I nominate Lootboxes/Gacha Games as my pick.
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Video Game Club [Current Topic: Gacha & Lootboxes | Nominations Open!]
- Thread starter Plague von Karma
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Plague von Karma
Banned deucer.
Oh crap uh I almost forgot--
I'll keep those two topics up for voting and today/tomorrow can be voting, sorry!!!
I'll keep those two topics up for voting and today/tomorrow can be voting, sorry!!!
In light of recent events and my general interest, gonna go for Leaks and Datamining
Plague von Karma
Banned deucer.
I left this open a lot longer than desired in hopes of a few more votes...
But anyway, the new Current Topic is Gacha and Lootboxes!
But anyway, the new Current Topic is Gacha and Lootboxes!
Gacha 
That word brings me grief lol... I played Fate Grand/Order and it is all about that base gacha. Getting those Saint Quartz built up is a pain xixi. But it is a interesting mobile game and is solid. I play the JP version of it. ._. Do not know any but /shrug!
That word brings me grief lol... I played Fate Grand/Order and it is all about that 
Gacha games make me feel pain that I have ever felt before :(
TheReturnerOfJuly
Banned deucer.
Gacha can be fun. "Can". Lootboxes and Gacha games are really just an elaborate scheme to drain money from your account. Sometimes, you might find a fun one that doesn't send you're debt into the negative millions. But, they're rare and far between. don't trust these games or sites. Lootboxes are physcologically designed to make you keep spending and spending. It's scummy, and that's why I don't even dare to touch these things. LIke, really scummy stuff to take your money.
I used to play Fire Emblem Heroes and Dragalia Lost a lot. I've probably spent around ~$200 on FEH alone, though I don't recall spending anything on Dragalia (though it was tempting). I stopped playing both around two years ago because even if I were to grind them out, there wasn't really a goal I wanted to reach besides making my characters strong as fuck. Dragalia also drained my phone battery, so there's that too.
I also occasionally take a look at some of the new heroes they add to FEH, and holy shit, they're really giving abilities a whole book as a description. The number of new resources you have to collect for things as well seems exhausting...
I also occasionally take a look at some of the new heroes they add to FEH, and holy shit, they're really giving abilities a whole book as a description. The number of new resources you have to collect for things as well seems exhausting...
Plague von Karma
Banned deucer.
I have a burning hatred for lootboxes, particularly because of how it's literally just thinly-veiled gambling, with all the psychological effects largely applying. I'd know, I ended up going through a brief poker addiction in my teenage years and experienced a relapse with this stuff, kicked it back in 2019. I don't like how "gacha" has been slowly creeping into general use too, since it's just another way of saying "lootbox-based game" or a way of sugarcoating what the game actually is. Day after day, Jim Sterling is continually proven correct on what he's been saying for years. I don't think anyone would miss these practices if they were banned.
It's funny how with Fire Emblem Heroes and Mario Kart Tour, Nintendo fans very quickly moved to defend the game's practices. I even saw a couple of people do it after being part of the barrage of criticism EA received for their handling of Star Wars Battlefront II. I'd argue that Nintendo's "f2p-friendly" games are even more insidious than half the trash on the Google Play Store; the whole idea of Free to Play economies is to drip feed you until you blow your gasket and give them a buck...a buck you could spend on an actual game. It's a shame Pokemon Go went down this road, and I wouldn't be shocked to see Unite do it too.
You can so easily make a store where you can buy anything in the lootboxes, but it's easier to make them randomized because you make more off of it. People end up spending 10x what you'd charge, getting all this stuff they don't want with it. It's manipulative and awful. The "just cosmetic" dross doesn't work either simply because it's not: there are entire skin markets out there, and more, watch those two videos there and try to argue it, I dare you.
It's funny how with Fire Emblem Heroes and Mario Kart Tour, Nintendo fans very quickly moved to defend the game's practices. I even saw a couple of people do it after being part of the barrage of criticism EA received for their handling of Star Wars Battlefront II. I'd argue that Nintendo's "f2p-friendly" games are even more insidious than half the trash on the Google Play Store; the whole idea of Free to Play economies is to drip feed you until you blow your gasket and give them a buck...a buck you could spend on an actual game. It's a shame Pokemon Go went down this road, and I wouldn't be shocked to see Unite do it too.
You can so easily make a store where you can buy anything in the lootboxes, but it's easier to make them randomized because you make more off of it. People end up spending 10x what you'd charge, getting all this stuff they don't want with it. It's manipulative and awful. The "just cosmetic" dross doesn't work either simply because it's not: there are entire skin markets out there, and more, watch those two videos there and try to argue it, I dare you.
https://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentar...ions/Gamingmicro-transactions/Public_Hearings
https://www.gamesindustry.biz/artic...recommends-banning-loot-box-sales-to-children
https://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentar...ions/Gamingmicro-transactions/Public_Hearings
https://www.rsph.org.uk/about-us/ne...mers-get-into-debt-because-of-loot-boxes.html
https://www.gamesindustry.biz/artic...recommends-banning-loot-box-sales-to-children
https://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentar...ions/Gamingmicro-transactions/Public_Hearings
https://www.rsph.org.uk/about-us/ne...mers-get-into-debt-because-of-loot-boxes.html
I think Gacha is obviously a really unfortunate and predatory development but what really interests me is how, even outside of explicitly exploitative lootboxes and phone games the reward mechanism has changed along this axis. Where once something would be hard to obtain because you didn't know where it was or weren't good enough at a task to get it, it's now more often difficult to get because it's random to find it and it just takes time rather than effort.
Maybe it's because stuff is easy enough to find on walkthroughs and from the community within days and they still want something to be hard to find even if you know about it. But regardless it still reinforces that same reward mechanism even if you don't pay money to keep pulling. The most stark examples I can think of that pull this in a quality single player game are Xenoblade 2 with the Blade gacha and Pokemon with Ultra Space and to a lesser extent Dynamax Adventures as a way to make finding legendaries more random. And roguelikes are more easy to make well and popular than ever (I even love good roguelikes), leaning more into the idea of making a player feel good by rewarding them with obscene power for an hour when they get lucky.
Makes me appreciate that there are still plenty of RPGs that play it more straight up. And you couldn't catch me dead playing one of those phone games.
Maybe it's because stuff is easy enough to find on walkthroughs and from the community within days and they still want something to be hard to find even if you know about it. But regardless it still reinforces that same reward mechanism even if you don't pay money to keep pulling. The most stark examples I can think of that pull this in a quality single player game are Xenoblade 2 with the Blade gacha and Pokemon with Ultra Space and to a lesser extent Dynamax Adventures as a way to make finding legendaries more random. And roguelikes are more easy to make well and popular than ever (I even love good roguelikes), leaning more into the idea of making a player feel good by rewarding them with obscene power for an hour when they get lucky.
Makes me appreciate that there are still plenty of RPGs that play it more straight up. And you couldn't catch me dead playing one of those phone games.
I'm not speaking for everyone, but back in 2016, I just bandwagoned against business practices like Gacha games and Lootboxes because "haha EA / Ubisoft / whatever non-Nintendo Company sucks" and I'd look cool for saying something a lot of people agreed with despite never really experiencing what it was. Fire Emblem Heroes was my first Gacha game and from there, I went on to play a few other games casually, like Epic Seven, Azur Lane, Fate / Go, Genshin Impact, which gave me a better understanding of how these games generally work. Now that I've actually experienced a number of games with Gacha elements, I'd still say I'm still generally against them, but not as much as I was before and there are a number of elements that I actually quite enjoy about most gacha games. The reasons are just based on my own experience playing Gachas:
- Frequent content updates and fair number of customizable elements
- Great and helpful communities that post ton of great guides, fanart, memes, etc.
- Gameplay is simple and fun, making it easy to pick up & put down. Despite the Stamina System being criticized, I like as a way of telling the player to move onto something else.
- Rolling for characters can be hit or miss, but the preparation for the rolls is pretty fun. I'm normally F2P so I have to save resources in advance and calculate factors like the average number of pulls I need for X character, what I can do to manipulate the RNG system in my favor, etc. Not sure about other gacha games, but in FEH and Genshin, there are Pity systems that guarentee a 5 Star character after a certain number of pulls. And even if you don't get the 5 star character, it can be fun to work on 4-Star projects since they are easy to get (in FEH and Genshin at least).
Don't have any experience with Lootboxes or Microtransaction games since I don't play games that feature those and normally ignore them if they are an option.
Overall, I wouldn't like Gachas to be banned since I enjoy the games that feature them. However, I do think there should be some tighter age restrictions on them, either to a 13+ or 18+ audience
Agreed with some sentiments that Gachas can be fun, especially if you are like me and don't spend money in game. The feeling of being blessed by RNG and pulling like an ultra-rare character or item (bless 10% scrolls from old school Maplestory) is pretty good. Lootboxes are probably more controversial since a lot of people will remember the Star Wars Battlefront II incident. I do think companies are moving in the right direction by eliminating the purchase of these lootboxes with IRL money, but the stigma around it bound to last for a bunch more longer.
what are some good ps4 game recommendations you guys have? i'd like something that takes quite a bit of time and is fun to play/engaging.
i've currently finished the crash trilogy (which doesn't check the boxes but its always fun) and horizon: zero dawn. horizon was a very refreshing surprise cuz I saw it for sale for $10 and got the complete edition not having many expectations and it blew my mind, super good and fun game. best story i've seen in a while. rare to see a game incorporate rpg elements and have them be non-complex. crafting was very easy and intuitive, and there weren't like 70 different items that ur supposed to memorize what they do and how they combine with each other. also basically its what i wanted from zelda botw but never received.
any other recommendations would be great :) i already played/finished tlou 1 and 2, infamous trilogy, dark (and demon) souls trilogy (didn't like bloodborne), batman games, need for speed payback/heat, sekiro (dropped cuz too frustrating). i guess i could always finish nioh cuz for some reason i never did, but any other recommendations are required
i've currently finished the crash trilogy (which doesn't check the boxes but its always fun) and horizon: zero dawn. horizon was a very refreshing surprise cuz I saw it for sale for $10 and got the complete edition not having many expectations and it blew my mind, super good and fun game. best story i've seen in a while. rare to see a game incorporate rpg elements and have them be non-complex. crafting was very easy and intuitive, and there weren't like 70 different items that ur supposed to memorize what they do and how they combine with each other. also basically its what i wanted from zelda botw but never received.
any other recommendations would be great :) i already played/finished tlou 1 and 2, infamous trilogy, dark (and demon) souls trilogy (didn't like bloodborne), batman games, need for speed payback/heat, sekiro (dropped cuz too frustrating). i guess i could always finish nioh cuz for some reason i never did, but any other recommendations are required
I’d look into the Witcher 3 and Nier automata. The Witcher is a little more complicated and probably not as fulfilling as far as combat/crafting goes compared to horizon but the story environment is really incredible. There’s a ton of content which more than makes up for the ok combat. It’s a lot more on the gritty side (like game of thrones) vs horizon/botw. I ended up reading the books the game is based off of because I was so invested in the world. Nier is a lot more linear but still open world. Combat is hack and slash but the focus is definitely more on the narrative. The story is good but for me it wasn’t the story as much as it was the experience of playing through the game. It sounds kind of dumb to say but there’s just something about the atmosphere of the game that really drew me in. It’s probably the only game where the soundtrack was so memorable and impactful for me.
I don’t really put much stock into gameplay but if that’s what you’re looking for, I thought the ff7remake was really fun and satisfying. It’s essentially a real-time conversion of the classic FF turn-by-turn combat. It’s a very satisfying mix of hack and slash alongside the typical FF elements presented as strategic attacks you can do. Really fun to play.
My personal favorite is probably the yakuza series. The story can get pretty melodramatic and it’s a beat em up game so combat might get repetitive but overall pretty lighthearted and funny. As long as you don’t take it too seriously it’s very fun. Tons of games in the series which I’m still working through!
Honorable mention to persona 5. I could go on but I think these are all pretty solid options.
Go on please, love your recommendations. i'm a huge fan of the witcher which is why i'm putting off witcher 3 until i get a pc that can run it (soon), i played the ps4 version for 15 mins and decided to stop cuz it wasn't looking/feeling very smooth lol, i want my experience of that game to be a good one if that makes sense.
i really like the idea of nier and yakuza though. fairly old games too so i might get some good deals with them :) broke student life
But yeah broke piggy bank sure does not help ._.yea that totally makes sense, a game like the witcher is definitely built for pc play where things are just smoother and faster overall.
P5 (or P5 royal I guess) is a super engaging game with tons of content (I finished at around 140 hours although it's probably more like 120 if you don't waste time like I do). I think the easiest comparison for these turn based games like persona and (most) FF is that it's basically a little more complicated pokemon. I'm personally kind of aged out of that style of game (honestly pokemon gameplay > persona gameplay lol) so the actual fighting did end up dragging for me. That said, the supporting content is really strong and more than makes up for any of its gameplay deficiencies.
If you liked infamous/superhero stuff then Spiderman is definitely worth a play. It won't be anything mind-blowing but the gameplay is smooth and runs well. I'm not really into spiderman lore or anything other than vaguely knowing his story which I think made the game more enjoyable just to be introduced to a lot of the characters. Not too long and not much side content but there's some DLC (which you can get with the goty edition?). Worth playing eventually.
and then the uncharted series is worth a play too. i think there's a collection of the first 3 for $20 and then U4 is another $20 so as far as most content for $$$ goes, that's a good bet. Not as long or as much content as the yakuza series but it's a fun adventure. I'm not really sure it's incredible in any aspect, they're just fun games to play.
If you liked dark souls and are a star wars fan, Fallen Order is worth a look. I've never played dark souls but my understanding is that it play similarly. I'm a big star wars fan so for that alone I had to play it but even then it was a little unfulfilling. If you aren't a huge star wars fan, I'm not sure there's enough in there for it to be worth it. Relatively short too. I think it's only worth it if you like souls style gameplay and star wars.
ok i think that about covers it. thinking about this made me realize there's still a ton of games that I still want to play lol...hopefully i can get to ghost of tsushima sometime this year!
okay thanks those are all great recommendations :D i have played all 4 uncharted games too probably forgot to mention them. spiderman is probably being sold for a good deal too which is great.
no idea what fallen order is but looks interesting, i'll look it up. i also know nothing of star wars besides the trilogy memes and the "i'm your father" scene lol
gacha should 100% be illegal. it makes me real sad when a game comes out with characters i enjoy but it turns out to be a gacha game
TheReturnerOfJuly
Banned deucer.
If it wasn't doing some scummy stuff, it wouldn't truly be a gacha. Gacha are just monster collecting games like pokemon that do scummy stuff. Sadly, pokemon dominates the market, and all of the games that would be good have to turn to gacha stuff to stay afloat. Every seen a monster collect game that actually lived for a month? No. Tem Tem's already dying, or already dead. Fresh things only grace us with fresh blood. I'm sorry, but the game you want to see is either incredibly scummy and impure, or doesn't have enough funds or motivation to stay afloat with pokemon right above them. Worst part is that pokemon's not dying anytime soon.
Yo-kai Watch has been around for 8 years...
On topic though, gacha games are scummy, but I'm pretty much fine with them if they don't push it too hard. The problem is that in
TheReturnerOfJuly
Banned deucer.
But is it even a monster collector anymore? It was one for the first and second, which was around 3 years, then the 3rd was almost one, and then the 4th has no resemblence to a monster collector. Yes, it was one, but it's sales dropped after the first one was released and it fell into obscurity. It isn't truly alive. Even the second one was hard for me to buy, and from the screenshots of the third (barely sold) it's a lot cheaper, and then the fourth ditched it and isn't for worldwide retail, also with another significant drop. It got outran, and even if it did still make games, they weren't actually doing well since the first release. I don't fully know if it is still alive back in Japan, but anywhere else it has been blown up without a trace. Yes it was there, but you have to measure the sales.
Echoing the sentiment that gacha can be fun, but this is grossly outweighed by the cancerous approach that studios have of turning them into money-printing mechanics.
In all honesty, I think if gacha mechanics were just rewards you got for playing the game and weren't something you were able to spend money on and/or weren't the only available adequate progression mechanic, then that would be best for the player. Sinking lots of money into gacha mechanics is literally gambling, while being forced to depend on RNG to progress is frustrating, so if it were optional and/or not gambling, I'd see that as ideal. Ofc, no chance that game studios would go for this.
In all honesty, I think if gacha mechanics were just rewards you got for playing the game and weren't something you were able to spend money on and/or weren't the only available adequate progression mechanic, then that would be best for the player. Sinking lots of money into gacha mechanics is literally gambling, while being forced to depend on RNG to progress is frustrating, so if it were optional and/or not gambling, I'd see that as ideal. Ofc, no chance that game studios would go for this.
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