So I started playing LC a couple of days ago with a Sand team and did reasonably well, getting to 1700 on PS after playing my 50 provisional games. During that entire time however, I didn't see one single actual hail team, while double sand rush or at least Hippo+Drillbur were seen every second game. Snover is used of course, but mostly as a check to sand teams rather than for a hail team. I decided i'd at least try to make it work myself, and after a bit of experimenting in rated battles trying to make Ice Body work and failing, this is what I came up with. Right now i'm 7th on the LC ladder with this team, 1821 with a record of about 20-3 since I started using it under the name Fralpr.
Unfortunately the pokemon that can benefit from Hail just aren't great stats wise, so i'm almost certain you could replace Cubchoo and Swinub with just about any other pokemon that fufill a similar role without benefitting from hail and do better. Ice type pokemon are also weak to stealth rock, and I opted not to use a spinner in this team despite that, because I have 2 scarfers, 3 priority moves and Mienfoo who shrugs off residual damage like it's nothing, which usually means I can finish threats off without too much switching in and out. But I wanted to use snow cloak, goddamnit.
Snover @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Snow Warning
Level: 5
EVs: 196 Spd / 184 SAtk / 128 Atk
Naive Nature
- Blizzard
- Ice Shard
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Fire]
Obviously a hail teams gonna have Snover. I use him with a Scarf because his weaknesses are very crippling and he's too slow to avoid that problem without it imo. You need to be very careful not to overpredict with him, as if your opponent you thought would switch stays in and uses a HP fire or just about any stab supereffective attack, you're in big trouble. Generally I will Blizzard or Giga Drain to be safe, as these moves will do pretty respectable damage to almost anything even if it resists them, and if your opponent stays in and eats them, that's even better. You can't afford to lose Snover in the early mid game so it's better safe than sorry.
Against other weather teams, especially sand, you need to be very careful with how you use him. While at high health, He can swap into Hippopotatas without a fear except from Toxic, and since he probably won't be staying in for more than 1 or 2 turns or swapping into many attacking moves and thanks to Giga Drain healing, Toxic isn't really that big a deal.
I'm still experimenting with this moveset, but right now I like it. Ice Shard is there because even with a Scarf, some unscarfed, unboosted pokemon like Abra and Diglett outspeed Snover, and killing them often becomes very important lategame, while the other moves provide decent coverage.
Swinub @ Life Orb
Trait: Snow Cloak
Level: 5
EVs: 196 Atk / 196 SDef / 116 Def
Adamant Nature
- Ice Shard
- Icicle Crash
- Earthquake
- Superpower
Swinub kind of sucks, but STAB Ice Shard makes him more useful than the ice body Spheal I initially tried to use in his place. He's so slow and his defenses are so bad that I found that trying to use him for any other reason is pretty pointless. He can swap in to SOME attacks (ie: non-stab attacks/attacks from walls that he isn't weak to), and he can easily outspeed and do enough damage to finish off and 2-3hko almost any defensive pokemon aside from Bronzor. But mostly, he's just here as a blood sacrifice to fast pokemon like Abra incase Lileep isn't available, hitting for good damage with a life orb STAB Ice Shard and then dying, allowing Snover or Mienfoo to clean it up. Sometimes you'll get a Snow Cloak proc and he does more than that, though, which can easily win you the game. Sadly, this is the best use i've found for a hail pokemon that isn't Cubchoo.
Cubchoo @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Snow Cloak
Level: 5
EVs: 76 HP / 200 SAtk / 196 Spd
Timid Nature
- Blizzard
- Surf
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Grass Knot
Similar to Snover, Cubchoo is too slow to really use anything but a scarf effectively. He at least doesn't have the grass typing, so he can usually survive a HP fire from weaker special attackers, or better, dodge it with Snow Cloak. This makes him a much safer option to use in a lot of circumstances, since he and Snover fill similar roles in the team and he is a lot less valuable than Snover as an attacker since he doesn't summon hail, only has 1 STAB and has no priority. Surf and Blizzard are obvious choices, however the other 2 move slots i'm not so sure of - HP fire does almost no damage to Bronzor, which is the pokemon I originally put it into this set for (although it's useful against opposing Snover), and Grass Knot is rarely useful unless you use it on a switch into slowpoke or something.
Lileep @ Eviolite
Trait: Storm Drain
Level: 5
EVs: 228 HP / 220 Def / 60 SDef
Bold Nature
- Toxic
- Stealth Rock
- Giga Drain
- Recover
I needed a decent mixed wall so Lileep was an obvious choice. Lileep can take any of the hits that my ice pokemon can't, though you probably don't want to swap him into a hi jump kick or any high powered super effective move like that - Mienfoo or Ponyta are generally better options there, as they can survive the hit and then at least retaliate on the next turn, while Lileep just dies on the second turn. It's almost impossible not to get rocks up and at least a couple of toxics up before Lileep goes down and if you keep him alive to the late game it can often spell gg because not many teams have more than 2 pokemon that can really threaten it. However, due to the general frailty of the ice pokemon on my team, it's rare that ever happens.
Ponyta @ Choice Band
Trait: Flash Fire
Level: 5
EVs: 4 HP / 196 Spd / 156 Atk / 76 Def / 76 SDef
Jolly Nature
- Body Slam
- Flare Blitz
- Wild Charge
- Double Kick
I needed something to kill Bronzor that can also threaten just about anything else. Yes, Choice Band Ponyta was the answer. No one ever sees this coming. Ponyta will outspeed and 1HKO lots of things that will cockily stay in on it, like non-defensive Scrafty, Croagunk and Mienfoo with Flare Blitz. It can swap in to any of these pokemons unboosted moves, survive one with 50% or higher health, and then 1HKO it. It 1hko's defensive Bronzor and Ferroseed, 2hko's any Hippopotas, and does significant damage to Lileep. Also, Ponyta doesn't fear non-stab Earthquake from walls that like to carry it, as Bronzor commonly does, as its natural bulk is high enough that it will usually only take him to just above half HP.
More often than not, I win the game against Sand teams because my opponent thinks he can safely swap in his 50% HP Hippo into a Flare Blitz, and he promptly loses his weather.
Flash Fire is also such a great ability. It's very easy to bait HP fire or just about any fire attack, what with 3 ice types, and swap in Ponyta for a boost. Ponyta with Flash Fire up becomes a god and will easily 1hko any non-defensive pokemon that doesn't 2x resist Flare Blitz, such as Scarf Chinchoo or Mantyke without Eviolite, which seem to be common switch ins once my opponent realizes their mistake and decides they need to swap in something that resists fire.
Ponyta doesn't have good coverage and will typically only be able to land 1 or 2 kills, or 3 at very most, due to a weakness to stealth rock and having to use recoil moves. Still, it's pretty strong. For an ou comparison, he's basically a fire type Staraptor.
Wild Charge and Flare Blitz are obvious choices, while Body Slam is good for the paralyze chance while still doing decent damage incase Ponyta ever outlives its usefulness (hasn't happened yet). Double Kick will 1hko Houndour who thinks he's swapping into a flash fire.
Mienfoo @ Eviolite
Trait: Regenerator
Level: 5
EVs: 156 HP / 196 Def / 76 Spd / 36 SDef
Impish Nature
- Toxic
- Drain Punch
- Fake Out
- U-turn
Pretty standard Mienfoo, except with toxic. The reason for this is to cripple Hippopotas and Lileep as they switch in, as well as any non-gastly ghost types who try to predict a fake out. This Mienfoo will easily dispatch any other Mienfoo and force them out, as well as Aipom and any other fake out users, giving you a free toxic which your opponent never sees coming because no one uses toxic Mienfoo ever. He is also a decent switch in to just about any physical attacker and Fake Out is a key part of the way that I deal with pokemon that outspeed my entire team like Diglett and Abra. This set gets 2/3hko'd by Hippo Earthquake depending on ev's, though, so you need to fake out/get your toxic up then u-turn out immediately.
All in all this team does have a good amount of weaknesses, but with 3 priority moves and 2 scarf users, you can still overcome just about anything that would normally check this team with a sacrifice of one of the less essential pokemon like Ponyta or Swinub. And if you can't, you have a pretty decent chance of a lucky snow cloak proc happening anyway and winning you the game. Except against Wynaut. If you ever try to use an actual attack against a Wynaut team with Snover before it's dealt with, you're dead, and dealing with Wynaut is kind of hard since once your opponent realizes you've got 2 scarfs, a smart player will only use it to kill Cubchoo and Snover. Double sand rush teams with Wynaut are almost entirely unbeatable for this team for this reason, while a single sand rush can be dealt with fine if Drilbur doesn't get an SD up. Misdreavus can be a problem, but you can usually get a toxic on it when it tries to switch into Mienfoo and then recover stall with Lileep. Sometimes it'll kill Lileep before it dies, but sacrifices must be made to use double snow cloak.
Aside from snow cloak and the residual damage, obviously the only thing hails good for is cancelling other weather and 100% accuracy blizzard. I've thought about maybe using some other pokemon that can use blizzard to abuse this, such as shell smash Clamperl, a bulky Porygon, or Staryu to get a spinner on my team. They'd both be great replacements to Swinub, i'm sure, as would just about any pokemon ever, but then i'd only be using 1 snow cloak and that'd make me less of a man.
Unfortunately the pokemon that can benefit from Hail just aren't great stats wise, so i'm almost certain you could replace Cubchoo and Swinub with just about any other pokemon that fufill a similar role without benefitting from hail and do better. Ice type pokemon are also weak to stealth rock, and I opted not to use a spinner in this team despite that, because I have 2 scarfers, 3 priority moves and Mienfoo who shrugs off residual damage like it's nothing, which usually means I can finish threats off without too much switching in and out. But I wanted to use snow cloak, goddamnit.
Snover @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Snow Warning
Level: 5
EVs: 196 Spd / 184 SAtk / 128 Atk
Naive Nature
- Blizzard
- Ice Shard
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Fire]
Obviously a hail teams gonna have Snover. I use him with a Scarf because his weaknesses are very crippling and he's too slow to avoid that problem without it imo. You need to be very careful not to overpredict with him, as if your opponent you thought would switch stays in and uses a HP fire or just about any stab supereffective attack, you're in big trouble. Generally I will Blizzard or Giga Drain to be safe, as these moves will do pretty respectable damage to almost anything even if it resists them, and if your opponent stays in and eats them, that's even better. You can't afford to lose Snover in the early mid game so it's better safe than sorry.
Against other weather teams, especially sand, you need to be very careful with how you use him. While at high health, He can swap into Hippopotatas without a fear except from Toxic, and since he probably won't be staying in for more than 1 or 2 turns or swapping into many attacking moves and thanks to Giga Drain healing, Toxic isn't really that big a deal.
I'm still experimenting with this moveset, but right now I like it. Ice Shard is there because even with a Scarf, some unscarfed, unboosted pokemon like Abra and Diglett outspeed Snover, and killing them often becomes very important lategame, while the other moves provide decent coverage.
Swinub @ Life Orb
Trait: Snow Cloak
Level: 5
EVs: 196 Atk / 196 SDef / 116 Def
Adamant Nature
- Ice Shard
- Icicle Crash
- Earthquake
- Superpower
Swinub kind of sucks, but STAB Ice Shard makes him more useful than the ice body Spheal I initially tried to use in his place. He's so slow and his defenses are so bad that I found that trying to use him for any other reason is pretty pointless. He can swap in to SOME attacks (ie: non-stab attacks/attacks from walls that he isn't weak to), and he can easily outspeed and do enough damage to finish off and 2-3hko almost any defensive pokemon aside from Bronzor. But mostly, he's just here as a blood sacrifice to fast pokemon like Abra incase Lileep isn't available, hitting for good damage with a life orb STAB Ice Shard and then dying, allowing Snover or Mienfoo to clean it up. Sometimes you'll get a Snow Cloak proc and he does more than that, though, which can easily win you the game. Sadly, this is the best use i've found for a hail pokemon that isn't Cubchoo.
Cubchoo @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Snow Cloak
Level: 5
EVs: 76 HP / 200 SAtk / 196 Spd
Timid Nature
- Blizzard
- Surf
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Grass Knot
Similar to Snover, Cubchoo is too slow to really use anything but a scarf effectively. He at least doesn't have the grass typing, so he can usually survive a HP fire from weaker special attackers, or better, dodge it with Snow Cloak. This makes him a much safer option to use in a lot of circumstances, since he and Snover fill similar roles in the team and he is a lot less valuable than Snover as an attacker since he doesn't summon hail, only has 1 STAB and has no priority. Surf and Blizzard are obvious choices, however the other 2 move slots i'm not so sure of - HP fire does almost no damage to Bronzor, which is the pokemon I originally put it into this set for (although it's useful against opposing Snover), and Grass Knot is rarely useful unless you use it on a switch into slowpoke or something.
Lileep @ Eviolite
Trait: Storm Drain
Level: 5
EVs: 228 HP / 220 Def / 60 SDef
Bold Nature
- Toxic
- Stealth Rock
- Giga Drain
- Recover
I needed a decent mixed wall so Lileep was an obvious choice. Lileep can take any of the hits that my ice pokemon can't, though you probably don't want to swap him into a hi jump kick or any high powered super effective move like that - Mienfoo or Ponyta are generally better options there, as they can survive the hit and then at least retaliate on the next turn, while Lileep just dies on the second turn. It's almost impossible not to get rocks up and at least a couple of toxics up before Lileep goes down and if you keep him alive to the late game it can often spell gg because not many teams have more than 2 pokemon that can really threaten it. However, due to the general frailty of the ice pokemon on my team, it's rare that ever happens.
Ponyta @ Choice Band
Trait: Flash Fire
Level: 5
EVs: 4 HP / 196 Spd / 156 Atk / 76 Def / 76 SDef
Jolly Nature
- Body Slam
- Flare Blitz
- Wild Charge
- Double Kick
I needed something to kill Bronzor that can also threaten just about anything else. Yes, Choice Band Ponyta was the answer. No one ever sees this coming. Ponyta will outspeed and 1HKO lots of things that will cockily stay in on it, like non-defensive Scrafty, Croagunk and Mienfoo with Flare Blitz. It can swap in to any of these pokemons unboosted moves, survive one with 50% or higher health, and then 1HKO it. It 1hko's defensive Bronzor and Ferroseed, 2hko's any Hippopotas, and does significant damage to Lileep. Also, Ponyta doesn't fear non-stab Earthquake from walls that like to carry it, as Bronzor commonly does, as its natural bulk is high enough that it will usually only take him to just above half HP.
More often than not, I win the game against Sand teams because my opponent thinks he can safely swap in his 50% HP Hippo into a Flare Blitz, and he promptly loses his weather.
Flash Fire is also such a great ability. It's very easy to bait HP fire or just about any fire attack, what with 3 ice types, and swap in Ponyta for a boost. Ponyta with Flash Fire up becomes a god and will easily 1hko any non-defensive pokemon that doesn't 2x resist Flare Blitz, such as Scarf Chinchoo or Mantyke without Eviolite, which seem to be common switch ins once my opponent realizes their mistake and decides they need to swap in something that resists fire.
Ponyta doesn't have good coverage and will typically only be able to land 1 or 2 kills, or 3 at very most, due to a weakness to stealth rock and having to use recoil moves. Still, it's pretty strong. For an ou comparison, he's basically a fire type Staraptor.
Wild Charge and Flare Blitz are obvious choices, while Body Slam is good for the paralyze chance while still doing decent damage incase Ponyta ever outlives its usefulness (hasn't happened yet). Double Kick will 1hko Houndour who thinks he's swapping into a flash fire.
Mienfoo @ Eviolite
Trait: Regenerator
Level: 5
EVs: 156 HP / 196 Def / 76 Spd / 36 SDef
Impish Nature
- Toxic
- Drain Punch
- Fake Out
- U-turn
Pretty standard Mienfoo, except with toxic. The reason for this is to cripple Hippopotas and Lileep as they switch in, as well as any non-gastly ghost types who try to predict a fake out. This Mienfoo will easily dispatch any other Mienfoo and force them out, as well as Aipom and any other fake out users, giving you a free toxic which your opponent never sees coming because no one uses toxic Mienfoo ever. He is also a decent switch in to just about any physical attacker and Fake Out is a key part of the way that I deal with pokemon that outspeed my entire team like Diglett and Abra. This set gets 2/3hko'd by Hippo Earthquake depending on ev's, though, so you need to fake out/get your toxic up then u-turn out immediately.
All in all this team does have a good amount of weaknesses, but with 3 priority moves and 2 scarf users, you can still overcome just about anything that would normally check this team with a sacrifice of one of the less essential pokemon like Ponyta or Swinub. And if you can't, you have a pretty decent chance of a lucky snow cloak proc happening anyway and winning you the game. Except against Wynaut. If you ever try to use an actual attack against a Wynaut team with Snover before it's dealt with, you're dead, and dealing with Wynaut is kind of hard since once your opponent realizes you've got 2 scarfs, a smart player will only use it to kill Cubchoo and Snover. Double sand rush teams with Wynaut are almost entirely unbeatable for this team for this reason, while a single sand rush can be dealt with fine if Drilbur doesn't get an SD up. Misdreavus can be a problem, but you can usually get a toxic on it when it tries to switch into Mienfoo and then recover stall with Lileep. Sometimes it'll kill Lileep before it dies, but sacrifices must be made to use double snow cloak.
Aside from snow cloak and the residual damage, obviously the only thing hails good for is cancelling other weather and 100% accuracy blizzard. I've thought about maybe using some other pokemon that can use blizzard to abuse this, such as shell smash Clamperl, a bulky Porygon, or Staryu to get a spinner on my team. They'd both be great replacements to Swinub, i'm sure, as would just about any pokemon ever, but then i'd only be using 1 snow cloak and that'd make me less of a man.
