Metagame Trademarked

SUSPECT FOR HOOPA U IS OVER

The results are

Ban:10
do not ban: 0
Abstain: 1

So with a landslide of 90.90% for ban, hoopa u is now banned in trademarked.

tagging The Immortal


SideNote: Vr for trademarked is almost done (though sub suspect may flip it upside down if banned) and I will try to have it posted by tonight.Some are still being contested but most are cemented and I would be willing to accept any nominations if you cna reasonably prove something deserves a placement or should be higher or lower. Thanks to Funbot28 for creating the doc for in the first place to help with the vr and SamHPL for contributing with some placements. Also to Imperator Romanum for giving some further nom and placement ideas through a vr that he and a few om room users made. Honestly I cant hop on ladder as much as i would like to since I work for a larger part of the day, so honestly any nominations are greatly appreciated.

Edit: and Ktütverde for contributing alot as well lol. Sorry memory bad lol and it was late for me when I was posting
 
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I'm sorry for picking apart another post, but how is Buzzwole one of the best sub abusers in the meta and Conk sucks as a sub user? Conk has a 100+ HP sub, STAB FPunch and access to Knock Off, it's slightly stronger than Buzz and way slower, fitting TR well. If we were to ban the sub users
ktüt mentioned, I'm sure Conk would take its place in many teams. Not having Roost is not really relevant for as long as Wish is still allowed. (Taunt I guess? lol)

As for the Wish vs Sub debate, even tho I had a Wish Chansey in my team, between just the sheer pressure of Sub Tran + TSpikes and the recovery from Lefties + Protect, most matches I didn't even need Wish healing for Tran. I'm sure banning Chansey or even Wish wouldn't change how oppressive Sub is, both at teambuilding and during a battle.
oh i think ypu read it wrong. i think both should be banned although i feel like wish before sub to test. sub woul d still prob be broken agreed . now that i think about it conk maybe could be good but the teams ive used so far havent been hurt by it at all. maybe i could be more open minded to its effects on other teams bit 2bh i havent seen it do well yet.
 
SUSPECT FOR HOOPA U IS OVER

The results are

Ban:10
do not ban: 0
Abstain: 1

So with a landslide of 90.90% for ban, hoopa u is now banned in trademarked.

tagging The Immortal


SideNote: Vr for trademarked is almost done (though sub suspect may flip it upside down if banned) and I will try to have it posted by tonight.Some are still being contested but most are cemented and I would be willing to accept any nominations if you cna reasonably prove something deserves a placement or should be higher or lower. Thanks to Funbot28 for creating the doc for in the first place to help with the vr and SamHPL for contributing with some placements. Also to Imperator Romanum for giving some further nom and placement ideas through a vr that he and a few om room users made. Honestly I cant hop on ladder as much as i would like to since I work for a larger part of the day, so honestly any nominations are greatly appreciated
For the VR, please put Crabominable in D. It's an excellent abuser of sub+focus punch, as well as being able to shit on stuff in trick room. I can pull up some replays, but they are pre-hoopa-u ban. I'll make a team with it to try to get reqs for sub suspect and post replays here.
 
176213


I'm voting BAN.

I didn't even know if I was gonna actually go for reqs and was just trying some stuff out at low ladder and decided to use Clefable's team. I just kept playing not even really thinking about it and ended up only realizing how close I was when I was at like 25 games. Really, really fun team (more fun to use than mine lol) and Mirror Move Koko is a godsend against the Sub Tran spam that has been going on. The Eject Button spam + MM + MF give you a lot of options on how to handle threats and that's fun. Still, as fun as the team is, it's another showing of how strong Sub Tran is, and just Sub in general.
 
Yeah yeah I don't have reqs to vote, but I might as well put down what I think about Substitute in Trademarked.

Simply put: Substitute should not remain legal in Trademarked because it enables unfairly-easy win conditions for any team. It doesn't matter what kind of team you're running or playstyle you're aiming to use; Substitute grants you an easier and sometimes undeserving victory by allowing a nearly-free setup opportunity with very limited risk or counterplay against it.

On Offensive teams, Substitute enables a free switchin or setup opportunity for your cleaner or sweeper to run over the opponent. Now you don't have to worry about poor defenses or setup availability nearly as much as before, because more often than not it's a freebie for you. On Defensive and especially Balance teams, however, Substitute just becomes insulting. On top of supplying the user with an easy switchin, it also has the benefits of a free recovery with Wish, additional defenses with Screens, easier hazard removal with Defog, and the ability to set up whatever it well pleases with the free time it's given, on top of (and this is the big one) not burdening any momentum your team may have. This means your Stall core can now run offensive pressure with a random Substitute sweeper like Kartana because it can afford the space, or a setup enabler like Breloom because it now has a free opportunity to mess up the opponent, or a booster like Victini or Kommo-o because your opponent will have to adapt to the new change in pace you brought in while you can set it up without issue.

The last example explains exactly what I think the problem with Substitute is: It lets the player easily set up new rules for the match while forcing the opponent to play by them. Even though there are ways to combat Substitute so that it doesn't become inherently overpowered, the sheer amount of free pressure it puts on the opponent for the simple reason of running it is incredibly unhealthy, especially with Wish users (hi, Chansey) granting them free entry to do whatever they want for almost no real cost.

In short, Substitute allows effortless turnarounds and pressure to the point that it's pretty much as bad as allowing Sleep moves in Trademarked, and has every reason to be banned.
 
I have to say that while chansey makes sub problematic, the other way round works too: imagine pairing chansey with a pokemon able to make infinite disguises: that's pretty much the concept of shedinja stall but with something totally safe and strong over shedinja.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-911890796 : reminder of sub's insanity and 100% safe use of it.
Sub isn't as safe as infinite Disguise would be - you lose 25% if you have 25% to lose. Sub mons without reliable recovery or Wish support can effectively be damaged by forcing them out, since they're going to lose 25% plus hazard damage when they come back in.

In this case, Kommo-o forces out Alolawak and then gets sacced to MMaw, but if Kommo-o had been kept alive, it could've forced out or KOed Alolawak on the second switchin (assuming rocks stayed up) even under TR:

252+ Atk Thick Club Marowak-Alola Shadow Bone vs. 4 HP / 0- Def Kommo-o: 202-238 (69.1 - 81.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 SpA Kommo-o Clanging Scales vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Marowak-Alola: 144-169 (44.4 - 52.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

If you're playing CAP (which is what I know best; I don't play standard tiers much), you're running Tomohawk (a physical wall with Prankster Haze and Roost) as your only answer to Cawmodore (a Belly Drum sweeper), and you see a Cawm in team preview, you have to make sure your Tomo can live a +6 Bullet Punch so it can Haze off the BD. Sub attackers, like Cawmodore, are things you have to prepare for and play around - but there are a variety of answers to them that can put in other work. In the case of Cawmodore, Tomohawk was the physically defensive mon til gen 7 brought in more Fairies, and Kommonium Z Kommo-o would still be a strong setup sweeper with a sound move.

I'm sorry for picking apart another post, but how is Buzzwole one of the best sub abusers in the meta and Conk sucks as a sub user?
Buzzwole has more physical bulk (important for a physical Sub user, since even the threat of a broken Sub forces it out if there's a WoW TM in the back) and reliable recovery in Roost, whereas the only advantage Conkeldurr has over Buzzwole is access to Knock Off.

Reliable recovery makes a big difference in longer games - without it, your opponent will have a much easier time whittling your Sub user down to below 25% + hazards. If Conk has to come in on something, your opponent can just switch to a Reflect / Cotton Guard / Iron Defense mon or a defensive Fighting resist like Toxapex, and then what do you do?
 
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When I saw myself consistently winning with a copypasted sample team that everyone in the meta should be prepared for, to the extent that I peaked at 12th and 15th on the ladder with two separate alts, I knew that something was rotten in the state of Trademarked. The exact nature of that “something” is pretty clear—namely, Substitute. Here are some of the things I’ve seen people running as Substitute answers, in case you don’t think it’s a problem:
-Primarina
-Meloetta
-Noivern
-Swellow
-Infiltrator Chandelure
-Hoopa-Confined
-Chatot
-Flash Fire Air Balloon Heatran, which hard counters the common Sub Heatran set
-An honest-to-God Infiltrator Jumpluff

I have Heatran as my Substitute user, and it’s absolutely ridiculous. Even the things that theoretically check it can lose to it. The only things that can even remotely switch into it are bulky Water-types and other Sub users, and even then, the Water-types take a solid chunk from Magma Storm and get trapped. It’s also one of the best scouting Pokémon out there—just clicking Protect and switching into Me First/Mirror Move/[insert other appropriate response] is one of the least risky strategies I’ve ever adopted in any game. That strategy alone completely invalidates every offensive playstyle. I’ve beaten teams that were specifically built around countering Substitute. I’ve won against competent, well-put-together teams with a team of Heatran and five bad memes. Substitute has carried me to near the top of the ladder multiple times. It’s completely braindead, nearly impossible to reliably beat, and severely restricts teambuilding. For those reasons, I, and everyone else on the ladder, believe that Substitute should be banned with extreme prejudice.
 

Imperator Romanum

formerly Grains of Salt
Ladies and gentlemen, step right up step right up!

Is substitute Heatran setting your defensive cores ablaze? Are you finding Marowak-A impossible to switch into? Does Chansey make you want to pull your hair out?

Well, look no further! I bring you the next generation of Trademarked memes; one pokemon and one set that can make all your dreams come true!


I present, Trick Assault vest Tapu Fini!

176269


Tapu Fini @ Assault Vest
Ability: trick
EVs: 248 HP / 64 Def / 12 SpA / 176 SpD / 8 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Scald
- Nature's Madness
- Taunt

Alright alright, I'll stop now.

Trick Tapu Fini was inspired by a switcheroo Noivern I saw on the ladder. Tapu Fini has a couple things over most of the other trick users, like Mew/Victini/Togekiss etc. mainly its excellent water/fairy typing alongside its natural bulk and access to defog/taunt and other utility moves. The set is very standard and is nothing out of the ordinary so I won't spend much time explaining it (12 SpA for the guranteed 2HKO on offensive Heatran and 8 speed for speed creeps)

Trick in the current metagame

Trick is shockingly effective against the metagame right now. Most teams on the ladder are built around a combination of two or more of these five playstyles; wish-sub cores, hazard dominance, stall, trick room and volt-turn. If you use Tapu Fini right you can cripple all of these playstyles.

Note: Tapu Fini wont break these cores alone, it's not a wall or stallbreaker - it's meant to cripple your opponents team by throwing a wrench, or in this case Assault vest, in their plan.

Wish Chansey

Tapu Fini is one of the few ways to reliably decimate Chansey cores. If your pokemon is faster than Chansey you can hard switch into Tapu Fini and swap its eviolite out with your Assault Vest - essentially neutralising Chansey as a reliable wish passer for the rest of the game. It can't use protect, status you or heal up in a prolonged fight.

Substitute

Here I'm mainly referring to Heatran, Excadrill, Celesteela and Marowak-A. The first three function best when they can use their status moves. Taunt for Heatran, Rocks for Excadrill and Leech seed for Celesteela. Without access to these mons they're significantly easier to handle. Chansey can 1v1 Heatran without Taunt, Excadrill can't toxic or put up rocks and Celesteela can't sit behind a substitute leeching of your team. Give them a gift and watch your opponent try to win without their stallbreaker or hazard setter. Marowak-A is the most fun though, not only will you prevent them from Swords dancing up but Trick removes their Thick Club - making them laughably weak. Adamant Flare Blitz only has a 6% chance to 3HKO Chansey.
Unfortunately you won't really beat the rest of the sub users, Buzzwole and Tyranitar don't care if they have assault vest or not.

Volt-turn & Hazard dominance

With some insight into your opponents team and who their hazard controllers are, for example Defog Zapdos/Landours-Therian/Koko, a well placed trick can shift the hazard domain into your hands. Usually they have either defog or recovery/stealth rock/reflect as their TM, Assault vest will either prevent them from defogging outright or recovering more health.

Trick Room

Probably the worst match up for this mon, but Trick Room can still be used effectively to neutralise powerful wallbreakers like Marowa-A, Specs Xurkitree, Primarina and Stakataka. You can also Trick Assault Vest to their secondary Trick Room setter to prevent them from setting up more Trick Rooms.

Stall

Here is where Tapu Fini can really shine. I've added a replay of me using the set against SamHPLs stall team below to showcase how Tapu Fini can cripple your opponent. Stall applies less offensive pressure which allows you to really stock around your opponents items over a long game. A lot of the stall teams use Assault Vest Magearna and that's great news, now you can give your assault vest to their Chansey and then take Magearnas Assault Vest and pass it along to their Heatran or Pursuit trapper. Tapu Fini also has Nature's madness and taunt which is even more annoying to stall.


http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-914233533 (Facing off versus SamHPL s stall-team)
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-914277363 (Another stall team)
 
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Ktütverde

Ban haxx, but only from the opponent
is a Tiering Contributoris the defending PU Circuit Champion
SUSPECT FOR HOOPA U IS OVER

The results are

Ban:10
do not ban: 0
Abstain: 1

So with a landslide of 90.90% for ban, hoopa u is now banned in trademarked.

tagging The Immortal


SideNote: Vr for trademarked is almost done (though sub suspect may flip it upside down if banned) and I will try to have it posted by tonight.Some are still being contested but most are cemented and I would be willing to accept any nominations if you cna reasonably prove something deserves a placement or should be higher or lower. Thanks to Funbot28 for creating the doc for in the first place to help with the vr and SamHPL for contributing with some placements. Also to Imperator Romanum for giving some further nom and placement ideas through a vr that he and a few om room users made. Honestly I cant hop on ladder as much as i would like to since I work for a larger part of the day, so honestly any nominations are greatly appreciated
It's not like I didn't enjoy contributing and doing most of the VR structure with Funbot, but I would appreciate not being forgotten and seeing SamHPL being thanked for a couple meaningless things, you know.

Also if it isn't clear enough, buzzwole completely outclasses conkeldurr and actually checks landorus and garchomp. Also has many more useful resists, better bulk, better speed. Don't use it in TR it 's not strong enough and has to predict too much, unlike sub marowak-alola which totally outclasses it there. Try it out first before ranking it where it doesn't belong at all, besides it's not even better than buzzwole on paper, so I really don't understand what is not obvious in my statement.

edit (to avoid double posting):
Ladies and gentlemen, step right up step right up!

Is substitute Heatran setting your defensive cores ablaze? Are you finding Marowak-A impossible to switch into? Does Chansey make you want to pull your hair out?

Well, look no further! I bring you the next generation of Trademarked memes; one pokemon and one set that can make all your dreams come true!


I present, Trick Assault vest Tapu Fini!

View attachment 176269

Tapu Fini @ Assault Vest
Ability: trick
EVs: 248 HP / 64 Def / 12 SpA / 176 SpD / 8 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Scald
- Nature's Madness
- Taunt

Alright alright, I'll stop now.

Trick Tapu Fini was inspired by a switcheroo Noivern I saw on the ladder. Tapu Fini has a couple things over most of the other trick users, like Mew/Victini/Togekiss etc. mainly its excellent water/fairy typing alongside its natural bulk and access to defog/taunt and other utility moves. The set is very standard and is nothing out of the ordinary so I won't spend much time explaining it (12 SpA for the guranteed 2HKO on offensive Heatran and 8 speed for speed creeps)

Trick in the current metagame

Trick is shockingly effective against the metagame right now. Most teams on the ladder are built around a combination of two or more of these five playstyles; wish-sub cores, hazard dominance, stall, trick room and volt-turn. If you use Tapu Fini right you can cripple all of these playstyles.

Note: Tapu Fini wont break these cores alone, it's not a wall or stallbreaker - it's meant to cripple your opponents team by throwing a wrench, or in this case Assault vest, in their plan.

Wish Chansey

Tapu Fini is one of the few ways to reliably decimate Chansey cores. If your pokemon is faster than Chansey you can hard switch into Tapu Fini and swap its eviolite out with your Assault Vest - essentially neutralising Chansey as a reliable wish passer for the rest of the game. It can't use protect, status you or heal up in a prolonged fight.

Substitute

Here I'm mainly referring to Heatran, Excadrill, Celesteela and Marowak-A. The first three function best when they can use their status moves. Taunt for Heatran, Rocks for Excadrill and Leech seed for Celesteela. Without access to these mons they're significantly easier to handle. Chansey can 1v1 Heatran without Taunt, Excadrill can't toxic or put up rocks and Celesteela can't sit behind a substitute leeching of your team. Give them a gift and watch your opponent try to win without their stallbreaker or hazard setter. Marowak-A is the most fun though, not only will you prevent them from Swords dancing up but Trick removes their Thick Club - making them laughably weak. Adamant Flare Blitz only has a 6% chance to 3HKO Chansey.
Unfortunately you won't really beat the rest of the sub users, Buzzwole and Tyranitar don't care if they have assault vest or not.

Volt-turn & Hazard dominance

With some insight into your opponents team and who their hazard controllers are, for example Defog Zapdos/Landours-Therian/Koko, a well placed trick can shift the hazard domain into your hands. Usually they have either defog or recovery/stealth rock/reflect as their TM, Assault vest will either prevent them from defogging outright or recovering more health.

Trick Room

Probably the worst match up for this mon, but Trick Room can still be used effectively to neutralise powerful wallbreakers like Marowa-A, Specs Xurkitree, Primarina and Stakataka. You can also Trick Assault Vest to their secondary Trick Room setter to prevent them from setting up more Trick Rooms.

Stall

Here is where Tapu Fini can really shine. I've added a replay of me using the set against SamHPLs stall team below to showcase how Tapu Fini can cripple your opponent. Stall applies less offensive pressure which allows you to really stock around your opponents items over a long game. A lot of the stall teams use Assault Vest Magearna and that's great news, now you can give your assault vest to their Chansey and then take Magearnas Assault Vest and pass it along to their Heatran or Pursuit trapper. Tapu Fini also has Nature's madness and taunt which is even more annoying to stall.


http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-914233533 (Facing off versus SamHPL s stall-team)
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-914277363 (Another stall team)
I like the trick+AV concept, but as Clefable likes to say, "switching is broken" in Trademarked. Essentially people will either switch to activate trademarks or attack. Chansey without any moves and just the trademark wish is still extremely good. I don't really imagine trick being very useful since people just hit and run in this tier.
 
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It's not like I didn't enjoy contributing and doing most of the VR structure with Funbot, but I would appreciate not being forgotten and seeing SamHPL being thanked for a couple meaningless things, you know.

Also if it isn't clear enough, buzzwole completely outclasses conkeldurr and actually checks landorus and garchomp. Also has many more useful resists, better bulk, better speed. Don't use it in TR it 's not strong enough and has to predict too much, unlike sub marowak-alola which totally outclasses it there. Try it out first before ranking it where it doesn't belong at all, besides it's not even better than buzzwole on paper, so I really don't understand what is not obvious in my statement.
Nice of you to mention me for no reason lol. And why are you assuming I haven't tried Conk out? The whole reason I suggested Conk getting ranked (I didn't even suggest placement) is because I found a lot of success using it in a TR balance team (the team I used for Hoopa reqs). Now, if you're using a terrible set like LO FPunch-less Conk I can understand why you would think it's bad. Here's the set:

Conkeldurr @ Leftovers
Ability: substitute
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Drain Punch
- Focus Punch
- Earthquake
- Knock Off

I used it alongside Will-o-Wisp Mew on my team, so whenever they brought in something that could wall (like Fini, Pex, etc.) I'd knock them off then get them burned with Mew. Most mons simply don't enjoy getting Focus Punched without lefties and burned, so that combo really helped me break through stuff.
 
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I wanted to share another team I've been working on. A while ago I posted an SD Lucario set that I think is one of the tier's best cleaners. Here it is again:

Lucario @ Life Orb
Ability: Swords Dance
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Extreme Speed
- Close Combat
- Bullet Punch
- Bone Rush

Extremespeed + SD is incredibly strong in every OM that it's allowed in, so why not try it in Trademarked? Lucario does 70%+ to almost everything in the tier with its strong priority attacks while also beating Sub Exca/TTar/Marowak/Tran with Bone Rush. Its biggest weaknesses are Toxapex and Sub fighting types like Buzzwole. That's why I pair it with this Hoopa set:

Hoopa @ Leftovers
Ability: Substitute
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hyperspace Hole
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Nasty Plot

Like Hoopa-U, little Hoopa is the Sub mon that beats other Sub mons. Hyperspace Hole allows Hoopa to switch in on all the stuff that bothers Lucario. What I like about the Luc + Hoopa core is the fact that both mons take advantage of Chansey and both fit well on a hazard stacking team. Because I rely on Hoopa for grindy matchups, Lefties is the preferred item.

I built a full team around this core which ended up pretty interesting I think, so here's a mini RMT.
Lucario @ Life Orb
Ability: Swords Dance
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Extreme Speed
- Bullet Punch
- Bone Rush

Hoopa @ Leftovers
Ability: Substitute
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hyperspace Hole
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Nasty Plot

Aerodactyl-Mega @ Aerodactylite
Ability: Stealth Rock
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pursuit
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang

Roserade @ Eject Button
Ability: Spikes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Toxic Spikes
- Leaf Storm
- Sleep Powder
- Hidden Power [Ground]

Magearna @ Fairium Z
Ability: Heal Bell
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Protect
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Fleur Cannon

Alomomola @ Eject Button
Ability: Wish
EVs: 248 HP / 16 Def / 240 SpD / 4 Spe
Impish Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Toxic
- Protect
- Healing Wish
Lucario + Hoopa: See above


Lucario's home is on Spikestack Offense, and Rocks Maero is half of the spike stacking core. I chose Mega Aero because I wanted a speedy Pursuit user to pick off ghosts who would stop a Lucario sweep that could also set rocks. Edgequake is for general coverage, Ice Fang is for Lando/Chomp, Fire Fang for Kartana would also be reasonable to run but idk where it'd go.


Roserade's purpose is to set Spikes and absorb Toxic Spikes, which is important so that Hoopa doesn't lose to Chansey + Pex or other obnoxious cores like that. Eject Button allows it to function as a one-time "volt switch immunity". Leaf Storm + HP Ground let Rade hit pretty hard while not being total Tran fodder. Toxic Spikes and Sleep Powder can sometimes win games, but most of the time you'll be foddering Rade for free spikes and switches.


Random Will-O-Wispers really irritate most of the mons on this team, and Heal Bell Magearna is an easy to use cleric that ensures your Lucario sweep stays alive. I didn't have a Z-user so I went for Modest Fairium here, but I'm sure the set can be improved somehow. The team so far is somewhat soft to TR, so I added Protect to help run down the turns.


It's so hard to build a successful team without a Wish user, even on HO, so here's Mola. Alomomola + Magearna + MAero is a known core and Mola does an ok job blanket checking physical attackers. Eject Button + Healing Wish prevent it from being a total momentum black hole. For a cooler option that deals with Heatran and Kartana a bit better, you could try out Wish Mence, but I haven't found a set that works for me yet.
These are from a room tour that I ended up winning. In both games the plan was very similar: set up spikes and win with Lucario.

This game shows how Heal Bell Mag can save a sweep:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-915025770

Here's an example of how Bone Rush Lucario can break through Chansey/Heatran cores:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-915033196
I think this tier is far from fully explored and there are a lot of creative sets waiting to be discovered and put to good use. Shoutout to SamHPL who took the Sub Tran + TSpikes idea and turned it into an absolute powerhouse of a team. Even if Sub and Wish end up staying, I think Trademarked will still be fun to build and play.
 
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Heyo i heard yall hate fat mons and screech pursuit trappers, well here is a set that annoys alot of fatter core and gets rid of any dark types

I present to u, mini gothitelle


Klefki @ Choice Band
Ability: fairylock
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Play Rough
- Switcheroo
- Spikes
- Thunder Wave​

"But wait lordhelix, choice band klefki really?"

So how does it work? fairy lock forces you and the opponent to stay in for two turns for if u lead with it or uturn into it for some reason, but if u hard switch it in you trap them in for one turn only (not sure if its oversight or not but i dont really care tbh)

This set enables u to cripple iron defense Skarm, spikes Ferrothorn, and Chansey (altho u dont trap it reliably unless u catch it on a uturn cause it can protect on switchin) by hard switching and tricking to neutralize a threat. Obviously goes without saying it traps annoying ass darks like Hoopa ass-bound and Greninja and screech Tyranitar

So.. yea that basically it, its one dimensional, it traps, it tricks, it sets up a spike

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-902271110
Klefki traps porygon which stops it from healing or setting trick room as easily

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-903922966
Tricks zapdos which is really hard for my team to wear down or switch into and after klefki dies it actually forces hoopa to stay in for two turns for it to get revenged by kartana

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-902263806
Neutralizes togekiss to make it easier to switch in, also annoys with spikes throughout games

I wish i saved more replays, there was this notable stall match where it crippled Chansey on a double and trapped screech pursuit Ttar after it killed my mew which made breaking through the stall so much easier

Also shoutouts to imposter mew, with whirlwind it doubles as a phaser vs sub users and a emergency check to set up sweepers AND annoys fat teams by switching in constantly. It just puts in so much work

Also zhoutouts to sub Heatran and Chansey core that makes me wanna gouge my eyes out as well
 
176581

(Gosh laddering has been awful)

I'm feeling fairly conflicted about Substitute.
I feel like it has been integral to the metagame as a whole and in this laddering session I have had close to no problems with it, since I made changes to my team and (particularly) added a counter to almost all viable substitute users, while having a substitute Alolan-Maroak of my own to with Bonemerang keep them in check.


Primarina @ Leftovers
Ability: Reflect
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Moonblast
- Sparkling Aria
- Psychic/Ice Beam/Psyshock
- Toxic

It is able to deal with Alolan-Maroak, Buzzwole, Conkeldurr, Tyranittar and beats or strongly pressures Heatran, while getting a toxic off on Chansey the opponent might use as an answer after protecting with Heatran, for example. It is not a certain counter to Kommo-o but in principle it should 1v1 it. Note it used under Trick Room, explaining the quiet nature and the 0 speed IV's. I would very much enjoy hearing your opinions.

Here is the team I went 28-2 with (and one of the losses was due to a double misclick.): https://pokepast.es/6a549efe6e409f62
(Gender's set to female against the incredibly rare attract TM and enjoy the fear-based nicknames)

There is no way of denying Substitute has been immensely centralising. Not having one on your team is strictly worse than including it. While I feel Hoopa-Unbound was unfun to both use and play against, I don't feel the same about substitute. As multiple people have said, P-don is incredibly centralising in the Ubers tier, and that is not necessarily problematic. Substitute has a whole lot of viable users and in that sense it promotes variety. However, the Ubers tier has a lot of ways to deal with Primal-Groudon and Trademark is not in the same situation; Primarina is a very good Pokemon, being able to run Rain Dance, Reflect and Light Screen, for example; Hoopa-Confined is a fairly good option if paired with sub but looses to any non-fighting substitute users; Meloetta, Noivern, Swellow, Chandelure (and god sake) Chatot are all incredibly subpar. Not to mention absolutely all of these lose to Alolan-Maroak (especially under TR), Tyranitar and even harder to Heatran. The fact that Primarina is not even sure to beat Heatran and Kommo-o goes to show how overpowered substitute can be. The best way to deal with substitute is to have a user of the trademark yourself. As referred, that makes some matches dependent on the matchup of sub users. It is also exactly the situation which defines over-centrality.

It it hard for me to let Substitute go. It is fun to play with, if frustrating to play against. However, I think the tier is not only centralised around it, but unhealthily so. There are very few non-sub pokemon that can deal with it and it constraints team building too much on that front. I have to vote ban, even though I don't know how to build without substitute; that's probably a good thing for the tier, as Mengy said. For the time being I'm easily swayed, however. I expect to hear your opinion.
 
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It it hard for me to let Substitute go. It is fun to play with, if frustrating to play against. However, I think the tier is not only centralised around it, but unhealthily so. There are very few non-sub pokemon that can deal with it and it constraints team building too much on that front. I have to vote ban, even though I don't know how to build without substitute but that's probably a good thing for the tier, as mengy said. For the time being I'm easily swayed, however. I expect to hear your opinion.
It's crazy how well this sums up my feelings about Sub too. As I talked about how fun Clefable's team was, there was the implication of how fun using Sub can be, too. I can see how it's by nature too strong, but sometimes it feels like only a few sub users (Tran, Maro-A) with proper support (TSpikes, Defog) really feel like too much. I have already voted pro ban, but maybe if there's a good enough point my opinion could change. Still, regardless of it all, it's clear that Sub is at the very least extremely centralizing. I'm curious for what possibilties would open up in a Sub-less metagame, not that it necessarily matters for the suspect tho.
 
Hi everybody. Although I've been playing PS for 6 years, this is my first time posting in Smogon. Ever. The debate on banning sub really got me into this. I personally enjoy sub. I dislike Wish Chansey more. This is why I built this team:


This team has evolved step by step, first being anti-TrickRoom, then anti-Chansey, and now currently trying to be anti-stall. It has elements that work against all three. It's not perfect, but it's been my most successful Trademarked team so far. (1415 rating, 68 W/ 60L (not all with this team, but I've easily played 40+ games with all the iterations of this team))
176617



Primarina @ Leftovers
Ability: substitute
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Sparkling Aria
- Moonblast
- Toxic
- Protect
Primarina is almost always the lead. For me it is the best sub-user (great bulk + typing + power), and the best anti-sub (great sound move + tanks hits + good lure for counters). Sparkling Aria hits Kartana hard, with a 80% chance to OHKO if Kartana used sub. 2HKO's Victini even under the Sun, before the V-Create SpDef drop. Sub-Heatran, Excadrill, Buzzwole, and my personal favorite, Kommo-o, fall prey to it. **It used to have Ice Beam**, but I swapped it for Toxic so I can hurt Chansey. Like I said, this team is made for Chanseys, and since Primarina is such a good lure for Chanseys...


Gengar @ Black Sludge
Ability: trick
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Destiny Bond
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Wave
- Taunt
Once Chansey takes a SA or a Moonblast, she'll try to Toxic me or break my sub with Seismic Toss. In comes Gengar, swapping out her Eviolite for some nasty Black Sludge. Outside of rare T-Wave variants, Chansey does SQUAT to Gengar. So she'll have to switch, giving Gengar a free shot to do some damage, Taunt, or set up a Destiny Bond. **It used to have Sticky Barb, so it could also hurt Toxapex right off the bat**, but I realize that with the shenanigans that Gengar causes, Gengar will have some other item by the time I switch into a Toxapex. Imperator Romanum is right when he says that Trick is great in this meta. Gengar is a great spinblocker & Toxic Spikes remover as well. My favorite plays are made with this guy. I once gave an AV to a Chansey and it was hilarious. Black Sludge is a low key poison that allows me to stall out A-Marowak and other threats. Gengar is a good revenge killer against Scarf Manaphy/Xurki/Victini, as you take their Scarf in the switch-in. Gengar attracts a lot of Magearnas, so in comes...


Claydol @ Leftovers
Ability: trickroom
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 5 Spe
- Rapid Spin
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
Trick Room Claydol. Yeah, that's right. It's special bulk is nothing to laugh at, as it is 3HKO'd by Magearna's Ice Beam and has even survived Shadow Balls from Blacephalons. Trick Room as an ability was chosen not to make this a Trick Room team, but after losing so much to teams featuring TR Magearna or Stakataka, I figured this out; Claydol can take a hit from them, shut down their TR, and either hurt them with a solid EQ, setup my own hazards, or clear up the opponent's. **I have swapped places with SR and TR** after facing once particular stall team, in which I realized I needed more hazards to beat stall with this team. However, at the end of the day, since I only have two fast pokemon, TR is what saves me from being swept by fast set up and Scarfed pokemon. The 5 speed IVs are so it outspeeds Mega Mawile under TR. Toxic is there so I can also hurt Chansey, EQ hits Toxapex, but I got nothing for Ferrothorn, so in comes...


Chesnaught @ Leftovers
Ability: spikes
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Leech Seed
- Spiky Shield
- Drain Punch
- Earthquake
One of the most recent additions, Chesnaught was the wake up call to my lack of hazards (**he used to be a Curse Mega Heracross with 4 multi-hit moves. Sadly the weakest link back then**). He can reliably switch in, set up Spikes, and take a hit. Resists all of Ferro's moves and forces him out. **He used to be a Sub-Puncher,** but I realized that setting up that Sub was kinda slow and unreliable, especially against things like Ice Punch Mega Swampert. Spiky Shield + Drain Punch is more reliable and gives me more longevity. Having now two Protect moves on the team allows me to stall out a burned, Black Sludge'd 6+ Linoone better than before (recently lost to this). Also allows me to stall out Alolan Marowaks under TR and Victinis under the sun better. At 64 Base Speed, it sits just below's Magearna's speed tier, so under TR this boy can hit Maggy with a nasty surprise EQ. I am vulnerable now to Scald burns against Toxapex though, which was also a reason to have subs. I cant have it all, though. So I needed someone to take burns (and dish out some as well)...


Volcanion @ Assault Vest
Ability: willowisp
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Steam Eruption
- Fire Blast
- Sludge Wave
- Earth Power
The reliable tank without reliable recovery. Or, he doesn't have recovery at all. That doesnt matter to me, at least; by the time he's dead, he's soaked up several Will-o-Wisp's and, in return, burnt several Swords Dancers such as Kartana & Lando-T, and also Toxapex's as I can't Toxic them. Volcanion has great natural bulk, so with AV and Will-o-Wisp, he can take all sorts of hits and live. Great switch in against Victini, Kartana, Magearna, Primarina, etc. Its powerful, varied movepool forces lots of switches, which is good for me if I have my spikes and rocks set up. Once Chansey is dead, Volcanion is free to hit hard. It synergizes great with the rest of the team, so it is a good lure for many walls, and its team members can take hits for him. 70 base speed is the awkward middle stage of Pokemon; however, in a half TR, half normal team, its great, as under the right conditions,it can sweep both sweepers or walls. It's typing makes it the most vulnerable against SR however, and so far I have no Flying types...


Aerodactyl @ Aerodactylite
Ability: honeclaws
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Fire Fang
- Defog
The rookie. **After its previous iteration, SD Acrobatics Talonflame** fell time and time again to many bulky Zapdos', I realized I needed something to kill Zapdos, but can also take in a Heat Wave, only take SR damage, and be faster than things like Greninja. After seeing that the only other fast, physical Flying-type was Aerodactyl, I swapped in my team's second burn immunity for an arguably better pokemon. Better bulk, a Mega with better natural offensive stats (after Maggy takes the boosts away with Heart Swap), an actual ability, better coverage (for Skarm, Toxa, Ferro, Maggy), a speed tier only rivaled by Mega Zam (bye bye Zeraora), a Normal resistance (tho Linoone one-shots Mega Aero anyway), a slot to use Defog when hazards get out of hand and only 25% taken from SR, Aero is proving to be a worthy replacement. Haven't gotten the chance to Stone Edge a Zapdos to death tho.

Threats include heavy stall cores such as Chansey+Toxa+Ferro, as they can wear me down hard using hazards. That's why I recently added Defog to Aerodactyl. To me, Sub can be worn down, so I wouldn't say to ban. However, my sub alt is still underway, so I'll be back when I got the requirements.

176618


I post a lot of replays in case evidence. My last few matches were losses, I'm finally facing people in the 1500's and I'm finally seeing some new strategies.

Yes I like Migos, in case you're wondering. Yes, I know I have some lyrics wrong.

Primarina @ Leftovers
Ability: substitute
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Sparkling Aria
- Moonblast
- Toxic
- Protect

Gengar @ Black Sludge
Ability: trick
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Destiny Bond
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Wave
- Taunt

Claydol @ Leftovers
Ability: trickroom
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 5 Spe
- Rapid Spin
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic

Chesnaught @ Leftovers
Ability: spikes
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Leech Seed
- Spiky Shield
- Drain Punch
- Earthquake

Volcanion @ Assault Vest
Ability: willowisp
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Steam Eruption
- Fire Blast
- Sludge Wave
- Earth Power

Aerodactyl @ Aerodactylite
Ability: honeclaws
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Fire Fang
- Defog
 
Ribombee @ Choice Scarf Ability: Sticky Web EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe Timid Nature - U-turn - Moonblast - Bug Buzz - Hidden Power [Ice]
Landorus-Therian @ Choice Band  Ability: Gravity EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe Jolly Nature - Earthquake - U-turn - Stone Edge - Knock Off
Garchomp @ Lum Berry    Ability: Swords Dance  EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe  Jolly Nature  - Dual Chop  - Earthquake  - Stone Edge  - Fire Fang


Not many posts recently so I wanted to share a fun idea I've been toying with.
We all know how dangerous Sticky Web HO can be, but it has some serious flaws in Inheritance:

- Many of the tier's threats boost Speed upon switching in (Volcarona, Kartana, Lando)
- Fast flying type mons roam the tier (Mega Aerodactyl, Archeops ... Lando)
- The tier is filled with autodefoggers, many of which are also flying type (Zapdos, Skarmory, and, you guessed it, Lando)
- Trick Room is very, very strong (Phew, no Lando here)

One fun way to patch these flaws is with the move Gravity, set by Landorus. Webs + Gravity work together quite nicely. Landorus appreciates the guaranteed speed drop from webs, which allows us to spam EQ without worrying as much about getting revenged. SD Garchomp is an awesome abuser of both webs and gravity, and double ground spam gives us a good matchup versus TR, which tends to stack ground-weak mons. Plus, autofoggers can't switch into EQ when gravity is up.

This still leaves us weak to speed boosting mons, but oh well.

Here's the core in a bit more detail:
Ribombee @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sticky Web
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- U-turn
- Moonblast
- Bug Buzz
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Ribombee is the only viable Webs setter in my opinion. It's not total deadweight with a momentum move, a spammable STAB, and a move that hits through Sub. I run Scarf since Ribo is fast enough to outpace some -1 spe Tailwind users. With Gravity, Ribombee can end up being our only EQ switchin, so HP Ice is for enemy Landos, but Aromatherapy/Defog/Trick/anything else could work in that slot.
Landorus-Therian @ Choice Band
Ability: Gravity
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Stone Edge
- Knock Off

With Gravity up, Landorus is free to spam strong Ground moves and take lives. I prefer Choice Band to something like Groundium just to maximize immediate damage output. Soft Sand + SD could be another idea, but why settle for 1.2x damage when you are clicking EQ 9000% of the time?

edit: I've been playing with another Lando set, not for the faint of heart:

Landorus-Therian @ Choice Specs
Ability: Gravity
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Earth Power
- Sludge Bomb
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- U-turn

Why Specs? Well, lots of defensive teams have Willo Cofag or Mew as their main Lando switchin, and both of those get blown back by EPower. I wouldn't say this set is better than the Band set (Lando walled by Chansey lol), but it gets the 2HKOs it needs, and if the rest of your team ends up being a bunch of physical attackers it could be a reasonable choice.
Garchomp @ Lum Berry
Ability: Swords Dance
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dual Chop
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Fire Fang

I was surprised when I started testing this how incredibly effective this Garchomp set is. It hits really hard thanks to SD, but no Heart Swap/Haze users can switch into it, nor can Willo users thanks to Lum. It has the bulk to take a neutral hit, the speed to outpace QD Volcarona, and unlike choiced sets, it can switch moves freely to take advantage of its good coverage. Dual Chop lets it muscle past some Sub users.

What I like about this core is that it's aggressive and easy to build around. It gives you a game plan and two win cons but leaves open your choice of Sub mon, Z user, and Mega. The core doesn't provide everything (no hazards, buzzwole/prima weak, dies at the thought of an ice move) but it's a good starting point. I threw together a team really quickly that I think is fun and works well, though it can definitely be improved.
Ribombee @ Choice Scarf
Ability: stickyweb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Bug Buzz
- Moonblast
- U-turn
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Landorus-Therian @ Choice Band
Ability: gravity
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Stone Edge
- Knock Off

Garchomp @ Lum Berry
Ability: swordsdance
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dual Chop
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Fire Fang

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: substitute
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Magma Storm
- Earth Power
- Toxic
- Taunt

Ferrothorn @ Eject Button
Ability: spikes
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Protect
- Bullet Seed
- Gyro Ball
- Knock Off

Gardevoir-Mega @ Gardevoirite
Ability: willowisp
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Heal Bell
- Healing Wish
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
Here's a battle where the wincon was just clicking EQ in Gravity:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-916922715

Was having some fun on a joint account. Sub Buzzwole is tough but can be overwhelmed by the squad:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-918279169

Replay showing how Specs Lando can break through Will-O-Wisp cores:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-919791338

Specs Lando still gets the necessary damage on Ferrothorn:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7trademarked-918548463
 
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Quick post, sorry for double post:

The month is over, the metagame is done, and the Substitute test is about to wrap up. I'm changing my vote to DO NOT BAN.

Yes, Substitute is busted. But the meta is still fun to play, and every single one of my teams has a Sub user. I don't want to lose all of my teams right when the month ends.

It's not just my teams – all the competitive teams I've seen on the ladder have a Sub user. If we invalidate all competitive teams right when the month ends, Trademarked will never become an established OM. There will be no way to reintroduce it in OM tours because nobody will have a legal team or have any grasp on the metagame.

I think that's a sad future for a meta as fun as this one. Alucs, SamHPL, alephgalactus, Imperator Romanum, Whitephoenixace, I hope you see this and consider making a pragmatic decision to let Sub stay.
 
Quick post, sorry for double post:

The month is over, the metagame is done, and the Substitute test is about to wrap up. I'm changing my vote to DO NOT BAN.

Yes, Substitute is busted. But the meta is still fun to play, and every single one of my teams has a Sub user. I don't want to lose all of my teams right when the month ends.

It's not just my teams – all the competitive teams I've seen on the ladder have a Sub user. If we invalidate all competitive teams right when the month ends, Trademarked will never become an established OM. There will be no way to reintroduce it in OM tours because nobody will have a legal team or have any grasp on the metagame.

I think that's a sad future for a meta as fun as this one. Alucs, SamHPL, alephgalactus, Imperator Romanum, Whitephoenixace, I hope you see this and consider making a pragmatic decision to let Sub stay.
Really? I doubt that will happen. If your worry is that “nobody will have a legal team or a grasp on the metagame”, remember that that’s the way every OM starts out. Trademarked won’t be in any worse of a position than it was at the very beginning of its lifetime. Besides, people can still make and test teams on other servers after the end of the month. This meta is coming back eventually, one way or another.
 

Imperator Romanum

formerly Grains of Salt
Quick post, sorry for double post:

The month is over, the metagame is done, and the Substitute test is about to wrap up. I'm changing my vote to DO NOT BAN.

Yes, Substitute is busted. But the meta is still fun to play, and every single one of my teams has a Sub user. I don't want to lose all of my teams right when the month ends.

It's not just my teams – all the competitive teams I've seen on the ladder have a Sub user. If we invalidate all competitive teams right when the month ends, Trademarked will never become an established OM. There will be no way to reintroduce it in OM tours because nobody will have a legal team or have any grasp on the metagame.

I think that's a sad future for a meta as fun as this one. Alucs, SamHPL, alephgalactus, Imperator Romanum, Whitephoenixace, I hope you see this and consider making a pragmatic decision to let Sub stay.
you're going to lose all your team regardless lmao, it wont be eligible for omotm again until after Sword and Shield is out my man
 
Yeah, I see I'm in the minority here, and I see your points. I'll enjoy the craziness while it lasts. Maybe we'll enjoy a post-ban renaissance of new Trademarked ideas.

Also, last chance to get reqs in!
 

Ransei

is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Battle Simulator Moderator
Moderator
you're going to lose all your team regardless lmao, it wont be eligible for omotm again until after Sword and Shield is out my man
Despite not having a ladder for at least another four months, we all still have access to this metagame on https://rom.psim.us, and trademarked tournaments can / will be be hosted there, especially for those who would like to play after this suspect's outcome.

Won't be the end of the world without a ladder.
 
End of the month coming, so I'm gonna share the other team I built after sharing my old one. It's kind of my take on stall in Trademarked, it's based around putting pressure with hazards and status, and that comes which its pros and cons.



Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Wish
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Seismic Toss
- Soft-Boiled
- Heal Bell
- Protect

Tyranitar @ Choice Band
Ability: dragondance
EVs: 76 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 176 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Pursuit
- Crunch
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake

Excadrill @ Leftovers
Ability: Substitute
EVs: 172 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 80 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Protect
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Rapid Spin

Toxapex @ Black Sludge
Ability: Haze
EVs: 252 HP / 188 Def / 68 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Toxic Spikes
- Scald
- Recover
- Baneful Bunker

Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Ability: Spikes
EVs: 252 HP / 72 Def / 184 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Leech Seed
- Knock Off
- Protect

Mew @ Leftovers
Ability: willowisp
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 Spe
Bold Nature
- Psychic
- Soft-Boiled
- U-turn
- Knock Off

The theme of the team was always supposed to be me setting hazards and then winning the hazards war by having a reliable spinner. Sub Exca with enough HP investment has a Sub that can't be broken in 1 hit by Chansey and has a decent typing, making it a very good choice for the spinner. For compression, I use Spikes Ferro with Rocks in the moveset. Again, instead of running a TSpiker, I use Haze Pex with TSpikes in the moveset because it fits a defensive team better. I knew I needed either Reflect and Will-o-Wisp and each one has its pros and cons: Reflect doesn't miss (lol) and doesn't care about Sub, making it potentially the more reliable choice. Wisp, on the other hand, is permanent (unless they have Heal Bell) and deals damge (!) and that's what makes it the better choice for this team. While when dealing against offense Reflect may be better, spamming burns with Mew is what gives me an edge against many fatter teams, and it does that while still being able to keep physical attackers in check. Chansey is Chansey and TTar is my Pursuit user of choice.

Anyone reading this or checking the team is probably asking themselves "but how do you deal with X?" and chances are you're gonna have to figure out how to deal with X on the run. Yes, chosing Wisp over Reflect makes the team weaker to Sub users and like pretty much all teams, it doesn't have a Sub Tran counter. This team is not as straighfoward to use as my old team (by a longshot) and that may be one of the reasons I actually enjoy using it. I also love that it looks like someone was bulding a SM OU Sand team and just decided to make it a tad too fat lol. There's not much point listing the threats to the team, but "Cleric Offense" (aka Offensive teams that run Defog TM + Heal Bell) are extremely annoying.

If you're still unsure if the team is actually viable (I'm SUB is ez DUB):
177671

(Granted I used Mengy's MF + MM team for the first 30 games, after a loss using a TR team I saw in this thread I only used my team for the rest of the games).
You can also check SUB is ez DUB replays if you want.

I wanna thank Whitephoenixace for trusting me as a council member and Clefable for making and sharing cool teams and ideas. It was a fun month as OMotM, guys!
 

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