Too good for UU?

Footnote

Footnote

When you saw this title, what's the first Pokemon that jumped into your mind?

I've been reading a lot of analyses of previously UU Pokemon lately and most of them seem to say something along the lines of "with the changes in DP, this may be too good for UU" or "with the changes, this thing will be a monster in UU". Needless to say, not everything can be in the top 10% of UU.

What are your opinions about this? Should BL and UU combine to become the new UU? Should something else be done? Does anything need to be done at all? I don't have really strong feelings about it, but I thought it was interesting.

EDIT: Crap, crap, crap! I just realized that this looks like a tier-discussion thread, which is one of the forbidden subjects. For some reason, I didn't really think of it that way in my head. It was more of a "Hmm, that's interesting" kind of thing. So, even if it's tier-related, this is meant to be sort of a general, light UU Pokemon discussion, not a tier-change advocacy.

Also, I was serious with the question in the first sentence of my post. Which previously UU Pokemon do you think got the biggest boost and might be 'too good' for UU?
 
With too many things dropping to UU tier, I think NU tier will now have a real metagame to be played, not only novelty things like Dustox and few usable pokémon.

Or maybe it's time to create some new tiers. With all those new pokémon, it may not be possible to continue with the 3-tier system we have until now.

PS.: Also Footnote, I'm intersted in your sig's challenge, here in Brazil we play with very similar rules in real life tournaments. I just need a week to build a double battle team in DP
 
There really isn't much we can do about it. A tier can only be truly balanced if there is a faux tier both above and below it; this situation exists only with Standard, where there is Ubers above it and BL below it. This can also be the case with UU if we consider NU a faux tier. If we try to define the tiers more clearly, eventually we'll end up with a tier for every single Pokemon. And BL can never combine with UU; in BL, there are the Pokemon that are Standard level but just aren't being used that much at the moment, and Pokemon that fail in Standard but are too strong for UU. Both categories were excluded from UU for a reason.
 
Great Sage said:
There really isn't much we can do about it. A tier can only be truly balanced if there is a faux tier both above and below it; this situation exists only with Standard, where there is Ubers above it and BL below it. This can also be the case with UU if we consider NU a faux tier. If we try to define the tiers more clearly, eventually we'll end up with a tier for every single Pokemon. And BL can never combine with UU; in BL, there are the Pokemon that are Standard level but just aren't being used that much at the moment, and Pokemon that fail in Standard but are too strong for UU. Both categories were excluded from UU for a reason.
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but with nearly 500 pokemon, you don't see BL being able to become its own tier?

it just doesn't make sense to me to have a bunch of pokemon, such as articuno, that you just can't use because they don't belong in UU, but the stuff in standard just murders it
 
Are you talking about the most improved Pokemon?

I guess something like Feraligatr is way to good for UU now. What with physical STAB and Dragon Dance.
 
We should have no Faux Tiers, but just make like 6 tiers where everything fits. BL and something between NU and UU can be done.
Overused
Not So Overused
Underused
Lesser Used
Never Used

Can work, no? >.>

Anyway, I thought of Rapidash myself. Got pretty good improvement.
 
Lou Cypher said:
We should have no Faux Tiers, but just make like 6 tiers where everything fits. BL and something between NU and UU can be done.
Overused
Not So Overused
Underused
Lesser Used
Never Used

Can work, no? >.>

Anyway, I thought of Rapidash myself. Got pretty good improvement.
Click to expand...

What's the point of so many tiers? Why not the tiers from ADV (Uber/OU/Borderline/UU/NU) but have sub-tiers.

Top OU
Mid OU
Bottom OU

Top would be basically team staples, Mid would be pogeys alot of people use, but they aren't as Metagame changing, and bottom would be pokemon that don't really make a huge impact but are still powerful in there own rights, just not as used as others.

Of course, all three sub-tiers would be playable in said tier. (Unlike where Borderline can't be played in UU).
 
Ubers/OU/BL/UU/NU all become seperate tiers. BL easily has enough pokes to be its own tier. Machamp, Yanmega, Feraligatr, Floatzel, Crobat... it might have to be expanded a bit, and include some of the former OU pokemon that just barely made it out of BL in ADV. Stuff like Flygon and Swellow that are completely outclassed might have to be moved. With all the complete shit we got this gen, standards for UU might have to drop, to leave NU for Pachirisu-esque pokes and the usual Ditto/Shuckle/Luvdisc. And Chatot makes UU. Yes it does.

EDIT: Lol this is turning into tier discussion. Can we please leave it open? It's just one thread.
 
Blaziken may be dropping to BL now with Infernape around, but he could be too good for UU I think.

Stupid fire monkey.
 
For me Pogeys like Swellow, Feraligatr, Floatzel, Flygon and cia should become UU rather than BL.

I know how good are Feraligatr and Flygon for UU, but they could be TOP UU don't you think?, still they are easily countered...

DD Feraligatr has a hard time against things like Venasaur (I don't think is BL anymore...), Counter Meganium, Abomasnow, Steelix (Unless it goes BL...), Sleep Powder Tangela, Quagsire, and Tauntin' Pokemon resistant to Water :P

Flygon gets pwned by Lapras, the fast Sharpedo, Floatzel, Blastoise (has problem with CB Flygon obviously), Cloyster, Dewgong, Glaceon if it ends up here :P and the fast Frosslass and other Bulky Waters (Pelipper, Quagsire, Gastrodon, etc).

I guess that the UU Tier would evolve if it includes many of the "actual" BL Pokemon there, an evolution that would make it more interesting, if not BL is gonna be crowded than ever ¬¬
 
flygon might be outclassed by garchomp now, but i think BL would fit it nicely. it's too much of a monster for UU

i also think that the current tiers are fine, but we should drop some of the lower-tier UU's (like pigeot maybe) into NU to expand it a bit and make it more than just uttershit poke's
 
I don't get how the top/middle/bottom structure would work. People playing bottom OU would get pissed at challenges from top OU. The separation of tiers is pointless. It would just add more confusion to the game and further limit the amount of challengers people have open.

The pokemon I first thought of was Regigigas. It's got the stats to be in Ubers but the ability to be in UU.
 
wow i don't see how in any way this is NOT a tier discussion... it started off harmless enough but boy did this puppy evolve. anyway my vote goes out to Piloswine and Sneasel improving the most with actually legitimate evolutions. PS Mamoswine is a beast
 
Floatzel is too good for UU in my opinion, I think Claydol will be overshadowed by Bronzong (better typing), but will still be too good for UU.

Rapidash is a little too good for UU in my opinion too, as he's really only overshadowed by Infernape in OU as it is (for a fire lead, anyway).
 
Again, we can't know for real until we test it out, so why waste time discussing it?

Floatzel seems way too weak for BL though. Claydol will hopefully see some BL action, Rapidash probably won't change
 
The upcoming smogon wi-fi tournament may be a decent way to check some of these things...if only some brave people try them. : P If nothing else, we should get an idea if evasion is annoying or not.
 
Well couldn't we already "test" things now?

I mean, surely we could use a damage calculator and simply find out what "assumed OU" pokemon are beat down by Rapidash, etc..?
 
Eh, simple.

BL is way too large right now. The lower half of this is actually UU, except everybody is sticking to the old ways of thought. OU received a major increase in the power of the top-tier. This shift should carry down throughout the tiers. In otherwords, the standards for OU, BL, and UU are raised. Meaning many pokemon that would rape ADV UU are the DP UU standards. (I love how people play UU to lose standards yet there are still standards) (I also love the double meaning of standards)
 
Edux said:
For me Pogeys like Swellow, Feraligatr, Floatzel, Flygon and cia should become UU rather than BL.

I know how good are Feraligatr and Flygon for UU, but they could be TOP UU don't you think?, still they are easily countered...

DD Feraligatr has a hard time against things like Venasaur (I don't think is BL anymore...), Counter Meganium, Abomasnow, Steelix (Unless it goes BL...), Sleep Powder Tangela, Quagsire, and Tauntin' Pokemon resistant to Water :P

Flygon gets pwned by Lapras, the fast Sharpedo, Floatzel, Blastoise (has problem with CB Flygon obviously), Cloyster, Dewgong, Glaceon if it ends up here :P and the fast Frosslass and other Bulky Waters (Pelipper, Quagsire, Gastrodon, etc).

I guess that the UU Tier would evolve if it includes many of the "actual" BL Pokemon there, an evolution that would make it more interesting, if not BL is gonna be crowded than ever ¬¬
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I have to disagree with you on the big Gator.

With, Ice Punch/EQ/Waterfall/DDance the Gator is possibly too powerfull for UU..
 
The gator is essentially a Gyarados with no intimidate or 4X electric weakness. Still has great attack, better defense but less special, similar speed and the same freakin moveset. I'm almost wondering why he doesn't make standard. But then again, a lot of pokemon aren't making standard.

Dragonite has lost a lot of popularity, and so has some solid electric types of Jolteon and Raikou.
 
Multiple tiers is really useless for the sole reason it LIMITS playability and diversity. The more tiers you add the less available pokemon you can use.
 
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