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Togekiss

alexwolf said:
How do you guys think mixKiss with Work Up would fare in OU?
It gets a very powerful ES to ko frail pokes just like Lucario does and can also KO most physical walls like Skarmory,Ferro and Gliscor.

Edit:Togekiss's ES at +1 is stronger than Lucario's ES at +2!!!
Click to expand...

Togekiss fully invested +1 Atk * 80 * 1,5 = 39240
Lucarios fully invested +2 Atk * 80 = 56000

So unless you use Hustle, its not stronger (and even then it doesn't hits that much harder).

Hustle CB E-Speed is kinda usable, but there is Dragonite who does the same a little weaker but with STAB Outrage.
 
alexwolf said:
How do you guys think mixKiss with Work Up would fare in OU?
It gets a very powerful ES to ko frail pokes just like Lucario does and can also KO most physical walls like Skarmory,Ferro and Gliscor.

Edit:Togekiss's ES at +1 is stronger than Lucario's ES at +2!!!
Click to expand...

I'm assuming that's with Hustle?

Well, I would of thought it wouldn't work so well, but you say it's +1 ES outdamages Luke's +2 ES?! Well, maybe it does have potential.
 
tehy said it. Togekiss is basically relying on Stone Edge-leveled moves

Physical Togekiss isn't all that worth it for the power it brings to the table, and if anybody's actually desperate to use it, a mixed variant is the most competitively viable variant of any physical Togekiss. At all. At least Togekiss can actually use an accurate Flamethrower.
 
Yeah, physical Togekiss isn't really worth it, I'd just stick with NP Togekiss if anything. Speaking of which, I know I haven't seen a single Togekiss on the ladder, which is disheartening, especially considering that you can beat quite a few special attackers one on one when you use a specially defensive spread. For example, take LO Latios - they hit you with Draco Meteor -

252 SpAtk Life Orb Latios Draco Meteor vs 252 HP/252 SpDef Togekiss: 52.14% - 61.23% | 2-3 hits to KO (with Leftovers)

,which obviously will never KO. You either have 1) the choice of Roosting of the damage and tanking either another Draco Meteor ( 26.47% - 31.28% ), or hitting them with Body Slam ( 60% chance to paralyze with Serene Grace ). From there, you can just spam Air Slash and take them out, making Togekiss an excellent Latios counter. The same thing works with most other specially based Dragon-types as well, and even MixMence if they don't use Outrage ( Brick Break does 27.81% - 32.89% ). However, this is all provided you can keep SR off the field, so yeah Rapid Spin is a huge must.
 
Yea, I'd reckon Togekiss also counters Virizion, Celebi, OTR Reuniclus, Volcarona, and Gengar, too. I would hate to face Togekiss if I'm running special HO, lol.

EDIT: Did anyone had success in pulling off a successful wallbreaker Togekiss before? Similarly to Thundurus, it does possess Nasty Plot, 125 SAtk, and a useful special fighting move. To illustrate, +2 Aura Sphere has no problems scoring an OHKO on 252/252+ Tyranitar and scores a 3HKO on Blissey / Chansey (both are 2HKOed after SR if Togekiss is holding Life Orb). Nasty Plot + Air Slash is also brutal. Give it Substitute or Fire Blast, and I can see it being really annoying to take out.

Rotom-W seems like it can readily counter it, though.

PS: alphatron, wouldn't Togekiss T-Wave Volcarona and then paraflinch it to death?
 
It handles all of those pokemon save for volcorona and gengar with thunderbolt (as rare as they've gotten). Volcorona 2hkos with +1 fire blast. I'm assuming volcorona already has a +1 because no volcorona is going to switch in on togekiss and attempt to do anything.

Although it doesn't get STAB, I like Togekiss as the primary stored power user on baton pass teams because arua sphere is better than hp fighting, and flamethrower is better than hp fire. Togekiss doesn't always have to switch out against tyranitar like espeon does (unless you're using sunny day espeon or something) and can keep the chain going if need be.
 
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