit as hard with SE moves like gastrodon for example. If I don't feel like somewhat relying on Matchups, I run psychic to have a poke that hits mega venusaur and conkeldurr hella hard. but my usual setup is that I see an ideal pokemon for setting up on and I get a safe switch in. I understand your criticisms though It either sweeps the other team, hits their tanks hard before going down(win condition) like hitting heatran damn hard while possible losing its air balloon, or if you don't find an opportunity to get WP boost I find that I do some damage before he goes down. Its a late-game style poke but the opportunity usually presents its self mid-game.
 
I dont mean to say that Tyranitar counters your set because it does any set htat lacks focus blast, however waht Im calling into question si the weakenss policy.

Bulky Agility thundurus is a cool set however the unreliability of the weakness policy is problematic to the set. Thundurus' only two weaknesses are rock and ice type moves. There are a number of Rock-type move users in the tier including but not limited to Terrakion, Tyranitar, Excadrill, Hippowdon, Landorus-T, Garchomp, and Heracross. The others dont come to mind. Ice type move users are Mamoswine, Thundurus, COnkeldurr, Greninja, Manaphy, Raikou, Mega Manectric, KYurem-B, and again a few others I may be missing.

OF these you can not set up on while activating your item: Terrakion, Tyranitar, Offensive Lando-T, Mega Garchomp, Heracross, Mamoswine, Greninja, and Kyurem-B due to them 1 shotting you. Conk takes the +2 Tbolt like a champ and finishes you off with ICe Punch.

That leaves Garchomp who may just hit you with oturage to not risk missing and only a few sets carry stone edge, Excadrill who you need to have focus blast to OHKO in return, Hippowdon who may lack a rock move and can take a hit at +2 if specially defensive and KO back. Manaphy, Thundurus, Raikou, Mega MAnectric, and Defensive LAndo-T seem to be the only reliable set up opportunities with a few other situationally useful ones. Raikou has a chance ot live a +2 Focus Blast, and manaphy will probably be boosted anyways. So how can you justify a weakness policy in this meta?

Bulky Agility
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name: Bulky Agility
move 1: Agility
move 2: Thunderbolt
move 3: Hidden Power Flying / Hidden Power Ice
move 4: Focus Blast / Psychic
ability: Volt Absorb
item: Life Orb
evs: 168 HP / 252 SpA / 88 Spe
nature: Modest

This is the bulky set I would make a case for, WEakenss policy just isn't the right item for Thundurus. I changed the EVs to outspeed scarf 108s, Scarf Latios is trash and pursuit bait. however, a et like this basically already exists in the analysis already, so whatever.
 
Can I ask why youd use hp flying over psychic on thundurus therian? Psychic has the same base power as STAB hp flying and it alolows you to ruin mega venusaur whilst havin ice electric coverage still.
 
Because Ice-type coverage isn't too important. Thundurus-T really wants Focus Blast on its sets to hit Tyranitar, Heatran, Excadrill, Kyurem-B, etc. With Electric and Fighting, Flying gets better coverage than Psychic and hits all Grass-types.
 
Ash Borer said:
I dont mean to say that Tyranitar counters your set because it does any set htat lacks focus blast, however waht Im calling into question si the weakenss policy.

Bulky Agility thundurus is a cool set however the unreliability of the weakness policy is problematic to the set. Thundurus' only two weaknesses are rock and ice type moves. There are a number of Rock-type move users in the tier including but not limited to Terrakion, Tyranitar, Excadrill, Hippowdon, Landorus-T, Garchomp, and Heracross. The others dont come to mind. Ice type move users are Mamoswine, Thundurus, COnkeldurr, Greninja, Manaphy, Raikou, Mega Manectric, KYurem-B, and again a few others I may be missing.

OF these you can not set up on while activating your item: Terrakion, Tyranitar, Offensive Lando-T, Mega Garchomp, Heracross, Mamoswine, Greninja, and Kyurem-B due to them 1 shotting you. Conk takes the +2 Tbolt like a champ and finishes you off with ICe Punch.

That leaves Garchomp who may just hit you with oturage to not risk missing and only a few sets carry stone edge, Excadrill who you need to have focus blast to OHKO in return, Hippowdon who may lack a rock move and can take a hit at +2 if specially defensive and KO back. Manaphy, Thundurus, Raikou, Mega MAnectric, and Defensive LAndo-T seem to be the only reliable set up opportunities with a few other situationally useful ones. Raikou has a chance ot live a +2 Focus Blast, and manaphy will probably be boosted anyways. So how can you justify a weakness policy in this meta?

Bulky Agility
########
name: Bulky Agility
move 1: Agility
move 2: Thunderbolt
move 3: Hidden Power Flying / Hidden Power Ice
move 4: Focus Blast / Psychic
ability: Volt Absorb
item: Life Orb
evs: 168 HP / 252 SpA / 88 Spe
nature: Modest

This is the bulky set I would make a case for, WEakenss policy just isn't the right item for Thundurus. I changed the EVs to outspeed scarf 108s, Scarf Latios is trash and pursuit bait. however, a et like this basically already exists in the analysis already, so whatever.
Click to expand...
I understand what you're saying. I'm unable to really prove it statistically so we'll just conclude there. Oh and scarf latios is a pretty nice revenge killer, outspeeding the 108 speed tier which scarf is common. Also outspeeding +2 cloyster is pretty nifty if you don't run talonflame, but yeah I'm not gonna go on a full chat of how I like latios.
 
Amcheck time!
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Overview
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With the highest Special Attack of any Electric-type in the game, Thundurus-T can be daunting to face. It has a good Speed stat as well, although it's not as good as it used to be it could be better. Don't write an analysis in a form that puts emphasis on changes by generation. Thundurus-T's offensive prowess is augmented by its access to powerful boosting moves in Nasty Plot and Agility, as well as the defensive typing to set these up on certain threats. It also has several good coverage options that make it difficult to counter without knowing its moves. Although it is relatively frail, its typing makes it resistant to most priority moves, so teams cannot fall back on them as an answer. However, Thundurus-T faces a lot of competition from its Incarnate forme. While Volt Absorb is a useful ability, it's quite inferior to Prankster. Thundurus has a higher Speed as well, which can be crucial. Outside of the its competition, Thundurus-T's switch-in opportunities are limited by Stealth Rock, and its poor bulk can make it difficult to set up if the opponent keeps up the offensive pressure. Finally, you run the risk of being walled even if you can set up if you don't have the right coverage move. Overall, though, despite its flaws, Thundurus-T can be a very powerful sweeper.

Nasty Plot
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name: Nasty Plot
move 1: Nasty Plot
move 2: Thunderbolt
move 3: Hidden Power Flying
move 4: Focus Blast
ability: Volt Absorb
item: Leftovers / Lum Berry
evs: 20 HP / 252 SpA / 236 Spe
ivs: 30 SpA / 30 SpD / 30 Spe
nature: Modest

Moves
========

Nasty Plot makes Thundurus-T nearly impossible to wall, helping it be an extremely powerful stallbreaker. Thunderbolt is your strong bread-and-butter STAB attack. Hidden Power Flying is a secondary STAB attack that can wreck Mega Venusaur, something that would otherwise counter Thundurus-T otherwise. In conjunction with Thundurus-T's STAB moves, Focus Blast gets nearly unresisted coverage except for itself, Rotom, and the extremely irrelevant Dedenne. It also hits would-be-checks like Tyranitar, Excadrill, Kyurem-B, Chansey, and Heatran super effectively. Grass Knot can be used instead to hurt Hippowdon, Quagsire, and Gastrodon, but Focus Blast hits them hard enough, especially with after a Nasty Plot boost.

Set Details
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The Speed EVs outspeed Jolly Pinsir, while Special Attack is maximized to hit as hard as possible. The remainder goes into HP, which also gives you a number divisible by 16. If using Leftovers, this is best as it gives Thundurus-T more recovery each turn. If Lum Berry is used instead, then move 4 EVs from HP to Defense to reduce Stealth Rock damage. The IVs give the most efficient spread for Hidden Power Flying. Leftovers is generally the better item to sustain the stallbreaking, but Lum Berry is also very good to get a free pass from status. Life Orb could be used, but at that point this set is better used by Thundurus.

Usage Tips
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Nasty Plot Thundurus-T is used as an early- or mid-game wallbreaker that can break many defensive cores. It excels against stall, but can struggle against offensive teams and will not be as helpful as against them. This set is rather prediction-reliant in order to set up, as it often does it so on predicted switches. Because it does not use Agility, this Thundurus-T is much easier to check as well, so predicting switches may be necessary. It's best to come in for free on a double switch, after a KO, or from a slow U-Turn U-turn or Volt Switch, so that you can set up on while as healthily healthy as possible. If your opponent has something like Latios that is an easy switch-in and outspeeds, there is no reason to use Nasty Plot and you should instead just attack and switch out.

Team Options
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Like any offensive Pokemon, Thundurus-T appreciates entry hazards, and Deoxys-D is a great setter. Nasty Plot Thundurus-T is primarily a wallbreaker, so sweepers that can take advantage of it like Belly Drum Azumarill and Dragon Dance Mega Charizard X are good teammates. Keldeo has good defensive synergy, resisting Rock- and Ice-type attacks, while Thundurus-T resists Grass-, Flying-, and Electric-type moves. In addition, Keldeo can also break through Chansey easily or sweep after Thundurus-T wallbreaks. Aegislash, Tyranitar, and Scizor can easily switch into Latios and Latias. Aegislash and Tyranitar can Pursuit trap them, while Scizor has a slow U-Turn to get Thundurus-T in for free.

Agility
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name: Agility
move 1: Agility
move 2: Thunderbolt
move 3: Hidden Power Flying / Hidden Power Ice
move 4: Focus Blast / Psychic
ability: Volt Absorb
item: Life Orb
evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Modest

Moves
========

This Thundurus-T boosts its Speed with Agility to be nearly impossible to revenge kill. Thunderbolt is its strongest reliable STAB attack. Hidden Power Flying is a secondary STAB that hits Grass-types hard, especially Mega Venusaur. Hidden Power Ice can also be used to hit Dragon-types. Focus Blast gets the best coverage with Hidden Power Flying and hits Tyranitar, Excadrill, Kyurem-B, and Heatran super effectively. If not using Hidden Power Flying, Psychic is needed to get past Mega Venusaur. Grass Knot is also an option in the last slot to hit Hippowdon, Quagsire, and Gastrodon harder.

Set Details
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Speed and Special Attack are maximized to be as fast as possible before using Agility and to hit hard. Life Orb is the best item to get a great boost in power. A Modest nature is best since Thundurus-T is boosting its speed, but Timid could be used if you want to outspeed base 100 Speed Pokemon before you boost.

Usage Tips
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Thundurus-T should come in for free on something that it can definitely beat, like Talonflame locked into Brave Bird. It should be used as a late-game cleaner, not in the middle. If its checks are still healthy, then it shouldn't bother setting up, as it will just be forced out. Although it resists Flying-type moves, Choice Band Talonflame can revenge kill it once it drops below 50%.

Team Options
========

Thundurus-T really appreciates hazards to weaken its checks so that it can sweep, and to this end, Deoxys-D is very helpful. Belly Drum Azumarill can often clean up after Thundurus-T comes through, as the two share similar checks in Latias and Mega Venusuar. Latios is a good Defogger to increase Thundurus-T's set up opportunities and can also wallbreak. Keldeo has good defensive synergy, resisting Rock- and Ice-type attacks while Thundurus-T resists Grass-, Electric-, and Flying-type moves. They also share common counters that they can weaken for each other. Scizor checks Latios and Latias well, and can supply a slow U-Turn while threats like Talonflame come in to help Thundurus-T.

Double Booster
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name: Double Booster
move 1: Agility
move 2: Nasty Plot
move 3: Thunderbolt
move 4: Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Flying
ability: Volt Absorb
item: Leftovers / Life Orb
evs: 156 HP / 252 SpA / 100 Spe
nature: Modest

Moves
========

Thundurus-T can set up two different boosts with this set. Agility allows it to outspeed almost anything your opponent could have, while Nasty Plot boosts its Special Attack up to terrifying levels. Thunderbolt is a strong STAB move, while and you have a choice of two Hidden Powers for coverage. Hidden Power Ice gets almost perfect neutral coverage, but Hidden Power Flying is stronger against a neutral target and beats Mega Venusaur.

Set Details
========

The Speed EVs allow Thundurus-T to outspeed Scarf Latios at +2, generally the fastest Pokemon you will come across. After that, Special Attack is maximized with a Modest nature to hit as hard as possible. The rest goes into HP to increase set up opportunities. Leftovers is the better item to set up boosts, but Life Orb could be used for more power.

Usage Tips
========

Double Booster Thundurus-T works like a middle ground between a Nasty Plot set or and an Agility set. Usually, it won't get to do both, so you should pick depending on the team you're facing. If you are facing a more defensive team, set up Nasty Plot mid-game to break walls. If you are facing a more offensive team, set up Agility late (add a hyphen here) game to clean up and sweep. Most of the time, only one will be necessary, although if both are set up it can be very difficult for the opponent to recover. When it comes to setting up, the HP EVs are nice to make it easier, but it is still better to do it on predicted switches so your bulk is preserved for sweeping.

Team Options
========

Deoxys-D is a great teammate to set up entry hazards that wear down Thundurus-T's checks. Mega Pinsir is an effective wallbreaker or sweeper that can pair with Thundurus-T, although it stacks weaknesses. Belly Drum Azumarill can clean up after Thundurus-T goes through the opposing team. Keldeo has great defensive synergy, resisting Rock- and Ice-type attacks while Thundurus-T resists Grass-, Electric-, and Flying-type moves. They also share common counters, so they can sweep after each other. Scizor can offer a slow U-Turn to get Thundurus-T in for free as something like a Pokemon such as Talonflame comes in. Tyranitar, Aegislash, and Bisharp can Pursuit trap Latios and Latias, two of Thundurus-T's biggest checks.

Other Options
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Thundurus-T has a nice Speed tier and access to Volt Switch for a Choice Scarf set, but Choice-locked Electric-type attacks are easy to exploit. U-turn can also be used to grab momentum and weaken Latios and Latias. To this end, Knock Off can be used as Chansey is one of the best counters, and it also hits Latios and Latias. An All-Out Attacker without boosting moves could be used, as well as other moves like Substitute or Taunt. However, in general, Thundurus outclasses Thundurus-T at these other options.

Checks & Counters
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**Extremely Specially Bulky Pokemon**: Tyranitar can take Thunderbolts with ease, but it will lose to Focus Blast. Blissey and Chansey can wall Agility sets with ease, but Nasty Plot sets will break through. Heatran can beat any non-Focus Blast set without Focus Blast with Roar.

** Bulky Dragon-types without a 4x weakness to Ice**: Latios and Latias are two of Thundurus-T's best checks, but Hidden Power Ice can do good damage as they switch in. Kyurem-B can beat it as long as it doesn't have Focus Blast. Assault Vest Goodra is very bulky, but it can't OHKO, and a +2 Hidden Power Ice will 2HKO, so it cannot switch in and win.

**Ground-types**: Excadrill can beat Thundurus-T if it does not have Focus Blast. Specially Defensive Hippowdon beats sets without Grass Knot or Nasty Plot. Mamoswine can't switch in but nearly OHKOs OHKOes with Ice Shard.

**Grass-types**: Mega Venusaur beats sets without Hidden Power Flying or Psychic. Celebi also beats sets that don't have Hidden Power Flying or Nasty Plot.

**Offensive Pressure**: Thundurus-T can be difficult to revenge kill, as when it often uses Agility and resists most priority. The best way to keep it from setting up and destroying your team is by keeping up pressure.
 
Is there any reason we can't just combine agility and NP into one set, and then have double dance as another? The move slashes and ev spreads seem very similar.
 
Wouldn't Double Dancer be a better name for the double booster set as it is basically a specially-based rip off of SD+Agility/Rock Polish (acts like an adaptable DD, hense the name double dancer)
 
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